Poker talk - Specifically Hold'em - Hands and or strategy

[Steamtyme]

Do you have general strategic advice to give me?
I used to play tight and value oriented. Is it still a profitable style?

I would say just take some time to read up on articles or watch a few current pros who stream or produce youtube vids. It will give you a decent idea of what most people are using as strategy these days. It's definitely looser ranges and more aggressive overall, with people generally being comfortable firing 2-3 bullets in tourneys so more jamming in general early on looking for double ups.

ACR has decent cash game liquidity but they're on my shitlist right now. i'm still waiting for a bunch of refunds from a server meltdown they had a couple days ago.
tbh i'm thinking of firing up ignition casino. it's bovada's rebranded site. i'm pretty sure they carry forward the tradition of "no HUDs" which makes for more fun and casual games with less nits. they have a fat bitcoin bonus too.

Did they sort you out yet? I saw some people had their refunds then there was some clawed back, seems like a shit show. I never did fire up a different site, I pulled the trigger on a daily low stakes and a 6.60 MOSS, busted in the moss, but had a deep final table run on the daily finishing 6th. I was short stack and had to get jammy, probably could have waited out another ladder but was playing to win lol.

I was hoping to get more hands brought in here, but I got distracted. HM3 won't let me use my USD PP balance as they want to set up with a method they can continuously debit annually for their continued service and update program. So I'm just going to go the BTC route today. Then I should be able to bring some hands in the next couple days. Overall some interesting spots if I can find the hands.

[1714837793]

1714837793

[figmentofmyass]

ACR has decent cash game liquidity but they're on my shitlist right now. i'm still waiting for a bunch of refunds from a server meltdown they had a couple days ago.
tbh i'm thinking of firing up ignition casino. it's bovada's rebranded site. i'm pretty sure they carry forward the tradition of "no HUDs" which makes for more fun and casual games with less nits. they have a fat bitcoin bonus too.

Did they sort you out yet? I saw some people had their refunds then there was some clawed back, seems like a shit show.

they put out a statement saying they fully refunded everything, which is pretty upsetting. i've had to contact them multiple times and they've only refunded about half of my buy-ins.

it makes me wonder how much they are pocketing from this. they robbed everyone in late registration of chip equity but they don't seem to be reliably refunding people whether they busted out or not.

i can get over a server snafu. i can get over the shitty terms that i agreed to as a player. but this shit? feels pretty shady.....

I pulled the trigger on a daily low stakes and a 6.60 MOSS, busted in the moss, but had a deep final table run on the daily finishing 6th. I was short stack and had to get jammy, probably could have waited out another ladder but was playing to win lol.

nice!

[Steamtyme]

Curious what peoples thoughts are regarding live tournaments. I've never sat down at a legitimate poker table for cash or tournament games. There is a large annual series coming up about 2 hours away from me and I'm going to enter.

I'm definitely taking a bit of a leap stakes wise. My plan is to show up day one and buy into the satellite for 180, prize is entry to the 1100$ and 600$ tournaments later in the week. I believe there will be 10 packages available if they hit their max of 200 entrants.
There are other individual satellites i might try instead if the field seems to small where i don't like my odds of winning a package.

I've heard and am expecting things to be more old school. No one has huds or their ranges and analyzers pulled up. Personally i think i have the ability to play a solid game in this sort of situation, but thought i'd take opinions.

The new job has given me no chance to play online lately but this weekend i will be back and will return with some hands. I have been toying with a small percentage of donk leads as part of my post flop strategy so ill try and grab a hand or two with that if i can.

[tyKiwanuka]

Live poker is a very different animal.

I've heard and am expecting things to be more old school. No one has huds or their ranges and analyzers pulled up.

Not sure, if it is more old school, but you are definitely more reliant on your instincts to judge human behaviour in stressful situations. You have no stats available to support your decisions. And this goes vice versa for your opponents judging you too. They will look at you, monitor what you do and also maybe how your body will react (shaking hands for example). If you are cold as ice, you are fine, but if you tend to get nervous easily in bigger pots, you should definitely have sunglasses available and maybe even some hoodie to cover your face/neck. It will also give you a shield to decouple a bit from the whole environment.

Personally i think i have the ability to play a solid game in this sort of situation, but thought i'd take opinions.

The biggest difference, and this also refers to the above and the stats, is, the amount of hands you play. If you are an impatient person, good luck I often get bored already in online poker, because it is so slow sometimes and people take ages to make their action. In live poker this is ten times worse. You might sit there for an hour and do nothing but fold. There will be hands that take like 15 minutes; then you are looking forward to your next hand - Q2 - and you can wait again for some minutes.

