If tax calculators are to believed, staying in the UK means getting robbed

[Hawker]

The more you earn the more you pay. At least, that's the way the tax code is written.

Yes, but that would also be true without these ridiculous bands. Do I need to explain to these people that the same percentage of a higher amount is also a higher amount? No need to increase the percentage for that.

True but there is a sweet spot in the UK around 40%.  Go above or below that and tax receipts start to fall.  The introduction of the 50% rate reduced the tax take from the rich - its risen now that the tax is 45% and it might rise again when it goes back to 40%.

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[Hawker]

LOL - http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/i-am-a/journalist/electoral-commission-media-centre/news-releases-referendums/Complete-set-of-provisional-turn-out-figures-for-referendum-now-published

The figures are always a bit sketchy but I remember a BBC article practically complaining that about 42% or so? Were the only ones to show up, it was even worse in some of the local elections, dramatically worse.

Have you read the headline?  It was for the AV referendum.  Take a moment to read up what was at stake - a policy that would not change election results much.  People don't vote for things they don't care about.  

You will also see low turnout for EU elections and for local elections in the safe boroughs.  

Take a look at turnout for important elections: http://www.ukpolitical.info/Turnout45.htm  Its over 60% and that's despite all 3 main parties being committed to roughly the same policies. They are all for NHS, Police, Armed Forces and the Welfare State. 

I can only assume the reason you are on about turnout is that you argue that the policies which UK governments follow are broadly supported.  Unless you can find some party that offers different policies winning votes, that's a hard argument to make.

[Behemot]

All things considered UK is actually not that bad in comparison with other nations.

ROFLMAO. You get persecuted for having screwdriver in your pocket while criminals use pistols. There is higher rate of some criminal offenses in London than in Cape Town. And yet they keep robbing you saying how much they take care of you and how they are ensuring your safety. Sure, not bad 

[Darkcoins]

Roll on independence in Scotland.. Fed up of Westminster taxing us.. Bedroom tax is the latest one!!

[hilariousandco]

Roll on independence in Scotland.. Fed up of Westminster taxing us.. Bedroom tax is the latest one!!

Saw Cameron on TV with his serious face on the other day urging Scots to vote no on it for the 'sake of Great Britain'. I'm sure they're just going to miss your taxes and don't really care otherwise.

[Hawker]

Roll on independence in Scotland.. Fed up of Westminster taxing us.. Bedroom tax is the latest one!!

Saw Cameron on TV with his serious face on the other day urging Scots to vote no on it for the 'sake of Great Britain'. I'm sure they're just going to miss your taxes and don't really care otherwise.

Are you guys kidding?  The SNP is dedicated to higher taxes and they are the Scottish government.  

[Lethn]

All things considered UK is actually not that bad in comparison with other nations.

ROFLMAO. You get persecuted for having screwdriver in your pocket while criminals use pistols. There is higher rate of some criminal offenses in London than in Cape Town. And yet they keep robbing you saying how much they take care of you and how they are ensuring your safety. Sure, not bad  

I've forgotten the name of the Anarchist but I was told about this guy who had been accused by police of having a brick in his pocket at a protest and throwing at them and the only way he could prove his innocence was getting his coat forensically examined to prove that there wasn't even a trace of brick in the pockets. The only difference between the countries people like to attack so much is honesty, western countries generally tend to be much better at hiding and lying about their corruption whereas the eastern countries just can't be bothered with any of that.

Oh and Hawker I guess I have to agree with you on the voter thing if those turnout numbers are right, but the interesting thing is that my family is pretty pro-labour but they're getting tired of all the bullshit as well which is interesting, I think that the main reason people in the UK vote now is to make sure that the 'other guy' doesn't get in. As demonstrated by labour in the last election when they tried using that tactic against the neo-conservative party.

I think we'll see more George Galloway type manoeuvres by the voters just to make sure none of the main parties win, or at least I hope to see some of it lol the look on the Labour parties' faces was fantastic when it happened.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crvy6twP_3s

[Lethn]

It depends on how It's done, there was talk about Scotland keeping the pound even if there was a yes vote on independence in Scotland so in the end it wouldn't mean much, I don't think the SNP know very much about keeping a country independent for all I've heard about them.

That said, the idea of a yes vote for it alone scares the crap out of the main party politicians, much like with the AV Referendum lol

[Lethn]

Yes, that's exactly what I'm talking about, I also think that's probably what the Bank of England will be betting on, the politicians are just worried about saving face, they hate letting people decide for themselves on an issue.

[Hawker]

Roll on independence in Scotland.. Fed up of Westminster taxing us.. Bedroom tax is the latest one!!

Saw Cameron on TV with his serious face on the other day urging Scots to vote no on it for the 'sake of Great Britain'. I'm sure they're just going to miss your taxes and don't really care otherwise.

Are you guys kidding?  The SNP is dedicated to higher taxes and they are the Scottish government.  

I'm also not sure whether independence from Brittain will be beneficial for Scotland economically.

At least they'll shake paying for the war machine

Scottish independence will start off with a burst of high taxes to make up for the loss of the subsidy from the English.  Once that pain has been dealt with, the Scots are well educated people with a world class infrastructure of roads, education, health and the like.  An independent Scotland should do just fine.

