[2] US children wrongfully detained.

[bones261]

I don't care if the kids have to be held for months. They shouldn't be released until their parents are there to get them. The parents should have been with them to cross a national border in the first place. This is the fault of the parents.

The border patrol has no business detaining US citizens for months. (Unless the US citizens are smuggling something.) First of all, only 1 of the two children involved was having their identity questioned. They knew the 14 year old brother was a US citizen and should have allowed the parents to become involved much sooner. Furthermore, any fault of the parents does not absolve the border patrol of any mishandling on their part. Actually, the parents were not at fault. They had sent the children with a trusted adult friend to escort, as they had done in the past without incident. Unfortunately, the port of entry was extremely backlogged, and the friend thought it would be more expedient to have the children walk through and call them an uber to take them to school.  This matter should have taken a few hours at most to resolve, not 32 hours.

[TECSHARE]

"One time there may or may not have been racism, therefore our borders need not be enforced." Cool story bro.

   Enforced against who? Brown skinned US citizens?   Even you conceded above that this is stepping over the line. If someone has valid documentation that they are a US citizen, they need to be let in, without undue delay and hassle. Not be detained unjustly for 23 days, while the US fucking bureaucracy finally figures out that they made a mistake.

I see, you are playing the dumb game that bluefirecorp_ is pretending that this detainment was totally unrelated to illegal immigration enforcement and prevention too. Just because it is not preferable doesn't mean they should stop doing their jobs. What is "valid US documentation" is subjective. People can have fake ID, or the ID of other people that is either bought or stolen. I don't like that this happened, but I also don't pretend that they purposely detained these people just because they were brown and they could. That is bullshit and I think you know damn well it is.

Perhaps if there was not a certain group of people purposely obstructing border enforcement funding, they wouldn't be so backlogged and could have processed them faster? They are trying to do their jobs and they made a mistake. I don't find that any more acceptable than all of these idiots telling these people they can come here illegally and get all kinds of entitlements, resulting in a situation where the border patrol and court system is overwhelmed, which directly results in situations like these. One is happening far more than the other though. Then after denying responsibility for their part in it, the leftists then point fingers at any enforcement action taken and LAARP that they are fighting Nazis and concentration camps. The border needs to be enforced. All of this mass hysteria over border enforcement is based on delusional uncontrolled emotions, not logic or facts.

First of all, funding for immigration services has increased since Trump has been in office. The only concern Trump seems to be having is that ample funds are not being earmarked for his Wall Project, something he promised that he would make Mexico pay for, which is not happening. I think ~25 billion dollars should be enough for Homeland Security to ensure that any mistakes such as this are quickly resolved. It should not take 23 days or even 32 hours to sort this out. Also, "valid US documentation" is not subjective. The document is either real and belongs to the holder, or not. There is no gray area.
Also, it is not bullshit that these mistakes are made only for people with a darker complexion. I seriously doubt someone with blue eyes or blond hair is going to have to be concerned that their valid documents are going to be mistaken to be fake.

Increase by how much? A dollar? Technically a dollar would be an increase, but the rise in traffic has increased many times over. Has funding increased proportional to the amount of traffic? I don't think so. Good thing we have you here to tell us which budgets are enough. Why aren't you working at the GAO?

Let me ask you a question... If I were to say that a large percentage of the local taco shop's customers are probably Mexicans, would you consider that racist? Is it racist or just a natural consequence of the fact that Mexicans culturally tend to enjoy tacos? We are talking about the US/Mexican border here, as a consequence of this, the most likely ethnicity of people attempting to cross this border illegally are (GASP!) Mexicans. You are building this narrative as if they were stopped because border patrol is racist and just enjoys harassing brown skinned people, when the reality is they fit the characteristics of a common demographic of people attempting to cross illegally.

A similar narrative is pushed with the black community, where blacks comprise approximately 13% of the US population, but over 50% of the murders. Criminal activity has nothing to do with race, but a common culture. Blacks are not inherently criminals any more than Mexicans are inherently illegal aliens. This whole screaming racism act is just designed to distract from the cultural rot present within these communities so it can never be addressed. Who is the real racist? Those perpetuating the problems or those pointing them out so it can be addressed?

