China - everything is fine! But everything is bad ...

[NeuroticFish]

Your language and comprehension coupled with your over-confidence makes it nearly impossible to have a debate but we try to be as open to ideas on this forum as possible. It seems that you have also gone on to cry about discrimination in Meta, so I'd like to convince you that none of this is about discriminating against you as an individual but about the philosophy you are trying to propagate.

Keep in mind that brain washing works full power on such countries and there's a high chance that he indeed believe all he says.

You will never convince the free people of the world, much less bitcoiners, that an optimal method of scoial governance needs an over-arching central authority "managing" the best for everyone else.

Indeed.
@The Ghoul: bitcoiners' mindset is on "don't trust, verify". That's hugely opposed to what your way of thinking, since you didn't care to check all you say from multiple sources (I know that it may not be easy if you live in China). I won't also say that you should check, since ignorance is a bliss and your life in your country may be easier if you don't question "them".

I repeat again, nobody hates the fact that the Chinese people are better off than they were a few decades ago. We just have a certain dislike for propagandists from the Middle Kingdom who have been lately trying pretty hard to convince the rest of the world that they aren't wolves in sheep's clothing.

I second this. Big time.

[dezoel]

Guys there will ALWAYS be sinotrolls around the world, even in bitcointalk, do not really care for what they are saying. Do not forget, this is the same nation that kills you and your entire family if you ever go against the dictator at the top.

In USA there are tons of horrible things, it is not a good nation to live in by many many standards, you end up paying 5k dollars (median average income is 58k so nearly 10% of your entire year worth of salary) just for a root canal for your tooth, it is really horrible but I can yell as hard as I can to the face of president FUCK JOE BIDEN and nothing will happen to me, we just had 4 years of saying Fuck Trump on TV and nothing happened, go ahead and try to do that on China and see what happens, you will be executed at best, your entire lineage will be executed probably.

Just because other nations suck, doesn't change the fact that China is the worst nation in the entire world, even worse than Russia. I rather live in Venezuela being in poverty and starvation than live in China if they paid for everything I need and then more, a mansion as a slave is worse than a hut as a free person.

[amishmanish]

Guys there will ALWAYS be sinotrolls around the world, even in bitcointalk, do not really care for what they are saying. Do not forget, this is the same nation that kills you and your entire family if you ever go against the dictator at the top.

In USA there are tons of horrible things, it is not a good nation to live in by many many standards, you end up paying 5k dollars (median average income is 58k so nearly 10% of your entire year worth of salary) just for a root canal for your tooth, it is really horrible but I can yell as hard as I can to the face of president FUCK JOE BIDEN and nothing will happen to me, we just had 4 years of saying Fuck Trump on TV and nothing happened, go ahead and try to do that on China and see what happens, you will be executed at best, your entire lineage will be executed probably.

Just because other nations suck, doesn't change the fact that China is the worst nation in the entire world, even worse than Russia. I rather live in Venezuela being in poverty and starvation than live in China if they paid for everything I need and then more, a mansion as a slave is worse than a hut as a free person.

Haha...I really needed someone to say this. I am not from the US but out here, we always see the best AND the worst of America out in the open. There are movies about how sick and violent some people were. How racist and white supremacists can some be. How Blacks and other minorities can be targeted or how they can sometimes be just hard MoFos dealing drugs, lol..

Then there is that beautiful side of it. The one where a small, immigrant family can make big. Where people will get together and recognize the sacrifices and contributions, will help a little child and do their best to alleviate pains of others. All of those things have come from that country. And LMAO about "Fuck Trump". I mean Jimmy Kimmel actually had Stormy Daniels talk about how small of a dick the president had. I think if a Chinese as much as mentioned Xi Jinping and Dick in the same sentence, he'd be rounded off to some unknown prison.

So when these people come over here and tell the people living under actual free governance about, "Ohh but your rivers are unclean", its really just laughable. I mean that is not even the point. These people just don't understand what "Spirit of freedom" even means.

[bryant.coleman]

Just because other nations suck, doesn't change the fact that China is the worst nation in the entire world, even worse than Russia. I rather live in Venezuela being in poverty and starvation than live in China if they paid for everything I need and then more, a mansion as a slave is worse than a hut as a free person.