[Lethn]

I hope so, I wouldn't mind seeing an independent Wales as well.

[Slartybardfast]

I think the whole of Britain should vote on whether Scotland should remain as part of the United Kingdom, not just the scots.. 

[pening]

Scottish independence will start off with a burst of high taxes to make up for the loss of the subsidy from the English.  Once that pain has been dealt with, the Scots are well educated people with a world class infrastructure of roads, education, health and the like.  An independent Scotland should do just fine.

Yeah, paid for from that aforementioned subsidy.  To be fair they've got a "get on with it" attitude so have new stuff built which has improved their infrastructure (while in the wealth generating south east, every single development is bludgeoned to death by nimbism), but that wont last long once they are out of the union with less money.  They wont have the EU handouts either as they wont be able to join (Spain has already said they wont support Scotland joining, to send a signal to Catalonia and Basque), will find it very difficult to raise bonds when they have no national bank (BoE signalled will not support them), and the oil revenue is dwindling.  Noone other than the SNP thinks it will work economically, its a complete no starter.

[dg2010]

People in the UK are definitely getting screwed, thank the PAYE system for that. With the introduction of PAYE your tax is taken from your pay cheque before you even see the money.

Of course, once you get out of the PAYE system you will find that you can get away with paying much less tax. This is how the majority of the rich operate. They run business and they take dividends and receive 'loans' from off-shore unaccountable companies. It's not even difficult nor illegal. It's just not accessible by your average employee.

[Slartybardfast]

Yes the majority of contractors here in the UK use LTD company vehicles to be tax efficient. But for the employed this is not an option. Most people like the comfort of holiday, sick and crappy pension at the end, if the company has not plundered it.

[hilariousandco]

Roll on independence in Scotland.. Fed up of Westminster taxing us.. Bedroom tax is the latest one!!

Saw Cameron on TV with his serious face on the other day urging Scots to vote no on it for the 'sake of Great Britain'. I'm sure they're just going to miss your taxes and don't really care otherwise.

Are you guys kidding?  The SNP is dedicated to higher taxes and they are the Scottish government.  

Yes, but then the taxes go to the Scottish people, not Cameron and his Corporate buddies.

[Hawker]

Roll on independence in Scotland.. Fed up of Westminster taxing us.. Bedroom tax is the latest one!!

Saw Cameron on TV with his serious face on the other day urging Scots to vote no on it for the 'sake of Great Britain'. I'm sure they're just going to miss your taxes and don't really care otherwise.

Are you guys kidding?  The SNP is dedicated to higher taxes and they are the Scottish government.  

Yes, but then the taxes go to the Scottish people, not Cameron and his Corporate buddies.

That's a nice thought but in reality, the Scots enjoy a generous subsidy as well as disproportionate political representation.  If the Scots leave, England will be financially far better off.

[hilariousandco]

Roll on independence in Scotland.. Fed up of Westminster taxing us.. Bedroom tax is the latest one!!

Saw Cameron on TV with his serious face on the other day urging Scots to vote no on it for the 'sake of Great Britain'. I'm sure they're just going to miss your taxes and don't really care otherwise.

Are you guys kidding?  The SNP is dedicated to higher taxes and they are the Scottish government.  

Yes, but then the taxes go to the Scottish people, not Cameron and his Corporate buddies.

That's a nice thought but in reality, the Scots enjoy a generous subsidy as well as disproportionate political representation.  If the Scots leave, England will be financially far better off.

Are you sure? Why are they so bothered about you leaving then? It will effect their interests negatively in some other capacity.

[Hawker]

Roll on independence in Scotland.. Fed up of Westminster taxing us.. Bedroom tax is the latest one!!

Saw Cameron on TV with his serious face on the other day urging Scots to vote no on it for the 'sake of Great Britain'. I'm sure they're just going to miss your taxes and don't really care otherwise.

Are you guys kidding?  The SNP is dedicated to higher taxes and they are the Scottish government.  

Yes, but then the taxes go to the Scottish people, not Cameron and his Corporate buddies.

That's a nice thought but in reality, the Scots enjoy a generous subsidy as well as disproportionate political representation.  If the Scots leave, England will be financially far better off.

Are you sure? Why are they so bothered about you leaving then? It will effect their interests negatively in some other capacity.

National pride is more important than money.  Ireland got indepedence in 1921 and it was a financial disaster.  There was never a point where anyoen said "Lets go back to being British."  Same with most ex-colonies.

Money is not a big deal if you don't feel free.  As it happens, the Scots seem set to reject independence as they are big fans of the Queen and all that guff.  Sad for me as I live in England and our taxes would fall if Scotland left.  There can never be a Labour government in England again without Scottish votes.

[nastybit]

All things considered UK is actually not that bad in comparison with other nations.

ROFLMAO. You get persecuted for having screwdriver in your pocket while criminals use pistols. There is higher rate of some criminal offenses in London than in Cape Town. And yet they keep robbing you saying how much they take care of you and how they are ensuring your safety. Sure, not bad 

Right, I guess I can find the same job in Cape Town and get paid the same NET amount right?
So easy to throw shit and use stupid cases to justify your opinion.