What percentage of people in the USA do you think haven't paid taxes on trades?

[Anonohmon]

To be clear, we're talking trades or swaps from one crypto to another not just cashing out.

I had no idea taxes on crypto trades were even a thing. Hell, had no idea anything about taxes were when I first started dipping my toes in bitcoin. Then when I heard you have to pay taxes on cap gains I thought it was just for cashing out. I have a feeling more than half of millennials and gen Z like me also had/have no idea. Like 60% or more for millennials. I guess about 45 to 60% for everyone. Leaning more towards 50 to 55% as a more accurate guess. Only one of the dozen friends of mine who knows about this knew there were taxes on trades, and I'm not even sure he knew so much as just guessing to pick a different answer than the rest. Only like 4 of my friends knew taxes of some sort, namely, selling bitcoin would result in a taxable event.


Do you think this article is accurate or do you think it's more or less from the time this article was published?

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/40-crypto-investors-don-t-153230225.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly9kdWNrZHVja2dvLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAACTUn5OkJSyGccBl_t5YTX9BKJWJupqXk5BTRWm99ikZBjROQgLVoxb8Oe1MkXuAn6hhrIlOYbbEbymVnoezNgm6JvJRwCICtKa6XYbvo-Ft0B_0cl-Ii4fRmLpTQWrQ1o7ncBWwsomTr04VAMmf08eEiH3pt_CNRt4r7OMc37Cd

Isn't it insane that only in the USA, they tax trades and then expect YOU to figure out how much you "owe"??
Imagine going to the grocery store and the cashier scans all your items, her computer tells her how much you owe, but she wont tell you, and instead, expects you to calculate everything and if you're wrong, you go to jail. This is essentially the tax system in the USA and they don't teach any of this in schools. You're just supposed to be psychic and/or be born with this knowledge.

[1714195319]

1714195319

[davis196]

How the hell would I know what percentage of people in the USA don't pay "taxes on trades"? I don't have a crystal ball and I can't conduct anonymous surveys asking people in the US about whether or not they pay their taxes. I guess that they won't give sincere answers, even if I ask them. The question "Do you pay your taxes?" sounds suspicious, when a complete stranger is asking.
I don't live in the USA and I don't pay taxes there, but the US tax system can't surprise me anymore. It's a constant flood of bureaucratic BS over and over again.
What do you mean by "taxes on trades"? Capital gains tax is a thing in the USA, but I don't think that there is a tax for every cryptocurrency trade.

[Leviathan.007]

I would say a little part of people who trade cryptocurrencies and bitcoin paid their taxes because most people will use this market because they don't have to pay taxes and they can hide the transactions unlike the other markets, however, the government is trying hard to track the transactions and take tax from the money they trade in cryptocurrencies but still, the big players and anonymous whales will not pay the tax because none can track their transactions to calculate their transactions value and take tax from them.

[dansus021]

I would say a little part of people who trade cryptocurrencies and bitcoin paid their taxes because most people will use this market because they don't have to pay taxes and they can hide the transactions unlike the other markets, however, the government is trying hard to track the transactions and take tax from the money they trade in cryptocurrencies but still, the big players and anonymous whales will not pay the tax because none can track their transactions to calculate their transactions value and take tax from them.

Yep, I do agree with this, I mean basically most crypto adapting privacy first. so I think it was easy for people to avoid tax. maybe some users pay taxes because they trade on a centralized exchange and higher rank members or early adopters or experts in crypto would most likely put more than 50% on wallet not CEX.

and right now there is a bunch of Decentralized Exchange and p2p trader for cashing out money. so its become more untracable

[Upgrade00]

Then when I heard you have to pay taxes on cap gains I thought it was just for cashing out. I

AFAIK, it's just for cashing out or for when you make a purchase which can be taxable.
The tax rules vary from country to country, but in majority you shouldn't be taxed for converting BTC to ETH or vice versa, but on capital gains at the time you "cash out" relative to when you purchased the said asset.