If you are an impatient person, you might then be urged to play bad hands just because you are bored and want some action. And because people play rather few hands during such a tournament, it's also hard to get some read on them; the sample size is just not big enough to make good assumptions.

I'm definitely taking a bit of a leap stakes wise. My plan is to show up day one and buy into the satellite for 180, prize is entry to the 1100$ and 600$ tournaments later in the week. I believe there will be 10 packages available if they hit their max of 200 entrants.
There are other individual satellites i might try instead if the field seems to small where i don't like my odds of winning a package.

For your first live tournaments I would be very cautious with what you are willing to risk as entry fee. People will easily notice, when you are scared and take advantage of it. Behind a screen you can always hide a lot of things, but this is not possible face to face.

[figmentofmyass]

Curious what peoples thoughts are regarding live tournaments. I've never sat down at a legitimate poker table for cash or tournament games. There is a large annual series coming up about 2 hours away from me and I'm going to enter.

I'm definitely taking a bit of a leap stakes wise. My plan is to show up day one and buy into the satellite for 180, prize is entry to the 1100$ and 600$ tournaments later in the week. I believe there will be 10 packages available if they hit their max of 200 entrants.
There are other individual satellites i might try instead if the field seems to small where i don't like my odds of winning a package.

I've heard and am expecting things to be more old school. No one has huds or their ranges and analyzers pulled up. Personally i think i have the ability to play a solid game in this sort of situation, but thought i'd take opinions.

The new job has given me no chance to play online lately but this weekend i will be back and will return with some hands. I have been toying with a small percentage of donk leads as part of my post flop strategy so ill try and grab a hand or two with that if i can.

i've probably played a million hands online in my life, but can still count the number of times i've been to the casino on 2 hands. i've never lived close to one. when i've gone, time constraints always forced me to stick to cash games.

playing live is super fun. you should play the satellite just for the experience if nothing else. it feels way different, very old school. players are more donk-ish and passive than typical online players. you'd probably do well. the lack of hands vs online makes for high variance though. a bad beat on a $180 buy-in stings a lot worse than $11 at the online tables.

i've had no time to play lately either. i haven't bought into anything since that MOSS meltdown on ACR last month.

[tokeweed]

Curious what peoples thoughts are regarding live tournaments. I've never sat down at a legitimate poker table for cash or tournament games. There is a large annual series coming up about 2 hours away from me and I'm going to enter.

I'm definitely taking a bit of a leap stakes wise. My plan is to show up day one and buy into the satellite for 180, prize is entry to the 1100$ and 600$ tournaments later in the week. I believe there will be 10 packages available if they hit their max of 200 entrants.
There are other individual satellites i might try instead if the field seems to small where i don't like my odds of winning a package.

I've heard and am expecting things to be more old school. No one has huds or their ranges and analyzers pulled up. Personally i think i have the ability to play a solid game in this sort of situation, but thought i'd take opinions.

The new job has given me no chance to play online lately but this weekend i will be back and will return with some hands. I have been toying with a small percentage of donk leads as part of my post flop strategy so ill try and grab a hand or two with that if i can.

Live is def a lot softer than online poker.  There's lots of limping pf and lots of calling down with marginal holdings.

So if you've played a lot of online poker, the transition to live is much easier than the other way around.

[seoincorporation]

...

Live is def a lot softer than online poker.  There's lots of limping pf and lots of calling down with marginal holdings.

So if you've played a lot of online poker, the transition to live is much easier than the other way around.

This is good to know because i have never play live, only with local friends on a party but never in a casino. If you say the transition will be much easier i should test my luck in local casinos.

I will try to chase a local tournament, that would be fun.

[shoreno]

...

Live is def a lot softer than online poker.  There's lots of limping pf and lots of calling down with marginal holdings.

So if you've played a lot of online poker, the transition to live is much easier than the other way around.

This is good to know because i have never play live, only with local friends on a party but never in a casino. If you say the transition will be much easier i should test my luck in local casinos.

I will try to chase a local tournament, that would be fun.

This is good to know because i have never play live, only with local friends on a party but never in a casino.

isnt it live is simillar to offline ? if you play with your friends locally on a party then i assume tha you are playing offline but that is good to practice and improve your poker skills sometimes  . that is also good to know because your only playing when theres an occasion . its like simillar to drinking or smoking only when there is an occasion  like i what i do  .

