Tornado.Cash Sanctioned by the US

[cryptoperkele]

The source code is nowhere to be found, so unless someone has a backup, Tornado.Cash's original vision to bring privacy to the ETH chain would be doomed. The ability to take down the source code easily, makes me wonder if someday governments will do the same with Bitcoin if they find it too threatening to Fiat's existence. I believe the war is just beginning, so hold on tight as this is going to be a wild ride. Just my opinion

Someone has to got the source code, i am pretty sure about that. But i doubt that Bitcoin or any other protocol threats Fiat's existence ever. They are very much created for different purposes and regulations already came for Tornado Cash. They will come for others that want to launder money as well.

[RussiaUkraineTranslation]

The source code is nowhere to be found, so unless someone has a backup, Tornado.Cash's original vision to bring privacy to the ETH chain would be doomed. The ability to take down the source code easily, makes me wonder if someday governments will do the same with Bitcoin if they find it too threatening to Fiat's existence. I believe the war is just beginning, so hold on tight as this is going to be a wild ride. Just my opinion

Someone has to got the source code, i am pretty sure about that. But i doubt that Bitcoin or any other protocol threats Fiat's existence ever. They are very much created for different purposes and regulations already came for Tornado Cash. They will come for others that want to launder money as well.

On Ethereum it is not enough to post the source code. Ethereum DApps need server hosting, front end design and hosting, and in this case hosting on IPFS using multiple mirrors and RPCs that won't censor users accessing the contract. It's a lot more complicated than forking something like Monero. It might make more sense to use 0xMonero going forward because Tornado Cash has a big target on its back and people are afraid to use it now. 0xMR is a microcap and has an anonymous team and code, so it's a lot safer to mix with.

[Abiky]

Ideally, all developers and the team of decentralized applications should be anonymous, otherwise all decentralization will eventually turn into centralized. As for mixing, as long as there is a need for anonymity, such services will continue to work, but at the same time they will become inaccessible to control.

Tell that to Ethereum which has a publicly-known founder (Vitalik Buterin) and developers. How can Web 3.0 achieve its full potential if developers' identities are not anonymous? The same way the US government was able to easily take down the Tornado.Cash mixing protocol (even though smart contracts are still running on the ETH blockchain), the same could happen with ETH if the government deems it as a platform for money laundering and tax evasion. Could you imagine if Vitalik goes to prison just like Tornado.Cash's developer? It would be a complete disaster for ETH.

I think that's why Bitcoin's Satoshi Nakamoto didn't disclose his identity. He wanted protect himself (and the project) from government prosecution. Unless crypto/Blockchain developers put decentralization/censorship-resistance first, the whole industry will be doomed. It will be controlled by venture capitalists (VCs) and institutional investors, making crypto no different than traditional banking. If the US was able to successfully sanction a "decentralized" mixing protocol, imagine what would be of other non-custodial mixers and privacy coins? Just my thoughts

[tvplus006]

...I think that's why Bitcoin's Satoshi Nakamoto didn't disclose his identity. He wanted protect himself (and the project) from government prosecution. Unless crypto/Blockchain developers put decentralization/censorship-resistance first, the whole industry will be doomed. It will be controlled by venture capitalists (VCs) and institutional investors, making crypto no different than traditional banking. If the US was able to successfully sanction a "decentralized" mixing protocol, imagine what would be of other non-custodial mixers and privacy coins? Just my thoughts

In this case, it will be difficult to assess the prospects of the project if the team is anonymous. How will such a decentralized project differ from scams if both projects are presented by an anonymous team? Investors don't like an anonymous team.

[cryptoaddictchie]

In this case, it will be difficult to assess the prospects of the project if the team is anonymous. How will such a decentralized project differ from scams if both projects are presented by an anonymous team? Investors don't like an anonymous team.

Some projects are anonymously done and I think theres a way to asses an anonymous project, by its development which can be observed on Github for that project.  You are right,  investors dont like anon team but there are who invest on tech if they saw a great deal of potential for that project.  Its gonna be hard to trust anon projects but if its solid we can see its development on its actual market standing.

