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Author Topic: Stop Mining for Dollars and Start Mining For Pennies!  (Read 2995 times)
jduck1987
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October 04, 2011, 03:51:03 AM
 #1

I want to announce that Copper Logistics is no longer local sales only. We have opened our initial website at CopperLogistics.com and we accept Bitcoins. We are working on a better way of accepting bitcoins, but until then the current method will have to do. Shipping is free for all bitcoin orders and only $.99 for cash orders. The shipping special is now over
If you know of a good way to take orders or are capable of producing a WP plugin that accepts bitcoin please PM me.

CopperLogistics.com is now a publicly traded company on GLBSE, the asset ID is:
3550ea33a4ea6cc07b5314af218c3216761c8e3fde0f3629da80d1aa970361a5
https://glbse.com/asset/3550ea33a4ea6cc07b5314af218c3216761c8e3fde0f3629da80d1aa970361a5

Copper Logistics is a great way to diversify your investments because we never have money invested that we cant immediately "take to the bank". We purchase pennies from banks $10,00 at a time, sort them and return the unwanted zinc ones to credit unions.

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October 04, 2011, 04:08:45 AM
 #2

Just curious, 146 copper (1909-1982 minted) pennies in 1lb? And current melt value is $0.0203501/penny ?

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jduck1987
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October 04, 2011, 04:18:48 AM
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Just curious, 146 copper (1909-1982 minted) pennies in 1lb? And current melt value is $0.0203501/penny ?

That's about right, the pennies are usually worn down so the count is about 155+ per 1lb. You can use the calculator at http://www.coinflation.com/coins/basemetal_coin_calculator.html to determine the exact melt value at any given stock price change.
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October 04, 2011, 04:25:18 AM
 #4

Have you looked into pre-2011 nickles? Return is higher and diversified into nickle and copper (both growing market values).

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jduck1987
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October 04, 2011, 04:32:40 AM
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Have you looked into pre-2011 nickles? Return is higher and diversified into nickle and copper (both growing market values).

We don't sort for any nickel at this time. We do have several large machines that do nothing but sort silver from nickels (war time) dimes, quarters and halves. But we don't sell to the public.
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October 04, 2011, 05:04:29 AM
 #6

Just curious, 146 copper (1909-1982 minted) pennies in 1lb? And current melt value is $0.0203501/penny ?

That's about right, the pennies are usually worn down so the count is about 155+ per 1lb. You can use the calculator at http://www.coinflation.com/coins/basemetal_coin_calculator.html to determine the exact melt value at any given stock price change.


I just picked my penny jug up and weighed it. About 55lbs, but there are a few dimes, nickels and quarters in there. I am guessing it at over
8k pennies though. Not sure what to do with them, nor am I sure about what years the pennies are. Any ideas?


Thanks.

-ST

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jduck1987
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October 04, 2011, 05:13:14 AM
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Just curious, 146 copper (1909-1982 minted) pennies in 1lb? And current melt value is $0.0203501/penny ?

That's about right, the pennies are usually worn down so the count is about 155+ per 1lb. You can use the calculator at http://www.coinflation.com/coins/basemetal_coin_calculator.html to determine the exact melt value at any given stock price change.


I just picked my penny jug up and weighed it. About 55lbs, but there are a few dimes, nickels and quarters in there. I am guessing it at over
8k pennies though. Not sure what to do with them, nor am I sure about what years the pennies are. Any ideas?


Thanks.

-ST

You could donate them to me  Smiley

Seriously,
You should sort them into copper and non copper, keep the copper and turn the rest into your bank for cash. It wont take as long as you think to sort them by hand if all you have is 8k.
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October 04, 2011, 08:02:54 AM
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so 50btc would yield ~$315 at the current melt value?

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October 04, 2011, 10:21:54 AM
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yes mine those pennies!
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October 04, 2011, 11:44:57 AM
 #10

What about Canadian pennies? What years are copper?

