building a crypto criminal database

[Kemarit]

Bitcoin mixer is the dead end for all the investigation in case this blockchain criminal database will be implement. There is no way to track a transaction that process by mixer. This article show us that Bitcoin is traceable and not anonymous at all.

Of course not, Bitcoin should also fit into legal framework and that means that we need to sacrifice a part of of our privacy and anonimity and there is no sense in fighting it.

The only thing I used Bitcoin because it was anonymous and decentralized. If ever this feature will be compromised then it's not really the use case of bitcoin. We should not compromise our privacy in exchange for finding this criminal. Exchange must tighten there security because the problem starts there or maybe they cooperate with them.

Of course Bitcoin per se is not complete anonymous.

For me this is already bonderline censorship, and I don't like the idea of our addresses being registered as well, worst idea. I guess criminals will again try to outsmart they investigators, they can used mixers which they have done so, or use other coins besides Bitcoin and the most logical choice will be Monero, which has started already.

(https://www.coindesk.com/argentine-telecom-hackers-demanded-7-5-million-in-crypto-as-ransom)

[KrisAlex18]

It would be great if they can track the criminals, every website should have those futures that they can track people once there would be cybercrimes happen. It would be great because they will have a record of information about those things. One thing about it is that there are many hackers in this virtual world, we cannot deny those people because they are really expert with that thin they can really access your accounts or they can enter the back end of the website once it is not really secured. We should always have a backup for our files, which is necessary if you want to secure your data.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Of course not, Bitcoin should also fit into legal framework and that means that we need to sacrifice a part of of our privacy and anonimity and there is no sense in fighting it.

Nonsense. Centralized exchanges need to fit in to the legal framework, and you need to sacrifice your privacy to use them. There is no requirement to sacrifice your privacy to use bitcoin, and the day I have to complete KYC simply to use my own wallet is the day I sell all my bitcoin.

Bitcoin mixer is the dead end for all the investigation in case this blockchain criminal database will be implement. There is no way to track a transaction that process by mixer.

Not necessarily. There was a very interesting thesis posted on this forum last year which found it was potentially possible to break almost all mixing services and link incoming and outgoing transactions together. The only mixer which couldn't be broken was ChipMixer due to its unique mixing methods. You can read the thesis here: Breaking Mixing Services.

[bittraffic]

Its easy to track they say.  Its their project so if they can track criminals and put it in a database then tis their call. Blockchain tracks can be used to build cases and proof just how as we find it useful in finance.

Korean exchanges and probably the rest of the exchanges in Asia like Binance had already grabbed a lot of information from us as part of their database to scrape.

Yes and that surprises me! I know bitcoin is not completely anonymous. But unless and until the money is flown into a regulated business like exchanges, payment services, it's very difficult to track the sender. So this bold statement is really surprising. Quote from the article below,

Exchanges can freeze an account if anything needs to be investigated, you can actually see this on their terms and conditions, by this authority ( cyber crime group ) can enter the scene to look for something shady in relation to any crime that can be committed online. Tracking is easy, in fact every one can do this since the blockchain is publicly stored however the tracing for who is the one using the address is nearly impossible, I haven't heard any one that has been tracked because they located their IP, just remember the fact that IP can be faked using VPNs.

Database can be used to anyone who is in crypto sphere. So if you for once had tried posting your BTC or ETH address somewhere and they learned its yours, the authorities can just try sending some BTC to your account so they can interrogate you. This hasn't yet happening so far but there is no way that our wallets can deny coins sent to it.

For someone who has no connection to terrorism but suddenly receives coin from known or flagged wallets, it could destroy you and your kid's life.

[Rengga Jati]

This company in South Korea is figuring out that once a cyber criminal, always a cyber criminal.

You are right, once you are a cybercriminal, you will be always a cyber-criminal. Whatever the condition, cybercriminals always attack very simply. In my country, the criminal is caught and arrested after being a cybercriminal for several years previously. And he was arrested after doing that criminal in some years. So, does it mean that it is possible for the criminals to be caught and also arrested?

