Do not give your ID to IBB [America Haters ITT]

[Jonathan Ryan Owens]

Everyone,

Until IBB verifies its own principles identities and country of operation, your personal information should not be given or shared with the them under any circumstances. Do not risk identity theft, fraud and a nasty surprise down the road by providing such sensitive information to an unknown entity.

Forum reputation doesn't mean anything.

Regards,
Jonathan

[NothinG]

I'm usually against people starting threads in the wrong section, but I agree with the content.

[ffuentes]

But do you have requested money to senbozaukra (or whatever, i need to sleep now) or someone else who tells you that he has requested personal data?

[NothinG]

But do you have requested money to senbozaukra (or whatever, i need to sleep now) or someone else who tells you that he has requested personal data?

He's talking about this: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=41924.0
senbonzakura wanted his left arm and his first twig for Bitcoins.

[Jonathan Ryan Owens]

But do you have requested money to senbozaukra (or whatever, i need to sleep now) or someone else who tells you that he has requested personal data?

He's talking about this: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=41924.0
senbonzakura wanted his left arm and his first twig for Bitcoins.

You left out that it's Bitcoins that I'm more than capable of paying back, as opposed to the plethora individuals on here who have bad debt.

Fishy.

Regards,
Jonathan

[NothinG]

But do you have requested money to senbozaukra (or whatever, i need to sleep now) or someone else who tells you that he has requested personal data?

He's talking about this: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=41924.0
senbonzakura wanted his left arm and his first twig for Bitcoins.

You left out that it's Bitcoins that I'm more than capable of paying back, as opposed to the plethora individuals on here who have bad debt.

Fishy.

Regards,
Jonathan

I personally don't know you well enough to decide if you're capable enough to pay it back; rather, I don't see the need for them to collect so much information and as easily as a wallet.dat can be stolen...so could your information.

[Jonathan Ryan Owens]

But do you have requested money to senbozaukra (or whatever, i need to sleep now) or someone else who tells you that he has requested personal data?

He's talking about this: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=41924.0
senbonzakura wanted his left arm and his first twig for Bitcoins.

You left out that it's Bitcoins that I'm more than capable of paying back, as opposed to the plethora individuals on here who have bad debt.

Fishy.

Regards,
Jonathan

I personally don't know you well enough to decide if you're capable enough to pay it back; rather, I don't see the need for them to collect so much information and as easily as a wallet.dat can be stolen...so could your information.

NothingG,

True enough, you don't know me. The real issue, as you stated above, is that for 5 Bitcoins nobody should ever give their personal information out unless that lending association is willing to verify their identities as well, and even then, it's suspect.

Regards,
Jonathan Owens

[ovidiusoft]

Jonathan, you're upset over nothing. IBB has public rules, it's the first post in a sticky, you should have read them. You want BTC, he wants your ID, if it's not acceptable, you don't borrow from IBB. I don't think sending ID's to strangers is a good idea either (see below), but, as you wrote yourself "Forum reputation doesn't mean anything." and you're a faceless nickname just like everyone else here. If you think you're abused, you are wrong.

As for anonymity, I am not paranoid and I have no problem giving my name, photo and so on, but I wouldn't send my ID to anyone. That's why I wrote this: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=41369.0 . If you care to do a short experiment, I would play with a small value of 1 BTC if you have some GLBSE shares to use as warranty - no other requirements. 0% interest, I just want to see how this would work.

[Jonathan Ryan Owens]

Jonathan, you're upset over nothing. IBB has public rules, it's the first post in a sticky, you should have read them. You want BTC, he wants your ID, if it's not acceptable, you don't borrow from IBB. I don't think sending ID's to strangers is a good idea either (see below), but, as you wrote yourself "Forum reputation doesn't mean anything." and you're a faceless nickname just like everyone else here. If you think you're abused, you are wrong.

As for anonymity, I am not paranoid and I have no problem giving my name, photo and so on, but I wouldn't send my ID to anyone. That's why I wrote this: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=41369.0 . If you care to do a short experiment, I would play with a small value of 1 BTC if you have some GLBSE shares to use as warranty - no other requirements. 0% interest, I just want to see how this would work.

