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[sam00]

So basically after depositing  10.6 mBTC and making a total profit of 1.0391 mBtc (9.8%) I am now not able to receive any promotions again

If you are giving out these free spins once or twice a week for depositing 100€ every time then why do you "ban" the players that are pulling out a profit after wagering and playing on your site ?  

Thank you for going through with my last cashout since there are definitely some casinos that would've kept my last balance of 2.91 mBTC and just banned me.

But still, giving out free spins and then restricting players who are actually making a light winning doesn't sound right to me lol

This is just like what 1xbit does but without the scamming aspect, they're bitter that money is coming out of their pockets so they try their most underhanded tactic to discourage winners from making a lot of profit while playing in their site.

I did not want to compare them to 1xbit because they actually have a lot of scam accusations and because I always got my cashout on winz.io, but this is kind of what came to my mind that they are blocking players who make 10% ROI on their site.

If I won 100mBTC or huge amounts for multiple times because of their free spins then I would kind of understand but these sums are a joke if you know what I mean.

Do they actually care that much about 50$ that I rightfully won that they have to restrict me now ?

I opened a ticket and will post the reply here to let anyone else know if I find something out about their policy regarding players that win money

EDIT:
I just got the following reply stating that they don't just restrict their players and they always give a reasoning behind their decisions, yet they did not do that in my case.

TBy any chance, we are not restricting or "banning" our customers based on their winnings. We are doing everything to ensure that our players have a positive experience with us and enjoy the gaming process. That is why we offer freespins as a deposit bonus twice a week - for entertainment purposes only. Moreover, we have lifted all bonus wagering requirements and our bonuses are wager-free, again, for the convenience of our players. However, we also want to protect the casino and gaming providers from bonus abuse and money laundering, so we have minimal wagering requirements for deposits. In this way, we can ensure that a player has come not just to withdraw the winnings from the bonuses but use the bonuses just to enrich his gaming process. We never ban or exclude a player from bonuses without notifying him and explaining the reasons. Moreover, we do not want to jump to conclusions, so we only make a decision to stop issuing the bonuses to the player if a player shows a pattern of the same bonus abuse startegy.

I answered again and asked for the reasoning behind my restriction since I have been following their guidelines that they also sent me in this reply.

EDIT2:
My playing pattern has been deemed "unfair"
They have requirements and I have met them and in some cases I also kept playing after wagering the minimum amount for the fun of it and trying to get a profit.

The rules regarding deposit wagering can be found on our official website in the section "withdrawal policy". In your case, the management has made a decision based on your playing pattern - as you made deposits only for bonus promotions, wagered the minimum amount, and withdrew the funds. According to our Terms&Conditions, the management has the right to exclude a player from bonuses if his behaviour seems unfair.
We are always happy to see you as our player and would be happy if you will continue playing with us but unfortunately, the bonuses are not available to your account.
We hope for your understanding.

In conclusion:
Winz.io does not seem to be scamming their players or taking back the winnings but if you are on a winning streak, you might get restricted from future bonuses. Thank you for your attention. Good luck and have fun everyone!

[dustboy]

After a total of 4 deposits I just received this email from winz.io:

Dear Player,

Thank you for being a customer at Winz.io! We are reaching to let you know that any kind of promotions, such as but not limited to deposit bonuses, lotteries, quests, tournaments are no longer available to you.

So basically after depositing  10.6 mBTC and making a total profit of 1.0391 mBtc (9.8%) I am now not able to receive any promotions again

If you are giving out these free spins once or twice a week for depositing 100€ every time then why do you "ban" the players that are pulling out a profit after wagering and playing on your site ? 

Thank you for going through with my last cashout since there are definitely some casinos that would've kept my last balance of 2.91 mBTC and just banned me.

But still, giving out free spins and then restricting players who are actually making a light winning doesn't sound right to me lol

Is that the full email from winz's support? I mean, didn't they tell you what is the reason why you will no longer eligible for the promotions? It is strange if the reason is just because you make small profit. I wish winz come here to clarify about this case as we need to get the information from both sides first before we can judge something.

[sam00]

Is that the full email from winz's support? I mean, didn't they tell you what is the reason why you will no longer eligible for the promotions? It is strange if the reason is just because you make small profit. I wish winz come here to clarify about this case as we need to get the information from both sides first before we can judge something.

For privacy reasons I cut small parts out of their email but their reasoning behind this restrictions is quoted above.

In your case, the management has made a decision based on your playing pattern - as you made deposits only for bonus promotions, wagered the minimum amount, and withdrew the funds.