Have you ever experienced living in poverty? It is easier to say like this. But in reality, 99% of the people just want to live comfortably, even if that means that they are living under an authoritarian regime. Just go and ask the ordinary Venezuelans whether they would be willing to swap their passports with the Chinese. I am sure that 90% plus would opt for that. Go to any poor country, and you will get the same response. Democracy is essentially the dictatorship of the majority. So what makes it any different from the system that they have in China?

[NeuroticFish]

Guys there will ALWAYS be sinotrolls around the world, even in bitcointalk, do not really care for what they are saying. Do not forget, this is the same nation that kills you and your entire family if you ever go against the dictator at the top.

Clearly. But that still doesn't stop us from telling them that they're wrong, now and then. Else some may start believing them, you know...  

Just because other nations suck, doesn't change the fact that China is the worst nation in the entire world, even worse than Russia.

Here I think that you are wrong. There are much worse in this world, countries with stronger dictatorship or internal wars for decades.

I think if a Chinese as much as mentioned Xi Jinping and Dick in the same sentence, he'd be rounded off to some unknown prison.

You may not be too far, (unless you meant Dick Cheney  ), but in the same time you're most probably somewhat inaccurate too.
I was kid in the last years of Ceausescu. You could read everywhere "Ceausescu si poporul" (Ceausescu and the people) and I just loved to rhyme it with "Ceausescu si toporul" (Ceausescu and the axe). While my parents were super scared every time I said that (and this kid was too small to understand why) and shushed me without explaining why, nothing has actually ever happened (luckily).

What I mean is although most probably the nation is full of informers, they won't care of just anybody without a tad more solid reasons.

[B-Bit]

No country is perfect. We can learn from their advantages and improve our shortcomings.
It's just that the government personnel of every country are above the top and feel that their policies are fine and they don't know how to improve.
Everyone has a high degree of attention to China, and I often see the keyword "China" on forums. Why is this?

[amishmanish]

Have you ever experienced living in poverty? It is easier to say like this. But in reality, 99% of the people just want to live comfortably, even if that means that they are living under an authoritarian regime. Just go and ask the ordinary Venezuelans whether they would be willing to swap their passports with the Chinese. I am sure that 90% plus would opt for that. Go to any poor country, and you will get the same response. Democracy is essentially the dictatorship of the majority. So what makes it any different from the system that they have in China?

Well, if you tell those poor people everything about China, I am sure that they wouldn't opt for the passport to live there. Also, can you hear what you're saying? You are basically enabling authoritarian rule instead of the freedom for the people, we shouldn't side with any kind of government, we always should look out for the well being of the public and authoritarian regime isn't a cure, it's a cancer.

That could just be a bit of hyperbole for effect from @dezoel but hey, its a figure of speech goddamit.

"Democracy is the dictatorship of majority". Wow, where did you come up with that?

I am all in for a debate about how democracies are flawed and how Facebook and Cambridge Analytica is ultimately turning us into slaves of the elite. This does not mean that I am about to shun my right to shit on those people and ideas and leaders who try such trickery. I am not ready to give up my right to protest or express just because I'll apparently get more rice. I don't know what this "Poor people" "cleaning river" "Construct toilets" argument has to do with authoritarianism versus freedom of expression. Its not like democracies haven't lifted out people from poverty throughout history.

I think if a Chinese as much as mentioned Xi Jinping and Dick in the same sentence, he'd be rounded off to some unknown prison.

You may not be too far, (unless you meant Dick Cheney  ), but in the same time you're most probably somewhat inaccurate too.
I was kid in the last years of Ceausescu. You could read everywhere "Ceausescu si poporul" (Ceausescu and the people) and I just loved to rhyme it with "Ceausescu si toporul" (Ceausescu and the axe). While my parents were super scared every time I said that (and this kid was too small to understand why) and shushed me without explaining why, nothing has actually ever happened (luckily).

What I mean is although most probably the nation is full of informers, they won't care of just anybody without a tad more solid reasons.

Haha..Thanks for that beautiful piece of personal history NeuroticFish. I'd love to hear someone actually say that out loud. Rhyming "Axe" with the name of the General Secretary could sure have consequences, which explains why the elders sushed. It seems innocent to discuss these things now but when people are given more power than their egos can handle, it inevitably leads to disasters. I am glad nothing ever happened..