It's of course a bummer that many are not properly educated on how taxes work, so what was originally designed to take from the rich, is now mostly affecting the poor and middle class who are not very informed about it.About the percentage in the U.S who haven't paid taxes on traded (capital gain), that is impossible to speculate in my opinion.

[Doan9269]

Tax is what is expected to be paid by every individuals regardless of status, this is now very common as it's only believed that business people were the only ones expected to pay tax, in cryptocurrency, every identified crypto bodies were expected to pay tax and i can say that they all are paying their taxes and if not all then the majority are, that's why any corporate organizations or institution that is identified being centralized will have no option than to pay tax, but since bitcoin is decentralized p2p network, it's the only crypto that is tax free except for its miners.

[DaveF]

I would put it above 60%. For now.

With a lot of the 'Big Name' exchanges that are US based they are going to be providing full tax info to the IRS starting next year so there will be a lot of people who will have to start giving up that information and paying.

Will probably crush the markets for a bit before everyone adjusts to the new normal.
How many will keep trading, how many will move to other unregulated exchanges will be interesting to see.

-Dave

[philipma1957]

Coming from an IRS family.

Mom worked there 24 years then retired
Wife worked there 33 years then retired
I worked there a year then left

I voted 15%

I report every trade.
In fact I occasionally do losing trades on purpose to balance my cap gains out.

I use coinbase and report.

Why do I do this?

Hmm wife's pension  is federal.
My pensions's are federal.

Our pensions are worth quite a bit.

To buy  the pensions we have at 66+65 years old including the medical would cost over a million bucks.

Lots of actuary math involved to get the 2 million value.

But here goes if you collect 50k in pensions for 20 years that is 1 million

Our ages suggest we would live for 20 more years.

we collect over 50k in pensions and our medical insurance would cost us 1200 a month which is about 300k over next 20 years.

So to not report trades and risk fucking the pensions up is not worth it.

BTW the like kind rule was crushed by Donald Trump and co.

All like kind trades have been removed other than real estate .

Under Obama you could do trade of stock to stock no reporting
and you could do trade of crypto to crypto no reporting.

So if you are USA voter contact your congress man and ask for a definite answer for repealing Donald trump's like kind limits for trading stocks and crypto.

I believe the act came into effect in 2018 but I am 65 and don't remember a lot of shit.

[stompix]

Isn't it insane that only in the USA, they tax trades and then expect YOU to figure out how much you "owe"??
Imagine going to the grocery store and the cashier scans all your items, her computer tells her how much you owe, but she wont tell you, and instead, expects you to calculate everything and if you're wrong, you go to jail.

It's quite the other way around, you go with a bag full of products, you tell the cashier that is worth 100$ you pay and you go on your way. If the guards stop you and you have 1000$ worth of merchandise they call the police.

Isn't it insane that only in the USA, they tax trades and then expect YOU to figure out how much you "owe"??

No, the US is not the only one that taxes this, and in every country in Europe that I know of you have to come with the amount you owe first.

AFAIK, it's just for cashing out or for when you make a purchase which can be taxable.

https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employed/virtual-currencies

The sale or other exchange of virtual currencies, or the use of virtual currencies to pay for goods or services, or holding virtual currencies as an investment, generally has tax consequences that could result in tax liability.

[noormcs5]

I would say a little part of people who trade cryptocurrencies and bitcoin paid their taxes because most people will use this market because they don't have to pay taxes and they can hide the transactions unlike the other markets, however, the government is trying hard to track the transactions and take tax from the money they trade in cryptocurrencies but still, the big players and anonymous whales will not pay the tax because none can track their transactions to calculate their transactions value and take tax from them.

I don't know about the US but in other parts of the world, people usually do not pay taxes on crypto because the funds/crypto kept in exchanges and wallets are not disclosed to the governments. Even if there is a strict law of taxes, people would pay tax only on the money which they converted into fiat money and also through the banking channel.