This sounds like a penny analogue to bitcoin mining. The more people mine pennies the less copper ones remain in circulation and the more difficult it gets. So the smart move is to keep the practice secret. Oops, too late.

jduck1987
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October 04, 2011, 01:32:26 PM
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so 50btc would yield ~$315 at the current melt value?

Correct.

What about Canadian pennies? What years are copper?

This sounds like a penny analogue to bitcoin mining. The more people mine pennies the less copper ones remain in circulation and the more difficult it gets. So the smart move is to keep the practice secret. Oops, too late.

Any Canadian penny minted before 1996 it copper.
hmongotaku
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October 04, 2011, 02:59:48 PM
 #12

How about you sorting them, melt them and send me a big fat block? I'll pay you money if you can get me a pure 99.99% purity 10 lb block. Last time I checked when I was a kid the zinc content is much higher? I mean it was basically copper coated and a bit fat zinc core.

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October 04, 2011, 04:11:49 PM
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its the same in the UK any 1p or 2p coin before 1992 melt value is higher than the coins value due to the copper content. But you cannot sell them for there metal value as your not allowed to melt them down.

jduck1987
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October 04, 2011, 04:46:36 PM
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How about you sorting them, melt them and send me a big fat block? I'll pay you money if you can get me a pure 99.99% purity 10 lb block. Last time I checked when I was a kid the zinc content is much higher? I mean it was basically copper coated and a bit fat zinc core.

Only pennies minted before 1982 are 95% copper, all pennies minted after 1982 are 97.5% zinc and 2.5% copper .
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October 04, 2011, 06:04:31 PM
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So at the best price on the website, they are selling 100lbs of pennies for $250. That is 18144 2.5g pennies. Selling $181 for $250 seems like a pretty good business.

The "FAQ" on the webpage doesn't address that this company is likely in violation of now permanent US law by profiting off the metal value of US coins, in excess of the allowed face value exception of $100 or below for numismatic purposes. It is a violation of federal law to smelt (or even export in bulk) US coins. I would expect that when federal agents raid this place, they will also be looking at the mailing lists to discover who has purchased coinage advertised specifically for its value in smelting.

--

April 17, 2007

United States Mint Limits Exportation & Melting of Coins
Final Rule Maintains Policy Established in December

WASHINGTON - The United States Mint today announced a final rule to limit the exportation, melting, or treatment of one-cent (penny) and 5-cent (nickel) United States coins, to safeguard against a potential shortage of these coins in circulation.

United States Mint Director Edmund C. Moy had approved an interim rule on December 12, 2006, to be in effect for 120 days. Enactment of the final rule was pending public comment, solicited during a 30-day period from the date of the interim rule’s publication in the Federal Register on December 20, 2006.

“The new rule safeguards the integrity of U.S. coinage and protects taxpayers from bearing the costs to replace coins withdrawn from circulation,” said Director Moy.

The rising commodity prices of copper, nickel and zinc have increased the value of the metal in both pennies and nickels so that the content of these coins now exceeds their face value. There is concern that speculators could remove pennies and nickels from circulation and sell them as scrap for profit.

The United States Mint has received inquiries from the public over the past several months concerning the metal value of these coins and whether it is legal to melt them. Widespread withdrawal of pennies and nickels from circulation could cause coin shortages, and it would be extremely costly to replenish them, given prevailing metal prices and production costs.

Specifically, the newly enacted final regulation prohibits, with certain exceptions, the exportation, melting or treatment of one-cent and 5-cent coins. Some of the exceptions allow for small amounts of these coins to be exported as pocket change, and for recreational and numismatic purposes. Other exceptions include the treatment of minor quantities of these coins for educational, amusement, novelty, jewelry and similar purposes. However, the public should review the regulation for precise terms and limitations of the exceptions.

The new regulation authorizes a fine of not more than $10,000, or imprisonment of not more than five years, or both, against a person who knowingly violates the regulation. In addition, by law, any coins exported, melted, or treated in violation of the regulation shall be forfeited to the United States Government.