I had never heard of Ceausescu but co-incidentally, just last week, i watched "Legends" on youtube about Nadia Comaneci, the perfect 10 girl of gymnastics and there I saw a part where she met him after the Montreal Olympics. So i could recall the name about him being from Romania and Nadia defecting to the USA.

--snip--
Everyone has a high degree of attention to China, and I often see the keyword "China" on forums. Why is this?

Thats what we've been trying to ask the CCP wolf warriors...lol..

[DrBeer]

No country is perfect. We can learn from their advantages and improve our shortcomings.
It's just that the government personnel of every country are above the top and feel that their policies are fine and they don't know how to improve.
Everyone has a high degree of attention to China, and I often see the keyword "China" on forums. Why is this?

Unfortunately, there will never be an ideal state structure. All those close to the ideal are decades, if not centuries, of finding compromises. At the same time, the dissatisfied will still remain But unfortunately there are much more non-ideal regimes, and this is influenced by many nuances - geographical location, accepted historical traditions, the presence or absence of resources, culture, religion / belief, and much more! I will not speak for other countries, it will not be very correct, I can only speak for the territory where the USSR used to be - we still suffer from remnants of totalitarianism, many decades of lawlessness, lack of freedom, and respect for individuals and private property. And the real struggle for change, at least in my country, began actively only 5-6 years ago !!! For 30 years of the existence of independent Ukraine, 25 years the country was ruled by the "heirs" of the communist regime, the neighbors are still in power by "ghouls" for whom a person is an empty phrase ... At the same time, I cannot say that we are very bad live, even despite the status of one of the poorest countries in Europe. One "positive" feature is that with noticeably lower official incomes, the real income base is 2-5 times higher, depending on the areas of work. And frankly, there are not so many poor people as it should be in 2nd place from the end, in terms of income. At the same time, prices for a significant part of the products are lower than those of their neighbors and do not lose in quality.
The level of real "poverty", I think, is a situation when income is either not enough or only enough for the minimum necessary food, the inability to buy the necessary medicines, clothes and shoes, the lack of housing or the ability to rent. If there are no such problems, it's just a low standard of living. But there you can try to move to the "middle class" or the average standard of living.

And returning to China - a rather interesting situation has developed there - the communist regime, a technologically backward agrarian country of the 3rd world (30 years ago), on the one hand, and on the other hand, a "cunning" policy as a state, almost at the state level legalized violation of international copyright law. law, massive "copying" of Western goods and services, aggressive economic and financial policies in the zones of influence, manual control of the economy if necessary, and as a result, in 30 years, the "sleeping tiger woke up" and begins to return "its positions", and it seems not only positions will return but also new areas "acquire". At the same time, China has regions sparkling with wealth, and regions with wild poverty and lack of prospects ... But we will always pay attention to China - the situation in Southeast Asia, Oceania, Africa, and part of Central Asia depends on it ...

[nightxglow]

No country is perfect. We can learn from their advantages and improve our shortcomings.
It's just that the government personnel of every country are above the top and feel that their policies are fine and they don't know how to improve.
Everyone has a high degree of attention to China, and I often see the keyword "China" on forums. Why is this?

Right, no country is perfect, no country is clean and pure. Every country has their own bad things, there is no way there is a perfect, great, awesome country with no flaws. Especially, china has different system, which might be quite controversial for people, no freedom, but they offer an equality. US might offer freedom, but not equality. The reason why people often mention these two countries, and compare them is due to their power. We can't deny that China and US has the biggest power in financial, enough to suppress each other and affect other surrounding countries. However, I don't think both countries is perfect enough, they all have their own pro and cons.

[Kittygalore]

Nope, given how power hungry CCP is, I think that they aren't losing any power anytime soon. I would like to say that their totalitarian approach became more powerful and at the same time subtle, some things that I can think of are the citizenship points, mass surveillance, espionage, persecution of Uyghurs, Falun Gong organ harvests and Uyghur concentration camps.

[DrBeer]

No country is perfect. We can learn from their advantages and improve our shortcomings.
It's just that the government personnel of every country are above the top and feel that their policies are fine and they don't know how to improve.
Everyone has a high degree of attention to China, and I often see the keyword "China" on forums. Why is this?

Right, no country is perfect, no country is clean and pure. Every country has their own bad things, there is no way there is a perfect, great, awesome country with no flaws. Especially, china has different system, which might be quite controversial for people, no freedom, but they offer an equality. US might offer freedom, but not equality. The reason why people often mention these two countries, and compare them is due to their power. We can't deny that China and US has the biggest power in financial, enough to suppress each other and affect other surrounding countries. However, I don't think both countries is perfect enough, they all have their own pro and cons.

