BITCOIN IS NOT A STORE OF VALUE

[NotATether]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n41GPPhLkhI&t=30s

Keeping in mind the most important factor, without gold and silver, all electronic equipment wouldn't exist = bitcoin would not exist. Computers, phones, tv's, etc ALL require silver and gold to be manufactured.

That's ridiculous. Gold and silver are good electrical conductors, and that's the only reason they are used in electronics. Bitcoin is not an element that's why you don't see any bitcoin in your electronic equipments.

The value of the quantity of gold and silver inside your device's is negligible, and for all practical purposes is much less than 1 mBTC.

[PSCQQSCQQP]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n41GPPhLkhI&t=30s

Keeping in mind the most important factor, without gold and silver, all electronic equipment wouldn't exist = bitcoin would not exist. Computers, phones, tv's, etc ALL require silver and gold to be manufactured.

That's ridiculous. Gold and silver are good electrical conductors, and that's the only reason they are used in electronics. Bitcoin is not an element that's why you don't see any bitcoin in your electronic equipments.

The value of the quantity of gold and silver inside your device's is negligible, and for all practical purposes is much less than 1 mBTC.

Worldwide, the ANNUAL manufacture of high-tech products (PCs, cell phones, tablet computers and other electronic and electrical devices) uses some $21 billion worth of gold and silver (320 tons and 7,500 tons, respectively).

What you're proposing is in fact, ridiculous. $21 billion/year isn't negligible. That's just in electronics alone, not counting all it's many other real world uses where it cannot ever be recovered once it's used. Once it's been put into electronics if those electronics are thrown away, the precious metals that were used in said electronics can never be recovered.

I just don't see how people can bother arguing about precious metals, they have and always will be stores of value that NOTHING man made will ever replace. They were here since the beginning of time, and will be here until the end of time. I'd like to see a person create something better than nature. It's yet to happen. I'll place my bets with nature as the winner, no contest. Keep living in fantasy land.

[NotATether]

Worldwide, the ANNUAL manufacture of high-tech products (PCs, cell phones, tablet computers and other electronic and electrical devices) uses some $21 billion worth of gold and silver (320 tons and 7,500 tons, respectively).

...that can NOT be recovered from the components unless you use hazardous metal extraction methods from the components such as liquefying them.

There's a reason why more end of life electronics end up in the landfill than in extraction laboratories. Because the cost to extract the gold from there is greater than the value of gold that is to be recovered. Besides it makes a lot of water pollution doing that anyway.

What you're proposing is in fact, ridiculous. $21 billion/year isn't negligible. That's just in electronics alone, not counting all it's many other real world uses where it cannot ever be recovered once it's used. Once it's been put into electronics if those electronics are thrown away, the precious metals that were used in said electronics can never be recovered.

And even you admit that they cannot be recovered. So why then, are people not using phones and PCs as a currency?   Because they have none of the properties of one, that's why.

PS. Gold can be confiscated!

Bitcoins cannot be confiscated!

Because they can be moved to a wallet whose private keys are owned by someone in another country.

So your point about gold being untraceable is irrelevant. I can simply CoinJoin my bitcoins and all traces will be broken.

You, on the other hand, can't CoinJoin your gold or silver, can you? No, because you can bet your bullions that they have serial numbers engraved on them.

[LegendaryK]

BTC is a trip to Vegas, sometimes you win, sometimes you go home with nothing.
People that only hold BTC never prosper, they just die and their coins get lost.

Not really sure what you mean, you're talking about gambling, investing in Bitcoin isn't a gambling, period.
Even Bitcoin price will dump 80% from the current ATH, you still have 20% in USD rate and you could sell it if you want, you're not lost everything.

Many early adopter who mine BTC in the early days are have good life and become a billionaire, the reason why their coins get lost is they think it's worthless so they didn't make any back up. Now when Bitcoin already worth for $20.000/each, many people already back up and tell their family about their private key.

Some people got rich , and do you know how,
they sold a large chunk , if not all of their bitcoins.

