Icopress ' Merit Source Application 🚩

[icopress]

I'm posting this because it's impossible to become a merit source without an app. To be honest, I'm not sure what I should mention other than posting 10 unmerited posts, so I'll be as brief as possible, and I will not tell about myself, because I perceive point number 1 as a formality that Theymos published in order to limit the flow of applications. In case my assumption is wrong, anyone can visit my BPIP or Loyce.Club profile.

1. Be a somewhat established member.
2. Collect TEN posts written in the last couple of months by other people that have not received nearly enough merit for how good they are, [...].

• Submitted posts have not received any merits.
• The submitted posts are written by 10 different users of different ranks.
• Might be worth mentioning (which is directly related to the topic) is that I sent over 2500 merits without being a merit source.
• I spent quite a lot of time here in the walls of the forum to understand what's what, (total time logged in: 195 days, 43 minutes).

SUBJECT	STORY
Bitcoin Discussion	Once all the mindless speculation stops and things are built correctly, using something efficient, like Taproot Assets, I'm still fairly confident there is genuine utility to be found.  The only reason people are writing it off is because it's currently poorly implemented and because unscrupulous people are using it for blatant profiteering to sell the digital equivalent of magic beans to gullible suckers.   I don't see Ordinals as "lucrative" (as per OP) in any way, unless you're the type of person (not you personally, nutildah, but in general) who somehow still sleeps at night knowing they've taken advantage of someone.  If they are used properly as a tool to represent real-world assets like financial documents, deeds, wills, etc, then that would be a world in which I can accept Ordinals.  Until then, however, it's a sleazy, underhanded crap-fest, much like ICOs, forkcoins and other the other speculative-bubble-abuses that have occurred previously.  I want no part of that.
Technical Support	All what was written about fees is correct, but just for record (and maybe for novice users): Blocks are "mined" by miners which do some calculations based on the given difficulty set for some period of time. Difficulty is adjusted every 2000 blocks, just to have the average performance 1 block every 10 minutes. But, it is average speed, it does not mean transaction will be processed in max 10 minutes. Unfortunately we cannot tell when next block will be mined. For example in the current "evaluation period" we are statistically 20 blocks late and soon difficulty will be decreased by +- 1%. As a consequence, you should be aware that it is possible to wait a long time for block and fee does not change anything. The risk is that if block is very late (it happens that we have 30, 40 minutes or 1h without block), fee which was sufficient 1 h ago, is not sufficient now, as your transaction will be removed from the 1st expected block as other users prepared lot of transactions with much higher fee. I skip talking about low-fee transactions purged from mempool as we talk about high fees.
Wallet software	An interesting Electrum server is also Fulcrum which has been discussed in some other thread(s) here on this forum, e.g. here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5441463 and also compared with other Electrum server implementations e.g. here https://www.sparrowwallet.com/docs/server-performance.html. I use Fulcrum on my RaspiBlitz node as replacement for electrs because I got tired of the issues that electrs has sometimes with addresses that have a huge transaction history. For my personal Electrum wallets I don't need Fulcrum, electrs would be fine. When I do sometimes a bit of blockchain digging I've run into such issues from time to time with electrs. Fulcrum is easier to configure to server huge address histories and it's refreshingly fast with data retrieval compared to electrs. Linux and Windows executables are available from the Github, MacOS executables are announced but not yet there. You can always check the code and compile your executable yourself. I don't mind that the main dev appears to be in the BCH camp, the project is open-source and works very well for Bitcoin.
Trading Discussion	Almost all CEXs use trading bots to create liquidity, maintain it and for many other things. Therefore, the use of bots in this field is old, and artificial intelligence may come to improve results or speed up the execution of tasks. Since you are looking for a bot that works with AI, all you need is that be AI prediction mechanism. This is an open source code with which you can get price forecasts of bitcoin prices using AI https://github.com/albert-espin/bitcoin-prediction what you have to do now is link these outputs to any of the traditional trading bots, and you will have a fully automated AI trading bot. As I mentioned, the role of artificial intelligence here is to predict Bitcoin prices only. You will find more projects here https://github.com/topics/bitcoin-prediction
Technical Discussion	Spam will always be an issue. No matter what limit will be set, block creators will always reach it. Set 1 MB as Satoshi did, and it will be reached. Set 4 MB as Segwit creators did, and you will also see fully filled blocks. If you are a block creator, then you have an incentive to create the biggest possible block. Why? Because then, you can pick some simple, deterministic algorithm, and generate terabytes of always valid transactions on-the-fly, then let your miners work on that header, and send mined block to other nodes. Then, you can start producing some next block, on top of what you created, while other block creators will try to validate what you submitted. Instead of thinking about block size alone, think about verification time. If blocks are produced every 10 minutes, but your blocks are so complex, that it takes 5 minutes to verify them, then guess what: other block creators have 5 minutes of "guessing time": you already know, if your block is valid or not. But others don't, and they have to decide, if they want to create the next block on top of not-yet-checked-block.