I believe that the way they use and transfer the BTC will never use their primary identification because it will sometimes need the account identification. It means that as long as they are use the centralized exchange, they may be revelaed.

[bittraffic]

This company in South Korea is figuring out that once a cyber criminal, always a cyber criminal.

You are right, once you are a cybercriminal, you will be always a cyber-criminal. Whatever the condition, cybercriminals always attack very simply. In my country, the criminal is caught and arrested after being a cybercriminal for several years previously. And he was arrested after doing that criminal in some years. So, does it mean that it is possible for the criminals to be caught and also arrested?

Well its always the case. I can agree to it.
The known criminal offenders are going to be the suspects. People who are tagged as sex offenders will usually be the first suspects when there is rape crime in the neighborhood. This pattern will also reflect in cyber crime. If you notice it, the scammers caught today can be tracked that they have actually scam before on differnet platform.

I believe that the way they use and transfer the BTC will never use their primary identification because it will sometimes need the account identification. It means that as long as they are use the centralized exchange, they may be revelaed.

So now those who uses decentralize exchanges mgiht just be closedlt watched under thier radar.

[hatshepsut93]

On that, he noted that crowdsourcing is one of the main ways that these crimes are being committed these days. His suggestion was to identify criminal wallets and flag them so that they cannot be used in the future.

What this means that in the future people will get their coins frozen when they send them to exchange if there's some link to criminal activity. Maybe you got unfortunate and there's just a few hops between your coin and some darknet market. Would they unlock your coins after you contact their support and try to explain the situation? Probably no, knowing how bad the customer support of exchanges usually is.

[rodskee]

On that, he noted that crowdsourcing is one of the main ways that these crimes are being committed these days. His suggestion was to identify criminal wallets and flag them so that they cannot be used in the future.

What this means that in the future people will get their coins frozen when they send them to exchange if there's some link to criminal activity.

Probably, if the trackers seen activities with criminals wallet, expect that
this will happen to your coin.

Maybe you got unfortunate and there's just a few hops between your coin and some darknet market.

This is really annoying as you can't do anything once there's relations with
your wallet add and illegalities.

Would they unlock your coins after you contact their support and try to explain the situation? Probably no, knowing how bad the customer support of exchanges usually is.

But you don't have any options, you have to work with your money to the point
that you'll provide everything.
You'll might get some chance but the delayed that will take place will annoyed
you while waiting for your money.

[kryptqnick]

I honestly don't know how I feel about this. While I obviously do want these cybercriminals to be found and arrested, I have a bad feeling whenever I see the words "Bitcoin" and "tracking" in the same sentence. It only looks like the "let's find a way to identify BTC users" plot thickens every day.

Hyungwoo Kim, CEO of Uppsala Security explained how domestic South Korean money laundering and cyber crime experts still roam free in the country using cryptocurrency.

(..)

Second, he explained that as he helped law enforcement discover the identities of some of the nth-room degenerates through their ETH, BTC, and Monero transactions, (..)

Kim made a straightforward plea to the audience that as cases of cyber crimes via cryptocurrency proliferate and are exposed, countermeasures against them should evolve. (..) His suggestion was to identify criminal wallets and flag them so that they cannot be used in the future.

Fortunately for law enforcement, cryptocurrency cyber crimes are easy to track.

Reading through the lines, my previous statement is further confirmed. So how are we going to flag criminal wallets so that they cannot be used in the future? Because that's censorship, and Bitcoin is a censorship-free cryptocurrency.

As others have told me in a previous thread of mine about mixers, at one point we will most likely all own Bitcoins that came from addresses that have been used in criminal activity or in mixers. So are we going to flag all these addresses? How do you censor a censorship-free system?

