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Author Topic: Hand Control to the Establishment: Arrest the Early Adopters  (Read 4179 times)
crazy_rabbit (OP)
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January 27, 2014, 08:25:58 PM
 #1

It occures to me with Charlie's arrest that this might be the start of people being arrested for things they did in the early days of bitcoin when it was all still considered "play money". With the blockchain being immutable as it is, the crimes of a few years ago (Stealing 10,000BTC) for example, might now be prosecutable, even though at the time maybe people thought it was worth no more then a 1000 USD. I bet a large number of theives or just lazy/entreprenurial bitcoin early adopters might have done things that sounded like fun at the time but now might be considered serious financial crimes. I wonder for example when Fontas might get found/arrested/prosecuted for securities fraud....

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January 27, 2014, 08:28:53 PM
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Nothing is ever going to happen to Pirate.

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January 27, 2014, 08:40:59 PM
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There'll never be a time where they retrospectively prosecute market manipulation. That just doesn't make sense. The markets aren't regulated now and that's that. If and when they are all this stuff will come to an end or be heavily disguised.

The people who are being arrested now allegedly broke laws that were applying at the time. Theft, money laundering, selling drugs, most of us know that's going to cause you some trouble.

I can well imagine that they regarded what they were up to at the time as just a game because it was way out of the spotlight. It's different now. It made some of them very rich. I'll bet they'd happily trade some of that for the old days. My sympathy hovers somewhere around the zero mark.
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January 27, 2014, 08:51:50 PM
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Charlie was connected to Silk Road. It doesn't matter when. Bitcoin is not on trial here, he is.

But you forum philosophers will find every reason to bark at the man...

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Coolstoryteller
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January 27, 2014, 08:54:41 PM
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Charlie was connected to Silk Road. It doesn't matter when. Bitcoin is not on trial here, he is.

But you forum philosophers will find every reason to bark at the man...

Technically everyone is connected to the silkroad one way or another through BTC. You think the largest marketplace for bitcoin transactions doesn't some how relate into other bitcoin related businesses? It's called RICO look it up all they need it .00000000001 of a BTC that originated from a silkroad transaction into 'yourbusinessnamehere' to go after you for money laundering.


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January 27, 2014, 09:11:19 PM
 #6

You wouldn't be able to prosecute someone based on something committed prior to a law being passed directly prohibiting what that action was. That would almost be the equivalent of trying to prosecute someone for a crime they hadn't yet committed.
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January 27, 2014, 10:11:34 PM
 #7

More victimless "criminals" having the boot stamping on their face forever. Just a matter of time before every single localbitcoins seller is prosecuted for not harming anyone, because "economic liberty must be destroyed"!

Saying that you don't trust someone because of their behavior is completely valid.
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January 27, 2014, 10:16:12 PM
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More victimless "criminals" having the boot stamping on their face forever. Just a matter of time before every single localbitcoins seller is prosecuted for not harming anyone, because "economic liberty must be destroyed"!

Were the guys that DPR put hits on not victims?

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January 27, 2014, 10:21:36 PM
Last edit: January 27, 2014, 10:52:00 PM by TheButterZone
 #9

More victimless "criminals" having the boot stamping on their face forever. Just a matter of time before every single localbitcoins seller is prosecuted for not harming anyone, because "economic liberty must be destroyed"!

Were the guys that DPR put hits on not victims?

1) "Dread Pirate Roberts" is nothing more than a pseudonym the government was able to co-opt once it seized SR's physical servers to use it as a honeypot and identity theft weapon. Identity theft, which it has the sum total of all prosecuted criminals' tactics, on how to execute, itself.
2) Nobody was in the least danger of getting killed or harmed whatsoever, as all the "hitmen" were government agents or bad Samaritans (like the "hitman" that RCMP claimed they couldn't find) and the government's ability to act as "DPR" and manufacture out of whole cloth a tie of that pseudonym to Ross Ulbricht, or anyone on the internet for that matter, establishes reasonable doubt.
3) Guilt by association is indefensible on every level. At the logical extreme, are you are willing to be executed for using a currency also used by mass murderers? Goodbye homo sapiens.
4) Guilt until proven innocence is indefensible.

