We once had a barter system here, but the government smashed it

[DoublerHunter]

^ Bater system was found out that there is no standardized value, you cant completely exchange your one sack of rice into a pair of shoes.
But I cant compare this to the BTC, government did not allow adoption in cryptocurrency just because this is a non-regulated currency, all currencies must be regulated by the government.
Nevertheless, see how the differences between the barter system and the currency and for sure it is different to BTC as a currency.
https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/061615/what-difference-between-barter-and-currency-systems.asp

[1714258207]

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[In the silence]

If you haven't noticed, Government is alright trying to control how we trade with exchanges now forcing people to first carry out KYC verification before using their platforms. I wasn't here when Bitcoin started, but I believe there was so much freedom trading Bitcoin back then than it is right now.

It's because back then bitcoin is not yet in the radar of the government, or any agency for that matter. But after the Mt. Gox heist, you will hear a lot of negativity starting to pop up. In the last 5 years or so, government are taking notice, hence KYC/AML verification is now in full effect.

However, this is the best effort they can put forward, they can't really stop bitcoin's trading. One way to do that is to stop internet, but I doubt they will have the power to do that.

It's a big deal when it comes to limit the usage of links on the internet to control bitcoin and it's way too impossible to stop the internet since this modern era of us takes place by using the internet.

[adzino]

-snip-
I wonder what this year will be like for BTC with so much bad media ( government )
publicity .

You have seen this "so much bad media" for the past few years, right? You see any difference in anything? Nope, you don't. But things have changed a lot. It is just that people aren't noticing. The government isn't pushing everything in one single day. They are imposing small rules and policies in such a way that people aren't even noticing the changes (all these small changes in a decade together has caused a huge change! People are just too distracted to notice!).
I would say this is one of the strategy the government is taking so that they can bring crypto currencies under their control through regulations without people making any noise.
Nothing we can do. It's inevitable.

[john_nautica]

-snip-
I wonder what this year will be like for BTC with so much bad media ( government )
publicity .

You have seen this "so much bad media" for the past few years, right? You see any difference in anything? Nope, you don't. But things have changed a lot. It is just that people aren't noticing. The government isn't pushing everything in one single day. They are imposing small rules and policies in such a way that people aren't even noticing the changes (all these small changes in a decade together has caused a huge change! People are just too distracted to notice!).
I would say this is one of the strategy the government is taking so that they can bring crypto currencies under their control through regulations without people making any noise.
Nothing we can do. It's inevitable.

You have a point. But I am also in doubt if they will be able to completely have the power to control and regulate cryptocurrency if they are not the ones who made it and who navigates the entire system. But of course, yes, they would have control over their people.

[semobo]

Back in the early 1980's My part of the country was in a huge recession. Peoples selling their houses for 1$ and walking away .

Did that happened in real life or it is kind of movie. $1 for a house sounds like a folktale. However the barter system you painted here is way below what bitcoin is created to do even though it is still a part of trading. Except there are people who know each other and decide to do it for the fun of it. I can exchange my eth with someone who has bitcoin or any other token i like. Afterall people swap cars in trades.

No one is going to sell their house for a dollar unless it is a haunted place. But doing a barter system payment in the 21st century will cut off the taxes to the governments that is why they banned it. We can't comment anything about what government likes to ban because they got the power and can ban anything that they wanted.

Bitcoin is likely to be banned as well when people started using it while it can be continued to use whether a ban is in place or not because there is no central authority to track down the bitcoin transactions.

[xcaret]

Semobo, I may be overly sensitive ,to your comment " No one is going to sell their house for a dollar unless it is a haunted place."
 Someone on this thread asked if I was dreaming ,or something about making a movie , meaning It was a lie. ( oh, here is the quote "Did that happened in real life or it is kind of movie. $1 for a house sounds like a folktale."
 
Semobo , I'm sure not thinking you are doubting what I said , I agree in Todays market no houses are being sold for $1 , let alone the hundreds that were sold for a buck back in the recession of 1982- 1984  . At least houses that are today selling for over $400,000 . ( which the $1 houses sell for, and even up to over a million bucks   today)

I explained all this in a post in this thread ,scroll back and look for a lengthy post , if anyone doubts it . Then show me at least the courtesy of one phone call.