"We can't deny that China and US has the biggest power in financial, enough to suppress each other and affect other surrounding countries." - the question is, do you really think that China wants to suppress the US economy, or vice versa? Do you see a real benefit from this? It was in the USSR that the West was to blame for everything and he, the West "dreamed of capturing and enslaving us all" It seems to me that China is unlikely to claim world domination and the status of a world policeman, who the United States is now. China has its own interests in its own and nearby regions, but China is hardly ready to take responsibility for making decisions "for everyone" and implementing them around the world. China needs CONSUMERS of the products of its economy, without which the Chinese economy will collapse as quickly as it has grown, and then a revolutionary situation will immediately mature there. And consumers are the rich USA, EU and other highly developed countries, which provide the much needed CURRENCY for the development of China! So it is more profitable for China to have a more partnership with the United States than the status of enemies.

[bryant.coleman]

Have you ever experienced living in poverty? It is easier to say like this. But in reality, 99% of the people just want to live comfortably, even if that means that they are living under an authoritarian regime. Just go and ask the ordinary Venezuelans whether they would be willing to swap their passports with the Chinese. I am sure that 90% plus would opt for that. Go to any poor country, and you will get the same response. Democracy is essentially the dictatorship of the majority. So what makes it any different from the system that they have in China?

Well, if you tell those poor people everything about China, I am sure that they wouldn't opt for the passport to live there. Also, can you hear what you're saying? You are basically enabling authoritarian rule instead of the freedom for the people, we shouldn't side with any kind of government, we always should look out for the well being of the public and authoritarian regime isn't a cure, it's a cancer.

How can you be so sure? Let's say someone living in the poorest part of the world has two choices. The first choice is to have a salary of $20 per month, but he can participate in the elections and has the freedom to use social media. The second choice is to have a salary of $1,000 per month. But in this case, he doesn't have the freedom to participate in the elections, or to use social media. If you believe that a majority would select the first option then you are wrong. You guys have no experience of living in poverty. And the so called democracies are not far behind China in terms of human rights abuses. You can check these wonderful incidents from the "so called" democracies:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9875781/Boy-eight-faces-DEATH-PENALTY-Pakistan-youngest-person-charged-blasphemy.html
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/7/30/bangladesh-indigenous-groups-chakma-khasi-santal-land-grab
https://www.aljazeera.com/program/newsfeed/2020/12/1/scores-killed-in-gruesome-nigeria-massacre
https://www.indiatoday.in/world/story/hindus-christians-being-forcibly-converted-in-pakistan-s-sindh-us-lawmaker-1828774-2021-07-16
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/8/9/brazil-indigenous-group-sues-bolsonaro-at-icc-for-genocide

[NotATether]

I don't know if this could be related to Jack Ma's sudden disappearance. Being the richest man in China isn't even a guarantee that you have your freedom. I even saw this article (https://www.forbes.com/sites/jenniferwang/2021/01/07/disappearing-billionaires-jack-ma-and-other-chinese-moguls-who-have-mysteriously-dropped-off-the-radar/?sh=55488deb2187) where most of their Billionaires are disappearing without a trace and that includes the great Jack Ma himself.

Avoiding the public eye isn't the same as getting kidnapped or lost mysteriously (like QuadrigaCX exchange founder).

~

How can you be so sure? Let's say someone living in the poorest part of the world has two choices. The first choice is to have a salary of $20 per month, but he can participate in the elections and has the freedom to use social media. The second choice is to have a salary of $1,000 per month. But in this case, he doesn't have the freedom to participate in the elections, or to use social media. If you believe that a majority would select the first option then you are wrong. You guys have no experience of living in poverty.

Most people would use part of that $1000/month to buy a VPN to bypass social media blockades but I doubt they would blink an eye about elections.

