Let's get rid of all regulations, what can possibly go wrong

[hatshepsut93]

If you have been reading the news lately, you would know the story about OceanGate submarine that failed and killed all people onboard. The cause of this tragic incident is that the creator of the submarine chose to ignore regulations. He believed that they are only in place to stifle innovation and that he knows better than the others and can't be wrong.

OceanGate CEO Stockton Rush said in 2021 he knew he'd 'broken some rules' by making the Titanic submersible out of carbon fiber and not pure metal: 'You're remembered for the rules you break'l

This should be a cautionary tale to people who dream about society without government and its regulations. Imagine if someone makes an "experimental and innovative" nuclear reactor that explodes and gives radiation sickness + cancer to hundreds of thousands. Or someone makes an "experimental and innovative" dam that collapses and floods houses. Invisible hand of the market won't be able to undo the damage or prevent it in the future from repeating again.

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[dothebeats]

In the case of OceanGate, aside from deliberately ignoring safety precautions and regulations, the CEO also ignored the advice of the experts in the field and also skimped on routine maintenance. There are tons of things that contributed to the said disaster, and most of it started from him just winging it and believing in what he thinks is 'best' for them at that moment.

Also, he surrounded himself with yes men that contributed to this tragedy. There are so many things that could go wrong if there aren't any standards or regulations set into place by governing bodies. So even if we admit it or not, governments and their laws and regulations are still needed in order to keep chaos at bay.

[mu_enrico]

It depends on what kind of regulation, but if he chose to ignore regulations that are based on science then it's just suicide.

“At some point, safety just is pure waste,” Stockton told journalist David Pogue in an interview last year. “I mean, if you just want to be safe, don’t get out of bed. Don’t get in your car. Don’t do anything.”

Source.

Well, he got what's inevitable when he ignores safety... It's never a waste to make sure the passengers come home alive. My deepest condolences, and hopefully this kind of negligence won't ever happen again.

[Fiatless]

In the case of OceanGate, aside from deliberately ignoring safety precautions and regulations, the CEO also ignored the advice of the experts in the field and also skimped on routine maintenance. There are tons of things that contributed to the said disaster, and most of it started from him just winging it and believing in what he thinks is 'best' for them at that moment.

Also, he surrounded himself with yes men that contributed to this tragedy. There are so many things that could go wrong if there aren't any standards or regulations set into place by governing bodies. So even if we admit it or not, governments and their laws and regulations are still needed in order to keep chaos at bay.

Regulators will always come up with different allegations and arguments after a tragic incident. It is when people have lost their lives that these government agencies will tell the world how the firm or company broke regulatory rules. But they were around and were watching these firms engage in risky adventures without stopping them. These agencies will not deny that they are aware that OceanGate was risking the lives of people and making a profit from it. Government agencies are reactive and not proactive. These deaths would have been avoided if regulators had sealed the company and ensured they abide by the rules.

Our system is run by highly connected corrupt and greedy folks that act above the law because of their links to the seat of power. The loss of life is irreplaceable, but it becomes painful to the bereaved if it happened because of avoidable mistakes.

[joniboini]

This should be a cautionary tale to people who dream about society without government and its regulations. Imagine if someone makes an "experimental and innovative" nuclear reactor that explodes and gives radiation sickness + cancer to hundreds of thousands. Or someone makes an "experimental and innovative" dam that collapses and floods houses. Invisible hand of the market won't be able to undo the damage or prevent it in the future from repeating again.

I think most people are fine with regulations as long as it is reasonable. The problem is that the one who runs the system can't be trusted, which is hard to solve since you can't simply tell everyone to "try to participate in governance then".

If this point is being connected with cryptocurrencies, such as exchange and whatnot, the problem is not really similar since the stakes are different. As far as I'm aware, nobody died when they don't submit KYC and don't want to do it, just facing some inconveniences. If we really want to force the invisible hand term into this discussion, then some might argue that the stock price of such a company can get slashed if the public found out that the CEO and its staff are a bunch of idiots. CMIIW.

A lot of cases related to exchange insolvency also give us some distrust in how people run these exchanges, or how the government handles the case. The debate about SEC being so unclear with their rules and how they go after exchanges is quite popular on social media afaik.
Hopefully, nothing like this will happen in the future.

[ChiBitCTy]

This whole story has been truly sad, and it saddens me to think that someone could be so stupid with other peoples lives.  I have since heard from several experts in deep sea travel, like famed film maker James Cameron, who talked about how crazy it was that they went down like they did with all the knowledge they had.   

I know it's a bit "harsh" to discuss..but that company better pay for the costs of the search and rescue mission.  That's not an economical hurdle the government should have to take on with what we now know about the situation.

