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Author Topic: SENDING BITCOIN WITHOUT THE INTERNET  (Read 692 times)
Kadal Ijo
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April 02, 2019, 05:08:30 AM
 #21

Bitcoin is very dependent on the internet, without bitcoin internet it cannot be used because bitcoin works with inter-block verification and needs an internet network, this is what makes bitcoin development very slow in third countries.

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April 02, 2019, 05:39:17 AM
 #22

You have to know, that today the Samourai wallet has a new platform that can create BTC transactions without the internet, and always keep privacy. so,  the transaction of BTC delivery can be created only by SMS. and it's very simple and easy.

Samourai wallet has a goTenna partner, goTenna is a company that produces communication devices without internet. maybe you can try this application.


It's worth trying, but I'm worried that if the number of users continues to increase, they won't be able to receive text messages, maybe they are working on them and this is more risky than we are connected to the internet.
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April 02, 2019, 05:58:51 AM
 #23

Another weird way to do this is to create loads of paper wallets and to fund them with small amounts. You then physically pay someone with these paper wallets, like you would have done when you used cash. The receiver can use these paper wallets in the same way or he can sweep those wallets, when he/she gets access to the internet again.

This is just a short-term solution, if the internet is unreliable for short periods or if someone wants to be off-chain for another reason.  Roll Eyes

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April 02, 2019, 06:32:53 AM
 #24

Hello guys, So I got involved in some argument yesterday, that it was possible to carry out a bitcoin transaction without the internet, some of my friends argued that it was impossible that the internet wasn't built that way, that there must be internet before this can ever happen.

Below is what I read from Bitcoin In Practice 1 been handled by Andreas Antonopoulos:

True cold storage” means that the private keys have never been on a networked computer or device, i.e. they have been
generated offline and without intermediaries. The signing of outgoing transactions (signed with those keys) also occurs
offline. This method is more common for long-term storage of large funds that you will not be sending out very frequently,
as it is generally impractical for everyday use. You can still safely use the addresses to send bitcoins to them, as well as to
check their balances.

From the above statement, it shows it's possible to send bitcoin from one's wallet to another wallet while the sender can perform this offline. This doesn't mean is not going to get verified online on the blockchain.

I want to hear your response about this submission.

Thanks


Ok, so Mocacinno has already answered your doubt so I will not repeat that again! Rather I will give you a whole new perspective of offline bitcoin transaction or no-internet bitcoin transaction. It is certainly possible to send bitcoin transaction without the internet. Please read the below news,

https://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-coders-send-international-lightning-payment-over-ham-radio

So after reading this article, you know that bitcoin transaction can be sent without internet that looks good for experiments but at the same time it is not practical!

yes, anyway you need Intenet.. only in case you have a physical btc coin. but that's a rare thing nowadays.
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April 02, 2019, 10:44:11 AM
 #25

Another weird way to do this is to create loads of paper wallets and to fund them with small amounts. You then physically pay someone with these paper wallets, like you would have done when you used cash.
This is true, but what would be stopping me from printing the same paper wallet multiple times? I can continue to hand out the same paper wallet and the same bitcoin to as many people as I want until someone transfers the bitcoin out of that address. Or I could quite easily keep a copy of the private key for myself, pay someone using a paper wallet (or even multiple people using the same wallet), and then transfer the funds back to myself.
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April 02, 2019, 03:19:52 PM
 #26

Isn't there a satellite that's been launched to do that very thing?
Isn't it the BlockStream you are referring to mate? If that is real then we can now access or transact even without an internet connection. Internet connection is one of the most problem most especially to areas with slow or no network connections. It will surely be a good news to each and everyone of us that truly supports Bitcoin. Sending Bitcoin even without internet connection could be a big impact to the community and adoption will surely be going up.



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Rainbot
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April 02, 2019, 03:44:25 PM
 #27

Seems like you're getting a bit confused here...
Simply put: it IS possible to create an airgapped setup so your private keys never touch an online machine... However, you'll need an ONLINE watch-only wallet to scan the blockchain looking for unspent outputs funding your address and create unsigned transactions.
These unsigned transactions are then moved to the offline (airgapped) machine for signing, and the signed transaction has to be moved back to an online machine for broadcasting.

