Quality War ( Europe vs China and India )

[Vishnu.Reang]

Being from India, I am not going to defend the products from my country. I admit that we still have a long way to go. Until 10-15 years ago, products from China had a reputation of being low-quality and less-durable. But they managed to change that, even while keeping the products very much affordable to the customers. I don't know whether India will be able to repeat the success of the Chinese.

Let's take an example of televisions. Earlier, the best quality TVs came from Japan, from brands such as Sony and Panasonic. When the Chinese companies started producing LED TVs, they were not very well received. A lot of people complained about the low quality. But a few Chinese brands such as Vu, Xiaomi and Hisense managed to change all that. They improved the quality of their products, without increasing the price. Now the rival brands such as Sony, Samsung, and LG are facing bankruptcy.

[cabron]

Being from India, I am not going to defend the products from my country. I admit that we still have a long way to go. Until 10-15 years ago, products from China had a reputation of being low-quality and less-durable. But they managed to change that, even while keeping the products very much affordable to the customers. I don't know whether India will be able to repeat the success of the Chinese.

Let's take an example of televisions. Earlier, the best quality TVs came from Japan, from brands such as Sony and Panasonic. When the Chinese companies started producing LED TVs, they were not very well received. A lot of people complained about the low quality. But a few Chinese brands such as Vu, Xiaomi and Hisense managed to change all that. They improved the quality of their products, without increasing the price. Now the rival brands such as Sony, Samsung, and LG are facing bankruptcy.

India will have its success as well. Xiaomi is by far one of the best phone brand today. It just doesn't have the marketing of Huawei its right there made by the Chinese. Over the years of manufacturing the products, they eventually arrive a standard that will compete products from elsewhere.

Just look what type of cars are shipped to Europe and even in US. They are Asian cars built for American size for thier leg rooms like Toyota Camry.

[coolcoinz]

There are nothing worse in the world than indian guys code

There is something worse: Indian tech support.

I use a lot of Chinese products and their quality can range from good products, like Xiaomi electronics, or total garbage fake crap like a lot of the power banks, batteries, cables and connectors that come from China. As for the EU products, most of them are still made in China, just assembly and quality check is done in the EU. All plastic molds and stuff come from Asia, same as all components like capacitors, circuit boards and such are usually Chinese, even in US/EU made products.

[abhiseshakana]

i don't know about India but the thing about Chinese is that they have been aiming to maximize their target customers as much as possible. that means they are producing as many product as possible with as big a range of quality as they can.

it is from top quality hence higher price targeting customers demanding higher quality and have the money to pay for it. which are usually from developed countries.
down to low quality crap hence the lower price targeting customers that don't have the money for it, which are usually from under-developed countries.

this also includes producing parts to complete products and making all other countries including developed countries heavily depend on them.

that is how they are overtaking the world.
the "war" is already lost, the rest of the world just hasn't realized it yet

China sells what the market needs, not what the market likes. While India is trying to catch up and emulate China with progress, development, and super-fast growth.

When we are going to import something, in a sales contract there is such a thing as a good specification and term of the agreement, as long as the exporter and importer have agreed on the two points above and price, then there should be no more debate because both parties have agreed. The evolution of China, from a plagiarist country to a country that is expert at modifying and now a country with innovation, can show that China is indeed a great country with whatever slogans the market needs, China can provide. And even more ridiculous, it is understood that China is good at making low-quality, low-cost goods, but many countries still have trade deficits with China.

India, although it has long been instilling technology-based education from an early age but like the Tigers who lost their fangs, and I think India is far behind China.

[Rikafip]

Let's take an example of televisions. Earlier, the best quality TVs came from Japan, from brands such as Sony and Panasonic. When the Chinese companies started producing LED TVs, they were not very well received. A lot of people complained about the low quality. But a few Chinese brands such as Vu, Xiaomi and Hisense managed to change all that. They improved the quality of their products, without increasing the price. Now the rival brands such as Sony, Samsung, and LG are facing bankruptcy.

I beg to disagree.

While Hisense, TCL and Xiaomi are decent TVs, especially in the budget range, if you want top quality, you will still go for Samsung, LG and Sony (not necessarily in that order of quality). Those Chinese brands still can't match them.
Here in Europe people are still mostly buying those proven brands, while only those that that are looking for budget options go for Hisense and other similar budget friendly brands.


https://www.flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1582792353

While situation on TV market can certainly change in the coming years, I still hope that those top brands will survive and won't end up like Pioneer and Panasonic, who once had best TVs on the market but people rather chose cheap crappy lcds instead quality.