[bittraffic]

Yep there is the need for regulation but we can't compare this to the innovation of cryptcurrencies where regulators are deliberately not allowing exchanges to register.

Oceangate is merely an adventurer's dream. Those who are willing to risk their lives to reach the deepest are happy to risk. I'm sure they know the risk, they probably sign waivers too.

[Swordsoffreedom]

Yep there is the need for regulation but we can't compare this to the innovation of cryptcurrencies where regulators are deliberately not allowing exchanges to register.

Oceangate is merely an adventurer's dream. Those who are willing to risk their lives to reach the deepest are happy to risk. I'm sure they know the risk, they probably sign waivers too.

When it comes to cryptocurrencies, it is true that governments are not doing their part, and they are negatively impacting the development of the industry as the SEC is doing. But besides that, there are also many investors who are against all regulations, they do not need to know what the regulations are and constantly oppose and strongly oppose.

It can be said that currently, the government and the people have not found a common voice, while we want freedom, the government wants to control us more. Since then, there have been too many unresolvable conflicts.

I am not against all regulations but they should at least make regulations that are appropriate and fair for all rather than just for their own benefit.

[Dunamisx]

Yep there is the need for regulation but we can't compare this to the innovation of cryptcurrencies where regulators are deliberately not allowing exchanges to register.

Oceangate is merely an adventurer's dream. Those who are willing to risk their lives to reach the deepest are happy to risk. I'm sure they know the risk, they probably sign waivers too.

People will still prefer being unregulated in some aspect than the other because they of the restriction it makes on them to be able to go on any length towards achieving their main aims and targets, this is about the right of doing what they feels normal for their own benefit in their business enterprise but due to the regulation protocols, it brings down their role and impact to effective changes as they have desired for through government regulations.

[Poker Player]

Imagine if someone makes an "experimental and innovative" nuclear reactor that explodes and gives radiation sickness + cancer to hundreds of thousands. Or someone makes an "experimental and innovative" dam that collapses and floods houses. Invisible hand of the market won't be able to undo the damage or prevent it in the future from repeating again.

Those examples you give are too exaggerated to the point of being unrealistic. For me, the amount of regulations should be reduced to the minimum possible, as well as taxes, but for example for the nuclear or the petrochemical industry, of course there must be regulations. Besides, today we are not exactly lacking in regulations. There are thousands and thousands of pages regulating ad nauseam for even if you want to open a fucking souvenir store. Besides, if the creator of the submarine violated the regulations, he committed a crime to begin with.

[philipma1957]

Imagine if someone makes an "experimental and innovative" nuclear reactor that explodes and gives radiation sickness + cancer to hundreds of thousands. Or someone makes an "experimental and innovative" dam that collapses and floods houses. Invisible hand of the market won't be able to undo the damage or prevent it in the future from repeating again.

Those examples you give are too exaggerated to the point of being unrealistic. For me, the amount of regulations should be reduced to the minimum possible, as well as taxes, but for example for the nuclear or the petrochemical industry, of course there must be regulations. Besides, today we are not exactly lacking in regulations. There are thousands and thousands of pages regulating ad nauseam for even if you want to open a fucking souvenir store. Besides, if the creator of the submarine violated the regulations, he committed a crime to begin with.

Well the highseas have very few rules. He dodged certification because he operated the sub only in international waters.

At least one of the dead was the ceo of the sub company.

[rat03gopoh]

This case even violates the rules of science where it applies in every part of the earth that is without regulation though, this case isn't the right approach to get rid of regulation completely.
Generally, people just don't want administrative rules that actually have almost no impact when they're violated unless you have substantial need in the realm of bureaucracy.

[livingfree]

We're not against of regulations if it's with other certain areas of the communities and countries that we're in. This is different from the regulations that we're having based on what they think about cryptocurrencies.

This is really sad and tragic moment. I've even read something about rejecting hiring actual experts that should have given them a better guide on this project.

I also watched a video of one of the excavation of the said submarine and saw how it looks like under, it was a success so it had gained confidence but it's a different thing having people on board.

[Renampun]

If you have been reading the news lately, you would know the story about OceanGate submarine that failed and killed all people onboard. The cause of this tragic incident is that the creator of the submarine chose to ignore regulations. He believed that they are only in place to stifle innovation and that he knows better than the others and can't be wrong.

OceanGate CEO Stockton Rush said in 2021 he knew he'd 'broken some rules' by making the Titanic submersible out of carbon fiber and not pure metal: 'You're remembered for the rules you break'l

This should be a cautionary tale to people who dream about society without government and its regulations. Imagine if someone makes an "experimental and innovative" nuclear reactor that explodes and gives radiation sickness + cancer to hundreds of thousands. Or someone makes an "experimental and innovative" dam that collapses and floods houses. Invisible hand of the market won't be able to undo the damage or prevent it in the future from repeating again.

