FortuneJack has a problem in Dice game

[bellicose]

So this was done on purpose, so that users often lose their money? 10.89% is a huge percentage, because everyone knows that even with 1% house edge it is often very difficult to play. I hope everything is really fixed.

[1714955753]

1714955753

[1714955753]

1714955753

[jpcfan]

even though i wagered 500btc over a few years at FJ. i'm up 11btc there


so i guess i am the master of dice. not even 10% edge can hold me down

[bellicose]

even though i wagered 500btc over a few years at FJ. i'm up 11btc there


so i guess i am the master of dice. not even 10% edge can hold me down

Do you have any proof of this? Even for several years, a profit of 11 bitcoins is very good. I have been playing dice since 2014 and I haven’t won in any of them, especially in the long run. Which method are you using?

[jpcfan]

even though i wagered 500btc over a few years at FJ. i'm up 11btc there


so i guess i am the master of dice. not even 10% edge can hold me down

Do you have any proof of this? Even for several years, a profit of 11 bitcoins is very good. I have been playing dice since 2014 and I haven’t won in any of them, especially in the long run. Which method are you using?

 in 6 years. let say i gambled like this at 7-8 dice sites. luckygames and FJ are only sites that i'm up


on the other dice sites i'm down more than 11 btc

[MonsterV]

 in 6 years. let say i gambled like this at 7-8 dice sites. luckygames and FJ are only sites that i'm up


on the other dice sites i'm down more than 11 btc

Do you have any other evidence besides picture above, it seems like it's not latest analysis because you posted the same picture last June. Sometimes images can still be manipulated in such a way, I hope you provide evidence in the form videos or share helpful tips here.

[veleten]

even though i wagered 500btc over a few years at FJ. i'm up 11btc there


so i guess i am the master of dice. not even 10% edge can hold me down

it was 10% ish HE only on a particular bet 990x
the rest of the bets gave 0.08+ % house edge increase which should have made hundreds of bitcoins extra to the site
them fixing it after all these years is nice and all , but if I lost a lot there I'd be pretty pissed to find out it wasn't totally fair and square
11 btc up is impressive off 500 btc wagered , in theory that should be  5 btc negative  , hope you cashed them out and spent on something good
wish I could boast same stats on any of the dice sites but math seems to be working as expected in my case - 100-200 btc wagered 1-2 btc down

[abel1337]

even though i wagered 500btc over a few years at FJ. i'm up 11btc there


so i guess i am the master of dice. not even 10% edge can hold me down

Do you have any proof of this? Even for several years, a profit of 11 bitcoins is very good. I have been playing dice since 2014 and I haven’t won in any of them, especially in the long run. Which method are you using?

 in 6 years. let say i gambled like this at 7-8 dice sites. luckygames and FJ are only sites that i'm up


on the other dice sites i'm down more than 11 btc

Pretty hard core gambler hmmm.

If FortuneJack tries to giveback the other 9.89% house edge, You would get back a ton of unknown fees that you are dealing with over these years.

I'm sure there are many gamblers who gamble like this, Fortunejack would take a long time compensating the players.

[jpcfan]

 in 6 years. let say i gambled like this at 7-8 dice sites. luckygames and FJ are only sites that i'm up


on the other dice sites i'm down more than 11 btc

Do you have any other evidence besides picture above, it seems like it's not latest analysis because you posted the same picture last June. Sometimes images can still be manipulated in such a way, I hope you provide evidence in the form videos or share helpful tips here.

what more evidence do you need? i havn't played at FJ in 2 years


. as you know when FJ upgraded their site few years back all wagering stats are gone. thats a old pic  as you can see i wagered  500btc.  my bonus awards alone is 10btc.





thats only other pic. as you can see won 1.1btc in weekly wagering. thats means i wager alot. people who know me know i dont lie about my gambling wagering n profits


plus i should mention not all 500 btc was on dice . back then i played every game

[Stunna]

Since this thread is being answered by FJ representative and already got cleared, maybe its time to lock this thread/topic?

They have not dealt with the issue. Let's apply this situation to any other market. Let's say I was trading with my brokerage and they advertise a flat 1% commission and then years later I find out that they had been charging me up to 10% on some trades. Is fixing the issue making it so all future trades are a flat 1% or is it refunding the amount I was overcharged for if not more.

