Gas prices, why do people pay that much more for a "brand"

[DaveF]

Not sure where this topic belongs but I figure I'll post it here.
I have been seeing this more and more over the last 10 years or so with people paying 20%+ more for a gallon for a "real name" brand of gas vs something else.
Now I am not talking "Bob's Gas" vs Shell, but well known but not one of the biggies.

Big ones:
Exxon / Mobil
BP
Shell
Sunoco

2nd tier but still just as good (if not better)
Speedway / Marathon
Valero
Chevron
QuikTrip

Sometimes it's even between the big ones there is a Sunoco station near me @ 2.39 a gallon full serve cash +$0.10 / gallon credit
From that station if you stand on the sidewalk you can SEE a Shell station probably a bit less then a 1/4 mile away $1.99 a gallon full server cash / credit same price.

Seriously???

Just thinking about this today when I was at a Speedway that was $2.09 cash / credit looking across the street [just a regular street no divider 2 lanes in each direction] at a Mobil that was $2.59 cash and even more for credit. With cars at the pumps. Why?

Can someone who does this explain it to me?

Funny part it is seems to be across the US. I have seen the same in NY, PA, KY, WV, CT, OH, AZ, NV, UT and others over the years.

Just off major roads tends to be close if not the same in price. Go local and WTF???

-Dave

[1715580594]

1715580594

[suchmoon]

Sometimes people have loyalty cards/discounts that make up at least part of that difference. I haven't seen differences of 20% except for a brief period recently when prices dipped to $1.30 at some gas stations and others held higher, around $2.00, but that's just pandemic panic. Normally the differences are within 5-10% and if you add a loyalty discount and a discounted car wash it becomes negligible or at least enough to make people think it's worth it (the cheaper gas station might have discounts too).

Me personally... cheapest gas from GasBuddy + 5% CC cashback is what I usually do.

"full serve" sounds like NJ, haven't seen that nonsense anywhere else LOL

[DaveF]

Sometimes people have loyalty cards/discounts that make up at least part of that difference. I haven't seen differences of 20% except for a brief period recently when prices dipped to $1.30 at some gas stations and others held higher, around $2.00, but that's just pandemic panic. Normally the differences are within 5-10% and if you add a loyalty discount and a discounted car wash it becomes negligible or at least enough to make people think it's worth it (the cheaper gas station might have discounts too).

Me personally... cheapest gas from GasBuddy + 5% CC cashback is what I usually do.

"full serve" sounds like NJ, haven't seen that nonsense anywhere else LOL

I have always see a 10%+ swing all over the place for the 30+years I have been driving. Even with discount cards I can't see it making up that much.
The 20%+ I have seen for years in the middle of nowhere where your choices were a bit more limited but now it seems to be creeping to more populated areas.

There are places on Long Island that are still full serve by order of the town. There are others that are in more expensive areas that have it because it's what people want.
And, it also cuts down on credit card fraud. For some reason people are less likely to use a stolen card when they have to hand it to someone as opposed to just putting it in a card reader.

-Dave

[squatz1]

Eh. I think a lot of people are stuck in the line of thinking that the brand name is more reliable because they're using 'x companies gas' and they think that other companies may not be as reliable. There may be some truth to this -- as some no name companies may use more bio fuel in their blend of gasoline / diesel (I know this is more present in regards to diesel though)

I think a lot of it is that people have just picked 'their' gas station. I typically go to the same gas station over and over just because of the convenience and how close it is to me, unsure if I'd even save a few bucks by going somewhere else.

Name brands and their marketing does work on people though, rewards programs and all that keep people invested in the brand by using it.

Sometimes people have loyalty cards/discounts that make up at least part of that difference. I haven't seen differences of 20% except for a brief period recently when prices dipped to $1.30 at some gas stations and others held higher, around $2.00, but that's just pandemic panic. Normally the differences are within 5-10% and if you add a loyalty discount and a discounted car wash it becomes negligible or at least enough to make people think it's worth it (the cheaper gas station might have discounts too).

Me personally... cheapest gas from GasBuddy + 5% CC cashback is what I usually do.