People swear this is because of racism, and not a culture of criminal activity and unwillingness to work with law enforcement. Every time some one is shot, even if they were armed and engaged in criminal activity, it is because of "racism". As a result police pull back enforcement from these neighborhoods, and then it gets even worse and they blame police for doing nothing. Given this country has become a police state, and that needs to change, but you also must understand that these kind of lies give these cops all they motivation and justification they need to further increase this lock down martial law type mentality. Who knew when you treat police like the enemy they treat you like the enemy? Funny how they works huh? This country is being pigeon holed into becoming a 3rd world country by exploiting the naive aimless empathy of its population. Empathy is good. Blind and unconditional empathy is dangerous.

[bill gator]

Click the 2nd link.

Originally there wasn't a second link. You added that with your last edit, which was after my post; I don't see how that responds to anything I said.

[bluefirecorp_]

Click the 2nd link.

Originally there wasn't a second link. You added that with your last edit, which was after my post; I don't see how that responds to anything I said.

This thread is about indexing wrongfully detained children, not about bickering about immigration reform.

Not my fault the data set isn't complete.

[TECSHARE]

Click the 2nd link.

Originally there wasn't a second link. You added that with your last edit, which was after my post; I don't see how that responds to anything I said.

This thread is about indexing wrongfully detained children, not about bickering about immigration reform.

Not my fault the data set isn't complete.

This is a collection of words, not a thread.

[bluefirecorp_]

This is a collection of words, not a thread.

So, we all know you're stupid, but when there's multiple posts under a single topic on forum like programs, that's called a "thread". Sometimes, places like reddit and 4chan and even facebook use the term "thread" to summarize these things.

Now, that you understand the word "thread", can you use it in a sentence for the rest of the class?

[BADecker]

Down for any detainment of kids that are innocent.

The kids ain't innocent. They simply haven't developed and honed their guilt skills yet.

[TECSHARE]

This is a collection of words, not a thread.

So, we all know you're stupid, but when there's multiple posts under a single topic on forum like programs, that's called a "thread". Sometimes, places like reddit and 4chan and even facebook use the term "thread" to summarize these things.

Now, that you understand the word "thread", can you use it in a sentence for the rest of the class?

You claim this discussion is about detaining children, not about immigration. Technically this is a collection of words. Since you are pretending this discussion has nothing to do with immigration I thought I would join you in pretend time and pretend that this is a collection of words that has nothing to do with a thread.

[bones261]

Let me ask you a question... If I were to say that a large percentage of the local taco shop's customers are probably Mexicans, would you consider that racist? Is it racist or just a natural consequence of the fact that Mexicans culturally tend to enjoy tacos? We are talking about the US/Mexican border here, as a consequence of this, the most likely ethnicity of people attempting to cross this border illegally are (GASP!) Mexicans. You are building this narrative as if they were stopped because border patrol is racist and just enjoys harassing brown skinned people, when the reality is they fit the characteristics of a common demographic of people attempting to cross illegally.

A similar narrative is pushed with the black community, where blacks comprise approximately 13% of the US population, but over 50% of the murders. Criminal activity has nothing to do with race, but a common culture. Blacks are not inherently criminals any more than Mexicans are inherently illegal aliens. This whole screaming racism act is just designed to distract from the cultural rot present within these communities so it can never be addressed. Who is the real racist? Those perpetuating the problems or those pointing them out so it can be addressed?

People swear this is because of racism, and not a culture of criminal activity and unwillingness to work with law enforcement. Every time some one is shot, even if they were armed and engaged in criminal activity, it is because of "racism". As a result police pull back enforcement from these neighborhoods, and then it gets even worse and they blame police for doing nothing. Given this country has become a police state, and that needs to change, but you also must understand that these kind of lies give these cops all they motivation and justification they need to further increase this lock down martial law type mentality. Who knew when you treat police like the enemy they treat you like the enemy? Funny how they works huh? This country is being pigeon holed into becoming a 3rd world country by exploiting the naive aimless empathy of its population. Empathy is good. Blind and unconditional empathy is dangerous.