[NotATether]

For quite a while, China products are almost equated with mass-produced, substandard, disposable, cheap, easy to break, and even dangerous to use due to certain chemical components.

That's the only thing that they lack although they have a lot of manufacturers but the quality is not that guaranteed. Most of the materials that they used in their products are very poor quality but they are affordable that's why the demand is high.

As a rule of thumb, if manufacturers' goals are to export as many units as possible they will sacrifice quality, and sometimes dramatically.

A large part of the global supply chain is in China, so if you manufacture things in other countries, certain parts can't be made in as large batches as if they were manufactured in China. It brings screw production in Apple's Texas plants to mind, very low compared to if they were produced in China.

[Darker45]

For quite a while, China products are almost equated with mass-produced, substandard, disposable, cheap, easy to break, and even dangerous to use due to certain chemical components.

That's the only thing that they lack although they have a lot of manufacturers but the quality is not that guaranteed. Most of the materials that they used in their products are very poor quality but they are affordable that's why the demand is high.

As a rule of thumb, if manufacturers' goals are to export as many units as possible they will sacrifice quality, and sometimes dramatically.

A large part of the global supply chain is in China, so if you manufacture things in other countries, certain parts can't be made in as large batches as if they were manufactured in China. It brings screw production in Apple's Texas plants to mind, very low compared to if they were produced in China.

I don't agree that production in large volumes will necessarily mean reduction of quality. This is never a truth acceptable by manufacturing companies which truly value their brand name, products' quality, and customer's satisfaction over profit or money.

Unfortunately, large international brands are moving to China due to cheap labor and raw materials as well. They are after a larger profit. But it doesn't mean that they cannot match China's production capacity. If they will to, they can.

[bryant.coleman]

I beg to disagree.

While Hisense, TCL and Xiaomi are decent TVs, especially in the budget range, if you want top quality, you will still go for Samsung, LG and Sony (not necessarily in that order of quality). Those Chinese brands still can't match them.
Here in Europe people are still mostly buying those proven brands, while only those that that are looking for budget options go for Hisense and other similar budget friendly brands.

While situation on TV market can certainly change in the coming years, I still hope that those top brands will survive and won't end up like Pioneer and Panasonic, who once had best TVs on the market but people rather chose cheap crappy lcds instead quality.

In Europe/US people are going to prefer local/Japanese/Korean brands instead of the cheap Chinese brands. But in developing nations such as India, the Chinese brands now have a near-complete monopoly in the electronics market (TVs, mobile phones.etc). And one thing that I would say is that the Chinese brands will never be able to compete with Japanese brands such as Sony and Panasonic. But they have narrowed their gap with the Korean brands, such as LG and Samsung. I have used Chinese (Xiaomi) and Korean (LG) brands, and I can confirm this.

[teosanru]

My Fellow Europeans

Indians and Chinese are telling me that they make better products and offer better services then us ...

What do you say to them ?

“Strike first. Strike hard. No mercy.”


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkOUfrnSNSs

There are couple of ambiguities in your statement. First of all this is not who economics work at all. Secondly if Europeans were capable enough to offer better goods and services then rest of the world. Then the industrial hub might never have shifted to USA and later China. Every market is not the same. Europeans are 10 years ahead in technology and the per capita income is much higher thereby they can afford products with higher quality which obviously come with a higher price tag. While developing economies like China India have consumers who don't mind sub par quality products when they are available at cheaper price. So the respective countries manufacturers make the products as per the needs of their customers. It's not that Europeans are great or Chinese/Indians are great. It's about understanding the consumer sentiment this is the reason why top investment funds are investing lile billions in China/ India not only in Europe.

Moreover Europe's response to Coronavirus situation has clearly demonstrated how illiterate and unready Europeans are when it comes to hygeine and healthcare. There were enormous amounts of death only with meagre cases.

[Cnut237]

China make most of the world's products, partly because traditionally labour has been cheap there, and partly because it is a big, highly populated country. As China gets wealthier, this will no longer be the cheapest labour market... but the vast vast infrastructure they have built up over recent years should ensure that they remain the world's production hub. Nowhere else comes close.