Google Calgary Alberta real estate companies .pick one with a lot of offices , ask for the manager ( the new people are to young to have lived through it ) . First read my post in this thread which explains how it all came about . Then ask if everything wasn't exactly what I said happened ..

I don't mean that Semobo doubts what I posted, I certainly agree with him that only a haunted house (today) here in Canada would sell for $1 .
 I'm writing this just for anyone who doubts me, or hasn't read my post explaining to someone else on here how it came about .           

[semobo]

Semobo, I may be overly sensitive ,to your comment " No one is going to sell their house for a dollar unless it is a haunted place."
 Someone on this thread asked if I was dreaming ,or something about making a movie , meaning It was a lie. ( oh, here is the quote "Did that happened in real life or it is kind of movie. $1 for a house sounds like a folktale."
 
Semobo , I'm sure not thinking you are doubting what I said , I agree in Todays market no houses are being sold for $1 , let alone the hundreds that were sold for a buck back in the recession of 1982- 1984  . At least houses that are today selling for over $400,000 . ( which the $1 houses sell for, and even up to over a million bucks   today)

I explained all this in a post in this thread ,scroll back and look for a lengthy post , if anyone doubts it . Then show me at least the courtesy of one phone call.

Google Calgary Alberta real estate companies .pick one with a lot of offices , ask for the manager ( the new people are to young to have lived through it ) . First read my post in this thread which explains how it all came about . Then ask if everything wasn't exactly what I said happened ..

I don't mean that Semobo doubts what I posted, I certainly agree with him that only a haunted house (today) here in Canada would sell for $1 .
 I'm writing this just for anyone who doubts me, or hasn't read my post explaining to someone else on here how it came about .           

I read your comment about people sold their house for a buck but asked to take over the remaining mortgage by the buyer which doesn't means the value of house is a buck. And also google didn't gave me any results about this but it could be true when there is no employment opportunity then there is no other way than migrating to a different place but if they have any loan on their house then they have to make some settlement or it will destroy their credit history.

[thesmallgod]

Only if you understand that government can't actually eradicate bitcoin worldwide. You need to read the impact the bitcoin has made. Before, the tension was drawing about bitcoin and other crypto been ban in some countries especially China but up till date crypto is getting much more attention day in day out and the recent bull run has uncovered a lot of things. Don't be surprise if some countries start to create their own crypto asset because it was reported before that some countries in Europe are already doing this.

[xcaret]

Semobo , I just googled Calgary real estate offices, tons came up, with phone numbers too.
 Those houses were valued around $85,000 up to over a million.
 
Owners had no employment As the pasted post below explains ,so they were not able to make the mortgage payment .They would lose the house and their credit rating . So being there was a law here in Alberta that any residential mortgage could be assumed ,they sold their house to those who advertised that they would buy the house and save the seller's credit rating .   The new buyer became the one on the mortgage ,and that is who lost his credit rating .
Oh, I just read what I had posted , you are right ,it looks like the houses full price was $1 . No they were still worth a lot of money if a buyer could be found. actually, the buyer was only taking over the mortgage for one buck .
The home still had the huge mortgage on it ..The seller lost what equity was in the home ,but he would loose it and his credit rating if the bank repo'd it . The law has now changed , about ten years ago they stopped allowing people to take over a mortgage with out the banks approval..   .I'll paste what I wrote earlier   

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm in the province of Alberta ,western Canada , until about 10 years ago In this province only ,any residencial property mortgage could be assumed. I could ( and did ) buy a house with a mortgage ,then walk into the bank that held the mortgage ,and have them transfer it into my name . They didn't like it ,but nothing they could do about it.

In 1982-1984 we had a horrible recession when our prime minister ( the father of this putz who is running things now ) decided to create a huge tax on crude oil , since Alberta ran on oil royalties , all the drilling rigs left for USA, Oil Sands layed of people to, Oil explorartion stopped also . So many people had moved here from other parts of the country ,that finding themselves out of work, no government assistance ,they moved back to where they had lived before coming here .the glut of houses on the market caused a 35% drop in prices.
To save their good credit standing they would sell their house for 1$ and the buyer took over the mortgage. leaving the seller in good standing at the credit bureau !