I can share my deposit and withdrawal history if anyone wants to see but there's no point in arguing any further. The owner/management has the right to do this and if they decide to act like this because of a few dollars they make their point clear that they just want users to use their bonuses to then lose money and not actually "win" by their own terms

[winz.io]

After a total of 4 deposits I just received this email from winz.io:

Dear Player,

Thank you for being a customer at Winz.io! We are reaching to let you know that any kind of promotions, such as but not limited to deposit bonuses, lotteries, quests, tournaments are no longer available to you.

So basically after depositing  10.6 mBTC and making a total profit of 1.0391 mBtc (9.8%) I am now not able to receive any promotions again

If you are giving out these free spins once or twice a week for depositing 100€ every time then why do you "ban" the players that are pulling out a profit after wagering and playing on your site ? 

Thank you for going through with my last cashout since there are definitely some casinos that would've kept my last balance of 2.91 mBTC and just banned me.

But still, giving out free spins and then restricting players who are actually making a light winning doesn't sound right to me lol

Dear Sam,

We work hard to provide players with fair end fun environment: we offer great selection of games, we offer wager free bonuses with no cap limits on outcome, we offer very fast cash outs and we do not manipulate RTP. We do it for a reason – to be different, but also because we believe fair play pays off for everyone over time.

In your case, should you have won, let’s say, 0.25 BTC from the last promo (that’s roughly the maximum the game would paid for the spin value) - we pay immediately, no questions. In August we paid a customer 45 Bitcoins in one day and did that within minutes of cash out requests, so smaller amount is not a problem as you can imagine.

However, 2% of players are gambling not for entertainment, but solely for the purpose of leveraging bonus money and making profit out of this. We are considering such behavior as a bonus abuse and your history with us is purely taking advantage in 100% of cases. Over time that ruins the experience for 98% of other players should we not deal with bonus rules abuse.

We always paid everything to you in time despite you approach and delivered our obligations in full. Our rules are quite liberal, but we also warn in Bonus Terms and Conditions that we can refuse further bonuses and even in some cases forfeit it, so we simply decided not to offer any more bonuses to you. We constantly monitor playing behavior of players and we do not tolerate bonus abuse behavior.

By the way, your account was never banned, you can still continue playing at Winz.io with the exception that no more bonuses will be available for you.

[iamwithyou]

After a total of 4 deposits I just received this email from winz.io:

Dear Player,

Thank you for being a customer at Winz.io! We are reaching to let you know that any kind of promotions, such as but not limited to deposit bonuses, lotteries, quests, tournaments are no longer available to you.

So basically after depositing  10.6 mBTC and making a total profit of 1.0391 mBtc (9.8%) I am now not able to receive any promotions again

If you are giving out these free spins once or twice a week for depositing 100€ every time then why do you "ban" the players that are pulling out a profit after wagering and playing on your site ? 

Thank you for going through with my last cashout since there are definitely some casinos that would've kept my last balance of 2.91 mBTC and just banned me.

But still, giving out free spins and then restricting players who are actually making a light winning doesn't sound right to me lol

Dear Sam,

We work hard to provide players with fair end fun environment: we offer great selection of games, we offer wager free bonuses with no cap limits on outcome, we offer very fast cash outs and we do not manipulate RTP. We do it for a reason – to be different, but also because we believe fair play pays off for everyone over time.

In your case, should you have won, let’s say, 0.25 BTC from the last promo (that’s roughly the maximum the game would paid for the spin value) - we pay immediately, no questions. In August we paid a customer 45 Bitcoins in one day and did that within minutes of cash out requests, so smaller amount is not a problem as you can imagine.

However, 2% of players are gambling not for entertainment, but solely for the purpose of leveraging bonus money and making profit out of this. We are considering such behavior as a bonus abuse and your history with us is purely taking advantage in 100% of cases. Over time that ruins the experience for 98% of other players should we not deal with bonus rules abuse.

We always paid everything to you in time despite you approach and delivered our obligations in full. Our rules are quite liberal, but we also warn in Bonus Terms and Conditions that we can refuse further bonuses and even in some cases forfeit it, so we simply decided not to offer any more bonuses to you. We constantly monitor playing behavior of players and we do not tolerate bonus abuse behavior.

By the way, your account was never banned, you can still continue playing at Winz.io with the exception that no more bonuses will be available for you.

Can you substantiate your claim of paying out 45 btc in one day? How about verifying your bank roll here by signing with your wallet? You just made a lame excuse for paying out 1 mbtc lol, I doubt that you have a decent bankroll for running a gambling platform.

Note: you can prove me wrong by just verifying your bank roll here.
 

[winz.io]

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[iamwithyou]

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Its super weird that you did not mentioned your so called 45 BTC win in your 'Readers digest of August win' LOL. We all want to know which slot he played and for how much multiplier he won for 45 BTC.
Note: I wonder if that win is just made up by you using your imagination (you stretched it a bit though in the heat of moment).

