Counting Cards -- a Dirty Cheat or a Legit Skill?

[deisik]

Here I primarily refer to the blackjack variety of card games and similar games where you can gain advantage by counting cards, i.e. taking notice and remembering the cards which have already been seen. As far as I know, brick'n'mortar casinos are likely to kick you out once they see that you are counting cards as this is a cheat according to their books. However, and this is a tricky part, I can't fathom how anyone could reliably determine whether you are practicing this technique or not. And then, I, for one, would consider it a skill rather than a cheat

What's your take?

[avikz]

If I go by the books, counting cards in blackjack is not illegal if no external help is taken or if no card counting machine is used. However, casinos usually take it as a cheating because this ability gives an edge to card-counters against the house. So there are two ways to look at it. If you belong to the player fraternity, you will see it as a skill and if you belong to the gambling house, you will see it as cheating!

[deisik]

If I go by the books, counting cards in blackjack is not illegal if no external help is taken or if no card counting machine is used. However, casinos usually take it as a cheating because this ability gives an edge to card-counters against the house. So there are two ways to look at it. If you belong to the player fraternity, you will see it as a skill and if you belong to the gambling house, you will see it as cheating!

Yes, that's what we can start out from

But if we assume that blackjack or any other card game (say, poker) is a skill-based game, to a certain degree, then this skill necessarily takes from the house edge (provided there is a house edge, of course) since otherwise it would be a luck-only game, a game of chance. And if we think about it further, it is the casinos' approach that starts to look extremely cheaty on its own as any skill should count as a cheat to them

[Gyfts]

I wouldn't consider it dirty at all. It's a skill that shifts the house edge in your favor a bit. It isn't illegal at all, but it's pretty damn hard to pull off nowadays. The casino's will look at if you're flat betting or not and then look at when you start to increase your bets on certain hands and throw you out. They have security cameras that accomplish the same thing so you're being watched at all times.

If you can pull off counting, go for it. It's a real skill to not get caught.

[BitcoinsGreat]

Here I primarily refer to the blackjack variety of card games and similar games where you can gain advantage by counting cards, i.e. taking notice and remembering the cards which have already been seen. As far as I know, brick'n'mortar casinos are likely to kick you out once they see that you are counting cards as this is a cheat according to their books. However, and this is a tricky part, I can't fathom how anyone could reliably determine whether you are practicing this technique or not. And then, I, for one, would consider it a skill rather than a cheat

What's your take?

How can you call that a cheat game ? If a person have a smart and sharp mind, he can remember the cards already seen and play accordingly. I will call it a skill rather than a cheat. Also how can casino kick you out, if you count the cards in your mind. They should never know whats going in your mind. 

[deisik]

Here I primarily refer to the blackjack variety of card games and similar games where you can gain advantage by counting cards, i.e. taking notice and remembering the cards which have already been seen. As far as I know, brick'n'mortar casinos are likely to kick you out once they see that you are counting cards as this is a cheat according to their books. However, and this is a tricky part, I can't fathom how anyone could reliably determine whether you are practicing this technique or not. And then, I, for one, would consider it a skill rather than a cheat

What's your take?

How can you call that a cheat game ? If a person have a smart and sharp mind, he can remember the cards already seen and play accordingly. I will call it a skill rather than a cheat. Also how can casino kick you out, if you count the cards in your mind. They should never know whats going in your mind

I looked into this matter a little deeper now

They have actually developed approaches and techniques for checking if you are trying to pull off something like card counting. For example, if you start to bet more (i.e. increase the stakes) after more cards are seen, this is kinda a sure sign that you are counting the cards (provided your own cards are good). Otherwise, there is no logic in raising the stakes. But then raising the stakes during the game should be prohibited to make counting cards an exercise in futility

[onrise]

Here I primarily refer to the blackjack variety of card games and similar games where you can gain advantage by counting cards, i.e. taking notice and remembering the cards which have already been seen. As far as I know, brick'n'mortar casinos are likely to kick you out once they see that you are counting cards as this is a cheat according to their books. However, and this is a tricky part, I can't fathom how anyone could reliably determine whether you are practicing this technique or not. And then, I, for one, would consider it a skill rather than a cheat

What's your take?