Dummies that keep holding, eventually die and their coins are lost, and they never prosper from bitcoin at all.
Most people won't share their private keys even with family, so coins are lost.

And if you can't see BTC is pure gambling, you are going to end up one of the people that go home with nothing.  
Vegas-Baby!

For those confused out there, their is no price fairy that guarantees the BTC price per coin won't go to zero.
If BTC devs keep ignoring the coming Government Proof of Waste mining bans, zero is the only price BTC will be worth.

[NotATether]

And if you can't see BTC is pure gambling, you are going to end up one of the people that go home with nothing.  

See, people like you are the reason prospective buyers have been warned by newspapers not to buy bitcoins in the early years, thus missing their chance to get free bitcoins, and are now busy making scammy altcoins that pump&dump investors in an attempt to make themselves rich.

And as long as you continue on that path, there will be ever more conmen making scamcoins just to get rich quick.

[LegendaryK]

And if you can't see BTC is pure gambling, you are going to end up one of the people that go home with nothing.  

See, people like you are the reason prospective buyers have been warned by newspapers not to buy bitcoins in the early years, thus missing their chance to get free bitcoins, and are now busy making scammy altcoins that pump&dump investors in an attempt to make rich.

And as long as you continue on that path, there will be ever more conmen making scamcoins just to get rich quick.

Bitcoin
Scam  √
GetRich Scheme √
Full of ConMen  √

So are you going to cover the losses of anyone that purchase btc at $60K, and it fell to $20K.
Since you want to be the fiat-btc price fairy.
If not , I guess that means you are one of the con-men.


 

FYI:
So are you going to cry fud when the World Governments all Ban PoW mining. 

[NotATether]

Bitcoin
Scam  √
GetRich Scheme √
Full of ConMen  √

So are you going to cover the losses of anyone that purchase btc at $60K, and it fell to $20K.
Since you want to be the fiat-btc price fairy.
If not , I guess that means you are one of the con-men.


 

FYI:
So are you going to cry fud when the World Governments all Ban PoW mining.  

I don't know what happened to you but looking at your previous posts here, you used to be make very rational arguments. But now you appear to be in complete "clown car" (to borrow a phrase from TECSHARE) mode. What the heck happened with you?

You know the bear market is only temporary, that bitcoin has recovered from every single price recession and has surpassed the peaks of previous halvening cycles even in current bear conditions, so why are you repeating the FUD of nocoiners?

I suggest you go buy some BTC before 4 years from now you wished you listened to my advice and bought some while it was still available for $20K...

I expected better from you.

[PSCQQSCQQP]

Worldwide, the ANNUAL manufacture of high-tech products (PCs, cell phones, tablet computers and other electronic and electrical devices) uses some $21 billion worth of gold and silver (320 tons and 7,500 tons, respectively).

...that can NOT be recovered from the components unless you use hazardous metal extraction methods from the components such as liquefying them.

There's a reason why more end of life electronics end up in the landfill than in extraction laboratories. Because the cost to extract the gold from there is greater than the value of gold that is to be recovered. Besides it makes a lot of water pollution doing that anyway.

What you're proposing is in fact, ridiculous. $21 billion/year isn't negligible. That's just in electronics alone, not counting all it's many other real world uses where it cannot ever be recovered once it's used. Once it's been put into electronics if those electronics are thrown away, the precious metals that were used in said electronics can never be recovered.

And even you admit that they cannot be recovered. So why then, are people not using phones and PCs as a currency?   Because they have none of the properties of one, that's why.

PS. cutive_Order_6102]Gold can be confiscated!

Bitcoins cannot be confiscated!

Because they can be moved to a wallet whose private keys are owned by someone in another country.

So your point about gold being untraceable is irrelevant. I can simply CoinJoin my bitcoins and all traces will be broken.

You, on the other hand, can't CoinJoin your gold or silver, can you? No, because you can bet your bullions that they have serial numbers engraved on them.

