Why is it so hard to start community projects in the Bitcoin Talk forum.

[o_e_l_e_o]

-snip-

Yeah, if you run a free and open-to-all competition, giveaway, or similar with a monetary reward at the end, you will be flooded with newbie and alt accounts. And easy way round this is with by charging a small buy in, or requiring every involved account to have earned a minimum amount of merit.

There are some things like this going on, such as hilariousandco running various football betting pools. I would definitely have joined LoyceV's price prediction thread had I known about it - getting the word out is another hurdle that needs to be overcome for things such as this.

[LFC_Bitcoin]

It was my latest idea that triggered the thread. I thought it would be fun to have a type of prediction contest about the Bitcoin price at the time of the next halving. Members put 0.001 ( about £ 2,50 or $3.50) into a locked Bitcoin address, and the one who got closrst to the price, scooped the pool. It would have created some good speculation threads, which would have helped the forum, and if the price of Bitcoin did rocket up, then it could have provided a substantial prize.

The money tied up is negligible, and apart from the initial research, there is no work involved.

Why don’t you start one?
If there was a big enough pot I’d definitely play. You could post post it in the gambling section too, lots of degenerates willing to throw money away there (including myself )

There are some things like this going on, such as hilariousandco running various football betting pools.

I’m currently leading that

Edit - Just looked & you’re 2nd o_e_l_e_o

[Jet Cash]

I did start one in serious discussion, but I closed it due to lack of interest.

[LFC_Bitcoin]

I did start one in serious discussion, but I closed it due to lack of interest.

I guess it’s like anything. To get interest (buyers/customers so to speak) you need to be seen. I don’t know which part of he forum would be your best chance. Bitcoin Discussion is full of spammers.

Maybe the gambling section - Ganbling Discussion. There are 30 of us in hilarious’ Premier League paid pool. I can’t remember how much we had to pay to enter, something like 0.005BTC when the price was around $6,000.
The top 5 at the end of the season get a paid prize.

[OgNasty]

Want a perfect example of why it is so hard to start actual community projects with actual software development?  Take a look at the trust rating for nonnakip: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=69046



After more than 6 years of running a community project with no compensation, refusing to let his site take deposits, and not having 1 single issue result in any wrongdoing, there are users who are currently in DT that have attacked his trust with absolutely no valid reason or evidence.  I am not an alt of nonnakip or vice versa.  We aren't citizens of the same country nor do we live on the same continent even...

If a developer with decades of experience traveling the world giving talks on software development can't donate time over more than 6 years of his life to working on a community project without being attacked by DT members with no technical skills of any kind and a personal axe to grind, why would any regular user try to make any effort for the community at all?

I actually think this example is reason enough for TMAN and owlcatz to be excluded from the trust network by anyone who honestly cares about community projects here.

[bernardos]

Because it seems impossible to find 5 people that trust each other here. As soon as a serious topic comes up there is either a problem regarding DTs or trust ratings or both.

[Jet Cash]

Well I might have another go with this ASIC miner I picked up. A 2013 mining rig is not going to be commercially viable, so it will just be educational, but going back to the basics could be interesting. That is if I can find the schemarics and software to run it. At the moment , I can't even find details of the power connections.

[bill gator]

It was my latest idea that triggered the thread. I thought it would be fun to have a type of prediction contest about the Bitcoin price at the time of the next halving. Members put 0.001 ( about £ 2,50 or $3.50) into a locked Bitcoin address, and the one who got closrst to the price, scooped the pool.

I tried that: Put your money where your mouth is!
It didn't work, nobody joined despite bumping the topic for a while.

It's possible that the people in speculation that are actually willing to put their money where their mouth is, are already doing so and would have very little reason to participate. That being said, I never travel to that section of the forum, but would happily participate in something like that for the fun of it and nothing else. There aren't enough people around here with a sense of community, but as our forum grows this is natural to happen; it's tough for humans to keep track of increasingly large groups in any manner that would resemble trust and camaraderie.

I'd actually love to have a real-life get together with some members here, maybe a barbecue or something with coffee and name tags.  Anonymity and distrust seem to rule the day here, though and I doubt I'll ever get to meet a member face-to-face.  Too bad Jet Cash is in the UK (I think).  Can you put some jet ski skids on your van or something and make your way to the east coast of the US?

Let's start a fund to get Jet Cash over here and let's all go do a meet-and-greet. Decentralization, anonymity, privacy, productivity and high-valued assets all make it difficult to coordinate a meetup. Our shared values as a community are similar to cats, they aren't very socially cohesive qualities.

I would point to trolling of NastyFans ...

The problem is how often this trolling seeps out into "real" life. People calling employers, families, making threats and filing frivolous lawsuits all make regularly trusting people suspicious of any interaction that has personal depth. Then on top of all of this is the increased amount of scrutiny that we put upon one another; our mistakes are magnified, archived and discussed for years and it is rare that anyone is given the benefit of the doubt around here.

Most people who are any good at anything are probably already getting paid to do it somewhere else.

I would've given you merit if I had the spare.

It's a big combination of all of these things. There is regularly more risk than reward when attempting to work as a community, whether that be in-person or online.

[Jet Cash]

Maybe we should try to set up a video conference.

[r1s2g3]

I guess we are much diverse and very few active members.  Each user have different hobby and interest so it become somewhat difficult to get the group of like minded people.

I second OgNasty on the point that community here scrutinize and criticize too much.

[CryptopreneurBrainboss]

I guess we are much diverse and very few active members.  Each user have different hobby and interest so it become somewhat difficult to get the group of like minded people.

