[Updated] FTX

[DanWalker]

Also, if Sam wins this court case, what would happen to Caroline and the Chinese quant Wang who might presently be sharing confidential information.

I don't think he has the slightest chance of winning the case, what he should be thinking about is how many years he will spend in prison when the collapse of FTX is considered the biggest fraud in US history.

The trial started today, and one of the news I heard was that it took them a day to pick a jury for this trial. An interesting thing is that these jurors are all people who know nothing about cryptocurrency. The reason given to explain this issue is to have fairness in the trial process, without bias. This has caused some mixed opinions.
https://www.businessinsider.in/tech/news/sam-bankman-fried-trial-potential-juror-dismissed-after-saying-he-cant-be-unbiased-given-everything-negative-he-heard-about-crypto/amp_articleshow/104141095.cms

It is ridiculous that the SBF does not want to admit fault for this problem,

Once the trial begins and if we have enough evidence to send him to jail, it won't matter whether he wants to plead guilty or not. His fate is no longer in his hands anymore.

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[UmerIdrees]

Yes which would make everyone assume that Sam Bankrupt-Fried would also plead guilty to also be allowed to settle and get a lighter sentence. However, what does Sam know which does not make him want to plead guilty? Does this imply that if he pleads guilty he might be forced to share confidential information that should never be share? This is very headshaking unless Sam has become crazy and he thinks he is innocent hehehehe.

Also, if Sam wins this court case, what would happen to Caroline and the Chinese quant Wang who might presently be sharing confidential information.

I do not care who wins the case or who will lose this case, my only concern is what will happen to our funds stuck at FTX and whether will we ever be able to recover them. This is a big question which is not addressed by anyone, not even the court of law.

Also, this is strange that the court and everyone is more interested in giving punishment or bail to the SAM but no one really cares for those who have lost their life savings there on the FTX exchange. Though it is also people's fault to keep money at exchanges but still some people have a high trading volume and the money stays in exchange if you are in any future trade.

[JayJuanGee]

It is ridiculous that the SBF does not want to admit fault for this problem,

Once the trial begins and if we have enough evidence to send him to jail, it won't matter whether he wants to plead guilty or not. His fate is no longer in his hands anymore.

SBF might not be favored very much by pleaing.. and there are some small chances that he could hang the jury or something like that, but there are still other charges that are outstanding.. ... so it is difficult to imagine any scenario in which he does not get at least 5-10 years.. would really be some long shot kinds of scenarios, and perhaps his going to trial is an attempt to shoot at those long shot scenarios.. even though he is likely using other people's money for the cost of the trial.. but that's another matter... remember at one point, he said that he ONLY had like $100k in his bank account.. another one of his lies.

Yes which would make everyone assume that Sam Bankrupt-Fried would also plead guilty to also be allowed to settle and get a lighter sentence. However, what does Sam know which does not make him want to plead guilty? Does this imply that if he pleads guilty he might be forced to share confidential information that should never be share? This is very headshaking unless Sam has become crazy and he thinks he is innocent hehehehe.

Also, if Sam wins this court case, what would happen to Caroline and the Chinese quant Wang who might presently be sharing confidential information.

I do not care who wins the case or who will lose this case, my only concern is what will happen to our funds stuck at FTX and whether will we ever be able to recover them. This is a big question which is not addressed by anyone, not even the court of law.

Also, this is strange that the court and everyone is more interested in giving punishment or bail to the SAM but no one really cares for those who have lost their life savings there on the FTX exchange. Though it is also people's fault to keep money at exchanges but still some people have a high trading volume and the money stays in exchange if you are in any future trade.

You sound mixed up UmerIdrees.

There are various kinds of proceedings, and yeah, there is no one stop place for justice, and sometimes justice is not meted out..

The criminal trial does go personally after Sam because that is the general nature of a criminal trial.. sometimes there could be orders of restitution for victims.. but there surely needs to be found evidence of guilt first before the trial would go into the damages phase (whether that is ONLY sentencing or if their might be ways in which restitution could come from Sam to the extent to which funds/property can be found and attributable to him).

[Raflesia]

SBF is threatened with 115 years in prison as stated by @Watch.guru.

The hearing resumed but I was quite strange with the reasoning by the lawyer from SBF where SBF's lawyer argued that his client never intended to steal customers' money and claimed that SBF was just overwhelmed with the speed of growth of its two businesses.
I as a layman don't really accept this argument because after all when it commits a conscious act of taking customer funds it must have known that it was wrong and it was stealing but the lawyer said it didn't intend to do so which makes me a bit ambiguous because logically there is no way it would take more than $10 billion in customer funds just because of the element of accident.