"full serve" sounds like NJ, haven't seen that nonsense anywhere else LOL

Yeah I saw this happen a few times near me as well -- only because of the massive volatility in the market which causes some to just not change their prices for a few days and be able to reap the high margin rewards of that.

GasBuddy works though, amazing app. But only when I'm outside of where I live. Not gonna chase a buck or two when I'm coming home tired from work.

[DaveF]

OK this is just nuts:



60 cents more for unleaded (and that is the cash price) add another $0.14 for using your credit card.
No CC charge at the cheaper station.

And $1.22 spread on diesel. WTF?

I am thinking that the other station is either a front for a money laundering business, or is run by someone who does not understand how things really work.
On the other hand there is actually a car at the pumps getting gas so could just be me.

Bit of a ramble here but........
Reminds me of something that happened at the end of 2019 with someone screaming at the TV.

Bit of background. I live in Long Island NY, never hid that fact.
There is a road called Jericho Tpke, state road 25 that just about runs the length of the island (east - west).

We are going to concentrate on a 12 mile stretch between a town called Syosset ( where it crosses RT 135 a major north - south route) and another town called Commack (where it crosses the Sunken Meadow parkway another major north south route)

Now, for the most part it's a 2 lane road in each direction, with a bunch of lights. Probably will take you 30 to 40 minutes to do it if there is traffic. With no traffic, hitting a few lights it's 20.

So, we were sitting around watching the local news when you had one of those "local business in trouble" segments.
It was a small Greek restaurant that has been there for years.
The owner was complaining on and on about how the high rents, the cost of insurance, the high cost of labor, etc. Was driving him out of business.
I Just thought to myself boo hoo, adapt or die. The person next to me fucking lost it. Screaming (at the TV mind you) "well maybe if your prices were not so fucking high and your had better food life would not suck so much you looser"

OK perhaps a bit harsh but whatever.

No, he was pissed (still over a 90 second or so TV news blip) so we hopped in the car and went for a drive (lucky me).

In that 12 mile stretch of road that the restaurant was more or less in the middle of (5 mile spot) there are 8 Greek Restaurants / take out places. If you go north or south on a few of the major roads a mile you add about another 5 or so places.

So, 3 hours and 2 gyros later we had the conclusive proof that you can't just charge what you want because no matter how much you like to blame others for your business failing, it can all comes back to you and what you charge for your stuff. Especially if your product can be obtained elsewhere.

So how long (if they are not a front for the mob laundering money) till we see the segment on the poor owner of the Mobil station.

-Dave

[franky1]

many factors at play

1. if the fuel is mined/refined in country vs imported
2. how many gas stations to dilute the HQ profits. EG 100 vs 1000 means the thousand can offer slight cheaper prices.
3. location of the gas station. even a quarter mile might have a different lease value
4. tax amounts. again state by state and also if imported or locally refined.
5. distance from nearest distribution point
EG if shell is just 50 miles from nearest local point. and mobil is 150miles. it costs mobil slightly more to refiill
6. how busy the station is
a gas station that only requires one tanker a week vs gas station that requires 3 tankers a week can get better deals for bulk buying

[KiloFoxtrot]

many factors at play

1. if the fuel is mined/refined in country vs imported
2. how many gas stations to dilute the HQ profits. EG 100 vs 1000 means the thousand can offer slight cheaper prices.
3. location of the gas station. even a quarter mile might have a different lease value
4. tax amounts. again state by state and also if imported or locally refined.
5. distance from nearest distribution point
EG if shell is just 50 miles from nearest local point. and mobil is 150miles. it costs mobil slightly more to refiill
6. how busy the station is
a gas station that only requires one tanker a week vs gas station that requires 3 tankers a week can get better deals for bulk buying

Very true indeed!

Simply because it's a free market and customers literally get what they're paying for (as mentioned and enumerated already above).

And as long as the customer is always willing to pay for it, the law of supply and demand may not hold true sometimes when comparing "Gas Station A" versus "Gas Station B, C, D, and E for example.

