Bitcoin allows tax evaders, Please pay attention....

[Lucius]

We know that the rules are not the same in all countries when it comes to Bitcoin taxation, so there really are people who can’t pay such a tax even if they want to. If they sell their BTC and start living luxuriously, should they worry about not paying a tax that doesn’t actually exist? I know that taxes are quite high in some countries, so I understand that people are figuring out how to avoid them - but if it's a 10% -20% tax rate, I see no reason not to pay and enjoy the rest of the money.

On average we want to have a luxurious life, have a car, have a house, and something expensive if we have a lot of bitcoin. This is a natural human instinct so it becomes an advantage on the part of the government in detecting abuse. The reported treasures may not match one's lifestyle so this suspicion will only end in an in-depth investigation to reveal the motive behind it.

Maybe most want it, but some would definitely choose a remote and quiet place, away from the crowds, dirty air, and water from a plastic bottle. Sometimes living in luxury does not mean being happy, because money can buy almost anything, but important things cannot be bought with money.

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[Mahanton]

I don't see much point in the thread. The OP talks about tax evaders as if everyone who evades taxes does so in large quantities. There are plenty of people who don't declare small amounts because they know it's virtually impossible to get caught and prefer to save on taxes. So to those people, what the OP says about lifestyle does not apply.

And the big evaders already know enough and have tax advisors and lawyers, so I don't think they care much about what the OP says on the subject.

They do really love on focusing on things alone with bitcoin without trying to look back  on whats currently happening on reality which even fiat does have that tax evasion bullshit problem and now they are trying to pass it up on bitcoin? They should resolve it first before pointing out fingers to it because it would really be just a total joke
or troll if they would really be trying to sue this one out as a serious issue. Is this something surprising? Government and media does really love
on stirring up thing just to make it look bad.

[_BlackStar]

We know that the rules are not the same in all countries when it comes to Bitcoin taxation, so there really are people who can’t pay such a tax even if they want to.

That's right, we both know about this.
I'm sure many of us here don't really care how the government sets the tax rules because we are not their main target given the amount of wealth we have. They only target large asset owners and enforce strict rules for them to pay taxes. I don't know much about institutional investors investing in bitcoin nowadays, is the pay taxes after making big profits during this year's bitcoin ATH?

[kryptqnick]

The main problem with tax evaders is lifestyle, so I think this is a unique reason why tax evaders really didn't make it with bitcoin in the end. In the end I truly believe that if we still desperately want to live lavishly on bitcoin and other assets to avoid taxes, then this is really not going to work because sooner or later the government will smell it.

It's true that if a person shows off too much, the authorities might notice. But I also don't see why it's a big deal to pay some taxes if you're really rich. The problem is, in many countries Bitcoin is still in the gray area, so people can't really pay taxes for it and yet feel like they should be careful with lifestyles. What you said can actually be used for good, as a counterargument that Bitcoin's a way to commit financial crimes. And I hope that eventually, reasonable taxation policies will be introduced and would allow people who have BTC to use it fully legally.

[Lucius]

I'm sure many of us here don't really care how the government sets the tax rules because we are not their main target given the amount of wealth we have. They only target large asset owners and enforce strict rules for them to pay taxes.

I do not believe that this is the case, because most are still afraid of a system that is generally very powerful and ruthless when it comes to taxes - and this has always been the case in human history. In addition, some ordinary people have really gotten rich by investing in cryptocurrencies over the years, and each government wants its share, as evidenced by the growing pressure on all centralized crypto exchanges in the form of increasingly stringent KYC.

I don't know much about institutional investors investing in bitcoin nowadays, is the pay taxes after making big profits during this year's bitcoin ATH?

From what is publicly known, there are those who invest significant amounts in Bitcoin, but I guess there is a rule for them to pay taxes only when they sell Bitcoin as well as for ordinary people. I may be wrong, but it doesn’t make sense to me that anyone pays taxes on unrealized profits.