Bankman-Fried took more than $10 billion out of FTX to pay its sister company Alameda Research's debts in May and June of 2022

On the other hand, claiming to be overwhelmed by the growth of the business shows that he was not able to manage well and could not calculate the plan from the beginning of his business (because he played too many games) as expressed by his former employees in a long thread on twitter (X) then why do several businesses if you can't manage them well.

The lawyer's reasoning honestly makes me a little sick of the current drama and defence of SBF.

[Ryu_Ar1]

It is ridiculous that the SBF does not want to admit fault for this problem,

Once the trial begins and if we have enough evidence to send him to jail, it won't matter whether he wants to plead guilty or not. His fate is no longer in his hands anymore.

SBF might not be favored very much by pleaing.. and there are some small chances that he could hang the jury or something like that, but there are still other charges that are outstanding.. ... so it is difficult to imagine any scenario in which he does not get at least 5-10 years.. would really be some long shot kinds of scenarios, and perhaps his going to trial is an attempt to shoot at those long shot scenarios.. even though he is likely using other people's money for the cost of the trial.. but that's another matter... remember at one point, he said that he ONLY had like $100k in his bank account.. another one of his lies.

Actually in this condition I do not really like to see trials with the common law legal system because I prefer to see civil law which in my opinion is more applicable especially for SBF cases but when it comes to SBF and USA cases, it is definitely common law that will be used with the jury as one of the reinforcements even though it is the judge who has the decision.
On the other hand, looking at the scope of the current 12 jurors if you look at their background, they do not have any background in crypto so this will clearly confuse them so that this could be an advantage for SBF in his trial even though indeed with some facts that have been spread such as he was proven to take advantage of FTX for his own interests, it is enough to be used as one of the irrefutable evidence but this could also be reversed.
However, if this is just a long term scenario as you say, then it is likely that this case will drag on even though it would be better for him to stay in jail for a long time.

[BABY SHOES]

The hearing resumed but I was quite strange with the reasoning by the lawyer from SBF where SBF's lawyer argued that his client never intended to steal customers' money and claimed that SBF was just overwhelmed with the speed of growth of its two businesses.
I as a layman don't really accept this argument because after all when it commits a conscious act of taking customer funds it must have known that it was wrong and it was stealing but the lawyer said it didn't intend to do so which makes me a bit ambiguous because logically there is no way it would take more than $10 billion in customer funds just because of the element of accident.

The US government has said that SBF is a crypto empire built on lies or to enrich itself no wonder it is evasive but prosecutors have insisted that SBF is guilty as charged and this will be proven in court.

According to the prosecutors the US government has gone after the two jets that resulted from this scam, this will reveal even more as he has stolen billions of dollars and luxury goods.

Hopefully he will be proven wrong because he will be imprisoned for more than 100 years.

He could spend over 100 years in prison if convicted.

The lawyer's reasoning honestly makes me a little sick of the current drama and defence of SBF.

That SBF lawyer is on the payroll of course he will defend his client to the hilt. Lol

[JayJuanGee]

It is ridiculous that the SBF does not want to admit fault for this problem,

Once the trial begins and if we have enough evidence to send him to jail, it won't matter whether he wants to plead guilty or not. His fate is no longer in his hands anymore.

SBF might not be favored very much by pleaing.. and there are some small chances that he could hang the jury or something like that, but there are still other charges that are outstanding.. ... so it is difficult to imagine any scenario in which he does not get at least 5-10 years.. would really be some long shot kinds of scenarios, and perhaps his going to trial is an attempt to shoot at those long shot scenarios.. even though he is likely using other people's money for the cost of the trial.. but that's another matter... remember at one point, he said that he ONLY had like $100k in his bank account.. another one of his lies.

Actually in this condition I do not really like to see trials with the common law legal system because I prefer to see civil law which in my opinion is more applicable especially for SBF cases but when it comes to SBF and USA cases, it is definitely common law that will be used with the jury as one of the reinforcements even though it is the judge who has the decision.
On the other hand, looking at the scope of the current 12 jurors if you look at their background, they do not have any background in crypto so this will clearly confuse them so that this could be an advantage for SBF in his trial even though indeed with some facts that have been spread such as he was proven to take advantage of FTX for his own interests, it is enough to be used as one of the irrefutable evidence but this could also be reversed.
However, if this is just a long term scenario as you say, then it is likely that this case will drag on even though it would be better for him to stay in jail for a long time.