[tygeade]

There is a catch though, you have to wager your deposit first ion order to cash out.

Honestly there is rollover requirement everywhere, so it is totally understandable and everyone does that, but that doesn't mean that we should also be willing to let it get to our heads and get consumed by it neither.

Just focus on playing just because you want to play, do not let these bonuses make the decision based on what you are doing. Do not get the bonus if you do not want to, and if you do get it then do not force yourself to do it right away so that you can withdraw, just focus on it and eventually you will end up with a good one anyway. What I believe we should focus on is the fact that we should be gambling the way we want, and if it happens to win us something then that would be great, that's it.

[Doell]

Its super weird that you did not mentioned your so called 45 BTC win in your 'Readers digest of August win' LOL. We all want to know which slot he played and for how much multiplier he won for 45 BTC.
Note: I wonder if that win is just made up by you using your imagination (you stretched it a bit though in the heat of moment).

I help you check that if it's not clear with my picture/screenshots then you have to open winz.io on the start page in the latest winner section you can click top win slide to the side

[winz.io]

Can you substantiate your claim of paying out 45 btc in one day? How about verifying your bank roll here by signing with your wallet? You just made a lame excuse for paying out 1 mbtc lol, I doubt that you have a decent bankroll for running a gambling platform.

Note: you can prove me wrong by just verifying your bank roll here.
 

Thank you for being curious and giving us a chance to explain. And let me also give you an extended answer, so you have a good idea of what’s the driving factors behind the business. The team behind Winz.io operated in the market with various brands since early 2000s in all possible gambling niches, including casino, betting, bingo, poker and so on. We understand the industry well and right from the beginning we knew what is important. That doesn’t mean we did or do anything right, but I think our balance between right and wrong is on the positive side.

I actually understand very well you sentiment about being able to pay out and it is unfortunate phenomenon in the industry that there are so many casinos that exist for couple of months, promise a fortune, but in the end should a player win an equivalent of several $K in whatever currency, these casino make it close to impossible to withdraw.

We knew from the very beginning that this type of business requires:

• Fair approach, that’s why we publish RTP’s and maintain healthy RTP numbers. For example, Book of Dead RTP in our case is 96.21%, while in many other cases – 94% and I have seen as low as 89%

• Fast cash outs. We are a well-financed casino for that purpose. We are not hit and run guys and we are very capable of paying large wins quickly. And we could not do that immediately, took some time to negotiate processing fees, so that this approach could make commercial sense. We technically can’t do auto-cashouts, but that may happen in no too distant future.

• Fair bonusing. We started off with this regular approach, e.g. high bonus value and 30x wagering, but we quite quickly decided to change that to no wagering spins. No wagering free spins give more fair value than all these “up to 5 BTC” packages with 0.0001 BTC max bet that is close to impossible wager. No, we offer no strings attached. But if see abuse, we cut it off, cause 2% of abusing players damage 98% of guys who want to have fun. If we see that abuse will grow, then we will change again. Maybe to cashbacks, time will show.

• Decent bet limits. For example we take up to 0.4 BTC per bet in Blackjack VIP tables.

Now speaking of you question, the winning was a result of a rather long and very lucky streak in blackjack that day in Blackjack Prive tables by Evolution Gaming. We take up to 0.4 BTC per bet on those tables. The player was playing 4 tables simultaneously at max limits and also made side bets in majority of the rounds. The player made close to five digit in BTC in bets that month and that’s amazing by itself.

Another question, about the wallet. Casino operations are not that simple. We accept money in 15 currencies and even though most of action happens in maybe 5-6 currencies, we rely on a 3rd party service that does treasury management by keeping and constantly adjusting reserves of various sizes in all accounts, so we can pay quickly. Casino operations is a bit more than one big wallet to accept money and then to pay for everything. And even if we had that one big account, we wouldn’t publicly share any info on a mere request in the forum.

You are always welcome to make a simple test tough. Make a deposit, let’s say at least 1 BTC or maybe even 5 BTC, test games with the highest limits and try 4 tables simultaneously with the max 0.4B TC limits. If you win, great for you! If you lose, we will cover 50% of your loss. Then try to cash out and see yourself. We don’t make these deals usually, should you post results here, we are glad to make an exception.

[winz.io]

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[iamwithyou]

Can you substantiate your claim of paying out 45 btc in one day? How about verifying your bank roll here by signing with your wallet? You just made a lame excuse for paying out 1 mbtc lol, I doubt that you have a decent bankroll for running a gambling platform.

Note: you can prove me wrong by just verifying your bank roll here.
 