If a signed transaction is not broadcasted to the network, it won't end up in the mempool of a mining node, so it has 0 chance of getting into a block (getting confirmed)
Very informative reply if not until your clarification I have always believed that bitcoin transactions can be done offline as most ops have always said bit just waiting to how that is being done without the use of the internet. But now I know how send bitcoin is done in an offline mod.
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April 02, 2019, 07:03:45 PM
 #28

I was rather thinking of this to finally take its space, soon but other words I also know that private key was only used to protect the finds we have in our wallets according to the statement, we definitely will need the internet to sign in and out of it.

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April 02, 2019, 09:46:51 PM
 #29

It is impossible not to use the internet in bitcoin transactions or anything. We can send bitcoin by using a bitcoin atm. But this cannot be used throughout the world.

Indeed mate, for my own knowledge about bitcoin it's really impossible doing transactions for sending without an internet. You're right using atm for online transaction would be the fastest option to have with. Personally I haven't yet experience doing such thing without the web network connection, that's why I supported that idea regarding btc cannot be sent without internet. However, I am not certain with other types of wallet like those hardware wallets if there's a probability of sending using an offline features
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April 03, 2019, 03:32:08 AM
 #30

I think is impossible to happen to send bitcoin through offline or no internet connection because sending bitcoin is really need to connect to internet so the information will be updated . Maybe if you are sender of the bitcoin you really needed first the internet before you send but if you are the reciever even your offline is okay because once you reciever online using the internet the data will be update but all the time when you are using bitcoin internet is necessary.
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April 03, 2019, 04:47:53 AM
 #31

You have to know, that today the Samourai wallet has a new platform that can create BTC transactions without the internet, and always keep privacy. so,  the transaction of BTC delivery can be created only by SMS. and it's very simple and easy.

Samourai wallet has a goTenna partner, goTenna is a company that produces communication devices without internet. maybe you can try this application.


It's worth trying, but I'm worried that if the number of users continues to increase, they won't be able to receive text messages, maybe they are working on them and this is more risky than we are connected to the internet.

What about the text message , the one that we use on our mobile phones  . there is also a huge number of users that are using text message but a network company can still handle them . same goes to samorai wallet and its provider     .   its also my first time to hear such strategy of using bitcoin offline  . they are genius and they are doing a great job .  i hope this idea can grow on other wallet providers   .
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April 03, 2019, 06:53:42 AM
 #32

I think is impossible to happen to send bitcoin through offline or no internet connection because sending bitcoin is really need to connect to internet so the information will be updated . Maybe if you are sender of the bitcoin you really needed first the internet before you send but if you are the reciever even your offline is okay because once you reciever online using the internet the data will be update but all the time when you are using bitcoin internet is necessary.
Internet is very important nowadays, in order to make transactions we barely needed or it is necessary to have an internet to communicate from one to another. People are now commonly used internet connection not only because it is reliable but also it is an efficient way.

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April 03, 2019, 07:38:11 AM
 #33

I do not see it from that point of view, you may have confused some concepts, because until now to make transactions with Bitcoin you need to have Internet service, and this turns out to be a limitation for sites where it fails or simply does not exist. For now we will continue to depend on the Internet service to operate with cryptocurrency.

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April 03, 2019, 08:06:19 AM
 #34

I never do it sending bitcoin without use internet, maybe team and bitcoin development have new way how to sent bitcoin without use internet like have wallet could access every where.
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April 03, 2019, 08:25:37 AM
 #35

I do not see it from that point of view, you may have confused some concepts, because until now to make transactions with Bitcoin you need to have Internet service, and this turns out to be a limitation for sites where it fails or simply does not exist. For now we will continue to depend on the Internet service to operate with cryptocurrency.
Bitcoin also will be having transaction without internet, yes, that is possible there's a wallet that can transact bitcoin without internet but I think that is temporary, it still needs internet to have an update on blockchain transaction. As I read the article "Samourai wallet" can do that thing. Please refer to this link to read more regarding offline wallet. https://usethebitcoin.com/sending-bitcoin-without-internet-or-satellite-is-now-a-reality/
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April 03, 2019, 08:36:37 AM
 #36