How can you call that a cheat game ? If a person have a smart and sharp mind, he can remember the cards already seen and play accordingly. I will call it a skill rather than a cheat. Also how can casino kick you out, if you count the cards in your mind. They should never know whats going in your mind. 

I would not consider it as a cheating because during school days what we had being taught is to remember and write down in exams and so that focus one will develop overs the years. Now in the same way by staying focus I remember the cards which are played, and which are remaining and accordingly I play the game. Also its the mind game so any would not know if they calculate int he mind and show that they do are not keeping a track of it.

[Tipstar]

taking notice and remembering the cards which have already been seen. is not card counting. That's a primary card playing sense. If you lack it, it's better not to gamble on cards.

Card counting is actually trying to remember the serial of whole deck as they get displayed and shuffled in real world casino. That's not a thing in online casino. Most of the casino has a rule against card counting and expel the ones found to be doing that. But still it's a profitable take if you are not caught. Very few people do master that art.

[deisik]

taking notice and remembering the cards which have already been seen. is not card counting. That's a primary card playing sense. If you lack it, it's better not to gamble on cards.

Card counting is actually trying to remember the serial of whole deck as they get displayed and shuffled in real world casino

I think it is impossible to do in any modern casino

As I understand it, the deck is shuffled using a shuffling machine, thus you won't be able to learn and memorize the order of the cards in the deck (such a machine is also used to prevent people from colluding and that kind of thing). However, as per Wikipedia article on the subject,

Card counters are a class of advantage players, who attempt to decrease the inherent casino house edge by keeping a running tally of all high and low valued cards seen by the player

Put differently, what you consider a primary card playing sense, or what we consider a legitimate skill in a card game, casinos, on the other hand, think of as a cheat

[BitcoinsGreat]

Here I primarily refer to the blackjack variety of card games and similar games where you can gain advantage by counting cards, i.e. taking notice and remembering the cards which have already been seen. As far as I know, brick'n'mortar casinos are likely to kick you out once they see that you are counting cards as this is a cheat according to their books. However, and this is a tricky part, I can't fathom how anyone could reliably determine whether you are practicing this technique or not. And then, I, for one, would consider it a skill rather than a cheat

What's your take?

How can you call that a cheat game ? If a person have a smart and sharp mind, he can remember the cards already seen and play accordingly. I will call it a skill rather than a cheat. Also how can casino kick you out, if you count the cards in your mind. They should never know whats going in your mind

I looked into this matter a little deeper now

They have actually developed approaches and techniques for checking if you are trying to pull off something like card counting. For example, if you start to bet more (i.e. increase the stakes) after more cards are seen, this is kinda a sure sign that you are counting the cards (provided your own cards are good). Otherwise, there is no logic in raising the stakes. But then raising the stakes during the game should be prohibited to make counting cards an exercise in futility

Raising the stakes has no link to the card counting. There may be a player who is not counting the cards but still want to take risk or put pressure on the opponent by raising the stakes. He could be over confident too. There are lot of possibilities for raising the stakes and not just card counting.

[jrrsparkles]

Here I primarily refer to the blackjack variety of card games and similar games where you can gain advantage by counting cards, i.e. taking notice and remembering the cards which have already been seen. As far as I know, brick'n'mortar casinos are likely to kick you out once they see that you are counting cards as this is a cheat according to their books. However, and this is a tricky part, I can't fathom how anyone could reliably determine whether you are practicing this technique or not. And then, I, for one, would consider it a skill rather than a cheat

What's your take?

Its purely a skill, one who has better memory power can count the cards even before anyone acknowledges it. So this law made by the gambling side to restrict players from winning too often but still we can't say it is not practiced by any gambler when playing a card game so yes its a skill.

[TheUltraElite]

So consider you are playing on an online casino where the live dealers are doing the deals and you are playing Blackjack there. Consider the two following statements:

1. The dealer users more than one deck to deal the round. Its like 5-6 decks made into a mountain of cards from where they draw. You can visit the Evolution gaming providers and you can see it right away. If you can remember that many number of cards and survive through all the rounds then props to you.

2. You are also not counting cards from the start. Completing an entire deck for the dealer and then remaining on table to complete the next mountain of cards, make it all the more difficult.

3. Often you will not be playing alone. You will have to count the cards held by the other 5players at the table too if you want to keep track. Again something that makes it more difficult. Moreover why will they wait for you to count before the next round?