[Obito]

They can't use bitcoin to evade taxes, there's a public ledger that keeps track of all transactions so I don't see how they're going to be able to use it to evade taxes plus you can't move large amounts of bitcoin without a lot of people noticing so it's not going to be an easy task evading taxes using cryptocurrencies.

[Taskford]

They can't use bitcoin to evade taxes, there's a public ledger that keeps track of all transactions so I don't see how they're going to be able to use it to evade taxes plus you can't move large amounts of bitcoin without a lot of people noticing so it's not going to be an easy task evading taxes using cryptocurrencies.

If you publicly announce your wallet address then yet everybody can track you but if you secretly do it then use the mixers trusted mixers to wash your transactions then maybe anyone can avoid by using this method. But if hard implementation will happen and chase those evaders then restrict mixers then maybe they can get those people hiding on cryptocurrency and oblige them to pay their taxes.

[Kakmakr]

They can't use bitcoin to evade taxes, there's a public ledger that keeps track of all transactions so I don't see how they're going to be able to use it to evade taxes plus you can't move large amounts of bitcoin without a lot of people noticing so it's not going to be an easy task evading taxes using cryptocurrencies.

Wrong.... you can use Bitcoin to evade taxes if you steer clear of Bitcoin to Fiat conversion and if you are using Mixer services to cover your tracks. The thing is... when you do this, you spend "money" and if you spend money.. other people take notice and they start to talk.

The next thing you see are a bunch of people rocking up at your house to investigate suspicious criminal behavior (Finding probable cause like you selling drugs or for things like money laundering) and then they do a life style audit. If you cannot explain where the money come from to fund your life style.... then you are fuc$%ed. 

[Ultegra134]

I don't exactly get the point of this thread, tax evasion is a daily thing of fiat currencies too, I don't object that Bitcoin may also add one more mean of evading taxation. However, let's be real now, cryptocurrencies aren't the cause of tax evasion, it existed long before Bitcoin was created, everything else is just pure nonsense.

Don't get me wrong, I fully get your point, I'm also tax evading by holding a decent amount of cryptocurrency, which I'm not planning to declare anytime soon.

[oHnK]

The next thing you see are a bunch of people rocking up at your house to investigate suspicious criminal behavior (Finding probable cause like you selling drugs or for things like money laundering) and then they do a life style audit. If you cannot explain where the money come from to fund your life style.... then you are fuc$%ed.  

It's not easy to avoid taxes, if that's the concept.  But we can learn from Jeff Bezos who became an entrepreneur and did not pay taxes even though everyone knew how rich he was.  Whether it's fiat or crypto, as long as the intention is to avoid taxes, there must be a way. For example, when you have a company that has to pay taxes but you can avoid it by giving CSR to our foundation by covering up the management behind it.  This is often done by large companies, even state-owned companies.

[Silberman]

It is not the year 2011 or 2013 when governments did not learn to meet and thus impose taxes, but many countries develop their tax regime to become all bitcoin transactions need to be reported. In other words, when they achieve profits will pay taxes.
Generally, within 10 years and increased bitcoin network analysis  tax evasion will not be particularly high if governments issued Min tax report.

How can government take the taxes on bitcoin if they had not made it legal ?
The only way government can tax on bitcoin and crypto currencies, if they make it a legal tender and make regulations on crypto taxes. Unless they don't do it people will keep on enjoying the tax evasion as there is nothing documented legally about crypto tax.

Governments do not really need to make bitcoin legal tender to charge taxes, they just need to recognize bitcoin as an asset that can be bought and sold like a stock while still forbidding its use as a currency, this difference is important because bitcoin at its core is a currency and while its use as a speculative asset is important what really gives it value are the characteristics that makes it a form of money, so governments can still try to get a piece of the action in the form of taxes and forbid bitcoin from circulating freely.

[palle11]

I'm also tax evading by holding a decent amount of cryptocurrency, which I'm not planning to declare anytime soon.

Lol is hodling some amount of coin regarded as tax evading Or I don't know that to be so. I feel when you sell off your hodling and keep it secret from tax authority then that can be a crime of evading depending on if the country is collecting tax on cryptocurrency but if hodling is also part of evading is still new part of it.