   OMG, what you just described above is the very definition of making stereotypes based on race.    I have no idea what your ethnicity is; however it does appear that you have little understanding of the inconvenience caused when people make assumptions (prejudice) based on the color of someone's skin. I do have experience in this area. What is disconcerting in my case is that people make assumptions on my ethnicity based on the darker tone in my skin. In reality, I am of mostly European decent and my skin color is probably caused by one great-grandparent being Hawaiian and another great-grandparent being Croatian.
   An officer should never assume that they have "probable cause" that someone is up to no good based on what they assume their ethnicity is.
   However, after looking at the particular case involving the 9 year old girl, It appears that her and her brother were unaccompanied. Therefore, the fact that they were initially taken into custody probably had to do with that fact, rather than their skin color. However, I still do not think it should have taken 32 hours until their mother could regain custody. Also, once they confirmed that the 14 year son was a US citizen, they should not have tried to get him to confess, erroneously, that his sister was actually his cousin, and sign a form. I certainly hope before they made attempts to do that, that they at least read him his rights.
   Also, upon reading further into the case of the man held for over three weeks, it appears the suspicion was caused by a Visa that his mother had given fraudulent information for. She had stated in the application that he was born in Mexico, when applying for a visa so that he could visit Mexico. It also appears that his brother, that was in the car, was not a US Citizen. However, I still believe this matter should have taken less than 23 days to clear up. But i do understand why we was detained in the 1st place.

[TheCoinGrabber]

Last article first.

Police said two children they stopped, a 10-year-old boy and a 13-year-old boy, were positively identified as taking part in the robbery. Police said they also recovered a BB gun and the stolen cellphone.

However, Attorney General Karl Racine said in a news release Friday his office reviewed multiple surveillance videos that captured the crime and "we are now certain that there is no evidence that the 10-year-old boy played a role in the armed robbery. He is totally innocent."

I don't see anything too unjust here. Someone identified him so he was put in custody while it was being confirmed.

First one.

Though she's an American, Medina's family lives in Tijuana, and they cross the border each morning to get to school. On a Monday morning, CBP detained her and her 14-year-old brother, Oscar, saying she didn't look like the photo in her passport, according to NBC San Diego. CBP said the elementary student, who was questioned without her parents present, "provided inconsistent information during her inspection." The agency reportedly had no explanation for why it took 32 hours to confirm her citizenship and release her, though in that time they accused her brother, who is also a U.S. citizen, of human smuggling and tried to have him sign a document saying his sister was his cousin. Medina was finally released after her mother pleaded with the Mexican consulate to contact U.S. immigration authorities.

Tijuana is already in Mexico right? I'm just curious, are her parents also "American" or it's just her and her brother (what some people call "anchor babies")?

[bones261]

Tijuana is already in Mexico right? I'm just curious, are her parents also "American" or it's just her and her brother (what some people call "anchor babies")?

The mother is a US citizen. I don't know if she is naturalized or born in the US. They probably opted to live in Tijuana because it is cheaper than California. Why does it matter if the two were "anchor babies" or not? The 14th amendment made it clear that anyone born or naturalized in the US are considered citizens. (That was so legislators could not suddenly make laws to claim certain classes of people were not citizens.) If people want to revamp this definition, they will have to amend the constitution. I do not think such an attempt to amend the constitution for this purpose is going to get the needed support....

[TECSHARE]

Let me ask you a question... If I were to say that a large percentage of the local taco shop's customers are probably Mexicans, would you consider that racist? Is it racist or just a natural consequence of the fact that Mexicans culturally tend to enjoy tacos? We are talking about the US/Mexican border here, as a consequence of this, the most likely ethnicity of people attempting to cross this border illegally are (GASP!) Mexicans. You are building this narrative as if they were stopped because border patrol is racist and just enjoys harassing brown skinned people, when the reality is they fit the characteristics of a common demographic of people attempting to cross illegally.

A similar narrative is pushed with the black community, where blacks comprise approximately 13% of the US population, but over 50% of the murders. Criminal activity has nothing to do with race, but a common culture. Blacks are not inherently criminals any more than Mexicans are inherently illegal aliens. This whole screaming racism act is just designed to distract from the cultural rot present within these communities so it can never be addressed. Who is the real racist? Those perpetuating the problems or those pointing them out so it can be addressed?