I gave my CA Drivers License, with my signature whited out, and my ID # truncated. Address listed. Face is there.

That's fair. When they asked me for a passport, well.. That's when the red flag was raised.

Sorry, but for the 2 1/2 months I've been here, the 400 posts (almost), the credibility I have on other threads, a searchable post index, and a very public and open presence (I'm one of the few who are willing to actually use their real name), well..

That makes a request for a second form of ID *VERY* suspect.

IBB still hasn't shown its members identities. At least one of you should show your face, and stop hiding behind a veil (pun intended).

Regards,
Jonathan

[trentzb]

Secondary form of ID or address validation makes perfect sense. Suppose someone finds a lost wallet with an ID or steals a wallet with an ID, creates a forum account with that name and uses the ID for verification. A single ID is not sufficient to determine whether you actually own that ID. However, I don't have any reason to believe you don't own the ID you provided.

I am sure that requesting a loan from any conventional financial institution would require at least two forms of ID and more, and you most likely would never have access to contact information of the principals of that institution either.

[NothinG]

I've faked ID's of Drivers License, Credit Cards, Passports...you name it, I've faked it.
I still have my old templates I used to mess around with.

It's not finding an ID off the ground it's more: "I can tell it's shopped by the pixels."

[tysat]

I am sure that requesting a loan from any conventional financial institution would require at least two forms of ID and more, and you most likely would never have access to contact information of the principals of that institution either.

Two forms of ID for about $40 is a little much... hell I don't even have a passport and I'm 24.  You should have some contact information for the bank and other information about it.

[memvola]

Relax, senbonzakura is a cool guy with nothing but good intentions. I wish people here used the labels of "scam" and "troll" more conscientiously.

On the other hand, you are probably right about criticizing them about ID requirement. If it can't be lifted, maybe you can ask them to present a warning text whenever they ask for ID. That should solve yours (ours) and their problem.

ID theft is a real issue. Mine was stolen, presumably from a government office or a bank. We present our ID's everywhere, so I don't think presenting it here is more dangerous. Yet, it's still a concern. A WoT is in order, IBB could utilize OTC but I guess it's too geeky at this point. We have other alternatives though. Any recommendations?

[logansryche]

I partially agree, senbonzakura is a good person and I do see some point in wanting 2 forms of id.
I mean, it would be like you or me loaning out money and wanting assurance the person you're loaning to is the person they say they are as times have indeed gotten dangerous with fakes, scammers, hackers and the like(the fake mt gox pages are examples).

Back when bitcoins were 9usd/1btc, Senbonzakura was going to loan me 14btc on top of the 1.5btc he already lent me to get other folks to donate/loan/whatever towards my cause of a vehicle, but before doing so, I as asked to provide my drivers license, full name, address, city, state, zip, phone numer, email address, ebay name, glbse trade name and a copy of my passport PLUS get someone to loan me 10btc and pay it back. I know where he's coming from and I'd do it again in a heartbeat. I don't have a passport as I've never been out of the country, but it didn't matter. He worked with me and it was a pleasure.

I can also see why someone could see this as a red flag. It most honestly boils down to trust, and I have loads of it. Just my 2 cents.

[Jonathan Ryan Owens]

I think dropping the anonymity is important for everyone

If lending is to continue, it should be done through secure channels, with an expectation that there are controls in place that protect peoples data.

As a lender, IBB needs a user account system, an initial 'know your customer' routine, with secure upload for required documentation, and email notification for account changes.

This would cut down on fraud and protect everyone involved.

There is no reason not to have a secure portal with these features.

[pekv2]

IBB loaned out to me before this I.D. asking came into effect. I was late on my deadline but payed more than half then the remaining 4 days after. But yes, I will toss my name out there, that is probably as far as I will go. I've got a passport book, passport card, drivers license and State I.D.. As hopefully I am an established trusted member, I won't give out any of my Identification Credentials.