Thank you for being curious and giving us a chance to explain. And let me also give you an extended answer, so you have a good idea of what’s the driving factors behind the business. The team behind Winz.io operated in the market with various brands since early 2000s in all possible gambling niches, including casino, betting, bingo, poker and so on. We understand the industry well and right from the beginning we knew what is important. That doesn’t mean we did or do anything right, but I think our balance between right and wrong is on the positive side.

I actually understand very well you sentiment about being able to pay out and it is unfortunate phenomenon in the industry that there are so many casinos that exist for couple of months, promise a fortune, but in the end should a player win an equivalent of several $K in whatever currency, these casino make it close to impossible to withdraw.

We knew from the very beginning that this type of business requires:

• Fair approach, that’s why we publish RTP’s and maintain healthy RTP numbers. For example, Book of Dead RTP in our case is 96.21%, while in many other cases – 94% and I have seen as low as 89%

• Fast cash outs. We are a well-financed casino for that purpose. We are not hit and run guys and we are very capable of paying large wins quickly. And we could not do that immediately, took some time to negotiate processing fees, so that this approach could make commercial sense. We technically can’t do auto-cashouts, but that may happen in no too distant future.

• Fair bonusing. We started off with this regular approach, e.g. high bonus value and 30x wagering, but we quite quickly decided to change that to no wagering spins. No wagering free spins give more fair value than all these “up to 5 BTC” packages with 0.0001 BTC max bet that is close to impossible wager. No, we offer no strings attached. But if see abuse, we cut it off, cause 2% of abusing players damage 98% of guys who want to have fun. If we see that abuse will grow, then we will change again. Maybe to cashbacks, time will show.

• Decent bet limits. For example we take up to 0.4 BTC per bet in Blackjack VIP tables.

Now speaking of you question, the winning was a result of a rather long and very lucky streak in blackjack that day in Blackjack Prive tables by Evolution Gaming. We take up to 0.4 BTC per bet on those tables. The player was playing 4 tables simultaneously at max limits and also made side bets in majority of the rounds. The player made close to five digit in BTC in bets that month and that’s amazing by itself.

Another question, about the wallet. Casino operations are not that simple. We accept money in 15 currencies and even though most of action happens in maybe 5-6 currencies, we rely on a 3rd party service that does treasury management by keeping and constantly adjusting reserves of various sizes in all accounts, so we can pay quickly. Casino operations is a bit more than one big wallet to accept money and then to pay for everything. And even if we had that one big account, we wouldn’t publicly share any info on a mere request in the forum.

You are always welcome to make a simple test tough. Make a deposit, let’s say at least 1 BTC or maybe even 5 BTC, test games with the highest limits and try 4 tables simultaneously with the max 0.4B TC limits. If you win, great for you! If you lose, we will cover 50% of your loss. Then try to cash out and see yourself. We don’t make these deals usually, should you post results here, we are glad to make an exception.

I accept your offer, there are some minor terms that we need to discuss in order to make it happen but first of all, let's select some reputable escrow service providers here in the forum for 5BTC.  Are you willing to go escrow route?
Second I will only play provably fair games on your plateform, if you can prove provable fairness of your blackjack game I will play. So the deal goes like this you deposit 5 BTC first to escrow (we both will decide which one), then I will deposit 5 BTC to same escrow. After escrow confirms second deposit you will credit 5 BTC to my account on your plateform which I will give you later on. Then I will play with the condition of getting 50  percent loss cover condition with no wagering requirements.

[MusaMohamed]

I accept your offer, there are some minor terms that we need to discuss in order to make it happen but first of all, let's select some reputable escrow service providers here in the forum for 5BTC.  Are you willing to go escrow route?

5 Bitcoin is so big and Escrow service is a must. There are trusted Escrow service providers and you can find them from Recommended bitcointalk escrow services

bL4nkcode Escrow service

[batang_bitcoin]

I accept your offer, there are some minor terms that we need to discuss in order to make it happen but first of all, let's select some reputable escrow service providers here in the forum for 5BTC.  Are you willing to go escrow route?

5 Bitcoin is so big and Escrow service is a must. There are trusted Escrow service providers and you can find them from Recommended bitcointalk escrow services

bL4nkcode Escrow service

I'm reading a few post about this thing and I think that the winz team is handling it fairly enough. Someone who's dealing with the actual casino doesn't really need to have an escrow since they're the escrow themselves. And I think there's an unusual yet very good offer that's being brought to the table by the winz representative as I quote it below. But anyway, best of luck.

we will cover 50% of your loss. Then try to cash out and see yourself. We don’t make these deals usually, should you post results here, we are glad to make an exception.

[TimeTeller]

I accept your offer, there are some minor terms that we need to discuss in order to make it happen but first of all, let's select some reputable escrow service providers here in the forum for 5BTC.  Are you willing to go escrow route?