There's no way they'll actually block wallets because if even possible that would require the consensus and serious changes. What they can do is make a database of Bitcoin addresses that are known to belong to scammers and make sure that, say, exchanges don't allow deposits from these addresses. I think this would be an okay move, and it doesn't even mean that the identities of many people will be revealed. It will just be a kind of blacklist for addresses. However, I am not sure how efficient this solution is because scammers can use mixers to ensure that their money is not traced. So then the authorities should make mixers check through the database as well, but all this is resourceful and there will still be ways of getting around it. And yeah, some people might suffer from the system without actually being scammers. So there's more bad in this than good.

[Oasisman]

There's no way they'll actually block wallets because if even possible that would require the consensus and serious changes. What they can do is make a database of Bitcoin addresses that are known to belong to scammers and make sure that, say, exchanges don't allow deposits from these addresses. I think this would be an okay move, and it doesn't even mean that the identities of many people will be revealed. It will just be a kind of blacklist for addresses. However, I am not sure how efficient this solution is because scammers can use mixers to ensure that their money is not traced. So then the authorities should make mixers check through the database as well, but all this is resourceful and there will still be ways of getting around it. And yeah, some people might suffer from the system without actually being scammers. So there's more bad in this than good.

A centralized data base which allows all exchanges, mixers, and other trading platforms/services to automatically freeze a suspicious addresses is the most possible solution to this.
If the crypto enthusiast won't work to get rid or at least track these activities, I'm afraid that the governments will be the one to take actions to this since Bitcoin has been tagged into so many criminal activities in the digital world.

Now, I understand how so many of us are concerned about the mixers as the most useful tool for scammers to ran away without getting tracked. If all mixers has the integrity to serve their clients honestly, they must use the database to block and freeze a scammer addresses.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Would they unlock your coins after you contact their support and try to explain the situation? Probably no, knowing how bad the customer support of exchanges usually is.

Not unless you could provide solid proof that you sold or traded the coins to another party, which would be very hard to come by and would require handing over some ridiculously invasive KYC and personal information. And even then, the chances would be slim.

If all mixers has the integrity to serve their clients honestly, they must use the database to block and freeze a scammer addresses.

I can't disagree with this any more strongly. The day a mixer starts trying to identify me, look me up on a blacklist, and generally try to monitor how I use my own money, is the day I stop using that mixer and call them out for being a scam.

I am still struggling to understand why people who are supposed to be bitcoin advocates are talking about handing control over to a centralized third party. This is the complete antithesis of bitcoin. If you want to use a currency that can be arbitrarily frozen or seized, then there are hundreds of fiat currencies and thousands of centralized shitcoins you can choose from. Keep that nonsense away from bitcoin.

[Benefactor]

Scamming is taking place every day using cryptocurrency as a tool. It is not going to be completely eradicated in any way. If a government wants to stop scams for its country, it must take strong action. The first step is to identify the crypto criminals. The way the South Korean company is looking for cyber criminals. Actually a good move.

[pawanjain]

I guess it's just a criminal database with the filter of crypto related cyber crimes 
Well it's not bad if someone is trying to maintain a databse just for crypto related cryber crimes but I don't know what benefits will it bring to the crypto community. All I can think of right now is that once a criminal is identified for crypto crime and if the same person tries to do a crypto crime again then he will be easily identified for the crime. Though it won't benefit much, it is definitely a good step for crypto crimes taking place in the crypto community.

[gamer4156]

I don't think it is possible to commit any crime without proof. Those who have been engaged in this line must have a good knowledge about it. And they can catch them by looking at the invisible footprints online if they want. The government of every country should identify cyber criminals and bring them under the law and punish them.

[coinfinger]

This company in South Korea is figuring out that once a cyber criminal, always a cyber criminal. They found that two separate big crypto crimes shared the same exchange account for onramping or offramping. Of course most of it was done with Bitcoin. Don't know how it will get better before getting worse.

https://thenews.asia/hyungoo-kim-tracking-cryptocurrency-cyber-crimes/

Cryptocurrency is not bad, since it was created it has made a lot of things easy. I know a few of my friends who whenever I want to send money to them it was always difficult without Bitcoin, I used to make use of SWIFT codes and other methods that banks has to offer and it was really stressful whenever I have to send money to them or them send to me. I had to go to the bank and things gets worse when there are crowd in the bank, I will have to wait to get the form and then sign all those paperwork. And then the transactions take some days.