[popeye95]

Ideally, all developers and the team of decentralized applications should be anonymous, otherwise all decentralization will eventually turn into centralized. As for mixing, as long as there is a need for anonymity, such services will continue to work, but at the same time they will become inaccessible to control.

Tell that to Ethereum which has a publicly-known founder (Vitalik Buterin) and developers. How can Web 3.0 achieve its full potential if developers' identities are not anonymous? The same way the US government was able to easily take down the Tornado.Cash mixing protocol (even though smart contracts are still running on the ETH blockchain), the same could happen with ETH if the government deems it as a platform for money laundering and tax evasion. Could you imagine if Vitalik goes to prison just like Tornado.Cash's developer? It would be a complete disaster for ETH.

I think that's why Bitcoin's Satoshi Nakamoto didn't disclose his identity. He wanted protect himself (and the project) from government prosecution. Unless crypto/Blockchain developers put decentralization/censorship-resistance first, the whole industry will be doomed. It will be controlled by venture capitalists (VCs) and institutional investors, making crypto no different than traditional banking. If the US was able to successfully sanction a "decentralized" mixing protocol, imagine what would be of other non-custodial mixers and privacy coins? Just my thoughts

Tornado Cash looks like a scapegoat for the US govt to send a message toward any privacy coin and mixing service out there. They could have gone to ETH, the one was behind Tornado Cash as a smart contract in its system but they didn't. Because they know the backlash from the public is bigger if they've gone to ETH. So they picked the easy prey, Tornado Cash to make an example. The reaction from the ETH community is indifferent. Rally for the cause of decentralization/censorship resistance and support for Tornado Cash is low too. We're fucked if the US govt decides to push more if we do not make out stand here, against the Tornado Cash case.

[X-ray]

The source code is nowhere to be found, so unless someone has a backup, Tornado.Cash's original vision to bring privacy to the ETH chain would be doomed. The ability to take down the source code easily, makes me wonder if someday governments will do the same with Bitcoin if they find it too threatening to Fiat's existence. I believe the war is just beginning, so hold on tight as this is going to be a wild ride. Just my opinion

Someone has to got the source code, i am pretty sure about that. But i doubt that Bitcoin or any other protocol threats Fiat's existence ever. They are very much created for different purposes and regulations already came for Tornado Cash. They will come for others that want to launder money as well.

Im sure that some may have copied the code but the question is if even tornado developers can be jailed and then what's gonna happen with the forkers? They can be jailed as well. Think about that. Will you risking your life to be jailed? I will not do that. Yeah we know that how vitalik was giving his announcement about he was sometime using tornado but again this is mostly being used by criminals for the various purpose. I like the way how it was getting sanctioned.
Hackers who always hacking dapps were always using this money laundering tool.

[Abiky]

In this case, it will be difficult to assess the prospects of the project if the team is anonymous. How will such a decentralized project differ from scams if both projects are presented by an anonymous team? Investors don't like an anonymous team.

Bitcoin didn't need the attention of investors to succeed in its early days. Satoshi created it to be a financial instrument/tool, not an investment vehicle. Because exchanges are now obliged to comply with KYC/AML laws, any project with anonymous developers is quickly flagged as a "scam". Of course, scammers hide their true identities to get what they want. But not every project with unknown developers are a scam. Would you call Bitcoin a scam because no one knows who created it? The fact that the creator of Bitcoin is anonymous, gives the project itself true censorship-resistance. You can bet governments will be behind Satoshi's "tail" if they knew his true identity.

With what happened with Tornado.Cash lately, I would take everything with a grain of salt. How far will governments go, will depend on how strong opposing forces get. If there's no opposition, governments will keep hunting crypto/Blockchain tech down until they destroy it for good. The US started with Tornado.Cash, but it could move on to other non-custodial mixers like CashShuffle (BCH), CashFusion (BCH), and Whirlpool (BTC using Samourai wallet). Considering that 90% of crypto projects don't prioritize decentralization, implementing sanctions and/or restrictions against mixers and/or privacy coins should be a no-brainer. Who knows what the future holds to our right to privacy? Just my thoughts

Im sure that some may have copied the code but the question is if even tornado developers can be jailed and then what's gonna happen with the forkers? They can be jailed as well. Think about that. Will you risking your life to be jailed? I will not do that. Yeah we know that how vitalik was giving his announcement about he was sometime using tornado but again this is mostly being used by criminals for the various purpose. I like the way how it was getting sanctioned.
Hackers who always hacking dapps were always using this money laundering tool.