5 Bitcoin is so big and Escrow service is a must. There are trusted Escrow service providers and you can find them from Recommended bitcointalk escrow services

bL4nkcode Escrow service

I'm reading a few post about this thing and I think that the winz team is handling it fairly enough. Someone who's dealing with the actual casino doesn't really need to have an escrow since they're the escrow themselves. And I think there's an unusual yet very good offer that's being brought to the table by the winz representative as I quote it below. But anyway, best of luck.

we will cover 50% of your loss. Then try to cash out and see yourself. We don’t make these deals usually, should you post results here, we are glad to make an exception.

At least, winz team is open for this challenge. It means, they are sincere on this business and willing to accept player's challenge.
This will give them more credibility if they deliver on this situation.
Interesting if this act will push thru. Is he going to really deposit 5btc and play?
In any case, the casino will cover the 50% of his loss. So not a bad deal if he will push thru and test the site.

[winz.io]

Can you substantiate your claim of paying out 45 btc in one day? How about verifying your bank roll here by signing with your wallet? You just made a lame excuse for paying out 1 mbtc lol, I doubt that you have a decent bankroll for running a gambling platform.

Note: you can prove me wrong by just verifying your bank roll here.
 

Thank you for being curious and giving us a chance to explain. And let me also give you an extended answer, so you have a good idea of what’s the driving factors behind the business. The team behind Winz.io operated in the market with various brands since early 2000s in all possible gambling niches, including casino, betting, bingo, poker and so on. We understand the industry well and right from the beginning we knew what is important. That doesn’t mean we did or do anything right, but I think our balance between right and wrong is on the positive side.

I actually understand very well you sentiment about being able to pay out and it is unfortunate phenomenon in the industry that there are so many casinos that exist for couple of months, promise a fortune, but in the end should a player win an equivalent of several $K in whatever currency, these casino make it close to impossible to withdraw.

We knew from the very beginning that this type of business requires:

• Fair approach, that’s why we publish RTP’s and maintain healthy RTP numbers. For example, Book of Dead RTP in our case is 96.21%, while in many other cases – 94% and I have seen as low as 89%

• Fast cash outs. We are a well-financed casino for that purpose. We are not hit and run guys and we are very capable of paying large wins quickly. And we could not do that immediately, took some time to negotiate processing fees, so that this approach could make commercial sense. We technically can’t do auto-cashouts, but that may happen in no too distant future.

• Fair bonusing. We started off with this regular approach, e.g. high bonus value and 30x wagering, but we quite quickly decided to change that to no wagering spins. No wagering free spins give more fair value than all these “up to 5 BTC” packages with 0.0001 BTC max bet that is close to impossible wager. No, we offer no strings attached. But if see abuse, we cut it off, cause 2% of abusing players damage 98% of guys who want to have fun. If we see that abuse will grow, then we will change again. Maybe to cashbacks, time will show.

• Decent bet limits. For example we take up to 0.4 BTC per bet in Blackjack VIP tables.

Now speaking of you question, the winning was a result of a rather long and very lucky streak in blackjack that day in Blackjack Prive tables by Evolution Gaming. We take up to 0.4 BTC per bet on those tables. The player was playing 4 tables simultaneously at max limits and also made side bets in majority of the rounds. The player made close to five digit in BTC in bets that month and that’s amazing by itself.

Another question, about the wallet. Casino operations are not that simple. We accept money in 15 currencies and even though most of action happens in maybe 5-6 currencies, we rely on a 3rd party service that does treasury management by keeping and constantly adjusting reserves of various sizes in all accounts, so we can pay quickly. Casino operations is a bit more than one big wallet to accept money and then to pay for everything. And even if we had that one big account, we wouldn’t publicly share any info on a mere request in the forum.

You are always welcome to make a simple test tough. Make a deposit, let’s say at least 1 BTC or maybe even 5 BTC, test games with the highest limits and try 4 tables simultaneously with the max 0.4B TC limits. If you win, great for you! If you lose, we will cover 50% of your loss. Then try to cash out and see yourself. We don’t make these deals usually, should you post results here, we are glad to make an exception.

I accept your offer, there are some minor terms that we need to discuss in order to make it happen but first of all, let's select some reputable escrow service providers here in the forum for 5BTC.  Are you willing to go escrow route?
Second I will only play provably fair games on your plateform, if you can prove provable fairness of your blackjack game I will play. So the deal goes like this you deposit 5 BTC first to escrow (we both will decide which one), then I will deposit 5 BTC to same escrow. After escrow confirms second deposit you will credit 5 BTC to my account on your plateform which I will give you later on. Then I will play with the condition of getting 50  percent loss cover condition with no wagering requirements.