[philipma1957]

If you own a none performance cars like I do.

Chevy Malibu 2009 to 2014
Kia Forte 2014 to 2018
Kia Forte 2018 to 2020
Kia Optima 2020.

always new alway trade them in to same dealer.
you find the cheapest gas you can and buy it as often as you can.

I get bj’s wholesale gas ⛽️

Or Wawa Gas ⛽️.

Or is a really am low on gas ⛽️ Five dollars 💵 and drive to the cheap places.

My wifes cousin lives in Commack LI I have drive thousands of miles on Jericho Turnpike and seen hundreds of gas stations with stupid prices.

So Dave I can realate.

oh to suchmoon shame on you knocking one of NJ’s shining examples of law.

“Full service only no pump“

 

[suchmoon]

OK this is just nuts:

Ok, I must apologize for not believing you

I haven't seen such a blatant ripoff myself.

oh to suchmoon shame on you knocking one of NJ’s shining examples of law.

“Full service only no pump“

 

TBH I avoid gas stations in NJ - last time I did it maybe 10 years ago and it scarred me for life - so I don't even know how it really works. Does the pump person ask for your zip code or do the pumps not require zip codes with credit cards? Do they carry change and/or run to the cash register if you pay cash? Is it customary to tip the poor schmuck who's breathing fumes for a living? Does the whole thing work 24/7?

[eddie13]

I don't think I have ever noticed a gas station charge more if you use cash or a credit card... ??

I don't think I have ever seen it around me, and if it was out of state it was probably a work card so I didn't care anyway..
Never heard of it though..

[DaveF]

If you own a none performance cars like I do.

Chevy Malibu 2009 to 2014
Kia Forte 2014 to 2018
Kia Forte 2018 to 2020
Kia Optima 2020.

Accord Hybrid. 47 MPG +/- a bit depending on how I am driving.
So, yeah fill up rarely and look for the cheaper place.

OK this is just nuts:

Ok, I must apologize for not believing you

I haven't seen such a blatant ripoff myself.

You might have, just did not notice. If you didn't need gas, and were not looking at prices, you could have driven past a pair of stations like these not had it hit you.
As I said in the 1st post  it's everywhere, and getting worse.

Once (if?)  I'm back the road more often I'll get some more pictures.

oh to suchmoon shame on you knocking one of NJ’s shining examples of law.

“Full service only no pump“

 

TBH I avoid gas stations in NJ - last time I did it maybe 10 years ago and it scarred me for life - so I don't even know how it really works. Does the pump person ask for your zip code or do the pumps not require zip codes with credit cards? Do they carry change and/or run to the cash register if you pay cash? Is it customary to tip the poor schmuck who's breathing fumes for a living? Does the whole thing work 24/7?

Since Phil is from there he can probably answer better. But from the ones I have been to.
1) Some do ask for your zip, most don't. Since you are handing your card to an attendant it's a different processing fee & fraud prevention setup then self serve.
2) Once again depends, from what I have seen the busier places usually carry cash, the slower ones have a central register or 2.
3) I only tip in crappy weather. But I am cheap.
4)  24 / 7 / 365

I don't think I have ever noticed a gas station charge more if you use cash or a credit card... ??

I don't think I have ever seen it around me, and if it was out of state it was probably a work card so I didn't care anyway..
Never heard of it though..

Where do you live? It's all over the US. Mostly in smaller stations who:
1) Have owners that have no idea how business works and think they are "getting back the credit card fees"
2) Are under-reporting the cash for tax reasons
3) Have no real idea how much cash costs to handle and deal with
4) Just don't care.
-------------------------------------

Another rant based on eddie13's comment
I am beginning to see some other stores also charge a credit card fee. Mostly restaurants / take out places but some other stores are starting too do it.
You can tell that they either have a captive customer base like a beach or other secluded area, have no idea how business works, or are committing some kind of fraud with the not wanting traceable money.