[jaberwock]

There is some constant discussion about the possibility that tax evaders may really like bitcoin but in reality it is still difficult for most users to do because of the influence of lifestyle and desires. On average we want to have a luxurious life, have a car, have a house, and something expensive if we have a lot of bitcoin. This is a natural human instinct so it becomes an advantage on the part of the government in detecting abuse. The reported treasures may not match one's lifestyle so this suspicion will only end in an in-depth investigation to reveal the motive behind it.

It "allows" you to avoid if you want to, keep it in bitcoin for example and never take it out, and even while buying, you should try to be as hidden as possible, P2P is the best for that. However, it is a very bad thing to do and if nobody pays taxes then the whole world will be in chaos. Maybe you could think that government is inefficient and you are right, 100 bucks of tax usually ends up being 20 bucks efficient and 80 bucks corruption, and I would not be against saying that. This doesn't mean that we should avoid paying taxes because that 20% which is used properly is something that is very valuable and the world would be in big trouble if we did not pay that.

[EdenHazard]

I'm also tax evading by holding a decent amount of cryptocurrency, which I'm not planning to declare anytime soon.

Lol is hodling some amount of coin regarded as tax evading Or I don't know that to be so. I feel when you sell off your hodling and keep it secret from tax authority then that can be a crime of evading depending on if the country is collecting tax on cryptocurrency but if hodling is also part of evading is still new part of it.

Complicated shit to talk , taxes feel like government robbed us... it's always like we forced to pay something that we might not wanted it. but if you use your human sense , a deep sense one that taxes are actially help other people indirectly.
but since the community day by day losing trust on government then yeah taxes always feel like a theft. and yeah as i said .. complicated shit to talk. if you want to pay the taxes voluntraily then pay it , if not then just use crypto!

hahaha i knew everyone here are joking right? taxation in crypto does exist!

[paxmao]

Bitcoin is not the best tool to evade taxes. While it is in theory anonymous, in practice the users can be traced and eventually prosecuted if a government is decided and really is after setting an example. There are much better options such as privacy oriented coins like Monero or Grin or other based on ToR.

There is some people still thinking that bitcoin facilitates evasion, like if it was not easy enough with cash. Have you asked yourself what are the 500 euros notes used for? It is certainly not to buy bread.

[xSkylarx]

They can't use bitcoin to evade taxes, there's a public ledger that keeps track of all transactions so I don't see how they're going to be able to use it to evade taxes plus you can't move large amounts of bitcoin without a lot of people noticing so it's not going to be an easy task evading taxes using cryptocurrencies.

If you publicly announce your wallet address then yet everybody can track you but if you secretly do it then use the mixers trusted mixers to wash your transactions then maybe anyone can avoid by using this method. But if hard implementation will happen and chase those evaders then restrict mixers then maybe they can get those people hiding on cryptocurrency and oblige them to pay their taxes.

I agree, but who do you think will announce your wallet in public? Here in our country, crypto is becoming more popular, and the government is following suit. A branch of the government here in country says that if you earn money online or in crypto, you must declare it in their office and pay tax, which leads people to believe that they should not declare that they hold a crypto and should remain anonymous online. This is a type of tax evasion that is extremely difficult to detect.

[Ultegra134]

I'm also tax evading by holding a decent amount of cryptocurrency, which I'm not planning to declare anytime soon.

Lol is hodling some amount of coin regarded as tax evading Or I don't know that to be so. I feel when you sell off your hodling and keep it secret from tax authority then that can be a crime of evading depending on if the country is collecting tax on cryptocurrency but if hodling is also part of evading is still new part of it.

Holding itself isn't tax evasion, however, if I were to withdraw such amount of money, I'd have to declare where and how I obtained them. In the best case scenario, I'd have to pay approximately 20% in taxes, which I'd rather not. At least here, there isn't a solid taxation policy, however, any kind of deposit from a foreign exchange would trigger alarm bells.