Saying that you don't trust someone because of their behavior is completely valid.
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January 27, 2014, 10:35:15 PM
 #10

More victimless "criminals" having the boot stamping on their face forever. Just a matter of time before every single localbitcoins seller is prosecuted for not harming anyone, because "economic liberty must be destroyed"!

Were the guys that DPR put hits on not victims?

allegedly.



 
crazy_rabbit (OP)
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January 27, 2014, 11:42:44 PM
 #11

There'll never be a time where they retrospectively prosecute market manipulation. That just doesn't make sense.

I don't think the government would think of it like 'retroactive'. For example with Pirate, (not DPR but the ponzi scheme pirate) he argued in court that the SEC didn't have standing as Bitcoin wasn't real money, (and it wasn't at the time) but a judge says, "Looks like money, smells like money, buys like money- it's money" and just like that Bitcoin came under SEC regulations. It might feel retrospective, but the government could easily say if bitcoin is money, then it's money since the day satoshi powered up his first copy of the bitcoin software. So it would feel retroactive.

I also don't have much sympathy, but thats neither here nor there.

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January 27, 2014, 11:59:54 PM
 #12

The U.S. is a fascist police state. Stick around at your own risk. This goes for anyone btw, not just BTC hodlers.

edit: btw. they could arrest anyone who ever held a bitcoin. Just claim that they were transferred to you one time from a s/d address. The burden of proof is on you. To hell with the constitution and habeas corpus!
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January 28, 2014, 01:41:02 AM
 #13

This won't be the last "early adopter" to get arrested for playing around on the Silk Road. Now they have DRP by the short and curlies, he could be dropping all kinds of names ... all speculation of course.
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January 28, 2014, 01:43:21 AM
 #14

The U.S. is a fascist police state. Stick around at your own risk. This goes for anyone btw, not just BTC hodlers.

edit: btw. they could arrest anyone who ever held a bitcoin. Just claim that they were transferred to you one time from a s/d address. The burden of proof is on you. To hell with the constitution and habeas corpus!
.

I think most american's hate freedom, they prefer regulation and security the liberty imagined in the constitution is for the "nuts" as they call Ron Paul type people. I even heard Ron once complain how hard it is to sell freedom to american's, lets face it most hate the concept and want less of it regarless of what they say just look at the actions of normal american's it's all soviet style regulations they want. So yes I expect more arests and I hope I'm wrong I'm one of the "Ron Paul Nuts"

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January 28, 2014, 02:02:14 AM
 #15

Unprosecuted systemic election tampering and violence against Ron Paul/libertarians at Republican conventions does not mean most Americans hate freedom, it just means the totalitarians in unchecked power do, which is obvious.

Saying that you don't trust someone because of their behavior is completely valid.
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January 28, 2014, 04:03:15 AM
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This won't be the last "early adopter" to get arrested for playing around on the Silk Road. Now they have DRP by the short and curlies, he could be dropping all kinds of names ... all speculation of course.

I said it before and I'll say it again: Bitcoin will NEVER be outlawed in the U.S. or anywhere in the "western world".

They will, rather, use their massive surveillance apparatus to silently show up one morning at your house, shoot your dog, and "arrest" you for your alleged "connection" to s/d. This is much easier for them and you see a very similar thing already happening to protesters in Europe and around the world.
Your guns/plane-tickets should rather be ready before that happens!
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January 28, 2014, 04:10:32 AM
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I'd say most Americans lack a knowledge of what freedom means, from a constitutional perspective. They've been raised (as was I!)  in this system with all the messages and such... Most never really question what they're taught. They just follow the herd, keep their heads down, follow celebrities.