People generally sell broken phones and computers and other electronics for parts, ebay is a prime example. In many cases people save the broken PCB's to extract the precious metals...

Gold has never been actually physically taken from citizens here in the USA, and even if they tried, people can come up with alot more creative ways of hiding them that make it not worth it for the government to even try...

Bitcoin can in fact be seized, if hackers can steal it, then the government can steal it... with alot more ease than physically trying to find someones precious metals....
https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2022/04/22/seized-silk-road-bitcoin-to-clear-ross-ulbrichts-183-million-debt/

Bitcoin is on a public ledger, even if you coinjoin or mixed, chainalysis can work with law enforcement and seize them... You're not really hiding anything, your obfuscating, and they can easily figure that out.

As a matter of fact, you're a genius... if only humans invented this thing called a smelter to melt precious metals down so there wouldn't be any serial numbers.... Cmon bro, what are you like 12?

[franky1]

1. control your own keys = security
    custodian your value = risk..

he used the mtgox(custodian) which is nothing to do with using your own key security.. so first fail on him not understanding bitcoin principles

2. 'stable of price' is not the same as 'store of value'..  price and value are not the same number/thing

so second fail on him not understanding bitcoin . and first fail on not understanding economics

3. he thinks more retailers accept gold as payment than bitcoin. not true
i guy food, gadgets, and other daily lifestyle stuff in bitcoin, yet those same retailers wont accept gold

4. as for gold.. he claims bitcoin seizures are more common than gold
governments seize more gold than bitcoin per year
lets take india. it seized 9.8billion RS of gold in 2019 ($128m)
but india has not seized >$128m in btc
india reported in 2019 they seized less than $2m of bitcoin (60x less)

[LegendaryK]

Bitcoin
Scam  √
GetRich Scheme √
Full of ConMen  √

So are you going to cover the losses of anyone that purchase btc at $60K, and it fell to $20K.
Since you want to be the fiat-btc price fairy.
If not , I guess that means you are one of the con-men.


 

FYI:
So are you going to cry fud when the World Governments all Ban PoW mining.  

I don't know what happened to you but looking at your previous posts here, you used to be make very rational arguments. But now you appear to be in complete "clown car" (to borrow a phrase from TECSHARE) mode. What the heck happened with you?

You know the bear market is only temporary, that bitcoin has recovered from every single price recession and has surpassed the peaks of previous halvening cycles even in current bear conditions, so why are you repeating the FUD of nocoiners?

I suggest you go buy some BTC before 4 years from now you wished you listened to my advice and bought some while it was still available for $20K...

I expected better from you.

Vacation time,  

What you don't know:
Baby Boomers are cashing out to US$,
this means,
Past Performance is No Guarantee of Future Earnings.
Also the so called army of btc holders is going to get absolutely crushed by the inflation of energy & food costs, and it will get worse for the next few years.
Selling of BTC is going to be far below the energy cost to mine it.
As one analyst put it, Bitcoin is nothing more than a dumpster fire in the coming environment.
BTC PoW mining will be banned worldwide within ~2½ years,
because the people are going to raise ever lovin cane about btc miners driving up energy rates when the people rate is going to triple.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but the demographic /financial / energy / food collapses are all just starting and Proof of Work is just too flawed to survive it.
The abundance of the past is over, now begins the time of hardships, and struggles such as your generations has never known.
It sucks, but the time of abundance is up.  

I expect nothing from you, so save your moral pretense for those dumb enough to hold btc to zero.

FYI:
Start a Garden, if you want to Live, because Winter is Coming, and she is going to be a real bitch from now on.

[KaliLinux]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n41GPPhLkhI&t=30s

Keeping in mind the most important factor, without gold and silver, all electronic equipment wouldn't exist = bitcoin would not exist. Computers, phones, tv's, etc ALL require silver and gold to be manufactured.

Here we go again. Just FYI, everything in life happens for a reason and is all connected or interconnected to each other's development. If humans didn't exist then... I guess you know the rest. It is because we existed every other thing that will aid human existence existed and this view of Gold and Silver being used to develop whatever assisted in Bitcoin creation does not take away what Bitcoin is and as far as I am concerned, there is no correlation in this.