I am not sure how fruitful it might be to get into discussions of common law versus civil law because SBF is currently being tried in the USA.. so sure, it seems best to attempt to figure out what is the system in which he is being tried, and you are suggesting that the judge is in charge, and I am not sure if you understand the role that the jury plays.. yet I think that we can say that the jury and judge have powers in various kinds of ways, but in some senses, juries can engage in kinds of behaviors that the judge cannot stop.. both in terms of their determination of facts and their ability to sometimes be able to nullify laws (which doesn't happen too often).. so I suppose that I am just quibbling with your trying to suggest that the judge can still decide certain matters opposite to what the jury finds.

Pretty much the judge instructs the jury in regards to what is the applicable law, and when it comes time for the jury to make certain decisions regarding some of the facts, the judge cannot overrule the jury.. so sometimes the jury can end up nullifying the law based on their factual findings... and the judge would most likely not be able to do anything about that, absent some kinds of unusual circumstances.

The judge might instruct the jury that this allegation number 1 needs to show criminal intent to use client funds and it needs to show conduct of the defendant that led to negative consequences of the funds getting lost.. but then he might say that allegation number 2 has all the same elements as allegation number 1, but intent does not need to be shown.  Juries are supposed to be following the judge's instructions in terms of finding the elements of the crime, and if they don't find intent in allegation 1, the judge cannot tell them that they are wrong and make them go back and rethink the matter, even if he believes differently about the evidence in the case.  And if the jurors are spending time talking about intent in element 2, the judge might re-instruct them that they do not need to consider intent in terms of allegation 2 because it is not required in order for there to be a violation of the law... Maybe my examples are not very great, yet I am just making the point that the jury can sometimes even purposefully defy what the judge says or wants, especially if they make sure that they are expressing what they are doing in terms of finding facts.

Whether it is good or not may be another story.. it is what it is in terms of the system in which Sam is being tried, currently and the system  under which he may or may not get convicted.. and sure there is quite a bit that needs to happen yet prior to his actually getting convicted, and in the meantime, it still seems that he is spending his time in jail during the trial... even though I would imagine there is quite a bit of times that attorneys are getting access to him while he is "in custody" but he surely does not have the kinds of liberties that he would have if he was not "in custody" during the trial.

The lawyer's reasoning honestly makes me a little sick of the current drama and defence of SBF.

That SBF lawyer is on the payroll of course he will defend his client to the hilt. Lol

SBF's lawyers have legal duties to argue vociferously for SBF.  They could get charged with malpractice if they do not make as many strong and good arguments as they are able to make, even if they are favoring certain facts over other facts and presenting matters in the best light for SBF... and yeah, it goes to show that they don't have a lot to work for if they are not able to present very convincing arguments... based on more and more facts that are likely to ongoingly come out during the trial.. especially if the trial goes the full length, we might be hearing quite a bit of dirt, and even continuing to hear a decent amount of surprising and/or shocking drama in the process.

[JeromeTash]

I don't know if anyone shared this here but just as we think we have seen it all, and then a witness in Sam Bankman-Fried's trial, a former FTX developer, Adam Yedidia comes out and says that he resigned from FTX after finding out Alameda Research used stolen customer funds to repay loans.
More reading: https://watcher.guru/news/ex-ftx-developer-discloses-8b-discrepancy-during-trial

I mean, where was he to talk about this before the disaster happened? This case is filled up with drama left, right and central 

[Rikafip]

I mean, where was he to talk about this before the disaster happened?

He was probably too busy enjoying the severance pay so he couldn't warn anyone about what's going on in FTX.  


In other news regarding the ongoing trial, FTX Co-Founder and SBF's good buddy Gary Wang said that Alameda was allowed to withdraw the unlimited amount of money from FTX. Seeing how things are developing, I really don't see how will SBF avoid long term sentence. Then again, if OJ managed to get acquitted, anything is possible.  

According to reports from Inner City Press, Wang addressed the courtroom on Oct. 5 following testimony from former FTX developer Adam Yedidia and Paradigm co-founder Matt Huang. The former chief technology officer reportedly admitted to committing crimes during his time at FTX with the help of Bankman-Fried, former Alameda Research CEO Caroline Ellison and former FTX engineering director Nishad Singh.

“We allowed Alameda to withdraw unlimited funds,” said Wang in response to questioning from Assistant United States Attorney Danielle Sassoon.