World's busiest 10 container ports (data only available to 2018) by number of containers (thousand TEUs):


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_busiest_container_ports

[spy100]

Moreover Europe's response to Coronavirus situation has clearly demonstrated how illiterate and unready Europeans are when it comes to hygeine and healthcare. There were enormous amounts of death only with meagre cases.

Are you kidding with this statement ? Covid was spreading long before it was discovered probably from the start of 2019 .

And where did covid start ? China

Why ? Do to fact some Chinese guy decided to eat bats ...

Why we don't see more cases in China ? Do to fact commies always lie about numbers ... My country was a  communist country before 1989 .. we know what a communist is capable of  doing...lying

In Europe we shake hands with people,we hug and kiss our women a lot do to fact it's a cultural thing here for over a millennia ...that's what spread the virus  ...

In Europe we don't eat dogs and bats like Chinese do ... Nothing that a Chinese will make i will ever touch or buy as long as i live , this the punishment they deserve for creating the pandemic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1HH1-ozS_A

[Vishnu.Reang]

China make most of the world's products, partly because traditionally labour has been cheap there, and partly because it is a big, highly populated country. As China gets wealthier, this will no longer be the cheapest labour market... but the vast vast infrastructure they have built up over recent years should ensure that they remain the world's production hub. Nowhere else comes close.

I have bolded the term "partly" because that is just one of the many reasons.

Labor is not that cheap in China, at least when compared to the other Asian nations such as India, Bangladesh and Indonesia. Wages have grown over the past few years and now average wages for a factory worker in China stands at least 100% higher when compared to those in India or Indonesia. So why the companies continue to prefer China? There are many reasons.

First of all, an average Chinese worker is much more productive when compared to other people. Being an Indian, I have no reluctance in saying this. Here in India, I have seen foreign factory owners cursing the local workers, for their lack of work ethics and enthusiasm. Another factor that gives China advantage is the lack of red tape. This is a very big issue in countries such as India. And finally, environmental and other regulations are not that strict in China and this gives an advantage to those companies which deal with hazardous and toxic waste.

[Rikafip]

But they have narrowed their gap with the Korean brands, such as LG and Samsung. I have used Chinese (Xiaomi) and Korean (LG) brands, and I can confirm this.

It is true that Chinese products really raised the bar in that budget/best buy segment, and they do offer a lot for the money. I personally use few Xiaomi products (scale, Xiaomi Mi Box and Smartphone) and I am generally satisfied with the quality, especially considering the price, their products are really good value for the money. But if I want top quality, I have to look elsewhere. At least for now, unless they tackle that part of the market too. I remember times when Samsung phones were considered crappy and cheap, when Nokia ruled the market, and we can see now how situation changed.

[teosanru]

Moreover Europe's response to Coronavirus situation has clearly demonstrated how illiterate and unready Europeans are when it comes to hygeine and healthcare. There were enormous amounts of death only with meagre cases.

Are you kidding with this statement ? Covid was spreading long before it was discovered probably from the start of 2019 .

And where did covid start ? China

Why ? Do to fact some Chinese guy decided to eat bats ...

Why we don't see more cases in China ? Do to fact commies always lie about numbers ... My country was a  communist country before 1989 .. we know what a communist is capable of  doing...lying

In Europe we shake hands with people,we hug and kiss our women a lot do to fact it's a cultural thing here for over a millennia ...that's what spread the virus  ...

In Europe we don't eat dogs and bats like Chinese do ... Nothing that a Chinese will make i will ever touch or buy as long as i live , this the punishment they deserve for creating the pandemic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1HH1-ozS_A

Practically if we go by your theory that Covid did exist from start of 2019 then imagining that China was the inception place is almost a vivid imagination. Because in one year virus might have spread through so many carriers that predicting a source country is impossible.

Research of that person eating bat was based on facts that all of this starting in December in china and later we discovered covid was present in Italy in start of December too has already debunked that theory. I am not defending China but your theory is hollow dont give two contradictory opinions.

Secondly, if we go by conspiracy theories then you will find tons of them about how US created Aids etc. Not to forget about colonies and what not wars fought by USA in every small country. If you think it was someway better than communist you are mistaken

Thirdly, i am not talking about the spread of Coronavirus but the way it was handled and number of deaths. You can see russia and India too on top of the list but calculate the death rate and compare it with Europe. Italy boasted of world's best healthcare system.