[NotATether]

People generally sell broken phones and computers and other electronics for parts, ebay is a prime example. In many cases people save the broken PCB's to extract the precious metals...

That is completely different from "selling random objects for broken phone parts". Broken phone parts are not a currency or a store of value (and it would take a fool to believe that).

Gold has never been actually physically taken from citizens here in the USA, and even if they tried, people can come up with alot more creative ways of hiding them that make it not worth it for the government to even try...

Now you are just straight-up lying.

The circumstances of the case were that a New York attorney named Frederick Barber Campbell had one deposit at Chase National Bank of over 5,000 troy ounces (160 kg) of gold. When Campbell attempted to withdraw the gold, Chase refused, and Campbell sued Chase. A federal prosecutor then indicted Campbell on the following day (September 27, 1933) for failing to surrender his gold.[12] Ultimately, the prosecution of Campbell failed, but the authority of the federal government to seize gold was upheld, and Campbell's gold was confiscated.

...

Gus Farber, a diamond and jewelry merchant from San Francisco, was prosecuted for the sale of thirteen $20 gold coins without a license. Secret Service agents discovered the sale with the help of the buyer. Farber, his father, and 12 others were arrested in four American cities after a sting operation conducted by the Secret Service. The arrests took place simultaneously in New York and three California cities: San Francisco, San Jose, and Oakland. Morris Anolik was arrested in New York with $5,000 in U.S. and foreign gold coins; Dan Levin and Edward Friedman of San Jose were arrested with $15,000 in gold; Sam Nankin was arrested in Oakland; in San Francisco, nine men were arrested on charges of hoarding gold. In all, $24,000 in gold was seized by Secret Service Agents during the operation.[13]

David Baraban and his son Jacob owned a refining company. The Barabans' license to deal in unmelted scrap gold was revoked and so the Barabans operated their refining business under a license issued to a Minnie Sarch. The Barabans admitted that Minnie Sarch had nothing to do with the business and that she had obtained the license so that the Barabans could continue to deal in gold. The Barabans had a cigar box full of gold-filled scrap jewelry visible in one of the showcases. Government agents raided the Barabans' business and found another hidden box of US and foreign gold coins. The coins were seized and Baraban was charged with conspiracy to defraud the United States.[14]

Louis Ruffino was one individual indicted on three counts purporting to violations of the Trading with the Enemy Act of 1917, which restricted trade with countries hostile to the United States. Eventually, Ruffino appealed[15] the conviction to the Circuit Court of Appeals 9th District in 1940; however, the judgment of the lower courts was upheld based on the President's executive orders and the Gold Reserve Act of 1934. Ruffino, a resident of Sutter Creek in California-gold country, was convicted of possessing 78 ounces of gold and was sentenced to 6 months in jail, paid a $500 fine, and had his gold seized.[16]

Foreigners also had gold confiscated and were forced to accept paper money for their gold. The Uebersee Finanz-Korporation, a Swiss banking company, had $1,250,000 in gold coins for business use. The Uebersee Finanz-Korporation entrusted the gold to an American firm for safekeeping, and the Swiss were shocked to find that their gold was confiscated. The Swiss made appeals, but they were denied; they were entitled to paper money but not their gold. The Swiss company would have lost 40% of their gold's value if they had tried to buy the same amount of gold with the paper money that they received in exchange for their confiscated gold.[17]

Here is at least five instances of gold being seized from their rightful owners. Just because their government could. How are you going to react to this, pull an Alex Jones and declare Wikipedia to be a conspiracy theory?

Bitcoin can in fact be seized, if hackers can steal it, then the government can steal it... with alot more ease than physically trying to find someones precious metals....
https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2022/04/22/seized-silk-road-bitcoin-to-clear-ross-ulbrichts-183-million-debt/

Bitcoin is on a public ledger, even if you coinjoin or mixed, chainalysis can work with law enforcement and seize them... You're not really hiding anything, your obfuscating, and they can easily figure that out.