I still wonder what these billionaires thought when they boarded a submarine made of only carbon fiber and an Xbox controller. I mean, are they stupid enough to ride something even the quality of which is still doubted by many experts. even the funniest thing, they use an xbox controller which is only worth 30s USD, this is what I still can't understand.

it's no wonder that many people on social media laugh at them for being stupid enough to be able to dive to a depth of 3800 meters with a submarine made only of carbon fiber and an xbox controller, moreover they are billionaires who should be smart enough to see the situation.

[SmartGold01]

When we talk of regulations there are many angle and points you would want to view it from let say, regulation in bitcoin does it really possible and necessary to regulate it since bitcoin isn't controlled by government and how would they regulate it? Since they can't regulate it then it's better exchanges are being regulated to make sure investors interest are being protected.

Then to other things that concerns life is very important to be regulated by the certified body's and groups of professions who are designated  into the field before the creator or the inventor could carry out the test run.

Also, he surrounded himself with yes men that contributed to this tragedy.

This is another problems we are having nowadays that needs to pay urgent attention, any inventor or CEO that doesn't want to seek Idea from external body or regulated body's may surely incur some danger. As a groups of companies, there is a reason for a collective idea no way only the boss overall whatever suggestion being contributed I think for sure the CEO may likely be in danger in time to come.

[Gyfts]

This should be a cautionary tale to people who dream about society without government and its regulations. Imagine if someone makes an "experimental and innovative" nuclear reactor that explodes and gives radiation sickness + cancer to hundreds of thousands. Or someone makes an "experimental and innovative" dam that collapses and floods houses. Invisible hand of the market won't be able to undo the damage or prevent it in the future from repeating again.

I'm a proponent of a purely capitalist economy, and even someone that believes in an absolute state of capitalism, we would concede that some level of regulations are required.

OceanGate was subject to no regulations. There wasn't a single certification board that was willing to certify the vessel, nor was there an insurance company willing to offer them coverage because the vessel was assemped seemingly out of a hardware store. Sure, *zero* regulations are disastrous. But no one's arguing for total lawlessness absent of legal structure and regulatory framework. The current crypto frameworks are burdensome by design, ie overregulated.

[lovesmayfamilis]

Remember the tragedy in Turkey? There were speculations that construction organizations violated construction rules very severely. In the end, thousands of people suffered. Is it possible to deviate from the rules when human lives are in your hands? I agree that in some industries there should be strict regulations, the violation of which will threaten very severe penalties. Man is such a creature that it is difficult to motivate him to do honest work with just a carrot. He always needs a whip, that is, strict discipline, for order.

[yhiaali3]

The most dangerous thing is to manipulate human lives. When it comes to human safety, there must be strict rules and there is no room for complacency in safety rules in order to obtain an invention or save some money.

Of course, accidents will always happen, but this is not an excuse for not taking safety measures according to the highest standards when it comes to human life. It is a catastrophe, and those responsible for it must be severely held accountable, because if they are not severely held accountable, this failure will cause more lives to be lost in the future.

My condolences to the families of the victims who lost their lives in the accident.

[killerfrost]

(...)This should be a cautionary tale to people who dream about society without government and its regulations. Imagine if someone makes an "experimental and innovative" nuclear reactor that explodes and gives radiation sickness + cancer to hundreds of thousands. Or someone makes an "experimental and innovative" dam that collapses and floods houses. Invisible hand of the market won't be able to undo the damage or prevent it in the future from repeating again.

Sometimes people forget the terrible consequences that will happen for the sake of the immediate benefits, like many regulations in life, they all have a way of seeing and approaching whether it is accepting or rejecting it, it is also a how to bring balance to life. As the story you mentioned really, I find that this problem comes from small numbers, but when they have the opportunity to rise up more with money, relationships cause influence they can influence think of the majority, and the thing to do is to always spread the right things in life without pursuing personal gain.
Today I just happened to read an article about Ronald Reagan speaking about the issue of aliens that will help people to unite, although this is just a hypothesis but I also think the point is that we need to more solidarity in the world, not competition as it is now, perhaps without the appearance of aliens, we have killed each other.

[bayudndy]

I'm a bit surprised at the way the OP addresses the issue, although it can be said that the current law or regulation is fair, I also agree that sometimes it is a lack of humanity, not knowing. Have you seen any lawsuits of the same nature as mine where a murderer becomes a hero being praised for his actions killing evil people with depraved behavior. The authorities have not yet intervened, in fact there are many issues that people want to promote their own interests, fairness can be promoted, but looking directly at the truth, we have not been able to get justice. That way, the cost of living will take a form that is beyond our comprehension, but I would still like to reiterate the justice that exists.