People swear this is because of racism, and not a culture of criminal activity and unwillingness to work with law enforcement. Every time some one is shot, even if they were armed and engaged in criminal activity, it is because of "racism". As a result police pull back enforcement from these neighborhoods, and then it gets even worse and they blame police for doing nothing. Given this country has become a police state, and that needs to change, but you also must understand that these kind of lies give these cops all they motivation and justification they need to further increase this lock down martial law type mentality. Who knew when you treat police like the enemy they treat you like the enemy? Funny how they works huh? This country is being pigeon holed into becoming a 3rd world country by exploiting the naive aimless empathy of its population. Empathy is good. Blind and unconditional empathy is dangerous.

   OMG, what you just described above is the very definition of making stereotypes based on race.    I have no idea what your ethnicity is; however it does appear that you have little understanding of the inconvenience caused when people make assumptions (prejudice) based on the color of someone's skin. I do have experience in this area. What is disconcerting in my case is that people make assumptions on my ethnicity based on the darker tone in my skin. In reality, I am of mostly European decent and my skin color is probably caused by one great-grandparent being Hawaiian and another great-grandparent being Croatian.
   An officer should never assume that they have "probable cause" that someone is up to no good based on what they assume their ethnicity is.
   However, after looking at the particular case involving the 9 year old girl, It appears that her and her brother were unaccompanied. Therefore, the fact that they were initially taken into custody probably had to do with that fact, rather than their skin color. However, I still do not think it should have taken 32 hours until their mother could regain custody. Also, once they confirmed that the 14 year son was a US citizen, they should not have tried to get him to confess, erroneously, that his sister was actually his cousin, and sign a form. I certainly hope before they made attempts to do that, that they at least read him his rights.
   Also, upon reading further into the case of the man held for over three weeks, it appears the suspicion was caused by a Visa that his mother had given fraudulent information for. She had stated in the application that he was born in Mexico, when applying for a visa so that he could visit Mexico. It also appears that his brother, that was in the car, was not a US Citizen. However, I still believe this matter should have taken less than 23 days to clear up. But i do understand why we was detained in the 1st place.

And? Stereotypes are not racist. Please learn the difference. People are racist. Stereotypes can be the ignorance of ignorant people, but not exclusively. Many stereotypes exist for good reason. Statistically Mexicans like tacos. This is a stereotype which generally happens to be true, but has nothing to do with racism. That's the thing about these kind of discussions, the definitions of the words and meanings are just stretched a little bit here, a little bit there, and a little more over here until some one discussing an uncomfortable fact becomes "literally Hitler".

Your right. You have no idea what my ethnicity is. None at all. Don't project upon me. I don't care how dark your skin is, you are not the chosen emissary for all brown people, don't speak as if you are the only one to understand these experiences when the fact is there is no way you have any idea what I personally, or many others have experienced, just because they don't completely agree with you. As I said before "valid identity documents" is subjective. They may actually be valid documents, but what if they don't belong to the person holding them? What if there are inconsistencies as in this case with a validly issued but technically invalid paperwork? Their job is literally to check these things.

Also again, I would suggest that if the processing time bothers you, you support more funding for border enforcement, and stop encouraging people to flood in illegally by taking such a soft stance on illegal immigration. Maintaining a border under these circumstances is logistically difficult, and if it is not done, there will come a point where there will be no border because enforcement becomes impossible. I think you are smart enough to understand why that is not acceptable.

[bones261]

And? Stereotypes are not racist. Please learn the difference. People are racist. Stereotypes can be the ignorance of ignorant people, but not exclusively. Many stereotypes exist for good reason. Statistically Mexicans like tacos. This is a stereotype which generally happens to be true, but has nothing to do with racism. That's the thing about these kind of discussions, the definitions of the words and meanings are just stretched a little bit here, a little bit there, and a little more over here until some one discussing an uncomfortable fact becomes "literally Hitler".

    You do know that black people are a little touchy about implying that they all like chicken and watermelon. Right? Since I am not Mexican, I am not aware if they would find this disconcerting or not. However, I am certainly not going to go there.

