Calculating Satoshi's coins

[BitcoinADAB]

[BitcoinADAB]

"During 2009 the mining activity was so low that it was kept active on the minimum accepted difficulty, and blocks were created at a lower rate than one every 10 minutes. It’s plausible that even if Satoshi wanted to turn off his miner after a while, he may have finally decided to let it run until seeing more activity.

Supposition: Anyone who took the time and effort to create Bitcoin would not risk letting the network to halt due to lack of miners. He would run at least a miner himself."*

Satoshi mined, and he mined a lot to let the network run. And the mined coins he marked.

Think of it as sunken ships with these mined coins as their cargo.

And we want to salve these ships and recover the coins.


----------


How?

Five years ago, a Bitcoin puzzle was discovered https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1306983.0 and people are trying to calculate private keys of addresses that have different difficulties. For addresses with known x and y coordinates of the public keys, they have faster solutions.

We want to build a network, like the Bitcoin network (pools with participants), where instead of hashing the next block, the participants will calculate distinguished points of the elliptic curve that Bitcoin uses for its addresses. As Satoshi's coins contain the x and y coordinates, we can use the faster calculation method.

And this network will include Satoshi's mined coins. Hopefully we can calculate them and bring them back.


----------


As of today, it is nearly impossible to calculate them. Do your own research, understand it, then participate if you want.


----------


How will rewarding work?

If we solve a Satoshi's coinbase, which consists of 50 BTC, 25 BTC will go to the participants that calculated the distinguished points (12.5 BTC for wild point and 12.5 BTC for tame point) and with the other 25 BTC, we will buy the interaction token. The price of the interaction token will be an indicator for the success of that project and the participants can optimize their reward with that token.

As interaction token for that project, we will use ADAB token (ETH Contract: 0x034b0dd380b5f6f8123b8d0d0e42329b67772792). The initial project https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4720775.0) that should become a crypto exchange, doesn't exist anymore, we think that they had licensing problems. We invested in that project, the tokens have a good distribution and the market cap is < $100,000 (06/Jul/2021).

Exchange: Bitforex - pair ADAB/ETH https://www.bitforex.com/en/spot/adab_eth (09/Jul/2021 BitForex has hidden ADAB https://support.bitforex.com/hc/en-us/articles/4404391011853-Announcement-of-Hiding-22-Inactive-Tokens-and-28-Trading-Pairs)

We wanted to have a decentralized exchange for this project and created an own token as ADAB spin-off. We chose the Waves platform.

Exchange: https://waves.exchange/

Explorer with information on the token:
https://wavesexplorer.com/tx/9zMruSw8PPVPvRWgmrDi8QzsaGwNfBqdx9L5sMgASDAK

Name of the token: BitcoinADAB
Quantity: 10,000,000
Decimals: 8
Reissuable: no (10,000,000 tokens is max.)
AssetId: 9zMruSw8PPVPvRWgmrDi8QzsaGwNfBqdx9L5sMgASDAK

To find the token in the exchange:
Search with the AssetId: 9zMruSw8PPVPvRWgmrDi8QzsaGwNfBqdx9L5sMgASDAK
Switch to 'Unverified mode'
Pairs: BitcoinADAB/BTC and BitcoinADAB/WAVES

This is our interaction token for this project.


It will take a certain time to build up that network, which will be a large database.


----------


How will you be rewarded?

With the interaction token. Anyone can buy and sell that token. As already said, BitcoinADAB token will indicate the success of this project.


----------


How can we be sure that the participants will receive their reward and that the initial token will be bought after solving a coinbase?

We could keep the coins. But we could do this one time, as nobody would trust in that project anymore.


----------


Why these coins and not others?

We want to solve Satoshi's coins, because these coins were mined to serve the purpose, to let the Bitcoin network run. Without these coins, we wouldn't have Bitcoin today, they are special as they had to be mined. Satoshi mined them, marked them and didn't transfer them. Satoshi alone can respond to our project e.g. can transfer them to other addresses. If someone can sign messages to our points, we will be sure that it is Satoshi as they were marked in a way, that you can separate them from others.


----------


How can we know that the coins we calculate are Satoshi's coins?

Satoshi marked his mined coins.
https://bitslog.com/2019/04/16/the-return-of-the-deniers-and-the-revenge-of-patoshi/
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=507458.0

Satoshi's coins have been mined 2009 - mid 2010 (~block 55000)
There are ~27,000 unspent coinbases in this timeframe
~22000 blocks are Satoshi's coins (~80%)
~5000 blocks others mined (~20%)
That was the biggest problem, to separate them. Without separating them, we couldn't start that project. Because if we solved one of the points, which others had mined, the owner/s could sign a message and prove that he/she/them is/are the owner/s and this we had to solve before starting that project.
Today we know, which blocks Satoshi mined.