If you say the transition will be much easier i should test my luck in local casinos.

he means the transition will be easier if you already tried playing on online casinos but if not , then you might find it slightly hard to start on a local casino and as well as when you decide to play on online casino after that   .

[figmentofmyass]

Live is def a lot softer than online poker.  There's lots of limping pf and lots of calling down with marginal holdings.

So if you've played a lot of online poker, the transition to live is much easier than the other way around.

when i sat down at live $1/$2 games the first couple times, i gave people way too much credit for their holdings. there's something about the high # of hands seen online vs live..... people playing live (at least low stakes) get bored. they want to see action and gamble. they love to call down, sometimes just to see what you have.

i wish i lived near a casino. a decent reg could generate a nice side income off any of the $1/$2 or $1/$3 games i've seen. that's where all the weak players and tourists seem to sit. i found that skill level and aggression noticeably increased at $2/$5 but i'm drawing on a pretty limited sample.

[Steamtyme]

Good response guys - not going to quote to tough on mobile.
The buy-in is something I'm okay losing - can't win them all and it's not an amount I would be dropping consistently. So I'm not worried about letting it dictate my game; i have a strategy and will play it win or lose.
Physical tells are something I will have to adjust to in the moment. The celebratory and the deflated semi rage ones are more what I'm concerned with. I have been trying to treat my online games that way leading up to this, that includes a neutral reaction when being dealt my cards. I have caught myself smiling on the flop and turn when i get lax, so room to improve.

Glad to hear that I wasn't necessarily wrong in my assessment that live will be softer and potentially a more straight forward game. When i say that part I mean people will have a gamestyle and play that as opposed to HUD's telling them I've 3-bet to much this session or RFI'd a high percentage.

I am pumped for this despite it being 7 weeks away. I have always wanted to play live but never had the opportunity. Even 1/2 cash games seemed over budget for me, and I just like tournaments, despite being not to bad at micro stakes cash games. My biggest prep here has been to try and actively track pot size manually so I can size my bets appropriately.

I actually got a bit of a confidence boost last weekend despite losing in what I have to consider to be a decent leak in my game. I have to remember to breathe and reevaluate my hand strength on each street. So I will bring some hands to the thread tonight hopefully.

The confidence boost came from playing a few orbits at the table with a vlogger poker pro I watch - Jeff boski. I held my own quite well with a 4-bet that got him to fold, a few RFI'S he folded his BB to, and continued aggression bluff on the flop to get him to fold.
I just played my game and when I found myself thinking about holding back, I had to remind myself that it's important to just play your game.

@figmentofmyass did ACR ever get tour refunds sorted out? I have played 2 or 3 tournaments since then. I just wasn't able to save hands until this last weekend. I did pay for HM3 I'm just waiting in my new monitor to get that station up and running again. Then I can actually review my overall gameplay the last few months. Manages to use BTC I just had to message their support to get an address.

[figmentofmyass]

@figmentofmyass did ACR ever get tour refunds sorted out? I have played 2 or 3 tournaments since then. I just wasn't able to save hands until this last weekend. I did pay for HM3 I'm just waiting in my new monitor to get that station up and running again. Then I can actually review my overall gameplay the last few months. Manages to use BTC I just had to message their support to get an address.

they put out a statement saying they had refunded all affected tournaments. i looked and saw half or more of my buy-ins were still missing so i opened a ticket with live support. they basically told me "it's gonna take several days for the team to research and issue refunds for this, but i can see your original entries, so i can issue you tickets for all the missing buy-ins". i wanted to be done with all the drama, so i went along, but the whole thing still feels pretty shitty since i was thinking about just cashing out my account.

i have several unused tickets on my account now, which i'm sure i'll use eventually, but if i end up busting this account i'm gonna try out ignition casino instead. i wonder if their games are as soft as the bovada days.

[Steamtyme]

Finally some hands again. This first batch is from 2-3 weeks ago. I should have about an hour each morning after work to post how the hands finished up, and a new batch of 3 or 4 from other dates. Despite how promising this run looks even at the Level 30, I eeked out a little over a min cash. Lost several major flips with KK, and AK suited I believe I may have also had AA cracked. Memory is a little foggy, enjoy.