Bitcoin can only be seized if you reveal the private key to the would-be seizers.

The fact is, law enforcement and hackers alike cannot brute force even a 160-bit address. They will never be able to brute-force a 256-bit private key even if they turned the sun into a Dyson sphere.

You are always welcome to ask law enforcement and Chainalysis to crack Satoshi's private key at https://www.blockchain.com/btc/address/1A1zP1eP5QGefi2DMPTfTL5SLmv7DivfNa, they would be very happy to seize the coins (but they will never be able to because they will never find the private key with "chain analysis").

As a matter of fact, you're a genius... if only humans invented this thing called a smelter to melt precious metals down so there wouldn't be any serial numbers.... Cmon bro, what are you like 12?

22. And something tells me that you are the one acting like a 12yro around here, because although I have not found any references citing this as a crime, you are entering into grey territory by melting the serial numbers off, putting a big target on your head by the government. Imagine trying to move that gold around, and customs see it.

Nobody would take that risk, especially since there is a less suspicious way of doing that (Bitcoin). Which, despite all your rambling about chainalysis, the truth is that they can not identify a single bitcoin trail until it reaches a KYC exchange. They can only label an ID on them (and even my little C++ Turing-complete programs can do that).

[franky1]

BTC PoW mining will be banned worldwide within ~2½ years,
because the people are going to raise ever lovin cane about btc miners driving up energy rates when the people rate is going to triple.

try to do some math
work out the KWH of a electric car doing just 20miles a day(normal use)
multiply that by how many cars need to be electric soon

then realise that cars would require MORE electric than bitcoin mining industry
..
the bitcoin asics are getting far better at efficiency than an electric car can get
in the 8 years (2014-2022) of asics.
going from a 3.25kw GPU rack of a couple GHASH
to a asic of 3.25KW achieving ~158,000Ghash. in just 8 years
is alot better then the car batters 5% more efficient per generation/year

over the last year alone bitcoin hashrate has remained around the 200exa amount
but the electric has changed from about 80thash for 3.25kwh
to be ~158thash for 3.25  (~255 for 5.3)

meaning HALF the amount of electric, less amount of physical asics to still have 210exa network

math and a calculator are far more superior than a article/youtube video with bias

[LegendaryK]

BTC PoW mining will be banned worldwide within ~2½ years,
because the people are going to raise ever lovin cane about btc miners driving up energy rates when the people rate is going to triple.

try to do some math
work out the KWH of a electric car doing just 20miles a day(normal use)

1. The energy infrastructure can't support all cars being electric, so just forget that from happening.
2. The worldwide PoW ban is coming , no matter what fantasies you have in your head.

Pretending the entire world energy output is on a single grid is one of the delusions you should part with.

Pay attention:
The time of abundance is over, this means less energy , less finance, less food, and a lot less people.
Proof of Waste can't survive except in a time of abundance.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/aug/24/macron-warns-of-end-of-abundance-as-france-faces-difficult-winter

FYI:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-08-26/here-s-what-europe-is-doing-to-reduce-energy-consumption-for-winter#xj4y7vzkg
https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/egypts-cabinet-approves-plan-ration-electricity-save-gas-export-2022-08-11/
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/aug/15/kosovo-stops-import-of-electricity-and-begins-energy-rationing
https://time.com/6209272/europes-energy-crisis-getting-worse/
https://www.france24.com/en/europe/20220829-french-pm-says-companies-may-face-energy-rationing-this-winter
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/08/23/china-is-facing-another-power-crunch-but-this-time-its-likely-to-be-different.html
https://slate.com/technology/2022/07/texas-power-grid-electricity-ercot-abbott-heat.html

Ignoring the energy supply problem, will not make it go away.
PoW mining will be banned to save as many people from dying as possible from the harsh winters and burning summers that are coming.