----------


What, if Satoshi wants us to stop that project?

If Satoshi signs a message with the private keys for addresses that we will publish here for our calculations, we will stop the project immediately.

What, if other participants don't want these coins to be used?

They have the possibility to create a Bitcoin fork with new rules, that these early mined coins are not usable.


----------


Here are some examples of Satoshi's addresses (all coinbase 50 BTC - year 2009) - there are > 20,000 Satoshi blocks with > 1,000,000 BTC

Code:

Block   Address
 5168	1BeGnS32fmE8519HS4MZNzEXNF9qac2aZe
 5746	1MrtaEbkfz6fRaZdZkxgVKmaErVyjAVBvd
 6293	 1qqJ811Y5BGZ6FmvXqWWAY2ZYpC1WTAwo
 6881	 1XFBaNuVc8adgHzW4ofkZ4LpnzmGZLFtj
 7443	12yTBHcmSx8EkfwLSS4CxeN8d9mqZBN9EM
 8044	1Ev7PmfSL8N2a8iK6mTEKVcXZYpT2WvcAp
 8644	12j55m8ujDYdMRzeF9tEhoDJxHeaeSPFmR
 9205	1EpMerLUAURc6pFUgPFnA1ktGhPPJW9UHp
 9778	1NgbX9h8PauV62Gd4ZnaD4VRAVFVmU9YnZ
10353	1Ccg7vDQECRw86UwLKqwqJxgBJLLTRjLKt
11067	1GfHRDwooUCdq4HhTdqDyDTy1RQXsKqhjA
11625	17RDjaCwTfrGJJWBNbz8P8gM86gejgTsjD

These addresses are special addresses (here 12 of them, there are ~100). They are the last coinbase addresses, before Satoshi resets his miner (the related values, like the ExtraNonce, go to 0). These points are on the top of the blue lines, which reflect Satoshi's coins. More here: https://bitslog.com/2019/04/16/the-return-of-the-deniers-and-the-revenge-of-patoshi/*




----------



- will be edited -

[BitcoinADAB]

- reserved -

[pooya87]

And this network will include Satoshi's mined coins. Hopefully we can calculate them and bring them back.

In a normal key pair the private key is 256 bits and is selected in the correct secp256k1 range randomly so it is impossible to find it from the public key due to the massive search size that would take millions of years to search even when you share the work among all computing power in the world.

In a puzzle on the other hand the private keys are small from 1 bit to tens of bits and are meant to be searched and found in a short time. Faster if you share it among more people.

[BitcoinADAB]

In a normal key pair the private key is 256 bits and is selected in the correct secp256k1 range randomly so it is impossible to find it from the public key due to the massive search size that would take millions of years to search even when you share the work among all computing power in the world.

In a puzzle on the other hand the private keys are small from 1 bit to tens of bits and are meant to be searched and found in a short time. Faster if you share it among more people.

Thanks for your reply pooya87. Yes, you are right, normal addresses are a 2^256 problem. But Satoshi's coins are special, a 2^128 problem. You can see it here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1306983.0 how they solve it.

[AIDOGEofficial]

I will have to spend some time on that! haha

[NotATether]

These addresses you are referring to are the puzzle transactions and Satoshi did not make them. Therefore, it is not useful to use properties like mining reward amounts, and especially tokens, as clues because they have no relation to the private keys at hand.

The only known clue, is that each private key is between 2**n and 2**(n+1)-1.

[BitcoinADAB]

These addresses you are referring to are the puzzle transactions and Satoshi did not make them. Therefore, it is not useful to use properties like mining reward amounts, and especially tokens, as clues because they have no relation to the private keys at hand.

The only known clue, is that each private key is between 2**n and 2**(n+1)-1.

Thank you for your reply. Yes, we know that. It was only an example to explain the project.

In the project, Satoshi's coins will be calculated. They contain 50 BTC per address. Satoshi marked them, so we can know which addresses these are. You can read here
https://bitslog.com/2019/04/16/the-return-of-the-deniers-and-the-revenge-of-patoshi/
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=507458.0
if you want to know how it is possible to differ them.

Soon, we will update the 2nd post with some example addresses.

[PrivatePerson]

how do you plan to get Satoshi coins?

[BitcoinADAB]

how do you plan to get Satoshi coins?

That is the project. In the 2nd post you can read it and it will be updated.

[PrivatePerson]

Didn't find an explanation in the second post. Do you want to crack a 128 bit key?
In the puzzle you pointed to, only the 63 bit key is cracked. And 120 with a public key.
Where does the data come from that the first addresses have 128 bits?

