Looking for advice: gifting a paper wallet

[defa1]

A friend of mine recently had his first child and we are all going to visit and bring gifts. I want to gift $10 in btc not to be accessed until his kid is an adult, by which time it will be worth a lot more or nothing at all.

I'm trying to figure out the best way to do this so that in 20 years the btc can still be recovered. Do I make a wallet, write down the seed phrase, send in some bitcoin and then destroy the wallet? Or do I write down the private key for the specific address where I send the bitcoin to? And which wallet? Electrum doesn't use BIP39, but a BIP39 seed phrase isn't guaranteed to work with every BIP39 compatible wallet either... What about derivation paths?
Is there a secure way to generate a paper wallet offline with a QR code and everything?

I have no experience with paper wallets so any advice is welcome.

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[mocacinno]

A friend of mine recently had his first child and we are all going to visit and bring gifts. I want to gift $10 in btc not to be accessed until his kid is an adult, by which time it will be worth a lot more or nothing at all.

I'm trying to figure out the best way to do this so that in 20 years the btc can still be recovered. Do I make a wallet, write down the seed phrase, send in some bitcoin and then destroy the wallet? Or do I write down the private key for the specific address where I send the bitcoin to? And which wallet? Electrum doesn't use BIP39, but a BIP39 seed phrase isn't guaranteed to work with every BIP39 compatible wallet either... What about derivation paths?
Is there a secure way to generate a paper wallet offline with a QR code and everything?

I have no experience with paper wallets so any advice is welcome.

First of all: this might be interesting to you: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Timelock

There are several technical sollutions, but a newbie friendly one can be found here => https://coinb.in/#newTimeLocked
I would advise against running this on an online computer tough... Downloading the sourcecode and running it offline is safer.

Also, i'd suggest playing with this on the testnet first, don't lock funds before you've made yourself familiar with how this works

[ranochigo]

Don't use seeds. It's not that there won't be a way to recover it in 20 years but it's just that the recipient wouldn't want to use the seed as his main wallet. They should sweep it to another wallet that they solely control, using a private key is fine.

Paper wallets are generally fine, they are a great form of storage if you're looking to make it a gift. OP_CLTV (OP_HODL) is something you might want to explore. Encompassing it in a script hash address is a way to make time the variable; ie. making sure that it cannot be spent before the specified timeframe. Note that this is still a novel way to store Bitcoins, where most wallets don't allow custom scripts and you might need much more research to be able to spend it, as opposed to just using Electrum or Bitcoin Core.

[BrewMaster]

Also, i'd suggest playing with this on the testnet first, don't lock funds before you've made yourself familiar with how this works

it is near impossible to use coinb.in site for testnet sadly. i tried it recently and it either kept going back to main-net or failed to get the transaction history to build the transaction.

[mocacinno]

--snip--

it is near impossible to use coinb.in site for testnet sadly. i tried it recently and it either kept going back to main-net or failed to get the transaction history to build the transaction.

ouch... i had no idear the testnet feature didn't work on coinb.in

[bitmover]

As it is a gift, I suggest that you create something beautiful using QR Codes.

As the value is extremely low ($10)  I would use some website like this one (in an offline computer. Download the webpage disconnect internet and run locally)

https://iancoleman.io/bip39/

You can just generate a random seed. Then scroll down and get the QRCode Private key and Public Key when you hover the address:



Then I suggest that you just use some office software that you like (word, powerpoint?) and print the QRCode and the keys in a sheet of paper.

Then just print it and give it to your friend. You may want to put some plastic in it. Add some fancy background or whatever.


I will warn you that some website do that automatically (just google and you will find them). DO NOT USE THEM! Those websites have malicious code and they will most likely steal your coins. Just try to make something nice yourself, it is much safer.

Additionally, as you are thinking about a 10year interval, I strongly suggest that you teach him how to recover this fund in some wallet such as Electrum or any other that can use QRcodes.


Edit: To fund the wallet, just scan the QRCode or paste the public address in your personal wallet and send $10 in btc to it. Very easy to use.

[LoyceV]

I wrote a topic for this a while ago: Using Locktime for inheritance planning, backups or gifts.
Note that it is quite tricky, you need to know exactly what you're doing in order for it to work. And the receiver will still have to trust you didn't keep the private key for yourself.

[BrewMaster]

Edit: To fund the wallet, just scan the QRCode or paste the public address in your personal wallet and send $10 in btc to it. Very easy to use.

keep in mind that you should always do a little test to avoid having mistakes. for example in this picture (which would be the printed paper wallet) both QR codes are the private key.
if you were relying only on QR code and for example accidentally printed the address only you'd be screwed.

[DannyHamilton]

If you had said 5 years, or maybe even 10 years, then it wouldn't be too significant, but in terms of technology, 20 years is a LONG time.

Will Electrum (or any other client software) still be widely available 20 years from now?  Will Bitcoin have moved on to some other seed or signature system, making it difficult to find any wallet software that still supports the method you choose today?  20 years ago, QR codes didn't even exist yet (nor did things like the iPhone, Android, Blackberry, Kindle, Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, TOR, USB Flash Drives, Bitcoin). Wikipedia had only just been founded, and the vast majority of people were still using dial-up to connect to the internet.

I like the thought, and you could certainly just pick a method and roll with it hoping that recovery of the funds won't be beyond the abilities of the recipient 20 years from now, but if you want to be confident that the gift-recipient will actually be able to use the gift someday, then you're going to want to carefully think this through.

[bitmover]

If you had said 5 years, or maybe even 10 years, then it wouldn't be too significant, but in terms of technology, 20 years is a LONG time.