Technical Discussion	There's only one way to fully validate the current utxo set and that is by downloading the entire blockchain from the genesis block. if someone wants to trust some third party then  i guess that's up to them but internet speeds and storage space seem like they will able to support blockchain growth perhaps indefinitely since technology is always improving and we already have 20+TB drives. That's about a 40:1 ratio of unused to used space. You can bet that's going to get bigger in the future. people can already have a 1Gbps internet speed. That should be sufficient far into the future for downloading the blockchain. Blockchain grows at 0.1TB per year max, it takes how many years to fill up a 20TB HDD? In 100 years the blockchain will be at most about 10TB. On a 1Gbps connection you can download that in just over 1 day. In 100 years, 1Gbps probably will be something everyone has. No one is still on dialup. The day when you can't download and fully validate the blockchain from the genesys block if you so desire is the day that bitcoin becomes meaningless. Because you won't know if it goes all the way back to satoshi or not.
Technical Support	Yes, you cannot do "public key recovery", because: 1. The way how signatures are made, makes it hard to do it in the same way as for pre-Taproot addresses. If you have some output with a script "<signature> OP_SWAP OP_CHECKSIG", it works for pre-Taproot public keys, but it cannot be done for Schnorr signatures. 2. You don't need to recover any key, because Taproot address is used to encode your compressed public key directly, and it is automatically assumed that it has "02" prefix. 3. If you have more than one party, then after aggregation you only know the public key for the combined signature, you don't know which public keys are used in the middle, because if you know that the result is "10", then you don't know if it was "2+8" or maybe "3+7", or even "2+3+5".
Technical Discussion	It is not possible to actually 'seal a private key'. First of all, it is basically impossible to safely create pre-funded collectibles (safe as in: the creator has no access to the private key). The method Leo mentioned, allows you to make user-funded collectibles safely, but that kills the coin's collectible value, as now the user who funded it, can scam a future owner of the physical coin. In my opinion, for substantial amounts and as technology advances / gets cheaper, hardware-wallet-inspired collectibles should be considered. For instance, it is today possible to build a device which uses an open-source 'avalanche' circuit to generate entropy and private keys and store them in a secure chip, which even the creator cannot extract, although he has hardware access to the device. The device would be able to display a Bitcoin address, though, and destruction would be necessary to spend the funds. This is all possible and mostly how a hardware wallet works (only really changing the way the secure element grants you signing access), but those aren't exactly cheap, so this is the one drawback.
Altcoin Discussion	The "developer tax" (a mandatory fee which is either taken from transaction fees or from block rewards, and goes to the developers) you mention is implemented in various altcoins already, also in some which were initially not premined (for example PIVX). Such a developer tax, if it's mandatory, can however lead to problems which impact in the competitive situation: - If it's taken from transaction fees, then adoption can be harmed, because the coin would then be more expensive to transact than competitors. - If it's taken from block rewards, then it's simply additional inflation, which does not bring more security (like increased mining or staking rewards would do) but only dilutes the coin supply. There are however also models which don't have these problems. For example, in Signum (originally Burst), some big pools agreed to pay regularly a small fee to fund development activities and nodes which are always online. As this is completely voluntary, it's similar to a donation and thus does not impact decentralization at all. If problems for the competitive situation arise, the "tax" can simply be reduced or eliminated completely.
Mining Discussion	And thanks to Al Gore and his financial cronies, said coal power plant no doubt purchases carbon credits so on paper they are 'low CO2 emissions'.   That particular setup is also an outlier. Mines are setup where there is: a. Abundant low cost power. b. Friendly local governments. Regarding 'a', the massive amounts of power the largest farms use is there because there is not enough local loads to run the power plants at maximum efficiency and it cannot be economically be sent across 'the grid(s)' to be used elsewhere. The farms that were once located in the Pacific Northwest existed because of the large hydroelectric dams that were built to power several massive aluminum refining plants all mostly owned by Alcoa. When those plants were shut down during the 90's & early 2k's the utilities needed a huge 'local' load to justify operations. When miners and data farms moved in everyone was happy. Finally around 2013 Canada established a high-tension link between the Northwest and their grid to buy power from the dams who now had a market willing to pay more for that power. That more than anything is what drove PUC to all but shut down large mining farms... In that case, also 'b' was not present. These days the same supply/demand economics apply. Yes Texas has massive wind farms and guess what - they produce far more power than is usually needed to feed the all but isolated Texas power grid ran by ERCOT. It has only 2 ties to the rest of the national grid system and they are pretty limited in how much power can be sent through them. Now in their case the overcapacity was purposely built to accommodate local weather conditions and the amount of power produced & needed in the local areas. When there are poor winds in one area odds are they are good in enough other areas to cover it. That said, the end result is usually far more power than Texas can use. Enter mining farms. Most folks have at least heard of the deals that ERCOT and the mega farms in Texas have: The farms get to soak up the excess power at reasonable rates but with 1 caveat - whenever circumstances require it (most often weather) the farms have to throttle back their power usage and even stop running entirely until things change. So much for 'the power usage harming other users'... Yes ERCOT pays the farms a stipend for not running but it is a fraction of what the mines would earn if running plus that diverted power is still being used/bought. Still, given how easy it is to switch a mine on & off vs any other type of mega power hungry industry to free up that power to be sent where it is needed more, not a bad deal. ERCOT gets to build up their safety net of over-capacity knowing they have a line of buyers waiting to get some of that (conditional) excess power. Win-win for all involved.
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[icopress]

If someone wants to speak up, don't be shy. 