[philipma1957]

Here is the issue. BTC and crypto mining could be pushed to do this

https://www.nj.com/news/2019/06/six-flags-is-now-one-of-worlds-1st-solar-powered-theme-parks-more-clean-energy-is-on-the-way.html





or this




When the 2017 bill was passed it was a step away from solar and towards coal

BTC in 2012   264 kwatts in 1 day could mine 7 coins

BTC in 2022  1,125,000 Kwatts to mine the same 7 coins.

Coins became costly and greedy shortsighted people acted to alter the taxing system to grab from the industry.

Rather than properly manage the asset and use it to get a lot more parking lots like the photo above.

[yazher]

I don't think there are lots of people there who will gonna evade their taxes because they can be tracked and will face the consequences unless they know how to hide it from the government using their tricks. But normal people, will abide by the laws and don't commit something like that. especially when it comes to bitcoins where all eyes are on you if they find out you were hiding some huge amount of it and you are lucky if they don't get it forcefully from you.

[hugeblack]

Taxes differ from one country to another. We have no clear income tax or detail in the tax system, but due to the budget's dependence on oil to a large extent, the reliance of budgets on taxes will make them more stringent and strict, but over time you will learn how to reduce your taxes significantly.

As for the percentage, I don't know, but I'm not from the United States, and I knew the details of the tax system from here, so I expect that with a little research, most people will know that.

[BlockchainMentors]

Yes, There is a tax and not only there, but there is a tax in the whole world on cryptocurrency, if they do not do it, then at some point of time, Government will know and I do not know about other countries but in India, the tax is 30% and the rules are strict If you are earning money by trading then you will have to pay tax, if you do not pay, then there may be a case here.

[aoluain]

To be clear, we're talking trades or swaps from one crypto to another not just cashing out.

...snip...

Isn't it insane that only in the USA, they tax trades and then expect YOU to figure out how much you "owe"??

Who is checking to see what trades you make and if what you declare is correct?

Seems a bit strange that you can declare anything but then I imagine they then
go and check that you are making a proper declaration.

So for that reason I'm guessing over 60% have not paid taxes  (I know I havent paid
1 cent in all the years buying, trading and selling, but dont tell anyone ....)

[Kakmakr]

I do not know why the Americans always have to over complicate things.     In my country, Capital Gains on Crypto currencies are simple... you calculate how much money you spend on buying Crypto in one year.... and you subtract the selling price from that. That shows you the gain that you are supposed to pay taxes on. 

We also have some exemptions that you subtract from the total that you earned from Crypto trading. It is really not a difficult calculation to make... and it takes like 1 hour to finalize the whole assessment. 

[Upgrade00]

The sale or other exchange of virtual currencies, or the use of virtual currencies to pay for goods or services, or holding virtual currencies as an investment, generally has tax consequences that could result in tax liability.

Thanks for sharing, I was not aware of such distinctions in how taxes are calculated and what someone can be taxed.
I remember reading somewhere that in real estate you can reinvest (flip a property which has appreciated in value, for another) and you would not be taxed on it. Up until you sell the property for fiat; cashing out.
Not sure if that's still applicable and why crypto would be exempt.

[masterrex]

IMO, I think it is pretty hard to establish the percentage that you mean because we don't have the complete data of the people who did a crypto trade or swap in the US, but we can supply any estimate based on our own opinion, and not base on actual counts, since the US is an advance country in any means I presume that the effectivity of implementing tax collection system is also very high thats why I can say that it is only a small percentage let say as two percent who knows if it was really the right estimate. 

[2stout]

I'm thinking well over the highest threshold defined in OP poll, which was 60%.  If it was really low, then the IRS wouldn't be making such a big deal of things and the fact they have and are using software to find things out tells also tells me otherwise.

[FanEagle]

IRS is a weird one like that. They make you pay the taxes so that you would pay the right price and not tell you how much you owe, and if you pay the wrong amount then they will collect it with some interest. Meaning, they already knew how much you should have paid, if they didn't know at all then you could have paid 100 bucks instead of 1k dollars and they wouldn't know and you would get away with it.

But since they know, they can charge you with wrong amount, but if they knew, then why didn't they gave you the chance to actually learn what amount it is and then pay it? Why make people pay the amount they think they owe, instead of letting them take a guess?