You think, Governments are going to turn off lights, & shut down industries,
but allow BTC PoW mining to draw down the ever decreasing energy resources 24x7.
Wake up, the people will go burn down the PoW mining warehouses for heat before that happens.

[Dunamisx]

Snipped

For goodness sake how does this have something in common with bitcoin discussion, i think the rate of trolling newbies are ever increasing these days on bitcoin discussion, especially during this dip period, maybe that's one of the reasons to the increase, I checked the bitcoin discussion board to discover lot of threads talking shits about bitcoin here and there which i think most of them will definitely end up locked by the moderator and members will place such users on ignore list.

[Rizzrack]

try to do some math
work out the KWH of a electric car doing just 20miles a day(normal use)
multiply that by how many cars need to be electric soon

then realise that cars would require MORE electric than bitcoin mining industry

Fun fact:

World's electricity consumption in 2019: 23,900 TWh = 23,900,000,000 KWh
Estimated number of cars in 2019: 1.4 billion = 1,400,000,000

If we assume (exaggerate) that each car will have a battery of 40KWh and will have 200km autonomy and driving just 20km per day (12.5 miles) that means they would need 56,000 TWh EVERY 10 DAYS !
So 2,016,000 TWh per year. That's over 84X the current TOTAL electric consumption JUST from cars alone.

BTC consumes an estimated 127 TWh per year.

We've got 99 problems but crypto mining ain't one !

Keeping in mind the most important factor, without gold and silver, all electronic equipment wouldn't exist

They can just develop some new alloy materials to replace them. Expensive to R&D but probably cheaper in the long run !

[ChiBitCTy]

That’s simply not true that all electronics require either silver or gold to operate. If it was true, everything would be a lot more expensive than it is right now. Of course there are certainly a good bit of electronics that do, but it’s just a big exaggeration saying all do. Bitcoin is on its way to becoming a store of value in my opinion, and that’s not just going to happen over night. It’s going to take time.

[PSCQQSCQQP]

Time and experience will show you people.

You think the governments don't know or understand whats going on?

Why would they hoard precious metals and auction bitcoin, you think they are in the dark on this or you people on these forums are somehow more educated and intelligent than the people running the show from behind the scenes?

You all have a rude awakening coming.

IF bitcoin is a store of value, why doesn't the government hoard it for themselves, you think the people working at the NSA don't understand bitcoin?... it's their hashing algorithm. What about the news media outlets telling the general public it was only used by criminals and the government can't track it... Tell me how quickly you people let go of that delusion when the AML/KYC laws came home to roost.

All I see on these forums is a shared delusion for a 14 year old man-made invention. Likely perpetuated by the fact that 99.999% of people here have a vested interest in bitcoin/crypto-currency.

You would think that after every economic collapse people would be able to figure out that they will never beat the government, or their plans. Gold has and always will be part of their plan. bitcoin on the other hand, they will seize yours, then auction it off. They won't do that with gold.

Hard asset: Gold - 6000+ years and counting. Governments cannot stop it, so they hoard it instead.
Empty space: Bitcoin - 14 years with too many flaws to count. Governments can regulate it to death.

Yeah, bitcoin is about to get it's baby teeth knocked out by reality.

- Power failure = no bitcoin.
- Power costs get too high to sustain infrastructure = no bitcoin.
- Internet outage = no bitcoin.
- No electronic device = no bitcoin.
- Miners don't accept transaction = no bitcoin.
- You lose your income to pay for electric, internet, phone service = no bitcoin.
- Government takes over any of these major things = no bitcoin.

Let's see it remain a "store of value" if any of these things happens. Gold works regardless of all these things, that cannot be controlled.

Not to mention how many cyber threats that lurk in the shadows that you are oblivious to, what if a foreign nation hacks our power grid and shuts everything down, or a terrorist attack that knocks out electronic devices. It wouldn't take much to take out a large portion of the US.... How will you transact then?

bitcoin is fragile, and relies on so many other things to be able to function. Gold is just there, as it always has been, waiting to prove you wrong.