Intentional or unintentional, Fortunejack would have made 100s of bitcoins more than they should have by ripping off players. I find it shocking that they have not even expressed interest in exploring this situation further.

[Hunterqr]

Fortunejack dice game is a scam! proof


The provably fair system is not working properly.

https://i.redd.it/fmyh6k17v3f21.png

You can see that the losing streak always happen when I keep doubling the bet amount, but never on low bets.

The provably fair system can't explain this. So the fairness of FJ dice game is doubtful.

I realize numerous individuals will say that FJ has been running for a long time, the notoriety, and all that, yet that doesn't mean all is well. I don't question the provably reasonable calculation itself, yet I question the utilization of the calculation in shakers game. In light of thousands of wagers, I would state the shakers game is provably uncalled for!

[veleten]

Fortunejack dice game is a scam! proof


The provably fair system is not working properly.



You can see that the losing streak always happen when I keep doubling the bet amount, but never on low bets.

The provably fair system can't explain this. So the fairness of FJ dice game is doubtful.

I realize numerous individuals will say that FJ has been running for a long time, the notoriety, and all that, yet that doesn't mean all is well. I don't question the provably reasonable calculation itself, yet I question the utilization of the calculation in shakers game. In light of thousands of wagers, I would state the shakers game is provably uncalled for!

to be fair , this is not a proof that their provably fair system is not working properly
at least whatever you tried to show on your screen is irrelevant to PF
as for the losing streaks that happen when you bet high /low etc. its a common gambler's fallacy
if the system is provably fair , all of the rolls can be verified and cannot be manipulated
FJ dice can be anything but they are provably fair allright

[theskillzdatklls]

I suppose we should also credit FJ for fixing this!

Not really. They should be credited when they reimburse the players.

It's pretty nuts that nobody noticed this even though it was a persistent issue for years. I'm curious to see how much extra Fortunejack made from this and what they will do to reimburse the effected players. Given that this issue dates back years it will be extremely difficult to even figure out who was effected and to what degree, but given this level of error they should really spend some time to get this right.

Exactly. And i don't think it would take more than few hours to figure out which roll numbers were incorrectly treated as loss
They just need to loop through all the bets and check whether the side is Roll Over and Game === roll number.

Since there are 11.2 Billion rolls history. The amount of incorrectly treated rolls would be somewhere 448K considering 40% of the rolls were "Roll over"
Though i would love to hear some stats from your side

Yes, this is the simple/correct thing to do, definitely worth the backwards computation to do this in my opinion.

I am glad that FJ doesn't misrepresent it's non-provably fair games as provably fair games, generally speaking, as I've seen some other casinos do. So that's at least a point in their favor. But I wouldn't personally consider the thread closed until players are made whole. Technically speaking they received an interest free loan for years so they still come out on top by the end of this but it's an acceptable enough compromise.

[Stunna]

I've left Fortunejack negative trust in hopes that they will care to explore this issue further.

[yoloer808]

It is absolutely astounding that for FJ, this issue is resolved by them 'fixing' the bug. What about the lost btc of all us players over the years? I personally have over 200btc wagered on FJ dice, so I am quite possibly affected. Do they care?

[FortuneJack]

Firstly, we again want to thank the player that helped us to find the bug, which might have affected some dice games played on our website. However, the case described in the initial bounty inquiry was extreme and relevant only with the option of playing over 99.90. The effect of the bug will drastically decrease while lowering the payout: if on 990x payout the bug had mistaken house edge and drew it for 10.89%, the aftermath from system miscalculation will be reduced, as the payout will vary (see the chart).



The case we had to deal with is no ordinary, and the company felt obliged to find a fair and relevant solution, so this took a couple of days. It has been years since we are in business, and the only way we kept our presence steady in this turbulent market, is FortuneJack's dedication to acting as fair as possible towards players and every each of them.

Following the logic initially set from a player in this bitcointalk thread and data that have been available for us to do calculations, we conclude the following:

Data Available as we clearly cannot tell when the bug started to affect our dice game, we decided not to start guessing and credit players from the moment we have the oldest record - November 2014, almost the date of establishment of the FortuneJack Casino.