Your right. You have no idea what my ethnicity is. None at all. Don't project upon me. I don't care how dark your skin is, you are not the chosen emissary for all brown people, don't speak as if you are the only one to understand these experiences when the fact is there is no way you have any idea what I personally, or many others have experienced, just because they don't completely agree with you.

Your apparent insensitivity to this subject speaks volumes. Also, as a "brown person," I am qualified to speak on such matters, since I happen to be part of the population, and can share my first hand experiences.

As I said before "valid identity documents" is subjective. They may actually be valid documents, but what if they don't belong to the person holding them? What if there are inconsistencies as in this case with a validly issued but technically invalid paperwork? Their job is literally to check these things.

Whether a document is valid or not is an objective matter. There is no subjective gray area. However, I am sure a border patrol agent has to make a quick determination on whether a document may or may not be questionable, and warrants further investigation. I will concede that that part is subjective. However, in the end, it is not an opinion (subjective) but a fact (objective) on whether a certain document is indeed valid or not.

Also again, I would suggest that if the processing time bothers you, you support more funding for border enforcement, and stop encouraging people to flood in illegally by taking such a soft stance on illegal immigration. Maintaining a border under these circumstances is logistically difficult, and if it is not done, there will come a point where there will be no border because enforcement becomes impossible. I think you are smart enough to understand why that is not acceptable.

How on Earth am I encouraging people to flood in illegally because I would prefer US citizens should be able to cross the border and remain in the US with minimal hassle? Unless a US citizen is acting as a mule to smuggle across the border, they are not illegal and are definitely not immigrating. Furthermore, I only object to spending 50 billion dollars on a wall. Especially when a wall can be circumvented by both land and by air. If Congress wants to increase the budget for border patrol by 50 billion dollars to become better staffed and have better capability processing people that enter, I am all for it.

[bluefirecorp_]

Whether a document is valid or not is an objective matter. There is no subjective gray area. However, I am sure a border patrol agent has to make a quick determination on whether a document may or may not be questionable, and warrants further investigation. I will concede that that part is subjective. However, in the end, it is not an opinion (subjective) but a fact (objective) on whether a certain document is indeed valid or not.

Yeah, if the state randomly asks for my papers, I'm dipping out of that state. We have census, but not straight 'give me your papers or else'.

Police better have a crime they're investigating.

How on Earth am I encouraging people to flood in illegally because I would prefer US citizens should be able to cross the border and remain in the US with minimal hassle? Unless a US citizen is acting as a mule to smuggle across the border, they are not illegal and are definitely not immigrating. Furthermore, I only object to spending 50 billion dollars on a wall. Especially when a wall can be circumvented by both land and by air. If Congress wants to increase the budget for border patrol by 50 billion dollars to become better staffed and have better capability processing people that enter, I am all for it.

Hydrogen based drones for those avoiding checkpoints. More people = more workers. We're competing in a global economy, and there's a lot of work to be done.

But this isn't about these topics. It's about people being wrongfully detained; specifically US children.

[TECSHARE]

And? Stereotypes are not racist. Please learn the difference. People are racist. Stereotypes can be the ignorance of ignorant people, but not exclusively. Many stereotypes exist for good reason. Statistically Mexicans like tacos. This is a stereotype which generally happens to be true, but has nothing to do with racism. That's the thing about these kind of discussions, the definitions of the words and meanings are just stretched a little bit here, a little bit there, and a little more over here until some one discussing an uncomfortable fact becomes "literally Hitler".

    

You do know that black people are a little touchy about implying that they all like chicken and watermelon. Right? Since I am not Mexican, I am not aware if they would find this disconcerting or not. However, I am certainly not going to go there.

Thanks again for another perfect example of you interpreting and stretching the meaning of words, and then projecting it upon others. I said nothing of black people and watermelons, this is a projection of your own mind, and I am not responsible for your fantasies. Also, watermelons and chicken are not exactly a cultural aspect of the black community as tacos are with Mexicans, but I suppose that is arguable. I forget, are we all equal or are we not? Because if we are equal then Mexicans, blacks, whites, whoever have no special insights on being a human being that the rest of the human beings don't have. Furthermore I have no idea what ethnicity you are. As far as I know, all you have said are comments about "dark skin" that could be basically every ethnicity on Earth, just more proof you are projecting.

