Do You Trust In-House Casino Competition? (Wager/Multiplier/Raffle)

[Becky666]

Many casinos have leaderboards for a wide range of competition. Is there a way to verify the validity of the users and their scores? What stop the casinos from printing random (fake) users and put that on the leaderboard?
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Basically, no-one can very such leader-board nor their in-house competition becasue what they do wholly are just within. Have entered into different competitions that i presumed to be manipulated by the house but at the end there wasn't a means to verify the results. From that day onward, i repented from participating into such competition becasue they are not verifiable and fake are much just to collect your little pay as for ticket.

[Oilacris]

Many casinos have leaderboards for a wide range of competition. Is there a way to verify the validity of the users and their scores? What stop the casinos from printing random (fake) users and put that on the leaderboard?
<snip>

Basically, no-one can very such leader-board nor their in-house competition becasue what they do wholly are just within. Have entered into different competitions that i presumed to be manipulated by the house but at the end there wasn't a means to verify the results. From that day onward, i repented from participating into such competition becasue they are not verifiable and fake are much just to collect your little pay as for ticket.

Actually had that kind of impression not only just because im a small time player but i dont really have the interest on joining those even if i do have the money.

There's no way to verify into those winners because you wont really able to know if those are legit players or not and majority of people would really have the same
impression towards those competitions.

Its just really obvious since this is part of their promotions.Its good if they are really fair when it comes to winners and not part of theirs.
With any competitions or promotions i dont really pay much attention to it.

[shield132]

Many casinos have leaderboards for a wide range of competition. Is there a way to verify the validity of the users and their scores? What stop the casinos from printing random (fake) users and put that on the leaderboard?

That's the reason I only participate in competitions published and handled in Bitcointalk. It's easier to verify. Do you also think the same?

Sincerely,
A skeptic guy.

Yeah, they can do that, for example in Dice, they know server seeds and can manipulate the results. I remember Bitsler wanted to implement an option where people would invest money into bankroll but they changed their money because of that reason, it's possible to manipulate the results (win/loss).

It all comes down to how you trust the casino where you are playing. It doesn't worth for reputable casinos to cheat their customers because financial pros can't outweigh the cons that it will bring to their reputation. Bad reputation = a few players and a few players = less profit.

[chaser15]

Many casinos have leaderboards for a wide range of competition. Is there a way to verify the validity of the users and their scores? What stop the casinos from printing random (fake) users and put that on the leaderboard?

That's the reason I only participate in competitions published and handled in Bitcointalk. It's easier to verify. Do you also think the same?

I don't think users will be comfortable if they will see their names on the leaderboard with their respective details in such a way that it will be considered as proof that they are real humans.

I also feel the same way but since there is no way we can check or verify the validity of these users on the top of the leaderboard, I will just put my trust in that website but not on those unpopular sites.

[shoreno]

Is there a way to verify the validity of the users and their scores?

you can click the players bet and thats how you verify it

What stop the casinos from printing random (fake) users and put that on the leaderboard?

if the casino is trusted they wont do such things because they want a fair play for every gamblers and to make the game competitive the way it was mean to . if a casino is not trusted they are cases that they are going to create thier own players and they wont stop because they are corrupt and want to secure the prizes that they showcased  .

That's the reason I only participate in competitions published and handled in Bitcointalk. It's easier to verify. Do you also think the same?

like this one https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5310518.0 ( Bitcointalk poker series #2 hosted by Betnomi  )  ? because there are also gambling sites posted on bitcointalk that have a competition but not organized in a way like the one i used in the example  but the one that i used as sample can still be possible cheated .

[Lorence.xD]

There isn't technically anything stopping them from making fakes in their in-house raffles and such but I think that they wouldn't risk the house with such petty tricks, I think that we can trust the house doing this kind of thing if we were to look at their reputation which lies in between bad and good, if they lie near bad reputation then you know that you can't trust them but if they are on the opposite then they might be able to pull off this kind of petty tricks because they have a rich clientele and they want to make sure that they can trick them.