What we have is Bet Amount and Win Amount recorded on our players. Most of the data is not kept forever, so it made calculation quite hard, and we had to rely upon more general and big data.

We have constructed the model of possible harm the bug might have had on players' bets, combining general assumptions and general knowledge to finally achieve average formula of payout for every player, who might have been affected.

We consider that most default style of play, practiced by the vast majority of players in to play on the edge of 50.00 and even the default game on FortuneJack Dice is Roll Under 49.50 (The bet that cannot be affected by bug), we decide not to calculate definite chance of default in our calculations and divide bets on rough two Over and Under 50. All the are Over 50 might have been affected and non who are under 50 could have been.

We have also calculated that, on average, playing case of being in the range of 50.00, the effect of the bug would have been 0.0198% following the model initially voiced in the bug bounty approach and written in the first post of this thread.

Following the data and module, we decided to econ average out of the players bet amount from November 2014 until today using the formula:

(Bet Amount * 50% ) X 0.0198% - Where every possible bet that might have been done over 50 on FortuneJack Dice by every player is multiplied on the possible average effect of the bug on the house edge.

Following this calculation, we have decided that starting next week, until the end of October, we will be airdropping this amount on each of the player's accounts that have the history of playing dice on FortuneJack.

To claim the coins back, a person will only need to log in to FortuneJack Dice, and everyone who might have been affected will get the difference that on average bug might have had back on their accounts.

We think our approach is fair and will make up for everyone. We believe finding the average effect was crucial in dealing with this case, and the final decision is equally reasonable to every dice player on FortuneJack.

We want to sincerely apologize for allowing the bug to affect the game and would like to thank players, the most respectful competitors, and the insightful Bitcointalk community for participating in the discussion.

We will post updates over airdrop in this thread shortly next week.
FortuneJack.

[jspielberg]

Firstly, we again want to thank the player that helped us to find the bug, which might have affected some dice games played on our website. However, the case described in the initial bounty inquiry was extreme and relevant only with the option of playing over 99.90. The effect of the bug will drastically decrease while lowering the payout: if on 990x payout the bug had mistaken house edge and drew it for 10.89%, the aftermath from system miscalculation will be reduced, as the payout will vary (see the chart).



The case we had to deal with is no ordinary, and the company felt obliged to find a fair and relevant solution, so this took a couple of days. It has been years since we are in business, and the only way we kept our presence steady in this turbulent market, is FortuneJack's dedication to acting as fair as possible towards players and every each of them.

Following the logic initially set from a player in this bitcointalk thread and data that have been available for us to do calculations, we conclude the following:

Data Available as we clearly cannot tell when the bug started to affect our dice game, we decided not to start guessing and credit players from the moment we have the oldest record - November 2014, almost the date of establishment of the FortuneJack Casino.

What we have is Bet Amount and Win Amount recorded on our players. Most of the data is not kept forever, so it made calculation quite hard, and we had to rely upon more general and big data.

We have constructed the model of possible harm the bug might have had on players' bets, combining general assumptions and general knowledge to finally achieve average formula of payout for every player, who might have been affected.

We consider that most default style of play, practiced by the vast majority of players in to play on the edge of 50.00 and even the default game on FortuneJack Dice is Roll Under 49.50 (The bet that cannot be affected by bug), we decide not to calculate definite chance of default in our calculations and divide bets on rough two Over and Under 50. All the are Over 50 might have been affected and non who are under 50 could have been.

We have also calculated that, on average, playing case of being in the range of 50.00, the effect of the bug would have been 0.0198% following the model initially voiced in the bug bounty approach and written in the first post of this thread.

Following the data and module, we decided to econ average out of the players bet amount from November 2014 until today using the formula:

(Bet Amount * 50% ) X 0.0198% - Where every possible bet that might have been done over 50 on FortuneJack Dice by every player is multiplied on the possible average effect of the bug on the house edge.

Following this calculation, we have decided that starting next week, until the end of October, we will be airdropping this amount on each of the player's accounts that have the history of playing dice on FortuneJack.

To claim the coins back, a person will only need to log in to FortuneJack Dice, and everyone who might have been affected will get the difference that on average bug might have had back on their accounts.

We think our approach is fair and will make up for everyone. We believe finding the average effect was crucial in dealing with this case, and the final decision is equally reasonable to every dice player on FortuneJack.

