Copycat Signatures: Chipmixer and Wasabi

[DarkStar_]

I just came across this issue recently after wondering why Gyrsur had -2 trust.

This is not an acceptable use of the trust system and I will be leaving him a counter-feedback until his negatives are removed.

- While trollish, his actions don't imply that he would be untrustworthy when it comes to conducting any sort of business on the forum.

- He's not wearing the signature anymore.

He's been here since 2012 and doesn't deserve to have his forum reputation tarnished in this manner.

If we look at precedent, other users have been (justifiably) given negative trust for stealing signature designs. Examples include Alttradex, biy, Crypto_Qv9 and Untold. I don't think I'm in the wrong in considering someone who steals signature designs to be untrustworthy. I agree that trolling is not a valid reason to leave a negative trust feedback so I've reworded the trust rating.

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[Gyrsur]

you see? switched on the God mode again and did follow own rules over common accepted rules.

non-trade issues results in neutral Trust feedback
trade issues results in negative Trust feedback

I just came across this issue recently after wondering why Gyrsur had -2 trust.

This is not an acceptable use of the trust system and I will be leaving him a counter-feedback until his negatives are removed.

- While trollish, his actions don't imply that he would be untrustworthy when it comes to conducting any sort of business on the forum.

- He's not wearing the signature anymore.

He's been here since 2012 and doesn't deserve to have his forum reputation tarnished in this manner.

If we look at precedent, other users have been (justifiably) given negative trust for stealing signature designs. Examples include Alttradex, biy, Crypto_Qv9 and Untold. I don't think I'm in the wrong in considering someone who steals signature designs to be untrustworthy. I agree that trolling is not a valid reason to leave a negative trust feedback so I've reworded the trust rating.

[actmyname]

Was that before or after the changes made to the trust system? I'm not on my computer and can't search for the date, but I consider that to be quite relevant, since there used to be no posibility of leaving neutrals.

I would actually argue that it would be more useful to leave counters after the changes since the trust scores are themselves diluted by the extra members in the DT circle, the pressure to switch to one's own custom list, as well as the entire premise of flags.

[DarkStar_]

you see? switched on the God mode again and did follow own rules over common accepted rules.

non-trade issues results in neutral Trust feedback
trade issues results in negative Trust feedback

Right, because you care so much about following commonly accepted rules.


From the linked referenced thread:

Do's and Don'ts

• Don't leave (negative) feedback based on retaliation.

There's a reason I linked to precedents (that were definitely not set by me) in my explanation. At no point did I assert that I was correct either:

I don't think I'm in the wrong

I am very open to reconsidering my trust feedback. At the current moment, my belief is that it is correct.

[Gyrsur]

I am very open to reconsidering my trust feedback. At the current moment, my belief is that it is correct.

and because of this my negative Trust feedback will still stay for both users until they change it to the commonly usage of the Trust system.

[nutildah]

@csmiami: thanks for your expanded explanation
@JollyGood: thanks for removing the red trust on Gyrsur

None of this has anything to do with the negative feedback you received. Bitcointalk has never supported plagiarism.

Is that really plagiarism tho? No, its not. If it was, why shouldn't accounts that do this be banned from the forum?

"the practice of taking someone else's work or ideas and passing them off as one's own."

You are wearing a ChipMixer signature -- does that mean you are attempting to pass the "work" off as your own? You are wearing it with permission from ChipMixer, I understand, but how does that make it not plagiarism? At least Gyrsur attempted to put his signature through a text spinner, lol.

Regardless, you know full well that plagiarism isn't a reasonable excuse to leave red trust. There's a much better case to be made for "theft."

If we look at precedent, other users have been (justifiably) given negative trust for stealing signature designs. Examples include Alttradex, biy, Crypto_Qv9 and Untold. I don't think I'm in the wrong in considering someone who steals signature designs to be untrustworthy. I agree that trolling is not a valid reason to leave a negative trust feedback so I've reworded the trust rating.

Lets go through these 1 by 1.

Alttradex - this guy stole a signature to promote his ICO; his intention was to profit directly from use of the signature. AFAIK, Gyrsur is not an employee of zkSNACKs Ltd., the company that performs the CoinJoins using Wasabi Wallet. He had no intention of profiting off somebody else's work. Nor did he use the signature for the purposes of a campaign.

biy - same thing, copied w/o permission in order to promote their own project

Crypto_Qv9 - same thing

Untold - this guy doesn't have any negative feedback. He has a neutral from yahoo that reads

yahoo62278

2017-10-13

Reference

copied someone else's work. Removed it once caught

Basically, I can see how what Gyrsur did was annoying, but he had no intentions of acquiring a profit from his actions, and once reprimanded, he removed his signature (even if only after putting up a fight). I don't see how this equates to trade risk.