[bbc.reporter]

These are statements made by Sam's Chinese quant Gary Wang when the quant was questioned on the witness stand. It is more than 3 pages and some of the statements might not anymore be shocking because we know the news, however, this is still very head shaking on how all of these have occured. Why is this not on show everywhere similar to the court trial Johnny Depp vs. Amber Heard?

https://twitter.com/wagieeacc/status/1710559548094771301

[FatFork]

According to BitMex Research, FTX used a random number function to generate the insurance fund it published to the public:


https://x.com/BitMEXResearch/status/1710739315611877533?s=20

FTX exchange supposedly used fake information for the insurance fund it showed to the public, which gave a false impression of its real value. At the same time, FTX's former CTO, Gary Wang, testified against FTX's insurance fund and admitted that the displayed figure on FTX's platform was completely fake.

source

[bbc.reporter]

@FatFork. This is really very head shaking because these new information being discovered and shared make it appear that FTX was created as a criminal operation from the beginning. It is also strange that Sam Tabasco's name is not mentioned anywhere in the Chinese quant's testimony. Is Tabasco being protected? What does he know? Why is he not called as a witness?

In any case, Caroline Ellison will be on the witness stand this week. I am quite certain this will be another head shaking time of discoveries.

[Rikafip]

In any case, Caroline Ellison will be on the witness stand this week. I am quite certain this will be another head shaking time of discoveries.

She was on the stand today, and she just confirmed what people suspected. I am really curious to see how will SBF try to minimze his involvement in all this as he keeps saying that he is innocent.

Here are some excerpts, pay attention to bold part.

AUSA Sassoon: How do you know the defendant?
Ellison: At Jane Street then Alameda. We dated for a couple of years.
AUSA: Did you commit crimes?
Ellison: Fraud.
AUSA: With others?
Ellison: Yes.
AUSA: Do you see Sam Bankman-Fried?
Ellison: He's over there...
AUSA: What was his involvement in the crimes?
Ellison: He was the head of Alameda then FTX. He directed me to commit these crimes.
AUSA: What makes you guilty?
Ellison: Alameda took several billions of dollars from FTX customers and used it for investments.
AUSA: What was the defendant's role?
Ellison: He set up the systems and told us to take the money.
AUSA: How much did Alameda take to repay its lenders?
Ellison: In the ballpark of $10 billion. Ultimately around $14 billion
AUSA: How did you defraud Alameda's lenders?
Ellison: I sent balance sheets that made Alameda look less risky that it was.
AUSA: Why was there not enough money for customers in Nov 2022?
Ellison: We had take it to repay lenders.
AUSA: Once you were at Alameda, and you discovered losses, what did the defendant tell you?
Ellison: That he was sorry and would tell me more.
AUSA: Did your relationship remain strictly professional?
Ellison: No.
Ellison: We started sleeping together on and off in the summer of 2020. We dated and broke up.
AUSA: What did the defendant tell you about his ambitions?
Ellison: That he would be President.
AUSA: Of what?
Ellison: The United States

https://twitter.com/innercitypress/status/1711783668971188355

I am quite certain this will be another head shaking time of discoveries.

Here's one for you: our boy SBF planned to be a president of US. 

[bbc.reporter]

@Rikafip. I am very skeptical that sweet Caroline has stopped supporting Sam. I reckon from that testimony it appears that Caroline is being told or already has a plan to make Sam appear insane so Sam can plead insanity or temporary insanity caused by Adderall and avoid time in prison if he is charged guilty.

Sam and Caroline were lovers and on a psychological level, sweet Caroline is not very beautiful and the attention from a man she might have only felt from Sam. Her loyalty to him might be very deep hehehehee.

[Rikafip]

I am very skeptical that sweet Caroline has stopped supporting Sam. I reckon from that testimony it appears that Caroline is being told or already has a plan to make Sam appear insane so Sam can plead insanity or temporary insanity caused by Adderall and avoid time in prison if he is charged guilty.

I really don't see on what you are basing that, especially since he still claims that he is not guilty and I don't hink that jury will buy insanrity defense even if he tries (which I don't think he will).

Sam and Caroline were lovers and on a psychological level, sweet Caroline is not very beautiful and the attention from a man she might have only felt from Sam. Her loyalty to him might be very deep hehehehee.

You see them as a Bonnie & Clyde type of lovers but from what I read about their relationship, it wasn't like that at all. Allegedly, he was embarrased by her and didn't even want the others to know that they are together so I wouldn't be surprised at all if she is now vindictive and coulnd't wait to turn on him, which she did in the end.

[BABY SHOES]

Here's one for you: our boy SBF planned to be a president of US. 

No wonder... he made a lot of political donations, apparently his ambition was to become President of the United States.
The dream of becoming president is buried now, the one who is now waiting for a sentence of 115 years in prison if convicted.

