In Gox we trust

[wb3]

I would advise everybody to be VERY CAREFUL when discussing with wb3.
He registered just today, and many of his posts are in mtgox-related threads.

He is highly likely to be Baron's alter ego. If that is the case, he will be manipulating everybody to lower their trust in mtgox.

Witch! Witch! Burn the witch!

These are serious accusations in a community built on trust. I hope you have more to back that up than a half-assed hunch.

WoW, alter ego. Hmm...

Yea, Ok,  It couldn't be that I just found out about BitCoin from Steve Gibson got interested, started to check it out, decided to look at an Xchange to IRL USD, and found this very interesting thread with $45,000 USD plot with frozen account, servers that disappear in the middle of the night, suggestions of the Law involved, and am curious about the outcome before I try out the Xchange. It couldn't be that possibility, nahh ....  

Instead lets use Occam's Razor:  I am an alter ego of the Baron. From the Nigerian connection, yeah... that fits better.  It does add to the drama....  

Or how about this one:  I am a pissed of Aaron Barr from HBGary using Persona Management software to try to get back $45,000 dollars from the shady underground because I am now unemployed with no hopes of Re-employment and probably getting divorced and the wife is going to take everything so I really, really need the Money. And Bank of America won't give me a loan.

Yeah,,,, that one is better.  

Is there a term for Narcissistic Paranoids...... yeah...  they are called Shadow'sofHarbringer  Sorry but you deserved it...

[ShadowOfHarbringer]

I would advise everybody to be VERY CAREFUL when discussing with wb3.
He registered just today, and many of his posts are in mtgox-related threads.

He is highly likely to be Baron's alter ego. If that is the case, he will be manipulating everybody to lower their trust in mtgox.

Witch! Witch! Burn the witch!

These are serious accusations in a community built on trust. I hope you have more to back that up than a half-assed hunch.

Why so serious ?

[error]

woah, so Jed is of the eDonkey fame? motherfucking hero. I remember that software being the centre piece of my life as a kid.

Well... if we knew this for sure, it would be a great slashdot headline. Not your life as a kid, I mean, something like "Author of (in?)famous notorious edonkey p2p network is working on revolutionary new p2p network called bitcoin which promises to be to the dollar what edonkey is to mp3!" LOL

It took me less than two minutes to verify that this is true, something I did the first day I saw that stupid $45000 thread.

[rebuilder]

Why so serious ?

Because you're completely out of line. Arbitrarily denouncing people like you and some others have done is, in my view, extremely poor behaviour. I for one will not soon forget that. In fact, once all this dies down, I think a summary of what has passed should be attempted, and I think too that the more egregious, baseless accusations should be listed and the authors called out on them.

As for the subject of this thread, I have a fair amount of trust in Mt Gox as far as him acting in good faith goes. He's had the opportunity to scam me out of some cash and has not done so, and overall seems to conduct his trade with integrity.

This does not mean I trust his abilities in dispute resolution, though. I simply do not have enough history to make any judgement on whether or not he is capable and fair in such matters. The outcome of the current dispute will be important in determining my opinion on that. 

[sturle]

  If I stole $9,000 dollars from one bank, store, person, whatever and deposited the money into a bank account, the bank doesn't care or want to know where I got the money [...] Law Enforcement freezes accounts, not banks.  PayPal does it but report the activity to law enforcement and request details. It hurts their business too.

If you went into a bank and transferred USD 100 from an account to yours, signed with a false signature, and this was noticed by the bank after you left, your account would be locked at once.  No waiting for law enforcement to catch up.  Believe me.

It looks like someone needs to open the Xchange in Switzerland or the Cayman Islands to avoid all the minutia.

Swiss banks locks accounts on suspicion.  High profile cases lately is Mubarak in Egypt and Gadaffi in Libya.

Hell, illegal sites shy away from freezing money (i.e. all the gambling sites that cater to the U.S. are illegal but they don't ask where you got the money from, and they give it back pretty quickly) Why? Because it is good for business.

If I suspected MtGox of being illegal or endorsing illegal activities, I would keep far away from it!

[ShadowOfHarbringer]

Why so serious ?

Because you're completely out of line. Arbitrarily denouncing people like you and some others have done is, in my view, extremely poor behaviour.

Perhaps it is, but "bad behavior" is certainly much better option than being manipulated by alter ego of some Nigerian scammer.

First, they manipulate you.
Second, they steal your money.

So i think that "bad behavior" is low price for detecting lies & scammers. I couldn't have done that without little psychology & white-hat sociotechnics.

[wb3]

Ooo....  Ooo....  I am waving my hands over a bubbling pot.... Hex... Hex.... Toil... and Trouble......

Manipulate... Manipulate... 

Didn't know I had the power, thanks for giving it to me....

I had promised not to make another post in the other thread until you called me an alter ego again....   Thanks Now I can continue....

A little chess with Human Behavior,,,  I knew you would do it, paranoids can't stop... Once they get an idea in their head... it sticks like glue. 

Here a little riddle:

  I have been to Nigeria: but am not Nigerian. (actually been to lots of West Africa)
  I have been to India: but not Indian (recommend the Mango Masala ..yum)
  I have been to France: but not French (not cracked up to what its supposed to be)
  I have been to Bahrain: but not Muslim (*) (Dubai, Abu Dabi, etc...) ( Cheap Music $1.. Including Heavy Metal, those hypocrites )
  I know a Baron: but am not The Baron (keep the Garlic around)
 
  Who am I?


Now as far as what I know, I now know who and where to go to look for, (if I lost my money (large amount anyways)).