[mu_enrico]

So after reading you guys' comments, it's almost all talk about reputation. About how reputable/trusted casinos won't risk their reputation for a small amount of money. Yeah, it sounds logical, but not enough for a skeptic mind.

That's the reason I only participate in competitions published and handled in Bitcointalk. It's easier to verify. Do you also think the same?

like this one https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5310518.0 ( Bitcointalk poker series #2 hosted by Betnomi  )  ? because there are also gambling sites posted on bitcointalk that have a competition but not organized in a way like the one i used in the example  but the one that i used as sample can still be possible cheated .

Of course, it can be cheated (remember the massive alts discovery by Nutildah?), but at least by utilizing Bitcointalk, there will be less Sybil attack. And the culprit can be caught.


I'll let this thread open for a few more days to get more ideas (if any) about how to determine if the in-house contest rigged or not. The wager one is more obvious since often in just a few hours before it closed, whales start to rekt the leaderboard.

[fiulpro]

Many casinos have leaderboards for a wide range of competition. Is there a way to verify the validity of the users and their scores? What stop the casinos from printing random (fake) users and put that on the leaderboard?

That's the reason I only participate in competitions published and handled in Bitcointalk. It's easier to verify. Do you also think the same?

Sincerely,
A skeptic guy.

I do think one cannot for trust anything with closed eyes but idk if am right but is this possible to somehow Integrate blockchain itself in a casino ?? This way everything will be as open as it can be ? It would be extremely complicated but the track of scores , players, numbers can be kept in a highly integrated manner and anyone literally anyone can check if it's good or no!

We do have games which are developed on blockchain therefore I do think that, this might be possible but the system itself would be able to handle less number of individuals at a time.

Maybe this would be a time when we could trust these things with closed eyes ?

-*-

I myself do not particularly go forth in the competitions but I do think if someone would like to elucidate my idea ? Can blockchain be used in gambling platform??

[dunfida]

I'll let this thread open for a few more days to get more ideas (if any) about how to determine if the in-house contest rigged or not. The wager one is more obvious since often in just a few hours before it closed, whales start to rekt the leaderboard.

This had been always the case or situation happen on a wager competition where even you do secure your spot on the top wont really make any guarantee
that you would win the competition because as long it wasnt over then whales can really fucked you up even with the last minute left of the time.
You cant even tell if those are real players or simply on the side with the house.Hard thing on spotting or determining out if they are rigging or cheating it or not.

[shield132]

So after reading you guys' comments, it's almost all talk about reputation. About how reputable/trusted casinos won't risk their reputation for a small amount of money. Yeah, it sounds logical, but not enough for a skeptic mind.

That's the reason I only participate in competitions published and handled in Bitcointalk. It's easier to verify. Do you also think the same?

like this one https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5310518.0 ( Bitcointalk poker series #2 hosted by Betnomi  )  ? because there are also gambling sites posted on bitcointalk that have a competition but not organized in a way like the one i used in the example  but the one that i used as sample can still be possible cheated .

Of course, it can be cheated (remember the massive alts discovery by Nutildah?), but at least by utilizing Bitcointalk, there will be less Sybil attack. And the culprit can be caught.


I'll let this thread open for a few more days to get more ideas (if any) about how to determine if the in-house contest rigged or not. The wager one is more obvious since often in just a few hours before it closed, whales start to rekt the leaderboard.

I think it will be beneficial for you to check this thread where you'll see the detailed explanation of one example on how casino can cheat you in "provably fair" games: FortuneJack's "Adrenaline" game is not actually provably fair, despite being advertised as such
Popular and well-established casinos don't need to cheat, simply there is no reason to cheat because they already make decent money when they offer you wagering and other type of contests. Trust hugely matters in casinos, it can really ruin their business if they are cheating and it was somehow leaked. Some people still think that companies like Evolution (former Evolution Gaming) lie to their customers while in reality there is 0 such attempt. Games have house edge and it's already gives casinos the guarantee that they will profit. And in-house competitions just push you to wager as much as possible because of high competition, the reward that they give you isn't a huge loss for them too, just a tiny amount in reality.