The new rule, and public comments received on the interim rule, appear on the United States Mint website at www.usmint.gov

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October 04, 2011, 06:16:11 PM
 #16

He doesn't melt the coins. Selling coins for metal value is 100% perfectly legal, as long as you don't melt or destroy them. I believe there may be regulations for exporting for melt as well if anyone thinks they might have found a loophole. Look at the example of pre-1964 silver quarters. Those are bought an sold all the time for metal value. No need for wasting money melting it. Just because it is called melt value doesn't mean you have to melt it for it to be worth anything.

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October 04, 2011, 06:27:28 PM
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He doesn't melt the coins. Selling coins for metal value is 100% perfectly legal, as long as you don't melt or destroy them. I believe there may be regulations for exporting for melt as well if anyone thinks they might have found a loophole. Look at the example of pre-1964 silver quarters. Those are bought an sold all the time for metal value. No need for wasting money melting it. Just because it is called melt value doesn't mean you have to melt it for it to be worth anything.

It is not illegal to value pennies at $1.50 for numismatic purposes and encourage collectors to trade them at a different value than face. Just like $2 bills, you can go to the bank and get them for $2, and try to eBay older ones for more. However, the fact that there are metal price charts on the site and essays extolling the value of copper, and misguided predictions that it will be legal to melt the coins for copper puts the website in a harder to defend position of encouraging acquisition of coins as bullion. The law I quoted specifically made one cent and five cent coins illegal to smelt or treat, so the quarter coin example is not a good analogy.

jduck1987
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October 04, 2011, 08:20:10 PM
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It is not illegal to value pennies at $1.50 for numismatic purposes and encourage collectors to trade them at a different value than face. Just like $2 bills, you can go to the bank and get them for $2, and try to eBay older ones for more. However, the fact that there are metal price charts on the site and essays extolling the value of copper, and misguided predictions that it will be legal to melt the coins for copper puts the website in a harder to defend position of encouraging acquisition of coins as bullion. The law I quoted specifically made one cent and five cent coins illegal to smelt or treat, so the quarter coin example is not a good analogy.

The trade of copper pennies (inside the US) as "bullion" is not illegal, it is a descriptive term not a definition. The definition of bullion is:
1. gold or silver considered in mass rather than in value.
2. gold or silver in the form of bars or ingots.
3. Also called bullion fringe, a thick trimming of cord covered with gold or silver thread, for decorating uniforms.
4. embroidery or lace worked with gold wire or gold or silver cords.
 
You don't need to melt the coins into bigger block in order to use them as an investment. The purpose of investing in copper coins is in hopes that one day you will be able to melt them as you can silver coins. Silver coins were at one point protected by the mint (they must be the fourth branch of government) but now they are melted in hoards.

Quote
The authority granted to the Secretary by the Coinage Act of 1965 has been invoked on two prior occasions; in both instances the regulations were implemented as interim rules that were later made permanent until rescinded. In 1967, during the transition from silver to cupro-nickel clad coinage, then-Secretary Fowler authorized regulations that prohibited the exportation, melting, or treatment of all U.S. coins containing silver. 32 FR 7496 (May 20, 1967). In 1974, to stem the unprecedented increase in demand for one-cent coins attributable to speculation that the metal content of the coin would soon exceed its face value, then-Secretary Shultz invoked this authority, approving regulations that limited the exportation, melting, or treatment of one-cent coins. 39 FR 13881 (April 18, 1974). These prior regulations were rescinded in 1969 and 1978, respectively, when the prohibitions were no longer necessary to protect the Nation's coinage. 34 FR 7704 (May 15, 1969); 43 FR 24691 (June 7, 1978).

There is the possibility that you may never be able to melt copper coins, luckily you can still spend the coins. Over the last decade congress has considered no longer minting pennies due to their increasing cost to mint and low economic value. If this were to happen the ban on melting them may be lifted and the value would quickly rise on all pre-1982 pennies.
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October 04, 2011, 08:21:39 PM
 #19

So is this company encouraging back yard cookouts with pennies side dishes?

jduck1987
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October 04, 2011, 08:24:33 PM
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So is this company encouraging back yard cookouts with pennies side dishes?

Please read the post above, I am not encouraging the destruction of copper pennies.
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