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Author Topic: Avalon A10 series announced  (Read 1967 times)
sarcheer
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April 03, 2019, 02:00:39 PM
Last edit: April 04, 2019, 12:14:10 AM by frodocooper
Merited by frodocooper (1)
 #41

Just noticed, this is using 16nm chips!

Quote from the product page:

240 x A3205 Third Gen 16nm ASIC

Miners:
Avalon 1041, Whatsminer M10, Antminer T15 x 2, DragonMint T1 x 3, Innosilicon T2T, R4 x 2
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April 03, 2019, 02:48:59 PM
 #42

Have we worked out that these are standalone devices? i.e. if you just buy one A10 then you don't need anything else? Just http to the management interface on the miner itself?

Does that mean that if you have the choice of running them individually, each unit plugged into a switch ala most other miners out there, or you can just have one plugged into the network and all the others daisy chained off that one miner via rj45 cables?

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April 03, 2019, 02:59:21 PM
Last edit: April 03, 2019, 03:27:43 PM by NotFuzzyWarm
 #43

good question. However, the pics do not show any RJ45 jacks - only the I2C ones. Then again, we know Canaan is rather, um, 'iffy' with their pics.

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April 03, 2019, 03:26:24 PM
 #44

Just noticed, this is using 16nm chips!

Hmmmm, that would be interesting to see them go back. Maybe they noticed MicroBT's results. I think it's more likely whoever made the product information page slipped up a little. In the past it's generally a copy past of older hardware then they edit it with the new specs. We'll just have to wait on Steven to come back and enlighten us a bit.

Biffa-

I think there will still be need for the controller, not positive. For the networking I believe that you will be using the rj45 cables in place of the AUC cables. So only 1 device whether that be the PI/Controller is connected to the router/switch, then the rest are connected in the same fashion as previous models just a different cable.

I could be wrong but that's my understanding of the info given. I'm interested to hear more from Steven on this, it's all pretty cool. Especially the option to have a built in PSU or not.

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April 03, 2019, 03:46:50 PM
 #45

Just based on the price speculation I'm thinking controller is built in but will have daisy chain maybe like GMO designs with cat cables? Hopefully we'll get some more insights soon.

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April 03, 2019, 08:55:46 PM
 #46

... and some info that no one already knows Smiley
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April 04, 2019, 04:14:33 AM
 #47

We got solid confirm on pricing. Thanks to everyone from Canaan we've been talking with lately.

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April 08, 2019, 07:11:36 AM
Merited by HagssFIN (1)
 #48

... and some info that no one already knows Smiley
It's AB (overt of course)
... and I checked one mining on the pool, it was getting 31.89TH/s for an hour of shares.
(advertised rate is 31+TH/s)

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April 08, 2019, 11:41:38 PM
 #49

Canaan makes great hardware no doubt.  This just.. simply is priced too high for what it is unfortunately.  Please keep in mind the m10 was under $800 not too long ago and had better specs than this asic.
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April 09, 2019, 12:05:59 AM
 #50

Canaan makes great hardware no doubt.  This just.. simply is priced too high for what it is unfortunately.  Please keep in mind the m10 was under $800 not too long ago and had better specs than this asic.

it may be a bit more efficient somewhere I saw 50 watts a th as best number and the m10 was more like 58 watts a th at best number.

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April 09, 2019, 12:07:11 AM
 #51

Canaan makes great hardware no doubt.  This just.. simply is priced too high for what it is unfortunately.  Please keep in mind the m10 was under $800 not too long ago and had better specs than this asic.
No the M10 didn't.

Simple math:
The M10 is around 71W/Th in normal running mode 31/34TH
Better than 71W/Th was only gained by lowering the hash rate.

The A10 claimed specs are 56W/Th in normal running mode 31TH
No idea how good these will be with a lower hash rate - but the Avalon it's possible for full control of the Freq/Volt from the web page.

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April 09, 2019, 12:10:58 AM
Last edit: April 09, 2019, 12:31:44 AM by frodocooper
 #52

No the M10 didn't.

Simple math:
The M10 is around 71W/Th in normal running mode 31/34TH

The A10 claimed specs are 56W/Th in normal running mode 31TH

My bad, and my m10 never runs 71w/th lmao.  It's def more like 60w-65/th- and literally half the price... shipped.  So... m10 avg is like 65w/th (normal power) and 33th at $780 shipped vs 56w/th (normal power assuming) 31th $1500 + shipping.  Like.. seriously.  I mean hey, if people are willing to pay literally double the price for.. a little less power used then more power to them.  On paper though that sounds like a absolutely absurd idea.
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April 09, 2019, 12:35:14 AM
Last edit: April 09, 2019, 12:42:46 AM by frodocooper
 #53

My bad, and my m10 never runs 71w/th lmao.  It's def more like 60w-65/th- and literally half the price... shipped.  So... m10 avg is like 65w/th (normal power) and 33th at $780 shipped vs 56w/th (normal power assuming) 31th $1500 + shipping.  Like.. seriously.  I mean hey, if people are willing to pay literally double the price for.. a little less power used then more power to them.  On paper though that sounds like a absolutely absurd idea.

Yes, you made a case about the cost already, not sure why you are repeating it, but you stated "and had better specs than this asic."
Which is what I was correcting.

... though I will add that Canaan has the best record for reliability and support ...

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April 09, 2019, 12:41:50 AM
Last edit: April 09, 2019, 12:42:30 AM by frodocooper
 #54

Yes, you made a case about the cost already, not sure why you are repeating it, but you stated "and had better specs than this asic."
Which is what I was correcting.

... though I will add that Canaan has the best record for reliability and support ...