As far as Gyrsur's actions in the last 12 hours are concerned, its apparent that he isn't DT material, which I don't think he minds so much as he doesn't have a custom trust list, and that situation has corrected itself. It's ultimately up to Gyrsur to be amenable enough to encourage DarkStar_ to "let bygones be bygones," but unfortunately things didn't transpire that way... Oh well, I tried.

Thanks JollyGood and DarkStar for chiming in.

[DarkStar_]

If we look at precedent, other users have been (justifiably) given negative trust for stealing signature designs. Examples include Alttradex, biy, Crypto_Qv9 and Untold. I don't think I'm in the wrong in considering someone who steals signature designs to be untrustworthy. I agree that trolling is not a valid reason to leave a negative trust feedback so I've reworded the trust rating.

Lets go through these 1 by 1.

Alttradex - this guy stole a signature to promote his ICO; his intention was to profit directly from use of the signature. AFAIK, Gyrsur is not an employee of zkSNACKs Ltd., the company that performs the CoinJoins using Wasabi Wallet. He had no intention of profiting off somebody else's work. Nor did he use the signature for the purposes of a campaign.

biy - same thing, copied w/o permission in order to promote their own project

Crypto_Qv9 - same thing

That is a fair point. I still feel like stealing a signature design to promote something that you like is in a trust 'grey' area; if someone took the BestChange signature, edited it to be for Binance (without an affiliate link), I'd still consider to be somewhat unethical, as someone paid for the signature to be created for a specific purpose, and a different person used the design without permission and/or payment.

Untold - this guy doesn't have any negative feedback. He has a neutral from yahoo that reads

yahoo62278

2017-10-13

Reference

copied someone else's work. Removed it once caught

FWIW Untold talked with the signature creator, apologized, paid compensation and stopped using the copied design.

Basically, I can see how what Gyrsur did was annoying, but he had no intentions of acquiring a profit from his actions, and once reprimanded, he removed his signature (even if only after putting up a fight). I don't see how this equates to trade risk.

I personally dislike the idea of "you can freely take any designs, edit them and use them as long as you don't intend on profiting from them without being seen as untrustworthy", but I can see your point here. IIRC Gyrsur did keep the signature for a decent amount of time before removing it, though I could be wrong. I've removed my negative trust feedback.

[LoyceV]

Is that really plagiarism tho? No, its not.

Copyright is a better word indeed.

Regardless, you know full well that plagiarism isn't a reasonable excuse to leave red trust. There's a much better case to be made for "theft."

Agreed.

Most of this drama is solved by now: Gyrsur removed the signature, he lost his DT2-position, he removed most of his abusive negative feedback, he lost the negative feedback from DT on his own account. I'd say case (almost) closed, other than the few remaining negatives left by Gyrsur.

[Gyrsur]

thank you Nutildah, for working this out.

I recived the negative trust from JollyGood and DarkStar_  not right from the beginning but later if I joined the DT2 list.

I guess the aim was to damage me but I don't care about it because I have no financial interest anymore here on this place.

By the whole discussion I'm more and more aware of how to make politics and follow own financial interests by the different tools of Bitcointalk in these days like the Trust system.

Take a look at the post history of some participants of this discussion and you will become quickly aware what for intentions they have had to join this place.

@csmiami: thanks for your expanded explanation
@JollyGood: thanks for removing the red trust on Gyrsur

None of this has anything to do with the negative feedback you received. Bitcointalk has never supported plagiarism.

Is that really plagiarism tho? No, its not. If it was, why shouldn't accounts that do this be banned from the forum?

"the practice of taking someone else's work or ideas and passing them off as one's own."

You are wearing a ChipMixer signature -- does that mean you are attempting to pass the "work" off as your own? You are wearing it with permission from ChipMixer, I understand, but how does that make it not plagiarism? At least Gyrsur attempted to put his signature through a text spinner, lol.

Regardless, you know full well that plagiarism isn't a reasonable excuse to leave red trust. There's a much better case to be made for "theft."

If we look at precedent, other users have been (justifiably) given negative trust for stealing signature designs. Examples include Alttradex, biy, Crypto_Qv9 and Untold. I don't think I'm in the wrong in considering someone who steals signature designs to be untrustworthy. I agree that trolling is not a valid reason to leave a negative trust feedback so I've reworded the trust rating.

Lets go through these 1 by 1.

Alttradex - this guy stole a signature to promote his ICO; his intention was to profit directly from use of the signature. AFAIK, Gyrsur is not an employee of zkSNACKs Ltd., the company that performs the CoinJoins using Wasabi Wallet. He had no intention of profiting off somebody else's work. Nor did he use the signature for the purposes of a campaign.

biy - same thing, copied w/o permission in order to promote their own project

Crypto_Qv9 - same thing

Untold - this guy doesn't have any negative feedback. He has a neutral from yahoo that reads

yahoo62278

2017-10-13

Reference

copied someone else's work. Removed it once caught

Basically, I can see how what Gyrsur did was annoying, but he had no intentions of acquiring a profit from his actions, and once reprimanded, he removed his signature (even if only after putting up a fight). I don't see how this equates to trade risk.