"waking up" as it were, takes a lot of effort and can be frankly painful. Most people resist it with everything they have.


i don't post much, but this space for rent.
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January 28, 2014, 04:38:24 AM
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I'd say most Americans lack a knowledge of what freedom means, from a constitutional perspective. They've been raised (as was I!)  in this system with all the messages and such... Most never really question what they're taught. They just follow the herd, keep their heads down, follow celebrities.

"waking up" as it were, takes a lot of effort and can be frankly painful. Most people resist it with everything they have.



Waking up will take something other than a bunch of internet che guevara wannabes, who btw got his ass holed in while in the jungles of bolivia because reality turned out a little different than his fantasies.

Your kind are the easiest to manipulate. This kind of juvenile bullshit 'rah rah rah fite da powa' is not freedom, neither is it 'exercising your rights'. It's just a whole lot of bitching.

Fish rots from the head. Head of democracy is supposed to be level-headed, courageous and responsible people who have some back bone. Since we got a bunch of internet cunts acting the role, you are the greatest contributor to the degradation of democratic values and freedom - simply because you don't have what it takes to deserve them.

Look to yourself before getting mouthy with the 'establishment'. Can't even take a breather to stop bitching and barking at 'THE MAN'.


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January 28, 2014, 04:39:31 AM
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I'd say most Americans lack a knowledge of what freedom means, from a constitutional perspective. They've been raised (as was I!)  in this system with all the messages and such... Most never really question what they're taught. They just follow the herd, keep their heads down, follow celebrities.

"waking up" as it were, takes a lot of effort and can be frankly painful. Most people resist it with everything they have.



Waking up will take something other than a bunch of internet che guevara wannabes, who btw got his ass holed in while in the jungles of bolivia because reality turned out a little different than his fantasies.

Your kind are the easiest to manipulate. This kind of juvenile bullshit 'rah rah rah fite da powa' is not freedom, neither is it 'exercising your rights'. It's just a whole lot of bitching.

Fish rots from the head. Head of democracy is supposed to be level-headed, courageous and responsible people who have some back bone. Since we got a bunch of internet cunts acting the role, you are the greatest contributor to the degradation of democratic values and freedom - simply because you don't have what it takes to deserve them.

Look to yourself before getting mouthy with the 'establishment'. Can't even take a breather to stop bitching and barking at 'THE MAN'.

Democracy? LOL.

If you aren't the sole controller of your private keys, you don't have any bitcoins.
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January 28, 2014, 04:43:06 AM
 #20

I'd say most Americans lack a knowledge of what freedom means, from a constitutional perspective. They've been raised (as was I!)  in this system with all the messages and such... Most never really question what they're taught. They just follow the herd, keep their heads down, follow celebrities.

"waking up" as it were, takes a lot of effort and can be frankly painful. Most people resist it with everything they have.



Waking up will take something other than a bunch of internet che guevara wannabes, who btw got his ass holed in while in the jungles of bolivia because reality turned out a little different than his fantasies.

Your kind are the easiest to manipulate. This kind of juvenile bullshit 'rah rah rah fite da powa' is not freedom, neither is it 'exercising your rights'. It's just a whole lot of bitching.

Fish rots from the head. Head of democracy is supposed to be level-headed, courageous and responsible people who have some back bone. Since we got a bunch of internet cunts acting the role, you are the greatest contributor to the degradation of democratic values and freedom - simply because you don't have what it takes to deserve them.

Look to yourself before getting mouthy with the 'establishment'. Can't even take a breather to stop bitching and barking at 'THE MAN'.

Democracy? LOL.

Have you personally experienced and lived in any other form of governance that even attempts at such things?

LOL being a mouthy ass critic is fun until you actually have to face the reality of your words. Little pussies who take potshots at their posh surrounding are in for a rude surprise, just like that coward snowden.
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