Gavin Andresen calls it a "mistake" to trust CSW

[franky1]

It means nothing if you ask me since it is already too late. It's not like he needed that much time to figure it out! It takes a second to know if someone is lying when they can't provide any kind of proof not this many years. I don't buy the NDA thing either since he could have not-say he is Satoshi in first place!

Something definitely shady is going on behind the scene between Andresen and Wright and in my opinion the only reason why Gavin went back on his words is the fallout between them, possibly Craig scammed him or refused to pay the money he promised Gavin after his support or something similar.

The only important question we should ask is "what was the benefit of supporting a clear scammer in 2016 and what is the benefit in going back on his words today?
Was it money? Position? Government pressure? Something else?

YES IT WAS MONEY AND YES GA GOT PAID IN 2016
EVERYONE KNOWS HE GOT PAID IN 2016 TO VISIT CSW

and in pretty much all NDA's its a lump sum at the NDA signing day. not a ongoing payment for life

most NDA have a time limit/expiry included. this does not mean paying periodically until expiry. this is a "here take some cash in 2016. now shut up for X years or we will want that money back + X MULTIPLE ontop as penalty" type of deal

thats how NDA's work

in short. yes GA got paid to go to the UK in 2016 and say whatever the contract wants him to say.. or not say

there was obviously more then one NDA
as there is the pre-flight NDA(spring 2016) where he could not speak of having a meetup until an arranged date later in year.

and another contract about what he should and could say at a certain date and he had to stick to such limitations

as thats how standard NDA's/contracts work

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[NotATether]

Finally does the right thing. Hats off to him.

While the wave of bankruptcies and collapses have made CSW largely irrelevant last year and this one too, he's not going to be able to take any action against bitcoin while the price of Bitcoin SV is down (assuming Calvin Ayre is too tied up to give him financial firepower at the moment).

[moonie]

We should try to relax a bit. It’s not like Gavin is some official spokesperson for Bitcoin, and obviously the whole claim to fame on Craig’s side is half winded. IMO he’s Satoshi’s antithesis. What caused the resurgence of this debate lol

[NeuroticFish]

What caused the resurgence of this debate lol

Gavin's writing is one key "documents" CSW is relying on in his lawsuits against everybody contesting his claims or exposing is lies.

CSW already managed to obtain court order hence bitcoin whitepaper is not available on bitcoin.org for UK people (IPs).
CSW is dragging into lawsuits from people on Twitter to Bitcoin businesses and even Bitcoin developers for not allowing him to steal millions of bitcoin.

So... it's not a small thing this update.

[NotATether]

Gavin's writing is one key "documents" CSW is relying on in his lawsuits against everybody contesting his claims or exposing is lies.

CSW already managed to obtain court order hence bitcoin whitepaper is not available on bitcoin.org for UK people (IPs).
CSW is dragging into lawsuits from people on Twitter to Bitcoin businesses and even Bitcoin developers for not allowing him to steal millions of bitcoin.

So... it's not a small thing this update.

Well, in jurisdictions that have already gave CSW a green light to enforce whatever legal action he'd like e.g. the UK, the fact that the volume of fact-checking information about CSW that was ignored by the courts indicates that they will not be influenced by so much by the prosecution losing one document of their legal ammunition. It just makes CSW's fight a little harder but not impossible.

[Greg Tonoski]

Just for the context as Gavin's statment may not be just coincidence: "Craig Wright's UK Case Against 16 Bitcoin Developers to Go to Full Trial", 3rd February 2023.

[ABCbits]

GA should do this far earlier. But at least we should say "better late than never" for saying that statement.

We should try to relax a bit. It’s not like Gavin is some official spokesperson for Bitcoin, and obviously the whole claim to fame on Craig’s side is half winded. IMO he’s Satoshi’s antithesis. What caused the resurgence of this debate lol

GA has some influence on Bitcoin and cryptocurrency community. So some people might be angry at GA since his statement could mislead few newbie to buy BSV rather than other cryptocurrency with better history/potential.

[Lucius]

In my opinion, GA should have become a person of distrust the moment he went to the most famous three-letter agency and opened his soul on the subject of Bitcoin (for compensation, of course). I always wondered how Satoshi could even consider such a man as a trustworthy person and give him credibility after he left.