[crwth]

I haven't thought about promotions/competitions that are being run on their site that way. Yes, they can probably put up some random account to win the highest prize and get the award back, but that is up to them. I mean, we wouldn't know, but there's some uneasy feeling that the thought gives. I wouldn't think about it like that if my stats are okay with the leaderboard.

I agree that it's okay to check out competitions here, so it's transparent. But what's stopping them from creating their account here and posting their results? If that's how you think?

[Fundamentals Of]

I've had a few instances in which I doubted certain participants in competitions. I think it is not a matter of trusting or not because whether we like it or not the sites will always do something like this. That's part of marketing and they most probably have a certain budget allocation for it.

They need to always make it appear as though their competitions, raffles, chat boxes, or their entire sites in general are busy with a lot of users or gamblers. I assume many of those users are under the site's payroll. I think that's normal. And we have no way to verify whether they are legit users or just paid to use the sites.

[maydna]

I'll let this thread open for a few more days to get more ideas (if any) about how to determine if the in-house contest rigged or not. The wager one is more obvious since often in just a few hours before it closed, whales start to rekt the leaderboard.

This had been always the case or situation happen on a wager competition where even you do secure your spot on the top wont really make any guarantee
that you would win the competition because as long it wasnt over then whales can really fucked you up even with the last minute left of the time.
You cant even tell if those are real players or simply on the side with the house.Hard thing on spotting or determining out if they are rigging or cheating it or not.

We can let the casino do that while we can focus on ourselves. I think the casino will do anything that can ruin their reputations, especially if it is one of the trusty casinos that most gamblers know. But a gambler who has a passion for being the number 1 on the leaderboard will try hard to win many times as they want to see their name on that leaderboard. But still, the casino can arrange the name in the leaderboard, so it is hard for them to keep their name in that place. That is why we don't have to try hard to win by playing many times because that will not guarantee us to win.

[darewaller]

Basically, no-one can very such leader-board nor their in-house competition becasue what they do wholly are just within. Have entered into different competitions that i presumed to be manipulated by the house but at the end there wasn't a means to verify the results. From that day onward, i repented from participating into such competition becasue they are not verifiable and fake are much just to collect your little pay as for ticket.

I don't think any reputed site will ever rig a wagering contest. I know and fully understand the discussion that since the games in crypto gambling are provably fair, we are also looking at contests and wondering how to make them provably fair as well. I don't participate in many wager contests myself but from what I have seen, most of the players who win or are part of the leaderboard are usually active in the chat which makes me think the contest isn't rigged.

A simple solution to such contests is this: Make fixed limits like any player who wagers X amount of money will get Y amount of prize regardless of what others have achieved. This means that the prizes are fixed and cheating is impossible. It kills the fun to race against other players but at least makes it fairer.

[Kittygalore]

I believe in indoor casino competition but before that gamblers have to analyze the casino sites well although many gamblers are at the top of the competition casinos have lost their reputation for fraud. It usually depends on the individual how much risk he wants to take in case of competition it is better to pay attention to one's own game and if the situation is bad and the whales are in the market it is better to stay away from now.

In-house competitions are trusted depending on the reputation and the financial wellness of the casino, if they are doing well on both sides, then that means that they do not have any other intention other than to make some publicity and have their public relations go up and they want to attract more customers, if it is otherwise then you have to wary of it because they might rig the game that they are trying to conduct, risk will only come when you have an inkling feeling that the casino is going to cheat you.

[RealMalatesta]

I haven't thought about promotions/competitions that are being run on their site that way. Yes, they can probably put up some random account to win the highest prize and get the award back, but that is up to them. I mean, we wouldn't know, but there's some uneasy feeling that the thought gives. I wouldn't think about it like that if my stats are okay with the leaderboard.