NexisLexis baby, NexisLexis...

But I am more interested in the conclusion of the debacle. It is a book.

Was there even money?  If so, where did it come from?  Who gets to keep it?  Why do "they" get to keep it?  Is it going to be "Taxed"?
Why did Servers Switch? Was it done to get rid of logs? Was it compromised? What next?  and Hey, I get to play along again. Thnx.

It goes on and on,
 

[ShadowOfHarbringer]

I had promised not to make another post in the other thread until you called me an alter ego again....   Thanks Now I can continue....

Hey, I wasn't and I am not saying that you are Baron anymore, you misunderstood.

I just commented what happened before...

[molecular]

emansipator: thanks so much for summing up that crazy thread! you saved me hours!

as for my trust in Mt.Gox: yes, I trust him quite a bit. He's responsive to email and the money I wired him once showed up in my account on time.

I actually trust him more to not rip me off than I trust my traditional bank, which I know is ripping me off

[eMansipater]

emansipator: thanks so much for summing up that crazy thread! you saved me hours!

You're very welcome, and a big thanks to those of you who sent in tips--the number of tips means a lot more than the value to me; whether it's .01 or 5 they definitely brighten my day!

[Anonymous]

Its not mt gox's trustworthiness we should be questioning imo.

[eMansipater]

Its not mt gox's trustworthiness we should be questioning imo.

In my mind this thread is largely a reaffirmation of trust--just look at the poll.

[Anonymous]

Its not mt gox's trustworthiness we should be questioning imo.

In my mind this thread is largely a reaffirmation of trust--just look at the poll.

I agree.

I wonder if you worded it the same but replaced mt gox with other agents in the drama what the result would be ....

[ShadowOfHarbringer]

Its not mt gox's trustworthiness we should be questioning imo.

In my mind this thread is largely a reaffirmation of trust--just look at the poll.

I agree.

I wonder if you worded it the same but replaced mt gox with other agents in the drama what the result would be ....

Not saying anything good or bad about mtgox. But disagree with you.

The poll is rigged which should be obvious to anyone  having English reading comprehension on level of a 12 years old or better.

(...)

This is one for those who managed to actually read and understand the choices, and see how rigged the poll is. Unless they moved on in disgust before getting to this one.

OP:  Dr. Goebbels would be proud.

You are correct, the poll is ridicuously rigged.
Manipulation to the extreme.

I will start a new, better poll.

[ShadowOfHarbringer]

I have created a new, neutral & approximately objective poll.

Come and vote now:
http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4161.0

[eMansipater]

Its not mt gox's trustworthiness we should be questioning imo.

In my mind this thread is largely a reaffirmation of trust--just look at the poll.

I agree.

I wonder if you worded it the same but replaced mt gox with other agents in the drama what the result would be ....

Not saying anything good or bad about mtgox. But disagree with you.

The poll is rigged which should be obvious to anyone  having English reading comprehension on level of a 12 years old or better.

<snip>

OP:  Dr. Goebbels would be proud.

lol--great read!  Of course, as an aside, I wasn't trying to create an objective rubric of broad utility here.  Just picked the most common positions I saw being asserted in the black hole thread and posted them here so they'd be on one page instead of all throughout, careful to put in the last option in case I had missed big segments.  The options thus reflect the fact that generally speaking Mt. Gox is a trusted member of the bitcoin community, although I'm pretty disappointed that Baron didn't bother to choose the first option for us after all that going on about it in the other thread.

I'd love to see the +/- trust poll done on bitcoin in general, other bitcoin businesses and exchanges, etc.  Although it does put the options into a full range of trust instead of just a few common responses, it also leaves out the why's such as "bitcoin is new and unproven" vs "specifically because mt. gox is doing something wrong".  In that respect I think this poll does a lot better at providing a community counterpoint to the whole Baron thing.

Also the thread name is telling. Apparently, OP agrees that Mt.Gox is some kind of new deity.

This is the best part of your post though--since you're the one who came up with the thread name.  I love it!

[BitterTea]

Also the thread name is telling. Apparently, OP agrees that Mt.Gox is some kind of new deity.

This is the best part of your post though--since you're the one who came up with the thread name.  I love it!

I knew someone had suggested it, but I didn't know it was vlad. Brilliant!

Could we please rename the thread to "In Mt.Gox we trust" or maybe even better "In Gox We Trust"

[ranger]

Back on-topic: I had an interesting run-in with MtGox today. I transferred $1000 to Liberty Reserve a couple days ago, yet it never arrived. The transaction history on MtGox showed the transfer though, and the $1000 were neither on MtGox nor on Liberty Reserve. When I found this out I was pretty paranoid, thinking MtGox stole my money etc. etc. I e-mailed MtGox for clarification, and within the hour I got an e-mail back, saying that LR rejected the transaction for some reason, and that they transferred it to my account. Which they did, so all's well that ends well.

Things I will keep to heart from this encounter:

• MtGox / LR software is not perfect. Things can and will go wrong.
• There is definitely potential to lose money either by human or technological error.
• Despite the previous comments, the human(s) behind MtGox replied very quickly and have been extremely professional in their handling of these cases. As long as no change occurs in people managing the site or the bitcoin economy, I trust MtGox.

[ShadowOfHarbringer]

FYI, there is a new, neutral & approximately objective poll.

Come and vote/discuss there now:
http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4161.0

[eMansipater]

FYI, there is a new, neutral & approximately objective poll.

Come and vote/discuss there now:
http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4161.0

yeah, you already posted on the other page.