Hope you had a wonderful weekend! I think this is a good idea, but we should keep it even more simple. Since you had doubts of facts that happened in the ordinary course of business, I believe that the aim is testing that the ordinary course of business actually works in the way it is intended to.

So here’s the full list of conditions I propose:

Escrow is a good idea, but let’s keep it even simpler:

• We put 5 BTC into escrow
• You deposit 5 BTC directly to our website

There are two possible outcomes where a very skeptical person could argue things could go wrong (feel free to suggest more):

• We fail to pay whenever you decide to cash out
• You lose and we do not pay 50% cashback
• Escrow should cover these two scenarios

- Funds should be deposited by you to a player’s account from your wallet, which should be supplied to the escrow person ahead of the transaction

- Whatever is withdrawn from the player’s account should go back to the same wallet

- You should register and privately let us and escrow know the details of your player’s account

- You should livestream the session, link posted in advance. Livestream should include everything from registration to the logical conclusion of the experiment. The beginning of the session should start at a pre-agreed time. The purpose of the livestream is verification of events.

- We do have provably fair games, but limits in these games are rather low and not worth of 5 BTC experiment. The facts that you put in question are related to live blackjack by Evolution gaming. These games are a live broadcast from a studio and we offer up to 0.5 BTC per bet in Evolution’s Blackjack Prive. This is a private table, so you will be one on one with the dealer. Evolution itself is a stock-listed company, $27B market cap and employs 11K people. They take roughly $50B in bets monthly in various crypto and fiat currencies, holding about 70% of the global market share in live games, including crypto. Not provably fair, but good enough for a test.

[batang_bitcoin]

we will cover 50% of your loss. Then try to cash out and see yourself. We don’t make these deals usually, should you post results here, we are glad to make an exception.

At least, winz team is open for this challenge. It means, they are sincere on this business and willing to accept player's challenge.
This will give them more credibility if they deliver on this situation.

Yes, they're open and they're willing to take it so that they can satisfy one player that has concern as they play.

Interesting if this act will push thru. Is he going to really deposit 5btc and play?
In any case, the casino will cover the 50% of his loss. So not a bad deal if he will push thru and test the site.

I don't know, we'll just see it then but that's a good consolation for him and offer if he lose 5 btc then he gets back 2.5 btc.

[iamwithyou]

Can you substantiate your claim of paying out 45 btc in one day? How about verifying your bank roll here by signing with your wallet? You just made a lame excuse for paying out 1 mbtc lol, I doubt that you have a decent bankroll for running a gambling platform.

Note: you can prove me wrong by just verifying your bank roll here.
 

Thank you for being curious and giving us a chance to explain. And let me also give you an extended answer, so you have a good idea of what’s the driving factors behind the business. The team behind Winz.io operated in the market with various brands since early 2000s in all possible gambling niches, including casino, betting, bingo, poker and so on. We understand the industry well and right from the beginning we knew what is important. That doesn’t mean we did or do anything right, but I think our balance between right and wrong is on the positive side.

I actually understand very well you sentiment about being able to pay out and it is unfortunate phenomenon in the industry that there are so many casinos that exist for couple of months, promise a fortune, but in the end should a player win an equivalent of several $K in whatever currency, these casino make it close to impossible to withdraw.

We knew from the very beginning that this type of business requires:

• Fair approach, that’s why we publish RTP’s and maintain healthy RTP numbers. For example, Book of Dead RTP in our case is 96.21%, while in many other cases – 94% and I have seen as low as 89%

• Fast cash outs. We are a well-financed casino for that purpose. We are not hit and run guys and we are very capable of paying large wins quickly. And we could not do that immediately, took some time to negotiate processing fees, so that this approach could make commercial sense. We technically can’t do auto-cashouts, but that may happen in no too distant future.

• Fair bonusing. We started off with this regular approach, e.g. high bonus value and 30x wagering, but we quite quickly decided to change that to no wagering spins. No wagering free spins give more fair value than all these “up to 5 BTC” packages with 0.0001 BTC max bet that is close to impossible wager. No, we offer no strings attached. But if see abuse, we cut it off, cause 2% of abusing players damage 98% of guys who want to have fun. If we see that abuse will grow, then we will change again. Maybe to cashbacks, time will show.

• Decent bet limits. For example we take up to 0.4 BTC per bet in Blackjack VIP tables.

Now speaking of you question, the winning was a result of a rather long and very lucky streak in blackjack that day in Blackjack Prive tables by Evolution Gaming. We take up to 0.4 BTC per bet on those tables. The player was playing 4 tables simultaneously at max limits and also made side bets in majority of the rounds. The player made close to five digit in BTC in bets that month and that’s amazing by itself.