That is why there is no point in making bets to win these competitions, just bet as you normally do and if you get placed in any of the competitions that's just an additional benefit. The prizes in these competitions are usually smaller than the house edge, what I mean to say is you won't get more than 0.01 BTC in most of these competitions by betting less than 1 BTC, assuming the house edge is 1%. I follow some stake betting competitions and last I checked, someone wagered 276 bitcoins and counting to win a prize of approximately 0.026 BTC.

It's a no brainer to participate in competitions just because of the prizes because like it's already been talked that there is no guarantee the competitions are fair and even if they are fair, you are getting much less than what you are "expected" to lose by wagering the amounts needed to win the competitions.

On a funny thought, I was thinking if all the players unite and decide that no one will wager for the competition and let only one guy wager 5 USD and win the top prize and then we all share the money haha.

[Bitinity]

I haven't thought about promotions/competitions that are being run on their site that way. Yes, they can probably put up some random account to win the highest prize and get the award back, but that is up to them. I mean, we wouldn't know, but there's some uneasy feeling that the thought gives. I wouldn't think about it like that if my stats are okay with the leaderboard.

That is why there is no point in making bets to win these competitions, just bet as you normally do and if you get placed in any of the competitions that's just an additional benefit. The prizes in these competitions are usually smaller than the house edge, what I mean to say is you won't get more than 0.01 BTC in most of these competitions by betting less than 1 BTC, assuming the house edge is 1%. I follow some stake betting competitions and last I checked, someone wagered 276 bitcoins and counting to win a prize of approximately 0.026 BTC.

It's a no brainer to participate in competitions just because of the prizes because like it's already been talked that there is no guarantee the competitions are fair and even if they are fair, you are getting much less than what you are "expected" to lose by wagering the amounts needed to win the competitions.

On a funny thought, I was thinking if all the players unite and decide that no one will wager for the competition and let only one guy wager 5 USD and win the top prize and then we all share the money haha.

A hundred percent agree with you, especially for wagering competition where high likely the winners are those who do not play for the prize. The prize is just like an additional bonus for them for being active wagering on the site. Expected lose for those winners are always higher than the possible reward they get from the competition. I also do not see any benefits for casinos to put some random fake users on the winners list as high rollers are smart enough how to gambler their money. Only scam sites do such cheating imho.

[South Park]

Different when we are talking about wager, biggest profit, race and other contests, all of these contest could be manipulated (especially when the time of contest is near end).

Could be, but I don't see casinos to do it, as what the OP is, gamblers are very skeptic in this kind of things. Gamblers tend to keep a close eyes on things they anticipated to win, so if the competition have been painted with other colors, there is a high chance of gamblers to notice it very quick. Aside from being skeptic, being friendly is also part of a gamblers attitude, so it is natural that this gamblers pretty much know who are they competing to.

This is what it think as well, it is possible but unlikely, gamblers like to use the chat of the casino to comment on how they are doing, if suddenly a new player appeared, did not communicate it with others and began winning those competitions and this kept happening over and over again I would suppose that gamblers would have realized there is something wrong already and we could have seen a scam accusation on the forum about this.

[Saint-loup]

Different when we are talking about wager, biggest profit, race and other contests, all of these contest could be manipulated (especially when the time of contest is near end).

Could be, but I don't see casinos to do it, as what the OP is, gamblers are very skeptic in this kind of things. Gamblers tend to keep a close eyes on things they anticipated to win, so if the competition have been painted with other colors, there is a high chance of gamblers to notice it very quick. Aside from being skeptic, being friendly is also part of a gamblers attitude, so it is natural that this gamblers pretty much know who are they competing to.

Why would they care about that? Even if regular users could suspect something, there are many newbies who won't suspect anything and will fall into the trap. The crypto land is full of scams, casinos are not spared.

[cabron]

You really can't trust anyone unless there is a real name or account behind every user in the leaderboard. I feel the same with the exchange trading competition, I have joined several times and although I'm not really hoping to win, I just notice the top usernames do not resemble any real name.

If they connect the Bitcointalk account to the account on bitcointalk I guess that's something transparent. I think stake.com has this kind of system in which users in their stake.com forum are connected to their casino account.