What's more interesting is that Hakim and Ellison's conversation is expressed in this tweet so we know all the conversation: https://twitter.com/innercitypress/status/1712172823005810935

What is interesting is that Ellison said that there was a Thai prostitute who was involved in re-accessing Alameda's wallet in the name of another person with assets worth $1 billion but that had been frozen by the Chinese government.

What's interesting is that Elon Musk also commented.
https://twitter.com/TiffanyFong_/status/1712145358535512511

[bbc.reporter]

@BABY SHOES. On Sam's political ambitions, he never had a chance and if FTX was not a scam but a successful exchange, I reckon the chance will never be there for him.

In any case, the Chinese government having frozen $1 billion and bribing Chinese government officials was a shock for me. The other statements from Caroline similar to planning on scamming Saudi investors and convincing the regulators to crackdown on the competition is expected.

[BABY SHOES]

@BABY SHOES. On Sam's political ambitions, he never had a chance and if FTX was not a scam but a successful exchange, I reckon the chance will never be there for him.

Knowing this will never happen despite FTX's success to date, SBF will never become president. 
It's just that he's so ambitious that he uses the power of customers' money for his own desires.

In any case, the Chinese government having frozen $1 billion and bribing Chinese government officials was a shock for me. The other statements from Caroline similar to planning on scamming Saudi investors and convincing the regulators to crackdown on the competition is expected.

Reportedly Chinese officials will be bribed $150 Million through the prostitute and this will be an interesting drama again.

Then the question becomes where Sam Trabucco, who was once the co-CEO of Alameda Research, is now a mystery after the fall of FTX.

What's interesting about Matthew's article is that he's a reporter.

Another FTX employee named Handi, whose father was himself a Chinese government officials and apparently one of the (few?) clean ones, opposed the payment of the bribes. And who on Signal mocked her, as having her father "immediately turn us all in"?

  It was Sam Trabucco, the co-CEO of Alameda Research at the time. Trabucco, who some nicknamed Tabasco (like Trump's lawyer in the first SDNY E. Jean Carroll case) had neither been charged nor appeared without notice in court to plead guilty, like Caroline and Gary and Nishad and most recently Ryan Salame.

Source: https://matthewrussellleeicp.substack.com/p/sino-sam-trabucco-bankman-fried-bribed

[bbc.reporter]

@BABY SHOES. I reckon having the type of illusion Sam was having for himself might be caused by taking too much Adderall. This is a drug that will make the user feel good but also might make the user think he can achieve bigger goals than what is within his reality.



Drugs like Adderall may help you feel more alert, awake, and focused. It has a stimulating effect that releases dopamine to the brain, giving you a sense of euphoria and well-being.

Source https://www.leehealth.org/health-and-wellness/healthy-news-blog/top-trends/does-adderall-make-you-smarter

On Sam Tabasco, it has been speculated that he is an informant.

Also, I have not read all of the statements made by the Chinese quant and sweet Caroline, however, it is being mentioned in social media that Caroline got a loan for a gambling company. What is this gambling company? It was never mentioned.

[bbc.reporter]

News update.

It appears Sam and his lawyers have found a way to manipulate the trial by using delaying tactics caused by Sam's addiction to Adderall.

Also, I speculate that Sam's Adderall addiction might be used to argue the case towards the effects of this drug to a person and how the drug affected Sam's decision making in FTX to make it appear that he is another victim of the pharmaceuticals business.



Stimulant misuse is responsible for many issues, especially more commonly known drugs like Adderall. This use is extremely common on college campuses and with young adults more prone to risky behaviors. While both problem gambling and stimulant use have negative effects and are closely related in terms of their usage demographics, the relationship between Adderall and gambling disorders is an unknown for many individuals. Let’s explore how this drug can impact one’s propensity to partake in uncontrolled gambling activities.  

What Is Adderall?

Adderall is a class of stimulants used to treat Attention Deficit Disorder and related problems. It can be an extremely effective drug, and with that comes a desire for doctors to avoid overprescription or early refills. Yet, as with any medication, there are ways individuals can access it without a prescription that can lead to misuse and other related issues.

Stimulants and Gambling

Gambling and drug use are often lumped together in one, and for good reason. A surprisingly large percentage of college students report gambling, taking drugs, or both each year. With the popularity of gambling increasing over the past few years, there’s increased importance on understanding the relationship between drugs (like simulants) and gambling.

Many studies report that individuals who report gambling problems are also more likely to report misuse of stimulants or other drugs. So keeping these stimulants out of the hands of people who don’t need them and educating others on the impact of these drugs can go a long way to preventing gambling problems.

Source https://800gambler.org/can-adderall-cause-gambling-disorders/