Too many things can go wrong with bitcoin, check Murphy's Law.

As the world goes into an economic collapse even more you think that's going to be sustained?
By what, your hopes and dreams? You gonna force the people that have no clue about what bitcoin is to use it?

I don't need to explain gold or silver to anyone because everyone already knows what they are.

[pooya87]

BTC is shit

And yet it didn't stop you scammers from creating an exact copy of it, add a premine and sell it to idiots who were fooled by the Scammer Supreme CSW.

P.S. Interesting how this topic brought 2 of the old cockroaches of this forum out of their holes.

~

[NotATether]

You think the governments don't know or understand whats going on?

Why would they hoard precious metals and auction bitcoin, you think they are in the dark on this or you people on these forums are somehow more educated and intelligent than the people running the show from behind the scenes?

Most governments are dinosaurs when it comes to technology, the US government is no exception.

Governments do not know the economics about cryptos and the only knowledge pertaining to them that they have is from their crypto specialists, who are more knowledgeable about how to trace crypto owners than how it actually works:

IF bitcoin is a store of value, why doesn't the government hoard it for themselves, you think the people working at the NSA don't understand bitcoin?... it's their hashing algorithm. What about the news media outlets telling the general public it was only used by criminals and the government can't track it... Tell me how quickly you people let go of that delusion when the AML/KYC laws came home to roost.

Same reason why Tesla dumped their cache - because they need hard cash for liquidity, nobody there will accept payment on Bitcoin.

News media outlets writing about crypto are written usually by uneducated and uninformed people who have no knowledge of cryptocurrency economics.

All I see on these forums is a shared delusion for a 14 year old man-made invention. Likely perpetuated by the fact that 99.999% of people here have a vested interest in bitcoin/crypto-currency.

Sure we do. Most of us own bitcoin because we believe in its economic principles. You can mock and ridicule us now, but you will be the one shaking your head when Bitcoin's price moons again and you missed out on it (for the $1 trillion market cap is the not the peak of its market adoption).

Hard asset: Gold - 6000+ years and counting. Governments cannot stop it, so they hoard it instead.
Empty space: Bitcoin - 14 years with too many flaws to count. Governments can regulate it to death.

Gold is most used by governments as collateral against loans to other governments. Because hey do not want to deal with Bitcoin's (current) volatility for loans, that is understandable.

Yeah, bitcoin is about to get it's baby teeth knocked out by reality.

- Power failure = no bitcoin.
- Power costs get too high to sustain infrastructure = no bitcoin.
- Internet outage = no bitcoin.
- No electronic device = no bitcoin.
- Miners don't accept transaction = no bitcoin.
- You lose your income to pay for electric, internet, phone service = no bitcoin.
- Government takes over any of these major things = no bitcoin.

You conveniently ignore the fact that I have refuted your non-confiscation claim about Gold:

- Government sends a warrant against you = no gold, bitcoin, or any other asset.

Besides, we are going to a future where everybody in the world has access to electricity and the internet (Bitcoin cannot be censored). So Bitcoin was literally created for the future.

Gold is a thing of the past, used only by lenders, and dinosaurs who are unable to appreciate the profound implications of bitcoin (like Peter Schiff and you).

You see Ukraine's internet being controlled by Russia, is bitcoin dying there? No.

What about in Afghanistan, where crypto is banned there? No.

China? No.

Russia? Hell no...

bitcoin is fragile, and relies on so many other things to be able to function. Gold is just there, as it always has been, waiting to prove you wrong.

And gold depends on whether people are willing to sell it to you (custodial wallets do not count since it's not even your gold). It's a closed circle of adoption.

As the world goes into an economic collapse even more you think that's going to be sustained?
By what, your hopes and dreams? You gonna force the people that have no clue about what bitcoin is to use it?

I can do this all day with you. If you are on a tight schedule because you are in a rush to go find a fallout shelter to save yourself from an imaginary collapse, then that's on you. 99.99% of other people do not share your opinion about economic collapse.