Hand #1 Level 19 (500.00/1000.00) 125 Ante; 9 handed     Table '108' 9-max Seat #9 is the button Villain - 1 SB (35029.00) Villain - 2 BB (35975.00) Hero UTG+2 (76441.00) Hero -[Jd Jc] Raises to 2285 SB & BB call *** FLOP *** [9d 8h Tc] Checks to Hero Hero bets 3585.00 Villain1 calls 3585.00 Villain2 folds *** TURN *** [9d 8h Tc][5d] pot 15150.00 Villain1 checks Hero bets 5175.00 Villain1 raises to 12350.00 Hero calls *** RIVER *** [9d 8h Tc 5d][T d] pot 39850.00 Villain1 checks Hero ??

Hand #2 Level 20 (525.00/1050.00) Ante 130; 9-handed       Hero CO (95696.00) Big stack Villain SB (24306.00) *** HOLE CARDS *** Hero [9h Qc] raises to 2375.00 Villain calls 1850.00 *** FLOP *** [Qh 3s 8d] pot 6970.00 Villain checks Hero bets 1465.00 Villain raises to 6415.00 Hero ??

Hand #3 Level 27 (900.00/1800.00) ante 225; 8 handed       Hero SB (270530.00) Table Big stack Villain BB (153006.00) *** HOLE CARDS *** Hero raises [Ts Kc]to 4500.00 Villain raises 10800.00 to 12600.00 Hero ??

Hand #4 Level 30 (1250.00/2500.00) ante 300; 9-handed Villain1 HJ (86000-ish) Villain2 CO (155849.00) Hero BB (314995.00) *** HOLE CARDS *** Villain1 5000.00 to 5000.00 Villain2 raises 15000.00 to 15000.00 Hero [Qs Qd] calls 12500.00 Villain1 folds *** FLOP *** [6s 2s 3s] pot 38950.00 Hero checks Villain 2 19475.00 Hero??

they put out a statement saying they had refunded all affected tournaments. i looked and saw half or more of my buy-ins were still missing so i opened a ticket with live support. they basically told me "it's gonna take several days for the team to research and issue refunds for this, but i can see your original entries, so i can issue you tickets for all the missing buy-ins". i wanted to be done with all the drama, so i went along, but the whole thing still feels pretty shitty since i was thinking about just cashing out my account.
i have several unused tickets on my account now, which i'm sure i'll use eventually, but if i end up busting this account i'm gonna try out ignition casino instead. i wonder if their games are as soft as the bovada days.

That's a raw deal for sure. They likely offered tickets assuming most people would pull funds. Well hopefully those tickets happen to fall on a run-good session. I keep thinking about playing elsewhere but I've managed to be a break even player...mostly so I'm just going to keep plugging away for now. I'm done playing in the long ass big money tourneys for now, and am sticking with the regular low stakes nightlys. I just get a better return when I don't shoot myself in the foot. Stay tuned for more hands to come. Sunday I finished 15th in a 6K. Should have been a better showing but, it's a process taking the time to breathe and consider ICM in the moment. Jammed AQ (11 BB) from the CO into AK fresh big stack (50BB) UTG+2 He RFI'd 2BB and it just seemed the right price. There were at least 3 shorter stacks in the tournament.

[tokeweed]

^  Hand 1, I'd bet close to pot on the turn and call it off.  All sets, two pair and prolly 76 raise that flop.  You block QJ so I wouldn't be worried much about that.

As played, your small bet on turn might have looked weak to him hence the raise. 

On the river I think go for thin value.

[Steamtyme]

Hand 1 final.
Hero Checks and takes down the pot. Villain shows [Qh Ac] for a failed gutshot and 2 overs.

I elected to check, despite it being less likely they now had a 10, their raise on the turn had me thinking they had a strong 10 and were charging draws, I did consider the possibility of a flopped straight that some might play the same way, or a pocket overpair that beats me. Considering they had a complete air I don't think they would have called down any bet. I agree a flopped set would have probably been played more aggressively.

What I'm not sure of is in these spots if the checkback on the river is lost value in the long run if done in similar situations or not. Without having done any analysis, just from memory, I feel like it's a fairly even play as I can recall winning and losing in similar situations.

[figmentofmyass]

Hand 1 final.
Hero Checks and takes down the pot. Villain shows [Qh Ac] for a failed gutshot and 2 overs.

I elected to check, despite it being less likely they now had a 10, their raise on the turn had me thinking they had a strong 10 and were charging draws, I did consider the possibility of a flopped straight that some might play the same way, or a pocket overpair that beats me. Considering they had a complete air I don't think they would have called down any bet. I agree a flopped set would have probably been played more aggressively.