Developers wouldn't risk themselves copying/forking the code, because they know that would raise the alarm of the government. No one wants to face jail time for fines, so this is only the beginning of the end for privacy. Things are going to get worse once CBDCs are released. Governments will keep pressuring against crypto/Blockchain tech to prevent as much people as possible from using it. They will always come up with the excuse that crypto is used for money laundering and tax evasion. But we all know their hidden agenda. Unless the crypto community stands against such actions, the vision of a decentralized and censorship-resistant financial system would be nothing but doomed.

[SlimShadyMmp]

millions of funds keep getting missed out of thin air mate I really think tornado cash is been used by lots of hackers out there than real people and at such it helps prevent stolen funds from been untraceable and that way someone like normad can track hackers account more easily

[tvplus006]

Developers wouldn't risk themselves copying/forking the code, because they know that would raise the alarm of the government. No one wants to face jail time for fines, so this is only the beginning of the end for privacy. ..

Regardless of the desire of the government, there is a demand for such mixers, respectively, there will be a supply. So soon there will be a new "Tornado.Cash", which will really not only be decentralized, but also have an anonymous development team, which will not allow the government to control it.

[abel1337]

millions of funds keep getting missed out of thin air mate I really think tornado cash is been used by lots of hackers out there than real people and at such it helps prevent stolen funds from been untraceable and that way someone like normad can track hackers account more easily

It's the reality, Hackera would mostly resort in mixing their hacked funds to launder it also to make their hacked funds "clean" and spend it. There's a multiple hacking incident happened and mixing services such as Tornado cash are being mentioned on the news being the gateway to launder the money. There are still "real users" of this service but I think they don't use the service regularly like what hackers does.

[waONE]

In 2022, many top projects have become scams, from LUNA and now it's Tornado Cash,
even though Torn has also been listed on Binance, and is one of the altcoins with good performance,
but unfortunately maybe Binance will delist this coin, yes, just wait just the date, if you still have the asset,
then my advice is to sell it.

[TravelMug]

Developers wouldn't risk themselves copying/forking the code, because they know that would raise the alarm of the government. No one wants to face jail time for fines, so this is only the beginning of the end for privacy. ..

Regardless of the desire of the government, there is a demand for such mixers, respectively, there will be a supply. So soon there will be a new "Tornado.Cash", which will really not only be decentralized, but also have an anonymous development team, which will not allow the government to control it.

It's possible, that's how bitcoin mixers are born, because there is a demand for it. But only the tough one are able to survived as of this time.

And for those who are thinking to be the next "Tornado Cash", they will just have to out think the government and to not get track somewhere in the world, caught off guard and now facing a jail time. Monero was smart to do that as developers made a fork recently that will make it harder to trace for privacy reason.

[asriloni]

In 2022, many top projects have become scams, from LUNA and now it's Tornado Cash,
even though Torn has also been listed on Binance, and is one of the altcoins with good performance,
but unfortunately maybe Binance will delist this coin, yes, just wait just the date, if you still have the asset,
then my advice is to sell it.

Tornado was a scam tool as well. I hope that binance will be delisting this token from its exchange site. This token being used by so many criminals. Binance was also doing shady thing by accepting the scam token that used by criminals. So many people's money being stolen got laundered through torando. That means binance shall delist such token from its exchange site.

[tvplus006]

Tornado was a scam tool as well. I hope that binance will be delisting this token from its exchange site. This token being used by so many criminals. Binance was also doing shady thing by accepting the scam token that used by criminals. So many people's money being stolen got laundered through torando. That means binance shall delist such token from its exchange site.

I don't understand why you think the Torn coin is scam? The fact that the Tornado.Cash mixer was used by scammers to launder their money is not a reason to call the coin scam. We all know that the dollar is also used by scammers and other criminal structures, but no one calls USD scam.

