The NSA is reportedly able to access offline computers thanks to radio wave tech

[guybrushthreepwood]

When in doubt, do what the Russians do (don't, most of the time).

Buy typewriters.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/11/kremlin-typewriters_n_3579184.html

What if they typewriters are bugged?

[1715385276]

1715385276

[joschua011]

In the good old days when MTV actually played music and people were using these huge computer monitors with these ray tubes ( dont know how to translate this propperly ) one of the coolest ways to spy on someone was to receive the radio waves produced by those tubes and then use this information to duplicate the image on another monitor in a room next to the actual monitor, so you can see what someone was doing on his computer without ever touching it, installing software, or in some other way gain access to the machine.

If you knew a little bit about electronics this was actually not so hard to do.

I guess what is described in this article is simillar to this, it reminds me of a paper i read where researches listened to the sound that a CPU makes while de/encrypting data and from that sound  calculating the key ( = passphrase) that was used. This even worked if they recorded the sound with a cellphone. This sounds crazy but this totally works, in fact this audio stuff is becoming a huge problem in IT Security.

I am a Programmer and i know a quite a bit about this IT Security stuff, if the NSA could/would do this it wouldn't suprise me.

EDIT: I just found the paper where i first read this, if you really want to get into this ( highly recommended ) read it:
http://www.tau.ac.il/~tromer/papers/acoustic-20131218.pdf

[Wilikon]

When in doubt, do what the Russians do (don't, most of the time).

Buy typewriters.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/11/kremlin-typewriters_n_3579184.html

In theory having a set of microphones in an array in the room you want to spy on should pickup every keystroke individually and recreate any messages. Something between the audioscope and a gunfire locator. with the NSA budget they can make those very very small I am guessing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gunfire_locator


Two physicists developed a new technology called AudioScope that apparently enables you to zoom in on sounds in huge, loud places like sports arenas or lecture halls. Physicists Morgan Kjølerbakken and Vibeke Jahr, formerly of the University of Oslo, were were experimenting with sonar when they hit upon the idea for the AudioScope, which is based on a circular array of 300 microphones and a video camera. They've now launched a company, Squarehead, to commercialize the system. From New Scientist:
The AudioScope software then calculates the time it would take for sound emanating from that point to reach each microphone in the circular array, and digitally corrects each audio feed to synchronise them with that spot. "If we correct the audio arriving at three microphones then we have a signal that is three times as strong," says Kjølerbakken. Doing the same thing with 300 microphones can make a single conversation audible even in a stadium full of sports fans.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn19541-audio-zoom-picks-out-lone-voice-in-the-crowd.html

[Carlton Banks]

Christ, the whole world is going to be smothered in tinfoil before this NSA garbage ends.

[Snowfire]

A spookier technology, that has been around a while, monitors the radiated signal from each keystroke. In this system an antenna is aimed at the computer. It may or may not be connected to a network. Each time the user hits a key, a tiny bit of EM energy is broadcast. Using software on a computer attached to the antenna. The signal is turned back into characters and the keystrokes are revealed.   

That is actually fairly old tech (known as van Ecke phreaking.) But it cannot be done from any real distance; it requires a physical antenna and radio quite close by. A researcher also demonstrated that, given the right viewing angle and window placement, it is possible to reproduce and read the screen at which you are looking via the reflection off tour eyeball (think high-powered telescope in a neighboring building.) But this also requires dedicated boots on the ground at close range, (as do the old laser-off-a-windowpane mike trick or the track-you-in-your-home-by-wifi-signal trick) and would be unlikely to be used against you unless you are already a 'high-value target.' In the real world, hidden malware, Bios rootkits, keyloggers, and the like are far more of a concern, as they present issues even when no adversaries are physically present.

I think the claim about remotely accessing computers through unknown radio channels is mostly FUD, although there may be a few machines out there that could enable something like this in theory if the machine is on. Claims about this being possible with the machine off are total FUD.

[Carlton Banks]

I think the claim about remotely accessing computers through unknown radio channels is mostly FUD, although there may be a few machines out there that could enable something like this in theory if the machine is on. Claims about this being possible with the machine off are total FUD.

Interesting the amount of FUD-like claims emanating from the Snowden files. I thought he was supposed to be a technical expert?

What reason could there be for someone who should know his stuff to lend his credibility to claims of surveillance techniques which are technically dubious? And why allow them to be released in this dripping tap style, instead of just dumping them all?

Snowden seems all too keen to play along with the format of a media circus. And about a serious topic that he took a moral stand over, at great risk to his own life and liberty?

[benjamindees]

You people are seriously retarded if you think any of this is somehow technically impossible.

In a promotional video for the technology, Intel brags that the chips actually offer enhanced security because they don’t require computers to be “powered on” and allow problems to be fixed remotely.

http://www.infowars.com/91497/

[Carlton Banks]

Seeing as we're referencing the InfoWars website, can you tell me how the development of the Chinese Death Star is coming along? Been chewing my fingers down to the knuckles about that revelation.

[Coin_Master]

You people are seriously retarded if you think any of this is somehow technically impossible.