As far as Gyrsur's actions in the last 12 hours are concerned, its apparent that he isn't DT material, which I don't think he minds so much as he doesn't have a custom trust list, and that situation has corrected itself. It's ultimately up to Gyrsur to be amenable enough to encourage DarkStar_ to "let bygones be bygones," but unfortunately things didn't transpire that way... Oh well, I tried.

Thanks JollyGood and DarkStar for chiming in.

EDIT:

I personally dislike the idea of "you can freely take any designs, edit them and use them as long as you don't intend on profiting from them without being seen as untrustworthy", but I can see your point here. IIRC Gyrsur did keep the signature for a decent amount of time before removing it, though I could be wrong. I've removed my negative trust feedback.

again a lie, I took the signature changed the text to promote a decentralize service without financial interests and soon after this tread was created. I was forced to respond to this thread like in the Kindergarten and then I changed the colors and removed the "brand" sign and only THIS signature was available for a long time. AGAIN without financial interests and without damaging others here.

EDIT2: after I was removed from DT2 there was no need anymore to give me negative Trust feedback and so also the second one removes his negative Trust feedback to become in line with the official rules.

[JollyGood]

You are a seriously deluded individual who should seek psychiatric help otherwise your condition will be so extreme that you may not have the chance to be treated back to normality either through medication or through rehabilitation.

Nobody cares about damaging you financially, you hold no significance in the eyes of many users here. You claiming there is a conspiracy against you is laughable but you deleting your posts as well as your unwarranted negative trusts trying to hide your sarcasm and disdain for the members of the forum is supposed to be what... competence?

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thank you Nutildah, for working this out.

I recived the negative trust from JollyGood and DarkStar_ not right from the beginning but later if I joined the DT2 list.

I guess the aim was to damage me but I don't care about it because I have no financial interest anymore here on this place.

By the whole discussion I'm more and more aware of how to make politics and follow own financial interest by the different tools of Bitcointalk in these days like the Trust system.

Take a look at the post history of some participants of this discussion and you will become quickly aware what for intentions they have had to join this place.

[nutildah]

Alright alright, let's try to calm things down a bit... Situation seems to be resolved -- let's not rip off the freshly placed band-aid already.

I'd say case (almost) closed, other than the few remaining negatives left by Gyrsur.

He's now deleted all his negs so that's good.

I personally dislike the idea of "you can freely take any designs, edit them and use them as long as you don't intend on profiting from them without being seen as untrustworthy", but I can see your point here. IIRC Gyrsur did keep the signature for a decent amount of time before removing it, though I could be wrong. I've removed my negative trust feedback.

That is an understandable viewpoint. Thanks.

[JollyGood]

I laughed at his comeback aimed at me but just exactly how can he tell LoyceV to "Get a life because others have the money and he did the whole work"?

... And he moved the shady business or government honeypot line too....  

[Gyrsur]

I laughed at his comeback aimed at me but just exactly how can he tell LoyceV to "Get a life because others have the money and he did the whole work"?

... And he moved the shady business or government honeypot line too....  

EDIT: Dear MOD: quoted to prevent deletion (the GIF is just for fun).

[nutildah]

^^^


Seriously tho

[LoyceV]

I laughed at his comeback aimed at me but just exactly how can he tell LoyceV to "Get a life because others have the money and he did the whole work"?

Looks like he has no real arguments but wants to leave "retaliation neutral feedback". Fine by me, see my personal text

[Gyrsur]

Dear MOD,

quoted to prevent deletion and for my reference link for the Trust feedback.

Please don't delete the post again.

Thank you!

You are a seriously deluded individual who should seek psychiatric help otherwise your condition will be so extreme that you may not have the chance to be treated back to normality either through medication or through rehabilitation.

Nobody cares about damaging you financially, you hold no significance in the eyes of many users here. You claiming there is a conspiracy against you is laughable but you deleting your posts as well as your unwarranted negative trusts trying to hide your sarcasm and disdain for the members of the forum is supposed to be what... competence?

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-----------------------

thank you Nutildah, for working this out.

I recived the negative trust from JollyGood and DarkStar_ not right from the beginning but later if I joined the DT2 list.

I guess the aim was to damage me but I don't care about it because I have no financial interest anymore here on this place.

By the whole discussion I'm more and more aware of how to make politics and follow own financial interest by the different tools of Bitcointalk in these days like the Trust system.

Take a look at the post history of some participants of this discussion and you will become quickly aware what for intentions they have had to join this place.