AnhBen (OP)
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January 14, 2014, 02:25:10 PM |
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RodeoX
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The revolution will be monetized!
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January 14, 2014, 03:36:29 PM |
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Bars sell drugs. Why do they take drug money if it's alcohol?
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RodeoX
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The revolution will be monetized!
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January 14, 2014, 04:33:04 PM |
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MJ is "totally legal" in Washington. And there is no stigma among the many banks lending money to dispensaries. It does not make sense to me that a payment network is making my moral choices for me. Having said that, I have much respect for Tony.
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Carlton Banks
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January 14, 2014, 05:29:14 PM |
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Yep, the trouble is that this is still a legal grey area: state legal, federally illegal.
What would a marijuana dispensary do if they got robbed for their cash? Only really committed stoners would get a medical dispensation to buy when it was medical marijuana. Now, just being over 21 qualifys, and that's someone from any state, and I'm guessing foreign tourists too (the average skier might well be interested, definitely the snowboarders...). They can expect alot more business, and therefore alot more money. And alot more local drug dealers that will have to look for a new income...
And so any other legitimate business, especially ones operating in a somewhat legal grey area themselves, like Bitpay, will do themselves a favour to let the dust settle around this issue before they start becoming at all involved.
At least the dispensaries can publicly demonstrate a useful bitcoin innovation, as you can take cash style BTC payments at the dispensary, but keep the access to the "register" completely off-site. That will help spread a little more understanding of what the system is capable of.
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Vires in numeris
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Holliday
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January 14, 2014, 06:44:34 PM |
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BitPay is a business that provides a bridge for companies wanting to accept Bitcoin without taking the risk of holding the volatile currency or dabbling in the Bitcoin exchange market. Since they deal with fiat, this decision only makes sense. Marijuana dispensaries are welcome to accept Bitcoin on their own! They already involve themselves in a risky market, so a little extra risk shouldn't bother them.
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If you aren't the sole controller of your private keys, you don't have any bitcoins.
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RodeoX
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The revolution will be monetized!
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January 14, 2014, 08:13:15 PM |
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I still say it is arbitrary. Kinda like Amazon choosing not to sell guns. They could, but they don't. Since BitPay is a private business I do support their right to do as they wish.
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odolvlobo
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January 14, 2014, 09:43:29 PM |
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MJ is "totally legal" in Washington. And there is no stigma among the many banks lending money to dispensaries. It does not make sense to me that a payment network is making my moral choices for me. Having said that, I have much respect for Tony.
It is not totally legal in Washington. The state may allow it, but the U.S. government does not. I predict that this will result in another Supreme Court challenge to the abuse of the Commerce Clause by the U.S. government.
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Join an anti-signature campaign: Click ignore on the members of signature campaigns. PGP Fingerprint: 6B6BC26599EC24EF7E29A405EAF050539D0B2925 Signing address: 13GAVJo8YaAuenj6keiEykwxWUZ7jMoSLt
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LiteCoinGuy
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In Satoshi I Trust
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January 14, 2014, 11:21:49 PM |
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Bars sell drugs. Why do they take drug money if it's alcohol?
Don't be dense. They're clearly not taking a moral stance, just moving to minimise the risk associated with a drug that has precarious legal status, even if it has been decriminalised in the state in question. yep, its clever dont to deal with them in the next 2-3 years.
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Bitware
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January 15, 2014, 02:44:21 AM |
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This will only be settled in the Supreme Court.
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BTCisthefuture
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January 15, 2014, 07:47:07 AM |
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MJ is "totally legal" in Washington. And there is no stigma among the many banks lending money to dispensaries. It does not make sense to me that a payment network is making my moral choices for me. Having said that, I have much respect for Tony.
Has nothing to do with a moral choice, regardless of state law marijuana is still illegal federally. Until that happens you are unlikely to see banks and or payment processors deal with dispensaries simply due to the fact that it's illegal federally. Same reason you don't see actual pharmacies in legal states selling medical marijuana, since it's illegal federally and pharmacies receive federal licenses to operate they won't get involved. Are you sure banks are loaning money to dispensaries ? Banks haven't been working with dispensaries for quite some time due to federal laws and pressure from the federal government. All the dispensaries I've ever dealt with were started up with their own money, not a loan from a bank. Actually I've never heard of a bank giving out a loan to start a dispensary that's illegal on the federal level. Hopefully sooner than later federal laws change, because this really is nonsense that people vote for something but business owners are still punished and treated like criminals.
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BTCisthefuture
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January 15, 2014, 07:50:35 AM |
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This will only be settled in the Supreme Court.