[sana54210]

Holding itself isn't tax evasion, however, if I were to withdraw such amount of money, I'd have to declare where and how I obtained them. In the best case scenario, I'd have to pay approximately 20% in taxes, which I'd rather not. At least here, there isn't a solid taxation policy, however, any kind of deposit from a foreign exchange would trigger alarm bells.

That is the big difference in stocks and people like Elon and Jeff not paying too much taxes. They keep claiming that anytime they sell stocks, they are paying a huge amount of tax, sometimes as high as 50% and they claim that's good enough. Let's check it shall we? Elon paid a shit ton of taxes this year because he sold stocks, options that expired and some other stuff, billions upon billions of dollars, that's good right? Well he now worths over 300 billion dollars, at the start of the year that was under 200 billion dollars, less than half of what he worths now.

It means, even though he paid billions of dollars worth of taxes, he still gained 2x profit in a single year. What does that tell you? Does that mean he pays good enough taxes and he should not be asked for more? Or does that tell you that unrealized profits could be taxed and used for other stuff?

[Hamphser]

They can't use bitcoin to evade taxes, there's a public ledger that keeps track of all transactions so I don't see how they're going to be able to use it to evade taxes plus you can't move large amounts of bitcoin without a lot of people noticing so it's not going to be an easy task evading taxes using cryptocurrencies.

If you publicly announce your wallet address then yet everybody can track you but if you secretly do it then use the mixers trusted mixers to wash your transactions then maybe anyone can avoid by using this method. But if hard implementation will happen and chase those evaders then restrict mixers then maybe they can get those people hiding on cryptocurrency and oblige them to pay their taxes.

I agree, but who do you think will announce your wallet in public? Here in our country, crypto is becoming more popular, and the government is following suit. A branch of the government here in country says that if you earn money online or in crypto, you must declare it in their office and pay tax, which leads people to believe that they should not declare that they hold a crypto and should remain anonymous online. This is a type of tax evasion that is extremely difficult to detect.

Who the hell would really tend to announce or declare their income on crypto if government wont able to to trace or know into those people who do engage with crypto.

Its not surprising that this would be the main issue in talks about tax evasion and money laundering is always attached with crypto and these are the
main reason on why most government wont accept this one.

Its true that it does have its pros and cons but lets just focus now for its benefits.

[24Kt]

They can't use bitcoin to evade taxes, there's a public ledger that keeps track of all transactions so I don't see how they're going to be able to use it to evade taxes plus you can't move large amounts of bitcoin without a lot of people noticing so it's not going to be an easy task evading taxes using cryptocurrencies.

If you publicly announce your wallet address then yet everybody can track you but if you secretly do it then use the mixers trusted mixers to wash your transactions then maybe anyone can avoid by using this method. But if hard implementation will happen and chase those evaders then restrict mixers then maybe they can get those people hiding on cryptocurrency and oblige them to pay their taxes.

I agree, but who do you think will announce your wallet in public? Here in our country, crypto is becoming more popular, and the government is following suit. A branch of the government here in country says that if you earn money online or in crypto, you must declare it in their office and pay tax, which leads people to believe that they should not declare that they hold a crypto and should remain anonymous online. This is a type of tax evasion that is extremely difficult to detect.

Who the hell would really tend to announce or declare their income on crypto if government wont able to to trace or know into those people who do engage with crypto.

Its not surprising that this would be the main issue in talks about tax evasion and money laundering is always attached with crypto and these are the
main reason on why most government wont accept this one.

Its true that it does have its pros and cons but lets just focus now for its benefits.

But some people are just arrogant and just want to show and publish in their social media channels that they are into crypto. But it is their problem because they are opening themselves to government scrutiny. So if you want to keep your crypto life hidden, then, don't divulge anything in public. It is better to keep it to yourself or your immediate family. Also, if you are dealing with local crypto exchange, and usually, you need to verify your identity, are you already paying some type of tax as the local exchange is already paying tax to the government? I am still not clear on this matter.