Now consider an online Blackjack game where there is no physical deck being dealt out, like the one on Stake. Cards are dealt every round from a new deck. How do you expect to count card there?

What I am trying to point out is that you may count cards, but it is just something that becomes pointless in such situations.

[dothebeats]

I voted for the wrong option (sorry about that LOL) but I do believe that counting cards isn't, in any way a cheat that will cost the house a fortune over time. It's something of a skill that one could develop by playing blackjack or other card games that people get used to doing. Casinos hate this method since they think that they're being robbed of a fair game, while in reality not everyone can do it and one must have the mental capacity to remember the cards that are being tossed and are being shuffled by the dealer. Not everyone has the mental capacity of a computer capable of processing actions that are done almost seamlessly in a matter of seconds.

[Kong Hey Pakboy]

Counting cards or remembering the cards which have been already appeared is a true talent or skill because only few people can have this kind of talent, and it is really rare for a person to remember the previous card of your opponents that was appeared until the very end of the game. The only reason why other casinos consider this kind of talent a dirty cheat because they could get bankrupt if they let this kind of person inside a casino and won every game.

[bittraffic]

If you get caught I guess its cheating as they did make it a rule in the traditional casinos. I tried counting while playing just around with friends, its actually hard to do unless you have a very keen mind in remembering the cards. Counting cards in online casinos is a lot harder if possible. Should you discover a fair casino if you can do this. But you definitely have the skills if you can count the cards alone, using the counting card skill to work for to win is a lot better skill.

[7788bitcoin]

I can't fathom how anyone could reliably determine whether you are practicing this technique or not. And then, I, for one, would consider it a skill rather than a cheat

In my view if you are able to process this much information in a short period of time, it is a skill but in the eyes of a casino if you are caught counting cards then you will get a good spanking and will be thrown out of the casino. The casino always have weird rules, if you are big whale who always win then you will not the allow to play in a casino.

[deisik]

They have actually developed approaches and techniques for checking if you are trying to pull off something like card counting. For example, if you start to bet more (i.e. increase the stakes) after more cards are seen, this is kinda a sure sign that you are counting the cards (provided your own cards are good). Otherwise, there is no logic in raising the stakes. But then raising the stakes during the game should be prohibited to make counting cards an exercise in futility

Raising the stakes has no link to the card counting

Nah, I wouldn't say so

When you see, i.e. literally see with your own pair of eyes which cards are being played, that you have a better hand than the other players at the table, it makes perfect sense to raise stakes to win more. Indeed, it doesn't mean that you can't raise stakes for other reasons as well but this doesn't change the fact that casinos are watching the players for this activity and consider it an indicator of "cheating" through card counting

[stomachgrowls]

If you get caught I guess its cheating as they did make it a rule in the traditional casinos. I tried counting while playing just around with friends, its actually hard to do unless you have a very keen mind in remembering the cards. Counting cards in online casinos is a lot harder if possible. Should you discover a fair casino if you can do this. But you definitely have the skills if you can count the cards alone, using the counting card skill to work for to win is a lot better skill.

Im not really that good on remembering things that do flashes out on a few seconds or more. Im not say this isnt a skill but you do really need to have that photographic memory which is really an advantage into these kind of game where you can able to card count and remember everything .Its cheating on House rules but it isnt in general sense.

If you do play on casino and do able to card count then better not to show yourself too obvious.Im sure that only a few do able to to perform such as this one.

[figmentofmyass]

worthy of mention are other techniques like shuffle tracking, ace sequencing, and hole carding---all of which (like card counting) are considered legal as long as you aren't using external devices or colluding. like card counting, they can get you banned from casinos when management catches on though.

Otherwise, there is no logic in raising the stakes. But then raising the stakes during the game should be prohibited to make counting cards an exercise in futility

gamblers often raise stakes after losing in a futile attempt to get back in the black. this is profitable for casinos who generally have an edge either way. they want people to raise stakes.

a better solution would be to shuffle when players increase the stakes. that gives the house their edge back.

[malcovi2]

Its a skill there are people practicing it for years to have an edge, there were masters that was able to beat casinos of thousands of dollar. I dont see it as a dirty cheat since even casinos knew it and i think its not even illegal.