Something like this won't go to the supreme court. At the end of the day the federal government would need to change current laws for something to change. The issue of states violating federal law has already gone to the supreme court, even over marijuan spefically. It happened back in the 90s when California was the first state to legalize medical marijuana in America. I believe the ladies name who's case made it to the Supreme Court was Angel Raich (spelling?) she's from Oakland California. The supreme court made it clear that although states can pass laws that contradict federal laws the feds still have the right to enforce federal laws and a state legalizing something doesn't protect you from federal prosecution.
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BTCisthefuture
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January 15, 2014, 07:54:20 AM |
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MJ is "totally legal" in Washington. And there is no stigma among the many banks lending money to dispensaries. It does not make sense to me that a payment network is making my moral choices for me. Having said that, I have much respect for Tony.
It is not totally legal in Washington. The state may allow it, but the U.S. government does not. I predict that this will result in another Supreme Court challenge to the abuse of the Commerce Clause by the U.S. government. This issue already went to the supreme court quite some time ago and they already ruled the feds can continue to enforce federal marijuana laws regardless of what states laws allow. Angel Raich used the Commerce Clause as well as her defense and she lost. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gonzales_v._Raich
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BTCisthefuture
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January 15, 2014, 08:04:45 AM |
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Although it's not the best situation, it makes perfect sense.
Until federal law changes there will be plenty of types of companies who chose not to get involved with businesses that are in direct violation of federal law.
I can remember back 9-10 years ago various dispensaries in California DID accept debit/credit cards. The banks stopped working with them not out of moral reasons but because the federal government kindly asked the banks to stop (ie stop or face consequences of the law). Even things like armored truck companies have stopped working with dispensaries since they have federal licesnes, the feds kindly sent them a warning as well to stop transporting dispensaries cash. More recently the feds have been pressuring real estate owners and threatening to seize all their properties (even 99% of those properties don't have a dispensary in them) if they continue to rent any property to a dispensary owner.
The with states legalizing marijuana (medical or otherwise) all across the country the feds have already lost the ability to have the resources to do constant raids in all those states , so this method of pressuring everyone else to not work with pot stores is their last ditch effort to try to slow down the legalization movement. As more states legalize though, eventually the feds WILL have to throw in the towel and simply change the law so states can do whatever they want with pot.
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HairyMaclairy
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Degenerate bull hatter & Bitcoin monotheist
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January 15, 2014, 10:04:12 AM |
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Bitcoin needs a closer association with drugs like it needs a hole in the head.
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notthematrix
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CryptoTalk.Org - Get Paid for every Post!
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January 15, 2014, 11:11:20 AM |
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its not a real problem , you still can recive bitcoins privatly. dont see the fuss of this bitpay acts wisly , so no big deal/
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teukon
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January 15, 2014, 12:57:00 PM |
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Marijuana dispensaries are welcome to accept Bitcoin on their own!
...you still can recive bitcoins privatly.
Exactly. We do not condemn BitPay but commend Bitcoin. If all | fiat | payment processors decline to do business with you, your customers will need to bring fiat notes and coins to your store. | If all | bitcoin | payment processors decline to do business with you, your customers will need to send you bitcoins directly. |
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Peter R
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January 15, 2014, 06:11:10 PM |
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BitPay is a business that provides a bridge for companies wanting to accept Bitcoin without taking the risk of holding the volatile currency or dabbling in the Bitcoin exchange market. Since they deal with fiat, this decision only makes sense. Marijuana dispensaries are welcome to accept Bitcoin on their own! They already involve themselves in a risky market, so a little extra risk shouldn't bother them. +1 BitPay made the correct decision to not work with the dispensaries. Of course the dispensaries are still free to use bitcoin. For example, the Bitcoin Co-op in Vancouver has an open-source, web-based POS called Coinos that they would be free to use. Go to http://pos.bitcoincoop.org/register to play around--this webpage doesn't seem to showcase all the features, but I've used this Coinos system at Vera's burgers and at Don Francesco Ristorante and it works quite nicely.
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Mike Hearn
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January 15, 2014, 06:16:20 PM |
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Most pot shops are just small local stores, right? They could just use an Android phone or tablet and accept payments that way, then sell the money to local traders or use an exchange directly. You can pick up a good tablet really cheap these days.
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sunnankar
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January 16, 2014, 02:23:38 AM |
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Most pot shops are just small local stores, right? They could just use an Android phone or tablet and accept payments that way, then sell the money to local traders or use an exchange directly. You can pick up a good tablet really cheap these days.
I am not sure why more people do not understand this principle as applied to Bitcoin: Water flows around, not through, obstacles.
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