That's true although sometimes it isn't the faults of the forum users but that of the community project developers must of them starting this projects has alternative motives while others don't follow up the project and lack of advertising (creating awareness) is the cause of the low turnout or people leaving the project.

[MainIbem]

Undoubtedly, the interests and skills here are diverse. It ought to be harnessed adequately here. It is being harnessed but not coordinated. I have seen several attempts you have made to galvanize this community but most of the time it yields not so many fruits. I think at this point, Theymos should add voice to your efforts.

One thing that creates this inability to coordinate is that most of the persons are more interested in price high than a community outside of price-related stakes. The introduction of merit has put an end to massive account farming and shitposts to a large extent. But there is no reward for members that have been posting fantastic well researched topics and comments other than merits.

I think it is imparative at this point to add a thread on Mete to galvanize these great members like @Jet Cash, @Vod, @The Pharmacist, @LoyceV, @hilariuosandco, @TMAN, @DdmrDdmr and many more. There are also some reputable managers who have performed outstandinly that need to be drawn into this community too. this should be the building foundation of your proposed community.

[Jet Cash]

There are some interesting comments in this thread, and thanks to the posters. My greatest problem seems to be that I'm not here to generate income, and that doesn't fit the current profile for members. I'm a quester of knowledge, and an aspiring political agitator. I'm also a massive supporter of Bitcoin. There will never be another Bitcoin, and I may start a thread explaining why I believe this.

The Bitcoin community is changing, and it has moved a long way from the initial use and community. It started as a few computer guys mining on home computers, and mining is a fundamental component of Bitcoin. It is starting to be restricted to those who can invest large sums of money, and one can see that as halvings reduce the block reward, it may become the domain of the bankers in the future. I believe that it is important for mining to remain decentralised, but current Bitcoin Talk moderation is preventing the entry of "hobby" miners, and helping the large financial organisations take control in the future. They are already buying up coins to reduce liquidity.

Motivation is generated by having a vision and a goal, and when the vision becomes blurred, then the goal becomes less important. I think this is why so many of my projects fall by the wayside. I have quite a few outside interests - hence the collection of the computer scrap, and sometimes these coincide with my activities in bitcoin talk. The ASIC miner is one example, and I think it is sad that I have had to create yet another forum to discuss and collate information about mining for beginners. I will be bringing some of the information back to Bitcoin Talk, and I hope it will encourage a few new miners to maintain decentralisation.

[GreatOrchid]

Community projects bond members of a group, and can be mutually beneficial. It seems almost impossible to start and maintain such project, and this seems to apply to fun activities as well as more serious commercial activities. Why is this? Is it that we don't trust each other, or that we don't want to work together? I appreciate that there is a wide diversity of skills and interests in the forum, but there must be a few groups with common interests.

We have a vast community over here and do you really think we can trust each of them? It is not that hard to start a community project here if you are loyal and have everything pre-planned. All you need is a lot of hard work to start something like this and that's the reason not everyone can start a communication project over here. We can trust each other to a extend untill money isn't involved because as soon as money comes into, relations are left un-noticed. If you have a great concept and that needs to be reached to the community outside than you have the whole and sole right to start a new startup but it should be trustworthy!

[OgNasty]

I second OgNasty on the point that community here scrutinize and criticize too much.

It isn't scrutiny or criticism that is my concern.  That is healthy.  It's outright attacking projects with lies and continuing to repeat them so frequently that people start wondering if there's any shred of truth to them.  You'd think forum rules would protect against such trolling, but these users hide behind a shroud of ignorance, and while their posts seem to be protected under the guise of free speech...

I imagine everyone who cares about the forum would love to see these injustices righted by the community using a decentralized trust system, but for some reason everyone turns a blind eye.  It's harming this community in ways you'll never see, because talented developers will just move on to other projects as opposed to dealing with people like owlcatz and TMAN dirtying their name with fraudulent abusive ratings using their undeserved positions in the trust network.

Want a perfect example of why it is so hard to start actual community projects with actual software development?  Take a look at the trust rating for nonnakip: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=69046



After more than 6 years of running a community project with no compensation, refusing to let his site take deposits, and not having 1 single issue result in any wrongdoing, there are users who are currently in DT that have attacked his trust with absolutely no valid reason or evidence.  I am not an alt of nonnakip or vice versa.  We aren't citizens of the same country nor do we live on the same continent even...

If a developer with decades of experience traveling the world giving talks on software development can't donate time over more than 6 years of his life to working on a community project without being attacked by DT members with no technical skills of any kind and a personal axe to grind, why would any regular user try to make any effort for the community at all?

I actually think this example is reason enough for TMAN and owlcatz to be excluded from the trust network by anyone who honestly cares about community projects here.

[Jet Cash]

I can understand why some people need to conceal their identities, but I've never made any serious attempts to do this. However, I may need to do this as I become more active politically. I can see from recent actions that the City of London elite are planning to replace the failing EU with a post fake Brexit Britain, ad that is going to cause massive disruption around the world. It will also create lots of profit from all the local wars and regime changes that they will start. I'll probably become completely mobile and off-grid to take me through this period. Thank goodness for Bitcoin.

The trust issue is a massive concern though. If 1,000 contributions of 0.001 Bitcoin were made into a pool, and Bitcoin did go to the moon, that could result in a massive prize in fiat terms. This was why I suggested that the management should be undertaken by a few trusted legendaries, but as soon as you suggest this, then people start saying it is elitist. Good luck with trying to find a brand new member to include as a trustee.