Fourthly, in India most of the population don't even touch any kind of non vegetarian food and follows a perfect vegetarian diet so should we consider ourselves superior than Europeans? No? Then what kind of superiority are you getting over Chinese by eating chicken and sparing a dog? People have their cultures developed over a long period of time and do see the history why chinese started to do that. There is a study on that too.

Europeans and Americans have long been in some sort of hype about their supermacy. Now if two new countries whom they labelled third world are actually beating their Economy they are talking about protectionism.

[spy100]

Fourthly, in India most of the population don't even touch any kind of non vegetarian food and follows a perfect vegetarian diet so should we consider ourselves superior than Europeans?
Europeans and Americans have long been in some sort of hype about their supermacy. Now if two new countries whom they labelled third world are actually beating their Economy they are talking about protectionism.

You guys poop on beaches ... and you eat with your hands ... you Indians should be the last persons on earth that give morals about hygiene ...

Here is the proof 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixJgY2VSct0

[Mauser]

My Fellow Europeans

Indians and Chinese are telling me that they make better products and offer better services then us ...

What do you say to them ?

“Strike first. Strike hard. No mercy.”


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkOUfrnSNSs

Unforuntaely Europe is not so united to pull on one string and face off against China and India together. In terms of population the difference is huge with more than 2bn people on side. Luckily China and India are in a border conflict. The chances for the two countries to work together are fairly low at the moment.

If Europe works together with USA there would be a chance

[Twentyonepaylots]

Fourthly, in India most of the population don't even touch any kind of non vegetarian food and follows a perfect vegetarian diet so should we consider ourselves superior than Europeans?
Europeans and Americans have long been in some sort of hype about their supermacy. Now if two new countries whom they labelled third world are actually beating their Economy they are talking about protectionism.

You guys poop on beaches ...

I'm not an Indian, I'm laughing at this right now lol.

and you eat with your hands ... you Indians should be the last persons on earth that give morals about hygiene ...

And I'm laughing at you with this, it is okay to eat with bare hands even here in my country we do that, did your grandfather told you that God created Adam and Eve with spoon and fork? haha eating with bare hands in other countries is part of the culture and if you respect one then you'll be welcomed.  What I find wrong in eating with bare hands is if it is dirty, that would look dull and disgusting to every one.

Here is the proof 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixJgY2VSct0

You should not be basing with this video lol you did not even visited the India yet, there are Indians who can buy you yacht.

[Cnut237]

fact some Chinese guy decided to eat bats

The reason this happened is that China's economy has advanced very rapidly and unevenly. 1) There are people living and working in big cities, travelling abroad, living in the same way as the Westerners. 2) Equally, there are people living traditionally on the land with a lifestyle that has not changed for centuries. If you have just #1, then likely no Covid19. If you have just #2, then likely Covid19 develops but stays limited to a very specific very local area in rural China, and dies out. It's #1 and #2 together that caused the problem. Not saying it's impossible to have a global pandemic without both factors, we've obviously had them before, bubonic plague etc, I'm just saying the combination of both factors makes a pandemic much more likely.

Why we don't see more cases in China ? Do to fact commies always lie about numbers ...

People in authority have a tendency to lie about numbers. China, US, UK, most nations.

[MCobian]

In my opinion depending on the products and services compared, when talking about car and fashion I think Europe products
are better in quality compared to china and india products. Like Mercedes, BMW, Volkswagen, Ferrari, Lamborghini are European
cars with very good quality. Likewise like Gucci, Hermes, Louis Vuitton, Dior, Chanel are the best fashion brands from Europe that
have the best quality. In my opinion food products are better in China and India in quality.

[sedov1966]

I'm not from Europe, I am an Asian. But, I am not infavor with China nor India.
And definitely, I am not infavor with war. Its not the solution of the problem right now.
And we are not the enemy of each other. The Virus is our invisible enemy that we need to fight with. We need to set aside the self interests or the other country's interests. What matters now is to find the Cure for Covid-19 and save the lives of the people in the world. Peace be with you and your whole country ✌Stay safe 💕

Well put my friend, its all like you've said.
And I think we should pass this time of being in "war" or "race" with other countries, because thats not what each person needs.
Being in war is about playing games of governments.
But countries are just a bunch of random people with same genes in their bodies. They want to feel safe, they want to be happy and so on.
And ask anyone from any country if he/she wants to be happy - the answer is yes.
Ask anyone from any country again if the war is what we need - most probably the answer is no.