The damage done by GA when he stood by Faketoshi is irreparable regardless of all his apologies - and the question is why he is bringing up this topic again as if anyone with a modicum of common sense doesn't understand what actually happened.

[Kakmakr]

Gavin Andresen's first mistake was to speak to the 3 letter agencies and then admitting it to Satoshi Nakamoto... after that, Satoshi Nakamoto was gone...... then he left Bitcoin as the Lead developer and joined Mike Hearn as the competition to Bitcoin, making him a hostile enemy in most people's eyes.

He then caused more harm to Bitcoin, by supporting CW in his claim that he was the real Satoshi Nakamoto.... and that exploded in his face. Where do we draw the line between sabotage and mistakes?

[Carlton Banks]

Obviously it was a mistake to ever trust CSW, but Andresen needs to go further and categorically say "Sorry, I was wrong. CSW is obviously not Satoshi."

Andresen has long since ceased to be someone to look to anyway, so I don't understand your point at all, what he says or does not say makes no difference to the issue.


It's not (and never was) credible for him to claim that trusting Craig Wright made even 1 scintilla of sense, when he had more than enough:

• knowledge
• skill
• responsibility

...to actually assess what Craig Wright presented to him, instead of saying "of that looks good to me, I trust you o' unknown and unproven person making earth shattering claims to be the person I worked with on early Bitcoin under a pseudonym"

Andresen was clearly playing games, or a total idiot, and thus disqualifies himself from the list of "people to listen to"

[Yoshimaka]

CSW, GA, both of them lie, I know mister T and he doesn't look like CSW. mister T wants to stay anonymous otherwise he would come here and reveal his real identity. CSW's claims have no merits whatsoever. Please do not feed more to this fire.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Andresen has long since ceased to be someone to look to anyway, so I don't understand your point at all, what he says or does not say makes no difference to the issue.

My point is that this half baked non-denouncing is not enough. He can and should just outright call CSW a liar and a fraud, as everyone else has.

As I mentioned earlier in this thread, I (and everyone else here) already fully know that Andresen's statements cannot be relied upon in any way. However, CSW continues to rely on witness testimony in court, because that is all he has. Having one his most well known and prominent witnesses make a complete denunciation is more powerful than the statement of "it was a mistake to trust CSW", as I'm sure CSW will no doubt perform his usual mental gymnastics to say that Andresen was referring to something else entirely.

I place no value whatsoever in the opinion of people like Mashinsky or SBF either, but I still think they should come forward, accept the blame, and apologize to all the users of their platforms for scamming them.

[AverageGlabella]

Obviously it was a mistake to ever trust CSW, but Andresen needs to go further and categorically say "Sorry, I was wrong. CSW is obviously not Satoshi."

Andresen has long since ceased to be someone to look to anyway, so I don't understand your point at all, what he says or does not say makes no difference to the issue.


It's not (and never was) credible for him to claim that trusting Craig Wright made even 1 scintilla of sense, when he had more than enough:

• knowledge
• skill
• responsibility

...to actually assess what Craig Wright presented to him, instead of saying "of that looks good to me, I trust you o' unknown and unproven person making earth shattering claims to be the person I worked with on early Bitcoin under a pseudonym"

Andresen was clearly playing games, or a total idiot, and thus disqualifies himself from the list of "people to listen to"

Gavin Andresen still commands respect among the btc community he helped make it what it is today even if he has not been around like he was in the early years without him and his time that he put into developing btc I do not think he would have got to where we are today so quickly. His name is forever associated with btc and there comes responsibility with that. I do not doubt that he is reluctant to publicly denounce CSW hard because of their former friendship and he does not want the drama but it is the socially responsible thing to do.