*once again based on US studies I can't comment on other places but it has been proven (by both sides pro and anti credit card) that:
1) people who pay with cards tend to spend a lot more (even when getting breakfast) then those paying with cash
2) credit card fraud / charge-backs cost a business less then stolen cash / wrong change / counterfeit bills
3) general time cost of counting cash / going to the bank / dealing with having enough change / etc. is a larger cost to the business then the 3% CC fee.

-Dave

[franky1]

well heres one for you

even after the fuel drop due to the stock market goof a few months ago
fuel in the UK is
~£1 a litre
=£3.78(uk) a gallon
=$4.72(us) a gallon

enjoy that thought when next complaining that US is expensive.. its not

[philipma1957]

well heres one for you

even after the fuel drop due to the stock market goof a few months ago
fuel in the UK is
~£1 a litre
=£3.78(uk) a gallon
=$4.72(us) a gallon

enjoy that thought when next complaining that US is expensive.. its not

It is not so much that gas ⛽️ is costly.  It is that on a road that has 50 gas stations in a 20 mile stretch .

Route 9 from Lakewood to Oldbridge.
crosses 3 counties in NJ
The price variation can be 40%




In UK 🇬🇧 if you drive past 5 petrol ⛽️ stations in a 20 klick drive.

are they all one price 1 pound per litre or do they vary as low as 80p and as high as 120p?






Most of my driving is NJ then NY  then CT

since NJ is cheapest and I am served by an attendant I effort to fill up in NJ using the lowest price I can find.

Do I tip yes

 the Months of Dec and Jan for Holidays  I tip 2 usd

now with covid I tip 1 usd.

Do we have gas discount some gas stations ⛽️ have a cash discount.

The lowest price for gas is BJ’s about 1.89 a gallon.
Wawa is about 1.95 a gallon.

NJ has quite a few Wawa locations.
Less BJ wholesale clubs.

both have discounts.

I am older  63 and don’t need to drive 40,000 miles a year anymore.

I drive about 15,000.  The kia optima can do 400 miles per tank. so 40 gas ⛽️ fills a year.

And with covid restrictions I am down to driving 400-500 miles a month.  so only 12-15 fills a year.

[suchmoon]

I am beginning to see some other stores also charge a credit card fee. Mostly restaurants / take out places but some other stores are starting too do it.

I think it used to be against the law and/or against Visa/Mastercard rules to do so. Visa still doesn't allow to change extra for CC but allows to offer a discount for cash. Meaning the advertised price must be the higher one. Not sure about MC.

[franky1]

well heres one for you

even after the fuel drop due to the stock market goof a few months ago
fuel in the UK is
~£1 a litre
=£3.78(uk) a gallon
=$4.72(us) a gallon

enjoy that thought when next complaining that US is expensive.. its not

It is not so much that gas ⛽️ is costly.  It is that on a road that has 50 gas stations in a 20 mile stretch .
The price variation can be 40%

In UK 🇬🇧 if you drive past 5 petrol ⛽️ stations in a 20 klick drive.
are they all one price 1 pound per litre or do they vary as low as 80p and as high as 120p?

£0.99-£1.11 as 12% variance
they dont do 'full service' or any 'tips' or try to charge extra for using a card vs cash

the 12% variance it is very much based on factors of what 'company' its associated with which dictates how much control they have over costs. sometimes about convenience. sometimes about custmer loyalty

EG petrol station would charge the higher end but then offer £0.05 a lire discount if they show they shopped in the affiliated store that day
others are cheaper because they are affiliated with a super market and just want people to use them more often(bulk buy&loyalty)

[philipma1957]

well heres one for you

even after the fuel drop due to the stock market goof a few months ago
fuel in the UK is
~£1 a litre
=£3.78(uk) a gallon
=$4.72(us) a gallon

enjoy that thought when next complaining that US is expensive.. its not

It is not so much that gas ⛽️ is costly.  It is that on a road that has 50 gas stations in a 20 mile stretch .
The price variation can be 40%

In UK 🇬🇧 if you drive past 5 petrol ⛽️ stations in a 20 klick drive.
are they all one price 1 pound per litre or do they vary as low as 80p and as high as 120p?