Look at mybitcoin, ekk... But yea, I agree, nothing against IBB as they were very kind to loan to me, but giving your credentials out is a bad idea.

Next year, you've got the F.B.I hunting you down for something that you know nothing of because you've gave your credentials out a year prior.

Now, even walking into western union showing your ID, you are still taking a chance with the employee having access to you Identification.

I agree, this subject should be taken into consideration for others.

[teflone]

Im not speaking for IBB here.

But Johnathan.. Give it a rest..

Your underlying hatred and racial/religious tones are not needed here, let alone anywhere.
As a Canadian, you fullfill the ignorant american view that most countries see you as having.

Thank you for keeping up the stereotype.


If you would like to detail a full bussiness plan that IBB can enact in EVERY country, go for it!

Its easy to sit back and demand policies and other things from your comfortable chair in CA.(li.)


IBB is growing, from a seed.. They are JUST getting rolling. Everything comes in time, and they are learning as time goes by.


Personally, your about as easy to read as a book.

You are offended that IBB asked you for credentials, because YOU think your such a "treasure" in the net community.
You have such transparency with your full name, whoop dee doo! and you demand that people acknowledge it and clearly you demand IBB to conform to your beliefs.. You are laughable at best..



IBB Treated you JUST LIKE ANYONE ELSE ON THE FORUM!  Oh the horror!




Being a racist biggot is no way to live.

From your fellow Aryan.



These are my own thoughts, outside of IBB.

[Jonathan Ryan Owens]

Im not speaking for IBB here.[/Quote]

You most certainly are.

But Johnathan.. Give it a rest..

Make me.

Your underlying hatred and racial/religious tones are not needed here, let alone anywhere.
As a Canadian, you fullfill the ignorant american view that most countries see you as having.

Underlying hatred? Racial/religious tones? For fuck sake man, you just throw out every possible slander my way in hopes that something will stick. You have no fucking clue what you're talking about. I guarantee you are genetically and culturally whiter than I am. I was raised hindu, fucknob.

First you tell me i have underlying hatred and 'racial / religious tones' while you display YOUR OWN RETARDED BIAS by bashing on americans? Wow.

Thank you for keeping up the stereotype.

So far you've only bashed me. You haven't addressed the problems that others agree with, and your defensive reaction is apparently to bash me, americans, and anyone who thinks you're full of shit?

If you would like to detail a full bussiness plan that IBB can enact in EVERY country, go for it!

Why would I write a business plan for the IBB? The fuck are you going on about now?

Its easy to sit back and demand policies and other things from your comfortable chair in CA.(li.)

So if I'm in California, I must have a comfortable chair, is that it? I get it. You DONT LIKE AMERICANS. DURHURR.

IBB is growing, from a seed.. They are JUST getting rolling. Everything comes in time, and they are learning as time goes by.

Then learn from this, and stop asking for peoples IDs until there's A SECURE AND TRUSTED METHOD BY WHICH TO DO IT.

Personally, your about as easy to read as a book.

Your retarded.

You are offended that IBB asked you for credentials, because YOU think your such a "treasure" in the net community.

Wrong. I *KNOW* I'm a treasure, you pathetic trollish piece of dog excrement, friend.

You have such transparency with your full name, whoop dee doo! and you demand that people acknowledge it and clearly you demand IBB to conform to your beliefs.. You are laughable at best..

I demand that the IBB get its shit together and do it right, or don't do it at all. That's it, mr. canadian.

IBB Treated you JUST LIKE ANYONE ELSE ON THE FORUM!  Oh the horror!

No they didn't, but I'm not going to take the time to find all the ways that your statement is wrong. Anyone who's done their thread hopping will recognize that there is no objective standard.

Being a racist biggot is no way to live.

Ok, and here's where shit gets real, Mr. Anonymous PR front man for the IBB. You are so far out of line. I'm not racist and bigoted just because I strongly believe that this particular lending system is shit. Take your head out of your gaping asshole, asshole.

From your fellow Aryan.