[franky1]

GA did help with things in previous years. much like certain leaders of the past. but their voice today does not create code that activates today.

we have seen politicians get bought out and publicise certain corporate leanings and sides in the past.

just because they were leaders on date X does not mean we have to believe them on date Y nor does it mean they have power on date Z

we can uniquely praise their Date X activity. and find offence in date Y and not be bothered or not find it important or do find it important about Z
all as separate opinions of the same person.

there was even controversy abut date W. where some think core was defacto god group. and anything outside core is traitor group not belonging to bitcoin.
where other people think bitcoin should not have a god group. but instead a diverse network of multiple teams where no one is god. and instead just byzantine generals that should al be able to propose features and find unity over  features the community find usefulness in which the byzantine generals all then contribute towards providing code for in their own brands.. and not some opposition fight about who should be thrown off the network first

where by W is treated separate to X, Y Z but overall people can have thoughts that W is leaning one way or y leans the other or z is neutral

i dont think GA and CSW were buddies. it was a business deal (money changed hands)

[pooya87]

Andresen was clearly playing games, or a total idiot, and thus disqualifies himself from the list of "people to listen to"

That's a fact that you and I know but if we look through the eyes of newcomers Andresen is someone who could be made to look like an "expert" who knows what he is talking about. Lest we forget that we live in a society that average people tend to easily believe random stuff they read on the internet.

[AverageGlabella]

Andresen was clearly playing games, or a total idiot, and thus disqualifies himself from the list of "people to listen to"

That's a fact that you and I know but if we look through the eyes of newcomers Andresen is someone who could be made to look like an "expert" who knows what he is talking about. Lest we forget that we live in a society that average people tend to easily believe random stuff they read on the internet.

Why is Gavin Andresen a idiot? I have been around more long enough not to be known as a newcomer but I do not know why the btc community is so hostile towards him? From what I have read he has always been level headed and done what he thought was best for the btc community and it was a big loss when he stopped developing for btc.

[digaran]

NDA is applicable when dealing with national security or contracts with high monetary risks, I am not aware of a NDA where keeping silent is considered as obstruction of justice, unless there are some stupid rules in US or other countries that allow such a thing.

[darkangel11]

Finally does the right thing. Hats off to him.

While the wave of bankruptcies and collapses have made CSW largely irrelevant last year and this one too, he's not going to be able to take any action against bitcoin while the price of Bitcoin SV is down (assuming Calvin Ayre is too tied up to give him financial firepower at the moment).

Better late than never.

Devs are supposed to be smart. I had a lot of respect to people who are smart enough to update code and implement bug fixes, but then we have this:

"I saw him sign a message, put it on a USB stick that I provided to him and saw it verified on a clean computer that I had witnessed the downloading of the verification software, and it had been unpacked from a factory-sealed box," he said. "And it was a message I gave to him, so it was a message of my choosing. So I am convinced he has that key. So I don’t know why he did this wacky, complicated thing [on his blog]."

The above text is from 2016.

We all know this was fake. Craig never had the keys and Gavin either knew about it and went along with it lying to everyone or he was conned by Wright. Wright never had and still doesn't have Satoshi's keys and if he did he wouldn't be suing bitcoin devs to get access.
Wright wants to destroy bitcoin. If he had Satoshi's coins he'd crash the market and used the money to shill SV and pump it to start a FOMO rally.
Real Satoshi would never be the enemy of bitcoin like Wright.

[Upgrade00]

This is another reminder that we should all learn to always verify what we read, regardless of the expertise or reputation of the person saying it. Someone could be extremely smart and savvy in an area, and make rookie errors in another, or they could be bought over.

Do not be "influenced" by the opinion of others regardless how highly you rate them; Always Verify.This edit by Gavin Andresen is more like putting band aid over a deep tissue cut. There is a lot more that could be said to further distance himself from the idea that Craig Wright is Satoshi and categorically call it a lie.

[coolcoinz]

Gavin supported an obvious liar. I don't get how you could be so easily fooled. Craig never did anything good for the community. He's a narcissist who wants to use outdated centralized systems to influence bitcoin. A good examples of this attitude are patent claims and court cases where he tries to sue proponents of free speech. He thinks that the court can somehow give him rights to bitcoin. This idiot thinks he'll fight his way into history books.

Craig is sick, but what was Gavin's agenda here? What did he hope to achieve by supporting Craig?
Somebody should tell Craig that no matter what patents he gets and what court cases he wins, he can't turn back time.