[BitcoinADAB]

Unused hashed addresses: 2^256 problem (or 2^160 ripemd)
= impossible to solve as of today

Satoshi's coins include the x and y coordinates of the public keys. Although they are 256 bit, with Pollard's kangaroo they are a 2^128 problem.
= nearly impossible to solve

And we want to build with that project a network, that makes it possible.

[WanderingPhilospher]

Unused hashed addresses: 2^256 problem (or 2^160 ripemd)
= impossible to solve as of today

Satoshi's coins include the x and y coordinates of the public keys. Although they are 256 bit, with Pollard's kangaroo they are a 2^128 problem.
= nearly impossible to solve

And we want to build with that project a network, that makes it possible.

I'm not really following you. I'm not saying you are wrong but just trying to understand how it becomes a 2^128 problem??

I can get the x and y coordinates from any public key, but that doesn't make it easier to find/shrink the problem to 2^128. So please explain how you think it does.

Unless you are talking 2^128 group ops, which you need to/should specify as to not mislead people reading your posts.

And using Kangaroo doesn't shrink anything except speed up a search versus a brute force attack.

[BitcoinADAB]

If you have a 2^100 bit public key

you will need ~2^100 calculations if you have a hashed key
you will need ~2^50 calculations if you have the coordinates and can use for example Pollard's kangaroo


That's the reason, why they solved #63 (hashed key) and #115 (key with coordinates) in the puzzle.

[WanderingPhilospher]

Also, not saying this can't be done but you will have to have some powerful server equipment/setup.

1. so that many people can connect and join the hunt.
2. enough ram to combine files/collect points
  a. if you set a DP of say 60, you will have to store 2^60 points and distances (DP 60 will increase search time quite a bit)
  b. but if you go lower than 60, say down to 40, then you will need to store 2^80 points and distances
  c. with the 115 bit range, it took a file size of 300+ GBs to store all of the points and distances, and that was with a DP of 25

You will probably need at least 2 servers, maybe more. One to handle all connections and one to combine files and check for solved key

[WanderingPhilospher]

If you have a 2^100 bit public key

you will need ~2^100 calculations if you have a hashed key
you will need ~2^50 calculations if you have the coordinates and can use for example Pollard's kangaroo


That's the reason, why they solved #63 (hashed key) and #115 (key with coordinates) in the puzzle.

Haha, yeahhhhhhhh I am not new to the puzzle. Have been actively involved for over a year. I know how it works and how each key has been solved.

Then yes, you are talking group operations. Which sounds more logical than you just saying it becomes a 2^128 problem.

And don't clutter it with Satoshi's coins have x and y coords, that doesn't matter. Just say when a public key is exposed, you can use different methods than old school brute force method. Any address with public key exposed is susceptible to Kangaroo, not just his address because it has x and y coords.

[BitcoinADAB]

Our opinion is, if people understand what we want to try, they will join us. As already said, the problem is not impossible - it is nearly impossible. But software and hardware can be optimized and with a large network, we should try it.

[WanderingPhilospher]

Our opinion is, if people understand what we want to try, they will join us. As already said, the problem is not impossible - it is nearly impossible. But software and hardware can be optimized and with a large network, we should try it.

People will not understand by your first and second posts.

You have to spell it out, explain the reason behind your math of 2^128. Explain you'll be using a Kangaroo method versus brute force. Explain how Kangaroo works vs brute force.

Don't leave it up to the people that do understand and have been a part of the puzzle, to pull it out of you and make passerby readers have to read down 30 posts to understand how you are going to try, etc.

[BitcoinADAB]

edited 2nd post: some examples of Satoshi's addresses

[WanderingPhilospher]

As interaction token for that project, we will use ADAB token

Ok, this all sounds great great but to use a token, ADAB, that is riddled with ridicule and scam, seems fishy.

Why not start your own eth token, easy to create.

Why use a token at all?

25 BTC will go to the node that calculated the distinguished point and with the other 25 BTC, we will buy the interaction token

Pay people based on their hash rate/jump rate/key rate; whatever you want to call it, and split the entire 50 BTC amongst all people who contributed hashing power.
So you and your buds buy up the token now for cheap, then spread the 25 BTC over those tokens you picked up for cheap?

How would you even know who submitted the tame point that helped solve key and who submitted the wild point that helped solve the key? Do you honestly know how Kangaroo even works or are you just seeing that it is faster than brute force and want to implement it without really knowing how it works?!

Here are some examples of Satoshi's addresses (all coinbase 50 BTC)

There is a well known list with all of his "thought to be" addresses. I have the full uncompressed pubkey list, the compressed pubkey list, as well as uncompressed and compressed addresses. You posting a few addresses doesn't really prove anything other than you looked at the blockchain or googled it.

Bottom line, if one wants to do this, setup a server, set up a "Kangaroo pool" (like a mining pool), distribute found BTC amongst all people who helped based on their hashrate. Don't need a token, especially one with sketchy past.