Fuck you.

These are my own thoughts, outside of IBB.

No they aren't. That's just your disclaimer.

I'll keep up the banter if you want, but so far only about 30% of what you've said has any weight. If you respond, I'm going to guess that it'll be more attempts to bait me, slander me, call me a racist or bigot, and you'll try to show me how and where I am anything close to that. You can't. I never insulted anyones race, religion or creed.

If I were you, I'd reevaluate your reply, and probably apologize to me and others for making such sweeping statements.

[teflone]

Im not speaking for IBB here.

You most certainly are.

But Johnathan.. Give it a rest..

Make me.

Your underlying hatred and racial/religious tones are not needed here, let alone anywhere.
As a Canadian, you fullfill the ignorant american view that most countries see you as having.

Underlying hatred? Racial/religious tones? For fuck sake man, you just throw out every possible slander my way in hopes that something will stick. You have no fucking clue what you're talking about. I guarantee you are genetically and culturally whiter than I am. I was raised hindu, fucknob.

First you tell me i have underlying hatred and 'racial / religious tones' while you display YOUR OWN RETARDED BIAS by bashing on americans? Wow.

Thank you for keeping up the stereotype.

So far you've only bashed me. You haven't addressed the problems that others agree with, and your defensive reaction is apparently to bash me, americans, and anyone who thinks you're full of shit?

If you would like to detail a full bussiness plan that IBB can enact in EVERY country, go for it!

Why would I write a business plan for the IBB? The fuck are you going on about now?

Its easy to sit back and demand policies and other things from your comfortable chair in CA.(li.)

So if I'm in California, I must have a comfortable chair, is that it? I get it. You DONT LIKE AMERICANS. DURHURR.

IBB is growing, from a seed.. They are JUST getting rolling. Everything comes in time, and they are learning as time goes by.

Then learn from this, and stop asking for peoples IDs until there's A SECURE AND TRUSTED METHOD BY WHICH TO DO IT.

Personally, your about as easy to read as a book.

Your retarded.

You are offended that IBB asked you for credentials, because YOU think your such a "treasure" in the net community.

Wrong. I *KNOW* I'm a treasure, you pathetic trollish piece of dog excrement, friend.

You have such transparency with your full name, whoop dee doo! and you demand that people acknowledge it and clearly you demand IBB to conform to your beliefs.. You are laughable at best..

I demand that the IBB get its shit together and do it right, or don't do it at all. That's it, mr. canadian.

IBB Treated you JUST LIKE ANYONE ELSE ON THE FORUM!  Oh the horror!

No they didn't, but I'm not going to take the time to find all the ways that your statement is wrong. Anyone who's done their thread hopping will recognize that there is no objective standard.

Being a racist biggot is no way to live.

Ok, and here's where shit gets real, Mr. Anonymous PR front man for the IBB. You are so far out of line. I'm not racist and bigoted just because I strongly believe that this particular lending system is shit. Take your head out of your gaping asshole, asshole.

From your fellow Aryan.

Fuck you.

These are my own thoughts, outside of IBB.

No they aren't. That's just your disclaimer.

I'll keep up the banter if you want, but so far only about 30% of what you've said has any weight. If you respond, I'm going to guess that it'll be more attempts to bait me, slander me, call me a racist or bigot, and you'll try to show me how and where I am anything close to that. You can't. I never insulted anyones race, religion or creed.

If I were you, I'd reevaluate your reply, and probably apologize to me and others for making such sweeping statements.

Once again these are my own opinions outside of IBB.

But with that amount of vulgarity, I'd say I hit the nail on the head..

You have clearly demonstrated your attitudes towards people of the east with your "Veil" comment and the Allahu Akbar ref.
It wasnt un-noticed, did you forget writting those words ?

I have nothing against americans, alot of my family is american.. So please dont put words in my mouth..


Your clearly are an overgrown child that feeds on arguments such as this with strangers on the internet.

And I sadly have fueled you more..  This is a shame I must bear.