£0.99-£1.11 as 12% variance
they dont do 'full service' or any 'tips' or try to charge extra for using a card vs cash

the 12% variance it is very much based on factors of what 'company' its associated with which dictates how much control they have over costs. sometimes about convenience. sometimes about custmer loyalty

EG petrol station would charge the higher end but then offer £0.05 a lire discount if they show they shopped in the affiliated store that day
others are cheaper because they are affiliated with a super market and just want people to use them more often(bulk buy&loyalty)

Thank you so you get variance in price but  around 12% tops.  This seems more "normal"



While here in New Jersey or New York we can get 45-60% variance
In stations less than 10 miles apart.

[eddie13]

I don't think I have ever noticed a gas station charge more if you use cash or a credit card... ??

Where do you live? It's all over the US. Mostly in smaller stations

Well, put it this way..
Where I live gas stations aren't even prepay..
I hate that crap too..

Drive a long ways and I'm trying to pump gas smacking the machine for not working until I read "prepay only", say a few cuss words, go in, gripe to cashier about nonsense prepay, damn city folk, finally get gas, spin tires on way out..

I really don't pay that much attention to the cost of gas..
I only buy premium, because my cars need it, and I almost always fill up completely..
Hurts less to not even look..

I definitely don't get no 47mpg.. I'm lucky to get 20mpg..
I like to buy cars that are designed to burn fuel as fast as possible, and then do what I can to make them burn fuel even faster..
Gotta feed the trees some yummy CO2 ya know..

The only "brand" of gas I prefer is Shell V power 93... Other than that any old 91 will do just fine, but I feel the 93 is a little more det safety..

[Mauser]

I can't really answer that question for Germany, because here it seems different. People prefer to buy the cheapest gas for their cars. On a big street overhere we have a the big name gas stations and normally a few hundred meters further we have the low budge gas station with lower prices. Everytime I pass the gas stations there are more cars for the budget gas. But in the end it's probably all the same gas anyways and they just try to sell more.
The only difference is that the brand gas stations have a premium gas for high end sports cars. But I barely see people actually using it. I guess the Germans are looking more to save money than anything else.

[DaveF]

I don't think I have ever noticed a gas station charge more if you use cash or a credit card... ??

Where do you live? It's all over the US. Mostly in smaller stations

Well, put it this way..
Where I live gas stations aren't even prepay..
I hate that crap too..

Drive a long ways and I'm trying to pump gas smacking the machine for not working until I read "prepay only", say a few cuss words, go in, gripe to cashier about nonsense prepay, damn city folk, finally get gas, spin tires on way out..

I really don't pay that much attention to the cost of gas..
I only buy premium, because my cars need it, and I almost always fill up completely..
Hurts less to not even look..

I definitely don't get no 47mpg.. I'm lucky to get 20mpg..
I like to buy cars that are designed to burn fuel as fast as possible, and then do what I can to make them burn fuel even faster..
Gotta feed the trees some yummy CO2 ya know..

The only "brand" of gas I prefer is Shell V power 93... Other than that any old 91 will do just fine, but I feel the 93 is a little more det safety..

Wow, you must really be in the middle of nowhere. I have barely seen a non prepay station in 15 years. Not counting the full serve ones.

And I have receipts from 35 of the 48 continental states. A lot of them from some very rural places. I have fueled up in towns with a smaller population then the office building I work in and they even had the pre-pay pumps.

As for the fuel economy, it's just what you want to spend $$ on. I (pre covid) put on too many miles to have a non fuel efficient car at the moment. Or, as my accountant put it. "Compared to the car before this you are just about saving more in gas then the car costs"

When you get oil changes every 7500 miles and someone asks you "weren't you her this month already?" and you just nod and head for the free coffee & donuts you start to care...a lot.

-Dave

[suchmoon]

When you get oil changes every 7500 miles and someone asks you "weren't you her this month already?" and you just nod and head for the free coffee & donuts you start to care...a lot.

Isn't that what rentals are for? I've done 4-5k on two-week rentals, far cheaper than maintenance and depreciation on your own car. Oil change warning comes up, call Hertz, they tell you to ignore it LOL.