[Abiky]

Tornado was a scam tool as well. I hope that binance will be delisting this token from its exchange site. This token being used by so many criminals. Binance was also doing shady thing by accepting the scam token that used by criminals. So many people's money being stolen got laundered through torando. That means binance shall delist such token from its exchange site.

The Tornado mixing protocol wasn't a scam. It was just sanctioned by the US because of money laundering concerns. Smart contracts can still be accessed through the main Ethereum blockchain, but be aware that your ETH address could get flagged if governments manage to link your identity with it. The source code is open for anyone to review or modify to their hearts' content, so it's possible to "revive" the front-end (website) to interact with Tornado.Cash contracts directly. But even so, developers wouldn't risk themselves mirroring the website because they could face prosecution from the government.

This is sad because now people can't enjoy privacy on the ETH chain. Innocent people will now be treated just like a criminal who used the mixing protocol before. It would've been best for the US to sanction the persons using the Tornado.Cash mixer directly than the protocol itself. Someone said about Coin Center taking this to the court, so only time will tell us if we'll ever see Tornado.Cash or a similar privacy solution on the ETH chain again. Just my thoughts

[RussiaUkraineTranslation]

Developers wouldn't risk themselves copying/forking the code, because they know that would raise the alarm of the government. No one wants to face jail time for fines, so this is only the beginning of the end for privacy. ..

Regardless of the desire of the government, there is a demand for such mixers, respectively, there will be a supply. So soon there will be a new "Tornado.Cash", which will really not only be decentralized, but also have an anonymous development team, which will not allow the government to control it.

It's possible, that's how bitcoin mixers are born, because there is a demand for it. But only the tough one are able to survived as of this time.

And for those who are thinking to be the next "Tornado Cash", they will just have to out think the government and to not get track somewhere in the world, caught off guard and now facing a jail time. Monero was smart to do that as developers made a fork recently that will make it harder to trace for privacy reason.

I think 0xMonero is a good alternative to Monero because 0xMR has smart contract functionality.

[zasad@]

Is that allowed?
https://cryptoslate.com/professor-re-uploads-tornado-cash-code-to-github-for-research-purposes/
"Professor re-uploads Tornado Cash code to GitHub for research purposes
A professor of Computer Science at Johns Hopkins University re-uploaded Tornado Cash and Tornado Nova source codes to GitHub, saying he has been using the code for teaching purposes."

[Tomohisa]

Is that allowed?
https://cryptoslate.com/professor-re-uploads-tornado-cash-code-to-github-for-research-purposes/
"Professor re-uploads Tornado Cash code to GitHub for research purposes
A professor of Computer Science at Johns Hopkins University re-uploaded Tornado Cash and Tornado Nova source codes to GitHub, saying he has been using the code for teaching purposes."

I think under the for teaching and research disclaim might let our dear professor scoot free from the sanction by the U.S. Government. Unless the government can proof it causes harm by simply observing the code which is just a bunch of combinations of 1 and 0.

[Abiky]

Is that allowed?
https://cryptoslate.com/professor-re-uploads-tornado-cash-code-to-github-for-research-purposes/
"Professor re-uploads Tornado Cash code to GitHub for research purposes
A professor of Computer Science at Johns Hopkins University re-uploaded Tornado Cash and Tornado Nova source codes to GitHub, saying he has been using the code for teaching purposes."

It's for educational purposes, so I don't see why the code can be re-uploaded in the first place. But that's up to the government to decide. I really am against censoring code, especially when the same represents freedom of speech. How you will use that code (either for legitimate or illegitimate purposes) depends entirely on you. Again, I believe the US should've sanctioned the individuals using Tornado.Cash for illicit purposes than the mixer protocol itself. Everything's messed up now, so I don't think developers will dare to make another privacy solution on ETH (or any other chain) ever again.

I hope crypto advocates and industry leaders stand up against the decision to censor the use of Tornado.Cash for the good of crypto/Blockchain tech. Coin Center mentioned it will be taking this to the court, so I think there may be light at the end of the tunnel after all. Just my thoughts