Take care my friend. You certainly are a treasure - http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=40333.msg508356#msg508356

[Jonathan Ryan Owens]

Im not speaking for IBB here.

You most certainly are.

But Johnathan.. Give it a rest..

Make me.

Your underlying hatred and racial/religious tones are not needed here, let alone anywhere.
As a Canadian, you fullfill the ignorant american view that most countries see you as having.

Underlying hatred? Racial/religious tones? For fuck sake man, you just throw out every possible slander my way in hopes that something will stick. You have no fucking clue what you're talking about. I guarantee you are genetically and culturally whiter than I am. I was raised hindu, fucknob.

First you tell me i have underlying hatred and 'racial / religious tones' while you display YOUR OWN RETARDED BIAS by bashing on americans? Wow.

Thank you for keeping up the stereotype.

So far you've only bashed me. You haven't addressed the problems that others agree with, and your defensive reaction is apparently to bash me, americans, and anyone who thinks you're full of shit?

If you would like to detail a full bussiness plan that IBB can enact in EVERY country, go for it!

Why would I write a business plan for the IBB? The fuck are you going on about now?

Its easy to sit back and demand policies and other things from your comfortable chair in CA.(li.)

So if I'm in California, I must have a comfortable chair, is that it? I get it. You DONT LIKE AMERICANS. DURHURR.

IBB is growing, from a seed.. They are JUST getting rolling. Everything comes in time, and they are learning as time goes by.

Then learn from this, and stop asking for peoples IDs until there's A SECURE AND TRUSTED METHOD BY WHICH TO DO IT.

Personally, your about as easy to read as a book.

Your retarded.

You are offended that IBB asked you for credentials, because YOU think your such a "treasure" in the net community.

Wrong. I *KNOW* I'm a treasure, you pathetic trollish piece of dog excrement, friend.

You have such transparency with your full name, whoop dee doo! and you demand that people acknowledge it and clearly you demand IBB to conform to your beliefs.. You are laughable at best..

I demand that the IBB get its shit together and do it right, or don't do it at all. That's it, mr. canadian.

IBB Treated you JUST LIKE ANYONE ELSE ON THE FORUM!  Oh the horror!

No they didn't, but I'm not going to take the time to find all the ways that your statement is wrong. Anyone who's done their thread hopping will recognize that there is no objective standard.

Being a racist biggot is no way to live.

Ok, and here's where shit gets real, Mr. Anonymous PR front man for the IBB. You are so far out of line. I'm not racist and bigoted just because I strongly believe that this particular lending system is shit. Take your head out of your gaping asshole, asshole.

From your fellow Aryan.

Fuck you.

These are my own thoughts, outside of IBB.

No they aren't. That's just your disclaimer.

I'll keep up the banter if you want, but so far only about 30% of what you've said has any weight. If you respond, I'm going to guess that it'll be more attempts to bait me, slander me, call me a racist or bigot, and you'll try to show me how and where I am anything close to that. You can't. I never insulted anyones race, religion or creed.

If I were you, I'd reevaluate your reply, and probably apologize to me and others for making such sweeping statements.

Once again these are my own opinions outside of IBB.

But with that amount of vulgarity, I'd say I hit the nail on the head..

You have clearly demonstrated your attitudes towards people of the east with your "Veil" comment and the Allahu Akbar ref.
It wasnt un-noticed, did you forget writting those words ?

I have nothing against americans, alot of my family is american.. So please dont put words in my mouth..


Your clearly are an overgrown child that feeds on arguments such as this with strangers on the internet.

And I sadly have fueled you more..  This is a shame I must bear.

Take care my friend. You certainly are a treasure.

The use of vulgarity is just my vitriolic rage at your allegations.

Since when was it a slander to use Allahu Akbar? I think it's Khosh Fikra! We all love god, right? People of the east? There's muslims everywhere. I definitely was not generalizing towards people in the middle east.

So again, you have failed to demonstrate anything racial or bigoted on my part. These statements alone are neither racist or bigoted.



-Jonathan

p.s. Build a secure system if you're going to take IDs