But the good part is yet to come  ( how about this you bank haters? ) .
The buyer would rent the house out for very attractive price ,but not pay the bank a cent ( sounding good? ) after 3 months of threatening letters to the new holder of the mortgage the bank would take him to court , it was easy to stall the banks off in court for 9 months before the sheriff came and physically booted the tenents out and reclaimed the house . In those days you could rent a house out for $500 ,which was attractive even with the recession .
So for one buck you got the house and mortgage in your name and $500 free and clear for 9 months  $4,500 on each of the houses you bought .
Your credit went to zero but who cared , good blue collar wage was $11 per hour , less than $1,800 per month before taxes ,so you can see the incentive . My lawyer bought over 200 of them .   

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[CarnagexD]

What they did with the barter system in your country is definitely awful and all but I don't see how it could be connected to crypto now. As far as I know, people are more wary of what they get their news from and since we all know media can't be relied upon anymore, we're taking steps to avoid media dependency. Stock Trader giants on the other hand, now those are the ones that are a big pain in bitcoin's back.

Only if you understand that government can't actually eradicate bitcoin worldwide. You need to read the impact the bitcoin has made. Before, the tension was drawing about bitcoin and other crypto been ban in some countries especially China but up till date crypto is getting much more attention day in day out and the recent bull run has uncovered a lot of things. Don't be surprise if some countries start to create their own crypto asset because it was reported before that some countries in Europe are already doing this.

This is generally true, but if a major country is removed of bitcoin's reach and service, not only will it be bad for their investments but it would also be bad for bitcoin, one of the first things to look out for would be the massive panic selling, which will then be accompanied by the ban which will definitely affect bitcoin's price.

[Rengga Jati]

This is likely the first payment and transaction were. Before money, people use to barter for transactions and the price is determined by each value of each good or service. And until now, in my area, there is still kind of transaction, but only a few old people do this depending on the needs.
And moreover, at that time, there was also payment transaction using coin (in which it was real from gold or silver) that they were very valuable until now.

However, after first introduced by China, paper money was issued and had been being developed until now. I don't know what was the first reason for issuing the paper money for the transaction. However, it is also probably because of the development era, technology, and also widening the transaction coverage.
And after the era of development, paper money is the king of the payment.
But now, it seems like the world is changing again because digital money is here and probably will take over the paper money. Remember, that is the digital money (not oy for cryptocurrency but all digital money that is issued also by the government. 

[Keila Faith Villanueva]

If the future of btc is good, it's very likely that the government find trouble with us or find others ways to take btc away from us. They will be the final holder of btc and holder of all major wealth.

[kiki889988]

Bitcoin is decentralized, but so far its energy is not enough to get rid of government supervision, unless one day the government's credibility disappears and cannot affect our lives, but this is impossible in the short term.

[uneng]

With so many people making big profit from crypto currency I doubt the government will crack bitcoin down. Why would they do this if they can take a big slice of your pie through taxes? Not only them, but also the exchanges which are already charging exorbitant fees and all the kinds of middlemen you can think about. And of course, the government is earning twice: from your profits and from middlemen profit. And if the government earns twice, it means you are paying twice. Tis way bitcoin is never going to be cracked down.

[Darker45]

Why should your public barter system die along with that paper's free ads? That's a huge leap.

Times change. Change happens all the time. I know not where you're coming from but I am almost certain you have internet in your country. Ads on print media is not everything there is to ads. The online world has now dominated people's lives. Perhaps that paper ad's death is just timely. I mean, the modern times are offering more venues and tools and ways for people to deal with each other in whatever business they're at.

In my locality, barter has been revived during the pandemic. And it has made use of social media platforms.

Don't worry about media's portrayal of Bitcoin. Bitcoin doesn't give a damn.

[xcaret]

Why should your public barter system die along with that paper's free ads? That's a huge leap.

Times change. Change happens all the time. I know not where you're coming from but I am almost certain you have internet in your country. Ads on print media is not everything there is to ads. The online world has now dominated people's lives. Perhaps that paper ad's death is just timely. I mean, the modern times are offering more venues and tools and ways for people to deal with each other in whatever business they're at.

In my locality, barter has been revived during the pandemic. And it has made use of social media platforms.

Don't worry about media's portrayal of Bitcoin. Bitcoin doesn't give a damn.

I don't remember if the internet was even in use at that time , if it was , it was in it's infancy .