And the so called democracies are not far behind China in terms of human rights abuses. You can check these wonderful incidents from the "so called" democracies:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9875781/Boy-eight-faces-DEATH-PENALTY-Pakistan-youngest-person-charged-blasphemy.html
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/7/30/bangladesh-indigenous-groups-chakma-khasi-santal-land-grab
https://www.aljazeera.com/program/newsfeed/2020/12/1/scores-killed-in-gruesome-nigeria-massacre
https://www.indiatoday.in/world/story/hindus-christians-being-forcibly-converted-in-pakistan-s-sindh-us-lawmaker-1828774-2021-07-16
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/8/9/brazil-indigenous-group-sues-bolsonaro-at-icc-for-genocide

Yea. The US gov is no good at creating democracies in other countries (whether via CIA or direct invasion), because they're impatient and want everything finished immediately.

The British empire was the best at spawning governments IMO, they didn't mind waiting for a century to build them up. They should learn a thing or two from them.

[dezoel]

At least some of you agreed with me, but even the ones who disagreed basically said "No I prefer a belly full of food and a dictator at the top instead of starvation and freedom" which I can sort of understand, I mean some people only thing of their own life and not the general politics which is understandable, it is totally understandable.

However nobody could deny that in the west we have freedom, sometimes things suck but at least it is freedom that brought us there, I rather not be in china in any case, people in China rarely know what they are missing because from birth to death they all are feed what government wants them to see, even their social media and everything else special for their own nation, they do not go to twitter and chat there easily, they use their own social media and government can see who says what and punishes accordingly.

I think that is just way too harsh, you can say they are at least feeding their citizens, but that is not good enough, without freedom everything else sucks.

[bryant.coleman]

At least some of you agreed with me, but even the ones who disagreed basically said "No I prefer a belly full of food and a dictator at the top instead of starvation and freedom" which I can sort of understand, I mean some people only thing of their own life and not the general politics which is understandable, it is totally understandable.

However nobody could deny that in the west we have freedom, sometimes things suck but at least it is freedom that brought us there, I rather not be in china in any case, people in China rarely know what they are missing because from birth to death they all are feed what government wants them to see, even their social media and everything else special for their own nation, they do not go to twitter and chat there easily, they use their own social media and government can see who says what and punishes accordingly.

I think that is just way too harsh, you can say they are at least feeding their citizens, but that is not good enough, without freedom everything else sucks.

Your definition of "freedom" is different from the definition in countries like China. If the people are not satisfied with their rulers, then it will take only a few months to overthrow the regime. Communist regimes have become history in the former USSR and Eastern Europe. The Chinese believe that the alternative to the current regime will be even worse. And I would agree. I have visited countries in the neighborhood of China, such as India and Bangladesh. And what I could see was extreme exploitation of the poor people, by the so called "democratic" politicians and policemen. IMO, democracies in Asia are much worse than China.

[The Ghoul]

Your language and comprehension coupled with your over-confidence makes it nearly impossible to have a debate but we try to be as open to ideas on this forum as possible.

It seems that the most confident person is you.You are a “definition king”.Let me enumerate the definition you have made：

• 1.just indicative of your communist background
• 2.CCP puppet
• 3.Dear CCP representative
• 4.CCP apologists

In addition, you are not discriminating against the opinions expressed by me. You are really discriminating against me.

It seems that you have also gone on to cry about discrimination in Meta, so I'd like to convince you that none of this is about discriminating against you as an individual but about the philosophy you are trying to propagate.

I don’t know what your definition of cry about discrimination is. I just simply ask whether there is discrimination. To explain this objectively, do you understand it as cry?

You will never convince the free people of the world, much less bitcoiners, that an optimal method of scoial governance needs an over-arching central authority "managing" the best for everyone else.

Which government in the world is not a central authority? This is not what I said, this is what the history of mankind has told us for thousands of years. Those countries or groups that have centralized power have all perished in the course of history.

Your reply to my point about idiomatic usage of "All people are free to vote and express" in context of democracies just shows that your brain is unable to even comprehend democracy. Like i said earlier, lets leave it at that. You have already shown your true colors with expressions like "Stupid people with their stupid votes" etc., so there really is no need to elaborate on that. I will still address your typical CCP tactic of trying to target democracies for their internal problems. You clearly are up to date with your handbook of "talking points" with various nationalities. If its India, talk about Ganges and population and toilets. If its USA, talk about racism and BLM riots and Iraq.

You think of my response to you as a kind of "manual". Your mind is imprisoned. Have you not noticed it yet? The opinions expressed by active users on the forum are understood by you as a "manual". When I talk about the problems of your country, if you only regard these problems as my strategy to attack you, do these problems no longer exist?