Not technically impossible, just completely irrelevant.  This is not news, the title of this thread should be "NSA can access your computer if they insert a wireless device into it".  Really?

[benjamindees]

Do any of you actually read anything before posting?

[Coin_Master]

Do any of you actually read anything before posting?

Yes I read the Infowars article on Intel's 3G enabled chips, but this is not the place to discuss that issue.
This forum is called Bitcointalk.  It is a forum for discussing Bitcoin related topics.  Bashing the NSA for your own political propaganda campaign is completely off topic with respect to Bitcoin.  Go away and create your own forum for anti NSA discussion.
Thanks.

[benjamindees]

I tend to think that wireless spy chips becoming standard in PCs is somewhat relevant to Bitcoin.

[Wipeout2097]

I tend to think that wireless spy chips becoming standard in PCs is somewhat relevant to Bitcoin.

It is very relevant. Out-of-band access can bypass all security precautions, even an offline machine with a wallet running Tails OS.

[Coin_Master]

I tend to think that wireless spy chips becoming standard in PCs is somewhat relevant to Bitcoin.

It is very relevant. Out-of-band access can bypass all security precautions, even an offline machine with a wallet running Tails OS.

Out-of-band access has been available to anyone who is interested since the mid 80's.  Off the shelf equipment like the DataScan 2 from Codex allows anyone to observe your activities from a mile away.  Governments have protocols to prevent such emanations, to prevent remote observation and collection of sensitive data by unauthorized individuals (I assume you are concerned about someone obtaining your private keys?).  Tempest shielding was popular in the 90's to protect against spying.  Red/Black separation with optical network connections are used to prevent electromagnetic inductance from secure computers leaking sensitive information.  This is very standard in most military installations the world over.  What you need to understand is the attack surface is massive, you make no attempt to filter the signals leaving your computer through the power lines entering your home, you make no attempt to shield the data being processed by the CPU, what do you think happens when you switch at millions and billions of cycles per second.  Everything the CPU processes is transmitted, simple laws of physics, everything.  If you are serious about protecting your privacy on your computer, you had better learn about Van Eck Phreaking and Tempest monitoring at the very least.
To be clear, I would much prefer discussion about ways to grow the Bitcoin network, new services, and new ways to use Bitcoin.  Fun Stuff.

[benjamindees]

Securing Bitcoin against centralized control is a prerequisite for growth.  Bitcoin isn't "fun" if the same criminals who have destroyed the fiat economy can just steal your Bitcoins at any time.

I really don't see why you are posting in this thread if you would rather be discussing something else.  Go discuss something else, then.

[Wipeout2097]

I tend to think that wireless spy chips becoming standard in PCs is somewhat relevant to Bitcoin.

It is very relevant. Out-of-band access can bypass all security precautions, even an offline machine with a wallet running Tails OS.

Out-of-band access has been available to anyone who is interested since the mid 80's.  Off the shelf equipment like the DataScan 2 from Codex allows anyone to observe your activities from a mile away.  Governments have protocols to prevent such emanations, to prevent remote observation and collection of sensitive data by unauthorized individuals (I assume you are concerned about someone obtaining your private keys?).  Tempest shielding was popular in the 90's to protect against spying.  Red/Black separation with optical network connections are used to prevent electromagnetic inductance from secure computers leaking sensitive information.  This is very standard in most military installations the world over.  What you need to understand is the attack surface is massive, you make no attempt to filter the signals leaving your computer through the power lines entering your home, you make no attempt to shield the data being processed by the CPU, what do you think happens when you switch at millions and billions of cycles per second.  Everything the CPU processes is transmitted, simple laws of physics, everything.  If you are serious about protecting your privacy on your computer, you had better learn about Van Eck Phreaking and Tempest monitoring at the very least.
To be clear, I would much prefer discussion about ways to grow the Bitcoin network, new services, and new ways to use Bitcoin.  Fun Stuff.

If you are concerned with those, use a laptop on battery and "Spread Spectrum" on your PC bios. Don't use it to try to distract from the discussion of NSA and the 3G radio inside Intel processors

Furthermore, as an Software Defined Radio entry level enthusiast, I don't really need to "learn" that. I know it.

[cybershawrk]

why would the nsa put so much focus into its own citizens shouldn't they be putting more energy into spying on America s enemies? almost no one is safe from being spied on nowadays even most cell phones nowadays have special devices in them that allow agencies to hear everything around the phone even if its not in use
scary stuff

[TiagoTiago]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5N1C3WB8c0o <- sorta relevant

[TheButterZone]

why would the nsa put so much focus into its own citizens shouldn't they be putting more energy into spying on America s enemies? almost no one is safe from being spied on nowadays even most cell phones nowadays have special devices in them that allow agencies to hear everything around the phone even if its not in use
scary stuff

American citizens are their government's enemies. No other logical explanation for our civil rights constantly being violated with impunity, and the worst possible evil "winning" every election that counts.

[Matttm]

Well it's not like they are doing this just to annoy us, the NSA needs to do this for the safety of us. I know this is a big invasion of privacy but would you rather be private and more illegal crime going on?