What I'm not sure of is in these spots if the checkback on the river is lost value in the long run if done in similar situations or not. Without having done any analysis, just from memory, I feel like it's a fairly even play as I can recall winning and losing in similar situations.

i like the river check.

if it were based purely on equity analysis, a value bet would be in order, but 3 considerations i see: 1. it's villain-dependent---how likely is he to check-raise there? 2. villain bluff range aside, the pot size lends itself to a CRAI. do we want to invite that bet sizing? 3. we've already invested what, a 1/4 of our stack? with one overpair on a 3-diamond, 3-connector, paired board. is this really the spot to go fishing?

i still have not been playing at all myself. been afk a lot, and all my energy at home has been focused on trading/hedging the BTC market lately.......

[Meowth05]

Bluff is very hard to identify when you are playing online casinos because you don't see their facial expression. One good tactic when playing online is playing a bigg bet real quick so they think that I have a good hand this throws off their mindset even if they play a good hand, they wouldn't risk a play against an unpredictable player. Psychology works really well when you play poker.

[tokeweed]

Hand 1 final.
Hero Checks and takes down the pot. Villain shows [Qh Ac] for a failed gutshot and 2 overs.

I elected to check, despite it being less likely they now had a 10, their raise on the turn had me thinking they had a strong 10 and were charging draws, I did consider the possibility of a flopped straight that some might play the same way, or a pocket overpair that beats me. Considering they had a complete air I don't think they would have called down any bet. I agree a flopped set would have probably been played more aggressively.

What I'm not sure of is in these spots if the checkback on the river is lost value in the long run if done in similar situations or not. Without having done any analysis, just from memory, I feel like it's a fairly even play as I can recall winning and losing in similar situations.

Def not a 10.  I don't think he would spew and c/r the turn with 10 X and anything really strong would've c/r'd on the flop.

You block QJ.  So he has way less combos of the nut straight and usually 67 folds pf with how the action went.  But dunno how the games are at this site.  You know better than me.

And overpair would've 3bet pf.  So less likely he's holding that.

On river after a c/r on the turn usually means he's weak.  Go for thin value all day here.  Bet 1/4 pot and let all his weak holdings make a crying call.

[tyKiwanuka]

Thanks for uploading the videos for the tournament @Steamtyme, very interesting. I am no expert or pro, but here are some comments:

This hand - what was your thinking here ? What did you put Iv4n on ? I like the play, but river bet size was a bit too high imo, for what you were trying to achieve. A straight will always call you and you will lose. Pair of Q's or 9's will probably call you. Lower pairs and busted straight draws will not call you for 295. I think something around 100 would have been better, since you lose less against straight/QQ/99, but will make it more likely to get called from 77/66.

In the very next hand, with 83s, you immediately pre-selected fold - I wouldn't do that. If two players just call, you can invest 10 chips here imo and check the flop. Just like it was here.

The next hand then, is the one we talked about, but I still don't remember, what I had there, maybe KQ.

I like that fold here very much, although a lot of people would say, that it's a bad decision. Same here.

Here I would have re-raised to isolate figment and only play against him. After he checked to you on the flop, just make a continuation bet, play the button.

This fold I don't know - you could just go all-in here as small stack with ~10BB.

[figmentofmyass]

Here I would have re-raised to isolate figment and only play against him. After he checked to you on the flop, just make a continuation bet, play the button.

i remember this hand. i would have called a preflop 3-bet. i would have check-called a c-bet (or maybe opened) on that flop too.

what do you do now if i open on the turn? how about if i check? are there 9s, 10s, and pocket pairs in my range?

missed boards with overcards are a bitch unless villain is super weak, and you're confident you can get him to fold.

[tyKiwanuka]

what do you do now if i open on the turn?

I'll fold. I am most likely beat then, so no need to invest more chips and/or wait for a miracle on the river.

how about if i check?

I would probably check too then. It's too dangerous with just overcards (and no draws) to invest more chips and you are most likely just waiting to re-raise me

are there 9s, 10s, and pocket pairs in my range?

Hard to put you on a range so early in the tournament. That bet on the turn looks 6s to 8s. Your preflop bet more like QQ+. But I guess you had something completely different^^

missed boards with overcards are a bitch unless villain is super weak, and you're confident you can get him to fold.

Yes, but you have to check out, where you stand with your hand. For this very hand it is easy to judge (for you) what is right and what is wrong, because you know both hands. But you need some general approach to play these kind of hands, which are/look strong preflop, but are often a nightmare to play postflop, if you don't hit. Thats why I would isolate the raiser first. Often times, a re-raise preflop and a c-bet on the flop will get you the pot already. If not, you ran into some better hand or opponent flopped something good and it's better to give up then.