I don't care what you say, I live in China and I don't envy any other country. As a girl, if I choose India or China, my answer is China. I might die in India. Do girls have freedom in India?

[jrrsparkles]

At least some of you agreed with me, but even the ones who disagreed basically said "No I prefer a belly full of food and a dictator at the top instead of starvation and freedom" which I can sort of understand, I mean some people only thing of their own life and not the general politics which is understandable, it is totally understandable.

However nobody could deny that in the west we have freedom, sometimes things suck but at least it is freedom that brought us there, I rather not be in china in any case, people in China rarely know what they are missing because from birth to death they all are feed what government wants them to see, even their social media and everything else special for their own nation, they do not go to twitter and chat there easily, they use their own social media and government can see who says what and punishes accordingly.

I think that is just way too harsh, you can say they are at least feeding their citizens, but that is not good enough, without freedom everything else sucks.

China is having much better growing rate due to their strict policies and ofcourse I am not interested to live in such a place where I don't have any freedom which needs for every basic humans to live their life and some religions were treated much more pathetic than general in China and no one ever drop a word about such behaviour from China.

[dezoel]

Your definition of "freedom" is different from the definition in countries like China. If the people are not satisfied with their rulers, then it will take only a few months to overthrow the regime. Communist regimes have become history in the former USSR and Eastern Europe. The Chinese believe that the alternative to the current regime will be even worse. And I would agree. I have visited countries in the neighborhood of China, such as India and Bangladesh. And what I could see was extreme exploitation of the poor people, by the so called "democratic" politicians and policemen. IMO, democracies in Asia are much worse than China.

I understand your point of view, having a financially better life, not starving, not having trouble finding shelter, having a "decent" job (some find horrible jobs, some find good jobs just like in any nation) is all that you care about, and I respect that. However you are giving examples of nearby nations at all times, what about Norway? What about Finland? What about France? What about Germany? These are not nearby and they have democracy and they are doing fine? OF COURSE, they have problems, who could say that they don't.

Just an example, an amazon worker in USA making $15 an hour working 39 hours a week (to keep him under 40 hour threshold to not give him benefits and exploit his work) makes about 30k a year, the starvation level in USA for a family is 40k, so if one person works in that house, they are getting help from government, meaning tax payers pay for the rest of the salary for an amazon worker in USA, you see how horrible this is? However, I can criticize the government however I want, I can go on twitter and tweet FUCK JOE BIDEN and nothing will happen to me, NOTHING. Can you say the same for Chinese people saying that to president of their nation? Of course not.

This is the nation that has concentration camps for Muslims, ffs what are we talking about, THIS IS A NATION THAT HAS CONCENTRATION CAMPS, isn't that enough to say they are way too horrible to be liked? How can I like a nation that has concentration camps, that alone is a good enough reason to hate them big time, nothing else is even required? So, you may like their financial situation, but as long as they are doing disgusting things like this, I can never feel anything nice about them, not even 1% feeling for the government. This is not against any Chinese people, they are probably all fine (never met a Chinese person in my life before) it is just about government.

[lixer]

no country is perfect, no country is clean and pure. Every country has their own bad things, there is no way there is a perfect, great, awesome country with no flaws. Especially, china has different system, which might be quite controversial for people, no freedom, but they offer an equality. US might offer freedom, but not equality. The reason why people often mention these two countries, and compare them is due to their power. We can't deny that China and US has the biggest power in financial, enough to suppress each other and affect other surrounding countries. However, I don't think both countries is perfect enough, they all have their own pro and cons.

You just made a really good point on this. Every country cannot be perfect, there will always be something that will be a flaw for them. In the case of USA, I would say that the reason why there is inequality is because there are people of different races: Asians, Blacks, Latinos, etc. So, there tends to be a division among them. But when you go to China, there isn’t a huge number of different races there, so it now seems like they are united.

So, you cannot find any country that is hundred percent perfect in any way. Even those countries where there are too much freedom, unlike China, you are always going to find some problems. Freedom is a good thing, but sometimes there are people who tends to misuse the freedom that’s given to them.

[Assface16678]

That's what China is good at, covering up, remember Tianamen Square massacre, we couldn't have known about it if there were no foreign media at that time to cover the massacre and thanks to those people, we saw what CCP for what they really are, although it's a bit sad that nothing has changed ever since.