Your right. You have no idea what my ethnicity is. None at all. Don't project upon me. I don't care how dark your skin is, you are not the chosen emissary for all brown people, don't speak as if you are the only one to understand these experiences when the fact is there is no way you have any idea what I personally, or many others have experienced, just because they don't completely agree with you.

Your apparent insensitivity to this subject speaks volumes. Also, as a "brown person," I am qualified to speak on such matters, since I happen to be part of the population, and can share my first hand experiences.

More projection. You see it as insensitivity because I don't comply with your politically correct dogmas of ever shifting word bans and definitions. Just because I don't follow your religious brand of "progressivism" and cater to your every personal hangup doesn't mean I don't think human beings should be treated equally until they prove otherwise as individuals. Also, I used the term "brown person" because it includes pretty much everyone on earth. Again I have no idea what ethnicity you are, just a description of skin tone.

As I said before "valid identity documents" is subjective. They may actually be valid documents, but what if they don't belong to the person holding them? What if there are inconsistencies as in this case with a validly issued but technically invalid paperwork? Their job is literally to check these things.

Whether a document is valid or not is an objective matter. There is no subjective gray area. However, I am sure a border patrol agent has to make a quick determination on whether a document may or may not be questionable, and warrants further investigation. I will concede that that part is subjective. However, in the end, it is not an opinion (subjective) but a fact (objective) on whether a certain document is indeed valid or not.

Except to an enforcement officer, as I already explained, it is quite subjective. One might even go as far as to say this is why terms like "subjective" and "objective" exist, so as to differentiate these states of being according to context. Sure if you remove all context and pretend enforcing the border is not an issue, it is objective. To an enforcement officer it is completely subjective until confirmed. Literally their job is to judge, using context, if all of the information involved in the circumstances make sense. Some times that takes time to confirm. Some times when there are exceptional numbers of people flooding over the border, this process takes longer.

Also again, I would suggest that if the processing time bothers you, you support more funding for border enforcement, and stop encouraging people to flood in illegally by taking such a soft stance on illegal immigration. Maintaining a border under these circumstances is logistically difficult, and if it is not done, there will come a point where there will be no border because enforcement becomes impossible. I think you are smart enough to understand why that is not acceptable.

How on Earth am I encouraging people to flood in illegally because I would prefer US citizens should be able to cross the border and remain in the US with minimal hassle? Unless a US citizen is acting as a mule to smuggle across the border, they are not illegal and are definitely not immigrating. Furthermore, I only object to spending 50 billion dollars on a wall. Especially when a wall can be circumvented by both land and by air. If Congress wants to increase the budget for border patrol by 50 billion dollars to become better staffed and have better capability processing people that enter, I am all for it.

No, because you are trying to apply unrealistic standards to the logistical application of border enforcement. You are arguing from a position as if protecting the border has no importance whatsoever, dismissing any logistical conflicts your unrealistic standards create. It is almost as if you wouldn't mind if the process was just sabotaged all together by this process of incremental application of unrealistic standards. By advocating for policies which are destructive to the overall effort of securing the border, meaning more illegal crossings, thus encouraging even more to try is how you are encouraging it. So is your argument a wall would not slow illegal immigration? So because other methods might happen too, we shouldn't stop it in ways we can stop it? So your point is you are fine with the funding as long as it is pushing more people into the country at a faster rate? That kind of sounds like the opposite of restricting illegal immigration by simply lowering the standards, but maybe I am wrong. Again, all you are doing is opposing any border enforcement and not providing any viable solutions. It is just a strategy of obstruction and subversion.

[TECSHARE]

"How Asylum is Abused Every Day"

https://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/want-to-fix-immigration-start-with-the-abused-asylum-system/

[Masha Sha]

https://www.gq.com/story/border-patrol-detained-9-year-old-american-girl

https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/DC-Attorney-General-10-Year-Old-Boy-Handcuffed-by-Police-Totally-Innocent-508179501.html

There's two.

Down for any detainment of kids that are innocent.

it's to bring them to the court rape operations...