Another question, about the wallet. Casino operations are not that simple. We accept money in 15 currencies and even though most of action happens in maybe 5-6 currencies, we rely on a 3rd party service that does treasury management by keeping and constantly adjusting reserves of various sizes in all accounts, so we can pay quickly. Casino operations is a bit more than one big wallet to accept money and then to pay for everything. And even if we had that one big account, we wouldn’t publicly share any info on a mere request in the forum.

You are always welcome to make a simple test tough. Make a deposit, let’s say at least 1 BTC or maybe even 5 BTC, test games with the highest limits and try 4 tables simultaneously with the max 0.4B TC limits. If you win, great for you! If you lose, we will cover 50% of your loss. Then try to cash out and see yourself. We don’t make these deals usually, should you post results here, we are glad to make an exception.

I accept your offer, there are some minor terms that we need to discuss in order to make it happen but first of all, let's select some reputable escrow service providers here in the forum for 5BTC.  Are you willing to go escrow route?
Second I will only play provably fair games on your plateform, if you can prove provable fairness of your blackjack game I will play. So the deal goes like this you deposit 5 BTC first to escrow (we both will decide which one), then I will deposit 5 BTC to same escrow. After escrow confirms second deposit you will credit 5 BTC to my account on your plateform which I will give you later on. Then I will play with the condition of getting 50  percent loss cover condition with no wagering requirements.

Hope you had a wonderful weekend! I think this is a good idea, but we should keep it even more simple. Since you had doubts of facts that happened in the ordinary course of business, I believe that the aim is testing that the ordinary course of business actually works in the way it is intended to.

So here’s the full list of conditions I propose:

Escrow is a good idea, but let’s keep it even simpler:

• We put 5 BTC into escrow
• You deposit 5 BTC directly to our website

There are two possible outcomes where a very skeptical person could argue things could go wrong (feel free to suggest more):

• We fail to pay whenever you decide to cash out
• You lose and we do not pay 50% cashback
• Escrow should cover these two scenarios

- Funds should be deposited by you to a player’s account from your wallet, which should be supplied to the escrow person ahead of the transaction

- Whatever is withdrawn from the player’s account should go back to the same wallet

- You should register and privately let us and escrow know the details of your player’s account

- You should livestream the session, link posted in advance. Livestream should include everything from registration to the logical conclusion of the experiment. The beginning of the session should start at a pre-agreed time. The purpose of the livestream is verification of events.

- We do have provably fair games, but limits in these games are rather low and not worth of 5 BTC experiment. The facts that you put in question are related to live blackjack by Evolution gaming. These games are a live broadcast from a studio and we offer up to 0.5 BTC per bet in Evolution’s Blackjack Prive. This is a private table, so you will be one on one with the dealer. Evolution itself is a stock-listed company, $27B market cap and employs 11K people. They take roughly $50B in bets monthly in various crypto and fiat currencies, holding about 70% of the global market share in live games, including crypto. Not provably fair, but good enough for a test.

I am agreeing to every condition you put forward. The only thing that is concerning me is provable fairness of black jack games, I am not comfortable with black jack either (specially live dealer scenarios, lots of ways to cheat), I will play black jack if there is provable fairness without any human involvement. You can put forward a list of provable fair games in reply to this and I am ok with 0.1 BTC limit on those games. Please suggest some good escrow within this forum from your side also.

[winz.io]

Can you substantiate your claim of paying out 45 btc in one day? How about verifying your bank roll here by signing with your wallet? You just made a lame excuse for paying out 1 mbtc lol, I doubt that you have a decent bankroll for running a gambling platform.

Note: you can prove me wrong by just verifying your bank roll here.
 

Thank you for being curious and giving us a chance to explain. And let me also give you an extended answer, so you have a good idea of what’s the driving factors behind the business. The team behind Winz.io operated in the market with various brands since early 2000s in all possible gambling niches, including casino, betting, bingo, poker and so on. We understand the industry well and right from the beginning we knew what is important. That doesn’t mean we did or do anything right, but I think our balance between right and wrong is on the positive side.

I actually understand very well you sentiment about being able to pay out and it is unfortunate phenomenon in the industry that there are so many casinos that exist for couple of months, promise a fortune, but in the end should a player win an equivalent of several $K in whatever currency, these casino make it close to impossible to withdraw.

We knew from the very beginning that this type of business requires:

• Fair approach, that’s why we publish RTP’s and maintain healthy RTP numbers. For example, Book of Dead RTP in our case is 96.21%, while in many other cases – 94% and I have seen as low as 89%

• Fast cash outs. We are a well-financed casino for that purpose. We are not hit and run guys and we are very capable of paying large wins quickly. And we could not do that immediately, took some time to negotiate processing fees, so that this approach could make commercial sense. We technically can’t do auto-cashouts, but that may happen in no too distant future.