OP you went into wrong point and mocacinno explained everything well, I won't touch this task.
Btw currently not but possibly in future it will be available to send bitcoin without internet, there were a lot of ideas.
1. You have online wallet provider which you trust, send it message to send btc from your wallet to another wallet.
2. There was an idea of radio signals used specially for bitcoin which you would access with some small equipment attached to your smartphone, similar of GPS.

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April 03, 2019, 01:27:52 PM
 #37

I do not see it from that point of view, you may have confused some concepts, because until now to make transactions with Bitcoin you need to have Internet service, and this turns out to be a limitation for sites where it fails or simply does not exist. For now we will continue to depend on the Internet service to operate with cryptocurrency.
Bitcoin also will be having transaction without internet, yes, that is possible there's a wallet that can transact bitcoin without internet but I think that is temporary, it still needs internet to have an update on blockchain transaction. As I read the article "Samourai wallet" can do that thing. Please refer to this link to read more regarding offline wallet. https://usethebitcoin.com/sending-bitcoin-without-internet-or-satellite-is-now-a-reality/

Still trying to figure out how that will work since blockchain itself and mining is internet based. But i'm also intetrested why there are people who really believes it's possible. How? Probably a transfer from one hardware wallet to another through a link cable between two devices?


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April 03, 2019, 01:44:29 PM
 #38

Still trying to figure out how that will work since blockchain itself and mining is internet based. But i'm also intetrested why there are people who really believes it's possible. How? Probably a transfer from one hardware wallet to another through a link cable between two devices?

Well, there's a distinction between being able to create unsigned transactions, creating (or signing) signed transactions, broadcasting transactions and making sure those transactions are confirmed.

Once can easily create a cold storage setup, walktroughs are available for core, electrum and samurai (apparently... I haven't checked out the links in this topic). With a cold storage setup, one creates an unsigned transaction on an ONLINE machine, uses a medium to transfer said transaction to the cold storage device and sign it.
At this point, one can THEORETICALLY move the signed transaction back on a storage device and send the device to a big miner in an offline fashion... Theoretically, a miner *could* run his mining farm offline, but he'd have to have an online machine that builds a mempool and receives the latest blocks, each time a new valid block was received, the mining pool operator would have to download the block and the top 1Mb (without witness data) of his mempool onto a stick and transfer it to his offline mining pool... If he would succesfully find a header whose sha256d hash is under the current target, the operator would have to transfer the result back to the online machine to broadcast the new, valid block... So this whole setup is completely theoretically and not usable in reality. And even with this setup, the transaction would eventually have to end up in a block that's broadcasted to the network, or it would remain unconfirmed (even unknown) forever.

If you would pay somebody by creating a transaction spending unspent outputs funding your address with an airgapped setup and give this transaction to the receiver but asking him to never broadcast the transaction, the receiver would never be sure he got payed correctly, since you can always create multiple transactions spending the same unspent outputs. It's only when a transaction is included in a valid block, and this block becomes part of the blockchain, the transaction becomes immutable and the receiver is sure you cannot "steal" his funds anymore... So just sending signed transactions between hardware devices without broadcasting might be theoretically possible, but completely worthless (in bitcoin terms)

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April 03, 2019, 02:10:17 PM
 #39

Lol. it can't happen friend. Grin honestly I have never heard of sending bitcoin without an internet network. Even though there are bitcoin ATMs in your country, you still have to use the internet network and you cannot ofline.

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April 03, 2019, 02:31:59 PM
 #40

I never do it sending bitcoin without use internet, maybe team and bitcoin development have new way how to sent bitcoin without use internet like have wallet could access every where.
I agree with what you say, while currently bitcoin still needs an internet network to access it. but I hope that bitcoin companies can make access without internet networks in the future. Do you agree? Wink
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