Will def agree on that.  Not that I have any any issues at all with my m10's but just in general.  Canaans reliability I know for years to be well.
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April 09, 2019, 02:20:02 AM
 #55

A10 at stock spec is best over s15, m10, m10s. Pricing at 1.2k on canaan's site is pretty on par with the way this market is now. I believe the July release is the only barrier to making it a no brainer.

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April 09, 2019, 02:40:58 AM
 #56

A10 at stock spec is best over s15, m10, m10s. Pricing at 1.2k on canaan's site is pretty on par with the way this market is now. I believe the July release is the only barrier to making it a no brainer.

S15 is  60 high 50 low ------- cant buy it
m10 is 69 high 59 low ------- cant buy it
a1021 is supposed to be   56 high 50 low

I will get at least

 1 A1021
 1 s17  maybe the cheapest model
 1 m20 72 th on order

evaluate all three  and decide which one I will get a lot of.

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April 09, 2019, 10:19:49 AM
 #57

I might just get 12 of these guys instead of the S17, gonna wait and see for another month
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April 11, 2019, 06:07:41 PM
 #58

Just noticed, this is using 16nm chips!

Quote from the product page:

240 x A3205 Third Gen 16nm ASIC

Very well, i hope, really that they also plan to come with a 12nm part and 7nm part. MicroBT is good competition but more is netter.

I'm not very sure $1200 for 31T will look very enticing vs, say. 33T for $785 (especially with that tax in the US), but lets see who makes the first independent review, maybe its quiet or can be made more efficient.



Model NameAvalonMiner 10
Hash Rate31TH/s,-5%~+5%
Power Consumption1736 Watts,-5%~+15%(On Wall)
(Minimum, Variant power consumption at different temperature and speed)
Power Efficiency56J/TH,-5%~+15%
Power Supply Input176~264V AC 50~60Hz 7.5~10A
Chips240 x A3205 Third Gen 16nm ASIC
Smart ControllerCanaan Kendryte K210 Artificial Intelligence SOC
ConnectionRJ45, Up to 254 Miners(theory) Daisy-Chain Connection
Operating Temperature-10℃~35℃
Air-intake Temperature-10℃~35℃
Cooling2 x 12038 FAN
Noise70db (Typical)
Net Dimensions190mm x 190mm x 292mm
Net Weight7.9kg

I know they might just want to sound "advanced" and all, but that description is kinda scary. AI System On Chip? What else does that thing do besides handling the Asics?

PS: Repost per request of moderator.

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April 15, 2019, 01:07:58 PM
Last edit: April 16, 2019, 12:47:43 AM by frodocooper
Merited by frodocooper (2), philipma1957 (1), NotFuzzyWarm (1), HagssFIN (1)
 #59

Have we worked out that these are standalone devices? i.e. if you just buy one A10 then you don't need anything else? Just http to the management interface on the miner itself?

Does that mean that if you have the choice of running them individually, each unit plugged into a switch ala most other miners out there, or you can just have one plugged into the network and all the others daisy chained off that one miner via rj45 cables?

A miner consists of 2 hash boards and a  MMU.  the PMU is gone. The MMU ( miner management unit ) has two  versions, and this will quickly transition to 1 version.

The first version uses the old style rasb pi  to AUC.  My best estimate is that only a few machines will be built in that style.

In parallel we are finalizing test on a new style MMU  that has  RJ45  instead of the old 5 pin connector. with this version, the PI will be gone, the AUC will be gone and machines will daisy chain over ethernet. no real limit on how many you can chain..

This MMU is up and working, final gerber released and so  mass pro will switch over  ASAP.  If you get a AUC  version, we will probably have a  replacement MMU ( with RJ45)  to upgrade. I ordered the parts to do this.



I know they might just want to sound "advanced" and all, but that description is kinda scary. AI System On Chip? What else does that thing do besides handling the Asics?

The  AI chip is here

https://kendryte.com/

https://kendryte.com/downloads/

it's not scary.



... and I checked one mining on the pool, it was getting 31.89TH/s for an hour of shares.
(advertised rate is 31+TH/s)

I was running at 38TH earlier today  at 40C in the enviromental test lab. fun times.



Hmmmm, that would be interesting to see them go back. Maybe they noticed MicroBT's results. I think it's more likely whoever made the product information page slipped up a little. In the past it's generally a copy past of older hardware then they edit it with the new specs. We'll just have to wait on Steven to come back and enlighten us a bit.

Biffa-

I think there will still be need for the controller, not positive. For the networking I believe that you will be using the rj45 cables in place of the AUC cables. So only 1 device whether that be the PI/Controller is connected to the router/switch, then the rest are connected in the same fashion as previous models just a different cable.

I could be wrong but that's my understanding of the info given. I'm interested to hear more from Steven on this, it's all pretty cool. Especially the option to have a built in PSU or not.

Nope its 16nm  because the wafer cost per TH on yeilded die is lower on 16nm than 7nm.

No controller required in the RJ45  version, cgminer runs on the AI chip,  dual core  risc V.

I think the option with the non integrated PSU will probably rule the day, especially when folks figure out that if you have the right PSU, you can run it   above 31TH.. (31 TH is running about 1/2 the max clock) you'll take an effciiency hit that more than pays for itself at lower power prices.  

The purchasing decision and operating decisions become a bit more complex when you look at running the machine in max effciency mode ( say 24TH ) versus running it in max hash rate mode ( 38+ today) And how do I just put one number on the spec sheet? and then you have to factor in how efficiency changes with ambient temp.

Its almost like an AI problem. just kidding. But I do foresee customers who will now have fine grain control of the frequency that is tied to the actual operating conditions of their farm.

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April 15, 2019, 05:05:13 PM
 #60

This is a nice luxury to have you here Steve. Thanks for the info.

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