• Fair bonusing. We started off with this regular approach, e.g. high bonus value and 30x wagering, but we quite quickly decided to change that to no wagering spins. No wagering free spins give more fair value than all these “up to 5 BTC” packages with 0.0001 BTC max bet that is close to impossible wager. No, we offer no strings attached. But if see abuse, we cut it off, cause 2% of abusing players damage 98% of guys who want to have fun. If we see that abuse will grow, then we will change again. Maybe to cashbacks, time will show.

• Decent bet limits. For example we take up to 0.4 BTC per bet in Blackjack VIP tables.

Now speaking of you question, the winning was a result of a rather long and very lucky streak in blackjack that day in Blackjack Prive tables by Evolution Gaming. We take up to 0.4 BTC per bet on those tables. The player was playing 4 tables simultaneously at max limits and also made side bets in majority of the rounds. The player made close to five digit in BTC in bets that month and that’s amazing by itself.

Another question, about the wallet. Casino operations are not that simple. We accept money in 15 currencies and even though most of action happens in maybe 5-6 currencies, we rely on a 3rd party service that does treasury management by keeping and constantly adjusting reserves of various sizes in all accounts, so we can pay quickly. Casino operations is a bit more than one big wallet to accept money and then to pay for everything. And even if we had that one big account, we wouldn’t publicly share any info on a mere request in the forum.

You are always welcome to make a simple test tough. Make a deposit, let’s say at least 1 BTC or maybe even 5 BTC, test games with the highest limits and try 4 tables simultaneously with the max 0.4B TC limits. If you win, great for you! If you lose, we will cover 50% of your loss. Then try to cash out and see yourself. We don’t make these deals usually, should you post results here, we are glad to make an exception.

I accept your offer, there are some minor terms that we need to discuss in order to make it happen but first of all, let's select some reputable escrow service providers here in the forum for 5BTC.  Are you willing to go escrow route?
Second I will only play provably fair games on your plateform, if you can prove provable fairness of your blackjack game I will play. So the deal goes like this you deposit 5 BTC first to escrow (we both will decide which one), then I will deposit 5 BTC to same escrow. After escrow confirms second deposit you will credit 5 BTC to my account on your plateform which I will give you later on. Then I will play with the condition of getting 50  percent loss cover condition with no wagering requirements.

Hope you had a wonderful weekend! I think this is a good idea, but we should keep it even more simple. Since you had doubts of facts that happened in the ordinary course of business, I believe that the aim is testing that the ordinary course of business actually works in the way it is intended to.

So here’s the full list of conditions I propose:

Escrow is a good idea, but let’s keep it even simpler:

• We put 5 BTC into escrow
• You deposit 5 BTC directly to our website

There are two possible outcomes where a very skeptical person could argue things could go wrong (feel free to suggest more):

• We fail to pay whenever you decide to cash out
• You lose and we do not pay 50% cashback
• Escrow should cover these two scenarios

- Funds should be deposited by you to a player’s account from your wallet, which should be supplied to the escrow person ahead of the transaction

- Whatever is withdrawn from the player’s account should go back to the same wallet

- You should register and privately let us and escrow know the details of your player’s account

- You should livestream the session, link posted in advance. Livestream should include everything from registration to the logical conclusion of the experiment. The beginning of the session should start at a pre-agreed time. The purpose of the livestream is verification of events.

- We do have provably fair games, but limits in these games are rather low and not worth of 5 BTC experiment. The facts that you put in question are related to live blackjack by Evolution gaming. These games are a live broadcast from a studio and we offer up to 0.5 BTC per bet in Evolution’s Blackjack Prive. This is a private table, so you will be one on one with the dealer. Evolution itself is a stock-listed company, $27B market cap and employs 11K people. They take roughly $50B in bets monthly in various crypto and fiat currencies, holding about 70% of the global market share in live games, including crypto. Not provably fair, but good enough for a test.

I am agreeing to every condition you put forward. The only thing that is concerning me is provable fairness of black jack games, I am not comfortable with black jack either (specially live dealer scenarios, lots of ways to cheat), I will play black jack if there is provable fairness without any human involvement. You can put forward a list of provable fair games in reply to this and I am ok with 0.1 BTC limit on those games. Please suggest some good escrow within this forum from your side also.

Thank you for coming back swiftly. We do not have a provably fair blackjack at Winz.io. I doubt that anything could go wrong at Evolution tables as they wouldn't jeopardize $20+B valuation of their business interfering in our experiment, let alone know anything about it. But I understand if that is your choice.

[winz.io]

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