The reason the barter system I was mentioning failed was because We found each other by looking at that heading in the Buy & sell paper . Once it stopped allowing those ads ,it was hard for strangers to contact one another with their needs or services .
Yes the barter system still goes on ,as does the " I don't need a receipt if your not charging me the tax" .
Both save money .
Come to think of it someone should start a web site ,in every city in every country where people can advertise what their services are and others advertise what they are looking for ..No cash deals , barter only . It would be a hit once it got going . The key would be Barter only !!  I know that craigslist and others have the occasional ad where someone wants to trade . But I'm talking about Barter only ..           

[ReiMomo]

~snip~
Come to think of it someone should start a web site ,in every city in every country where people can advertise what their services are and others advertise what they are looking for ..No cash deals , barter only . It would be a hit once it got going . The key would be Barter only !!  I know that craigslist and others have the occasional ad where someone wants to trade . But I'm talking about Barter only ..           

That's only a wild imagination and it will never happen for sure. Barter only needs a real value of the product or the item that you barter from another product, this has been done a long time ago and you think if this isn't good then for sure it will exist until now and never vanished.

Digital and cash currencies will the only way to determine the value of the product to be exchanged, not just the barter system.

Maybe you can avoid paying tax by using bitcoin and do the same with a barter system, but if there is another way that bitcoin will taxable I will not hesitate my self to give it to my government. Paying tax is just helping to have a progress in your country, by collecting tax it means that you have contributed your part for your country's improvement, look at the US, (the most established country) they are very strongest country because they are very of paying tax, people should pay their obligation.

[amishmanish]

davis196
--snip96--
But the good part is yet to come  ( how about this you bank haters? ) .
The buyer would rent the house out for very attractive price ,but not pay the bank a cent ( sounding good? ) after 3 months of threatening letters to the new holder of the mortgage the bank would take him to court , it was easy to stall the banks off in court for 9 months before the sheriff came and physically booted the tenents out and reclaimed the house . In those days you could rent a house out for $500 ,which was attractive even with the recession .
So for one buck you got the house and mortgage in your name and $500 free and clear for 9 months  $4,500 on each of the houses you bought .
Your credit went to zero but who cared , good blue collar wage was $11 per hour , less than $1,800 per month before taxes ,so you can see the incentive . My lawyer bought over 200 of them .   

WOW!!. While these things seem out of question in today's connected world, a lot of such things have happened in the past. I didn't know that people put so much value on their credit rating so as to leave their property rather than default on the mortgage.

This is a very good example though that why it is so important to maintain bitcoin privacy. With the clear transaction trails, it will be easy to link all sort of BTC that people are earning today to some sort of questionable transaction (or atleast those that seem questionable). So would people risk getting doxxed and sued by authorities because of the KYC on some exchange or they would let go off that crypto to some sort of Govt treasury or auction of "confiscated good".

Events like these are reminders that how KYC can make you lose all that you have built through sheer hard work.

[Darker45]

~snip~
Come to think of it someone should start a web site ,in every city in every country where people can advertise what their services are and others advertise what they are looking for ..No cash deals , barter only . It would be a hit once it got going . The key would be Barter only !!  I know that craigslist and others have the occasional ad where someone wants to trade . But I'm talking about Barter only ..          

That's only a wild imagination and it will never happen for sure. Barter only needs a real value of the product or the item that you barter from another product, this has been done a long time ago and you think if this isn't good then for sure it will exist until now and never vanished.

This is certainly not just xcaret's wild imagination.

From where I live, something has recently made into the national news. It was a local barter community which was based on social media, Facebook in particular. It's a community with tens of thousands of members. All kinds of stuff were posted there for barter. No money involved.

Somebody who needs something will post something else that he/she owns and is willing to let go for the sake of that which he/she needs. This started during the height of the pandemic. A lot of people lost their jobs and livelihood. They've got no money. Things went back to basic all of a sudden. Barter became the refuge of a lot of people, although other stuff relating to hobbies and whatnot are also posted there.

[doomloop]

If something is not benefiting the government, they are always looking for ways that they are going to crack it down. As for BTC, I think it’s going to be a difficult case for them, they are not going to be able to crack it down and I believe they know that, so what they are trying to do this time around is to come into the platform and look for way to control it, they are doing their possible best.

Very soon whether you are making use of custodial or noncustodial wallet, they will be looking for ways to sip some information about you, especially those that are making use of custodial wallets, they are going to be the ones that will be used mostly by the government to extract information.