We want to sincerely apologize for allowing the bug to affect the game and would like to thank players, the most respectful competitors, and the insightful Bitcointalk community for participating in the discussion.

We will post updates over airdrop in this thread shortly next week.
FortuneJack.

Pretty solid response imo. Spent quite some time on FJ dice, curious how much will be airdropped to my account.

[jpcfan]

yeah, i'm a simple guy.

I'll settle for 0.02btc

then we can let bygone be bygones


FJ username: cryptobet



just for the record. i was first person to settle.

[FortuneJack]

Hi Bitcointalk Community,

I am writing to inform you that Dice Airdrop has just been launched on our website. The amount you have been entitled to will be calculated by formula posted by us above, in this thread.  The Airdrop will be active until the last day of October.

Wish you all the best of the luck,
David.

[Stunna]

Firstly, we again want to thank the player that helped us to find the bug, which might have affected some dice games played on our website. However, the case described in the initial bounty inquiry was extreme and relevant only with the option of playing over 99.90. The effect of the bug will drastically decrease while lowering the payout: if on 990x payout the bug had mistaken house edge and drew it for 10.89%, the aftermath from system miscalculation will be reduced, as the payout will vary (see the chart).



The case we had to deal with is no ordinary, and the company felt obliged to find a fair and relevant solution, so this took a couple of days. It has been years since we are in business, and the only way we kept our presence steady in this turbulent market, is FortuneJack's dedication to acting as fair as possible towards players and every each of them.

Following the logic initially set from a player in this bitcointalk thread and data that have been available for us to do calculations, we conclude the following:

Data Available as we clearly cannot tell when the bug started to affect our dice game, we decided not to start guessing and credit players from the moment we have the oldest record - November 2014, almost the date of establishment of the FortuneJack Casino.

What we have is Bet Amount and Win Amount recorded on our players. Most of the data is not kept forever, so it made calculation quite hard, and we had to rely upon more general and big data.

We have constructed the model of possible harm the bug might have had on players' bets, combining general assumptions and general knowledge to finally achieve average formula of payout for every player, who might have been affected.

We consider that most default style of play, practiced by the vast majority of players in to play on the edge of 50.00 and even the default game on FortuneJack Dice is Roll Under 49.50 (The bet that cannot be affected by bug), we decide not to calculate definite chance of default in our calculations and divide bets on rough two Over and Under 50. All the are Over 50 might have been affected and non who are under 50 could have been.

We have also calculated that, on average, playing case of being in the range of 50.00, the effect of the bug would have been 0.0198% following the model initially voiced in the bug bounty approach and written in the first post of this thread.

Following the data and module, we decided to econ average out of the players bet amount from November 2014 until today using the formula:

(Bet Amount * 50% ) X 0.0198% - Where every possible bet that might have been done over 50 on FortuneJack Dice by every player is multiplied on the possible average effect of the bug on the house edge.

Following this calculation, we have decided that starting next week, until the end of October, we will be airdropping this amount on each of the player's accounts that have the history of playing dice on FortuneJack.

To claim the coins back, a person will only need to log in to FortuneJack Dice, and everyone who might have been affected will get the difference that on average bug might have had back on their accounts.

We think our approach is fair and will make up for everyone. We believe finding the average effect was crucial in dealing with this case, and the final decision is equally reasonable to every dice player on FortuneJack.

We want to sincerely apologize for allowing the bug to affect the game and would like to thank players, the most respectful competitors, and the insightful Bitcointalk community for participating in the discussion.

We will post updates over airdrop in this thread shortly next week.
FortuneJack.

I am glad that you reconsidered and decided to explore this issue. While I'm not sure if I agree with the accuracy of these payouts given the methodology used, I still have to commend this action versus sweeping it under the rug.

[Bitinity]

I can confirm that I received some satoshi from this dice airdrop, around 25k satoshi to be exact and some other small amount in other currencies. I'm not quite sure how much I have wagered on the dice game because there was a reset on the total wager when there was a big update/upgrade on the site 3 years ago IIRC. My question to Fortunejack is that, do you count all the wagered amount (including the amount before the reset) or this airdrop is counted based on the amount wagered after the reset only?