Will Electrum (or any other client software) still be widely available 20 years from now?  Will Bitcoin have moved on to some other seed or signature system, making it difficult to find any wallet software that still supports the method you choose today?  20 years ago, QR codes didn't even exist yet (nor did things like the iPhone, Android, Blackberry, Kindle, Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, TOR, USB Flash Drives, Bitcoin). Wikipedia had only just been founded, and the vast majority of people were still using dial-up to connect to the internet.

I like the thought, and you could certainly just pick a method and roll with it hoping that recovery of the funds won't be beyond the abilities of the recipient 20 years from now, but if you want to be confident that the gift-recipient will actually be able to use the gift someday, then you're going to want to carefully think this through.

This is why I think this should be make as simple as possible.

A private key pair is enough. I wouldn't use no time locks as there is a risk of doing something wrong.

It is very likely that today's private keys will be compatible with wallets in the future, even though things change there will be some way to "convert" old format to new one.

[LoyceV]

A private key pair is enough. I wouldn't use no time locks as there is a risk of doing something wrong.

A (laminated) paper wallet inside a sealed envelope is indeed much easier. Just write: "dear baby, open this when you're 18" and ask the parents to keep it.

[HCP]

Got to agree with the K.I.S.S. proponents here... a simple private+public keypair loaded with $10 is probably the best solution here.

I would be very surprised if a standard private key was rendered unusable by any future changes to the network, so that shouldn't be an issue. Then some basic steps to make sure the private key is "safe" (eg. printing on waterproof paper and/or laminating etc) and then handing it over (maybe with some basic instructions on how to store it safely) and then all you can do is hope for the best

[pooya87]

~

Maybe a workaround:

Code:

OP_IF
  <20 years> OP_CheckLocktimeVerify OP_DROP <gifted_pubkey> OP_CheckSig
OP_ELSE
  <gift_giver's_pubkey_kept_private> OP_CheckSig
OP_EndIf

Assuming the "gift giver" stays in bitcoin they can stay up to date with the development and if something changed (eg. moving to another signature algorithm completely) they can move the coins using the ELSE branch otherwise the "giver receiver" can spend it after 20 years with the (different) key they were gifted.
This also helps recover the coins in case the receiver lost their key.

This should be easier and shorter with Taproot but I can only interpret Taproot scripts not write one. I'm interested if anyone else can do it though.

[defa1]

Thanks for all the good advice here. https://iancoleman.io/bip39/ seemed the best option but I just discovered that my coldcard has a built in paper wallet generator so I'm going to use that.

[defa1]

By any chance, are you talking about software provided by Coldcard (coldcard-paper-wallet-templator & wordlist-paper) or built-in Coldcard feature (https://coldcardwallet.com/docs/paper-wallets)?

I'm talking about the build in paper wallet generator on the device itself.

[bL4nkcode]

By any chance, are you talking about software provided by Coldcard (coldcard-paper-wallet-templator & wordlist-paper) or built-in Coldcard feature (https://coldcardwallet.com/docs/paper-wallets)?

I'm talking about the build in paper wallet generator on the device itself.

If this coldcard is the one ETFbitcoin mentioned then yes, you can do that. Here's their youtube video, steps on how you can do that  4 How to make a Bitcoin Paper Wallet with COLDCARD

Just make sure that no one has a copy of that paper wallet other than you and the child of your friends or any of his fam you trust.

[Remsjack]

I have no experience with paper wallets so any advice is welcome.

I gifted 0.001BTC to my dad through a polymerbit note and I'm really happy about it, you should give it at thought!

You can find it here: https://www.coinsofnakamoto.com/

It's not that expensive, it's reliable, and quite nice looking.

[defa1]

Ok so a little update... I created and printed out the paper wallet, it has the address bc1qrwc85tjunwql9zu9gew3q7knf70mv73tghtqyr and as you can see I deposited a small amount of Bitcoin on it. I tried creating a watch only wallet in Electrum (android) to see if it worked and... nothing. No funds on that address whatsoever. I tried sweeping the wallet with Electrum (both android and desktop) and Samourai Wallet and while they recognize the private key they don't find any UTXO...

What the fuck is going on?

edit: If I use the Electrum desktop wallet to create a watch only wallet and import the address it does recognize the UTXO..
edit: I can't sweep the private key in Bitcoin Core either

[HCP]

I tried creating a watch only wallet in Electrum (android) to see if it worked and... nothing.  No funds on that address whatsoever.

Seems like your Electrum Android wallet isn't syncing properly or something... I was able to create a watching-only wallet just fine:

I tried sweeping the wallet with Electrum (both android and desktop) and Samourai Wallet and while they recognize the private key they don't find any UTXO...

What the fuck is going on?

edit: If I use the Electrum desktop wallet to create a watch only wallet and import the address it does recognize the UTXO..
edit: I can't sweep the private key in Bitcoin Core either

Not sure why they wouldn't be able to sweep the private keys though... I can only think that your client is connected to a server that was lagging or not properly synced. Are you connecting to your own node/servers or are you using public ones?

 The funding transaction obviously exists and can be seen/synced... and I can even create an unsigned transaction from the watching-only wallet.

Obviously, not having the private key, I can't attempt to sweep or sign/spend the coins.

[defa1]

My desktop Electrum is connected to myNode running Electrs and Samourai to Dojo on myNode. I couldn't get the android version of electrum working with myNode yet so that's using public servers.

edit: I managed to sweep using electrum desktop, all I had to do was add p2wpkh: in front of the private key.

still looking into why it doesn't work on android, with samourai or bitcoin core...