But since we made up our minds to be using Bitcoin, it’s no longer hard duty, they will just send me the address on my WhatsApp and I will quickly copy and send the money to them, and pay lesser fees. Cryptocurrency is a good invention, just that criminals are now using it for fulfilling their criminal activities.

[Shasha80]

This is what I fear will happen more and more, committing criminal acts using cryptocurrency. This is one reason why cryptocurrency is
difficult to accept by ordinary people. What's more scary is that more platforms will require KYC procedures. It is difficult eliminated
criminals from the world of cryptocurrency, therefore I strongly support what South Korea is doing with building criminals database related
cryptocurrency. Because criminals usually do repeat crimes.

[Oasisman]

If all mixers has the integrity to serve their clients honestly, they must use the database to block and freeze a scammer addresses.

I am still struggling to understand why people who are supposed to be bitcoin advocates are talking about handing control over to a centralized third party. This is the complete antithesis of bitcoin. If you want to use a currency that can be arbitrarily frozen or seized, then there are hundreds of fiat currencies and thousands of centralized shitcoins you can choose from. Keep that nonsense away from bitcoin.

The only reason why I came up to that idea is because I feel very frustrated with how Bitcoin had a lot of holes where criminal activities can easily be done without being tracked easily as well.
And no, I didn't mean to hand over the control to these third party companies, that's why I mentioned "Integrity and honesty". They can look at the database of suspicious addresses without going over to the unnecessary ones I guess. This are just my opinion anyway.

Nevertheless, you made a strong point with your statement.

[Sadlife]

If those criminals use Bitcoin for criminal activities then it could be a bad move. As we know, all the transaction made in Bitcoin are publicly displayed in the Blockchain api (site).
So these criminals will surely cannot do anything they want with their stolen Bitcoins. I guess this is one of the perks of having a pseudonymous system.

[kezinaur14]

And the worst feeling ever is when the words Bitcoin and crime/criminal are in the same sentence. That's when Bitcoin is dismissed as a dirty currency. And, as such, it has to be severely regulated in such a way that its wings are clipped hard. This means government resources and powers are utilized to arrest the freedom that Bitcoin is providing to the people.

When these two words are almost equated, that's when the mere mention of Bitcoin evokes fear in people and a stereotype is created.

It's not accidental btw, this seems like a intentional or at least very convenient repeated coincidence. I mean remember current news cycles care mostly about clicks and nothing rustles peoples jimmies like the combination of these two. You just have to follow the money and you'll see what I'm talking about.

It sucks, really. But many new technologies were feared before they were accepted / commonplace, bitcoin is no exception to this norm, people fear what they don't understand and that's okay

[o_e_l_e_o]

The only reason why I came up to that idea is because I feel very frustrated with how Bitcoin had a lot of holes where criminal activities can easily be done without being tracked easily as well.

Sure, I can appreciate that, but look at any other piece of modern technology. The internet can be used by criminals without being easily tracked. Encryption can be used by criminals and make it impossible to have their communications read. Tor can be used by criminals and make it very difficult to de-anonymize them. Cold hard fiat can be completely untraceable. The solution to these problems is not to start banning bitcoin addresses, banning Tor, banning encryption, censoring the internet, etc., but rather to crack down on criminal behavior.

I mean remember current news cycles care mostly about clicks and nothing rustles peoples jimmies like the combination of these two.

The vast majority of crypto media cannot be called "news". They are low quality blog posts, more often than not containing incorrect information written by someone who has done zero research, lifted some posts from here/reddit/twitter, and doesn't even understand the subject matter or the terms they are using. CoinIdol, Cointelegraph, and sites like them are clickbait trash.