[Rikafip]

I'm posting this because it's impossible to become a merit source without an app.

Even though it is (very) rare, that's tehnically not correct as few members got merit source status 2 years ago when theymos did merit "readjustement" without applying to be a merit source.

Beside that, what to say other than you would be an excellent merit source so good luck with your application!

[_act_]

You have good application I hope theymos will make you a merit source.

There have been some people that have applied for merit source more than a year ago and many months ago, I hope theymos will make everyone of them to be come a merit source too because they all have good applications.

[SamReomo]

icopress is really a good member of the community and I would love to see him as a merit source because the guy can help the community a lot by sending merits to the posts that deserve those merits. I'm quite sure that anyone would love to have a member like @icopress as a merit source because we all know that the user has been doing great on the forum, and could be a very valuable asset for the current merits sources as well as the other members of the forum who give their best to create informative and useful posts.

[EarnOnVictor]

I'm happy to see this, and what can I say than to wish you very good luck with your application.

If there are no lapses reason, I believe you might not have put it upon yourself to apply. I only ask you to do things differently than most others, a different style might spread it better as you desire.

Good luck!

[Sandra_hakeem]

Icopresssssssssss!!!!!
Kodus mhannn! I least expected that from you at the time - not in a bad way... I mean, you've got a decent merit ratio which - without even looking up to confirm on bpip - I can tell you've sent that amount considering your 5k merit stat...
I hope big daddy T See's this? - and sure, why won't he? Afterall chymist cried his whole life, begging on a grant...took sometime buh the end was worth the while... I dunno if he's got plans to validate anymore persons, BUT YES, I SUPPORT YOU AND THAT'S WHAT MATTERS.

Sandra 🧑‍🦰

[joker_josue]

From what I know of you, I think you'd be a good source of merit. So I hope that when this situation is reviewed, you can be one of the chosen ones. 

[skarais]

icopress, I will support your merit source app. But anyway, so far I don't see the admin has accepted some of the apps and made them the latest merit source. But there is nothing wrong to try and keep updating your app with some best deserving posts on regular basis, it will definitely help you to get high probability to be made as a merit source.

Good luck, icopress.

[PX-Z]

I can't remember who and when was the last time theymos did add new merit source. I think it's already months or even a year already. I wonder if he will be ready add new ones. Since almost all the previous merit source applications are all qualified imo to be part of that cicrcle.

[The Sceptical Chymist]

I'm posting this because it's impossible to become a merit source without an app.

Even though it is (very) rare, that's tehnically not correct as few members got merit source status 2 years ago when theymos did merit "readjustement" without applying to be a merit source.

Wasn't that 4 years ago?  I recall it being 2019 when Theymos told me I was now a merit source and to go forth and prosper.  Lol.  Either way, it's practically impossible to become a merit source right now without creating an application thread, and if icopress didn't do it isn't likely Theymos would even know he was interested in the job.  But I guess I'm nitpicking.

I support your application, icopress.  I also think we probably need more merit sources in general, though it's hard to tell since there's a lack of data about which ones are still active, how active they are, and so forth.  All we've got is merit data and a Meta thread dedicated to members who've recently ranked up.  In any case, you know which posts deserve merits and which don't so good luck catching Theymos's attention, and if he happens to see this I'm hoping he'll tap you to be a merit source.

[Dr.Bitcoin_Strange]

Well, I have known you to be one of the respected old members of this forum, and I know that your application is not just a blaffle, but like you said, you have reported 10 good posts that were not merited. Yea, that's what it is, to really see some good posts but lack Smerit to appreciate the OP. I know we have a few merit sources here who are already trying their best in the way they have chosen to distribute their merit, but it seems a lot of good posts still remain unmerited, so all the available merit sources cannot really see every post at once, so if merit sources are more than the number they are now, there will be more chance for good posts to receive merit. I support your motion, @Icopress, and hope that theymos approves it.

[Rikafip]

I'm posting this because it's impossible to become a merit source without an app.

Even though it is (very) rare, that's tehnically not correct as few members got merit source status 2 years ago when theymos did merit "readjustement" without applying to be a merit source.

Wasn't that 4 years ago?  I recall it being 2019 when Theymos told me I was now a merit source and to go forth and prosper.  Lol. 

Well, maybe it happened then as well (it was probably before my time here) but it also happened in summer of 2021 (which was the last time theymos introduced new merit sources) as one of our local board member got a merit source status without ever applying for one. So yeah, it is possible but it's definitely better to apply than wait for a miracle.

[Nwada001]

I never knew you were not a merit source. All my time here on the forum, I came across posts that were merited, and when it was talked about merit sources, I always considered you one, as I always came across posts that were merited by you, even in places where posts barely earned merits.

I don't know which and what qualifies a member for being a merit source, but based on what I observed in how you distribute merit, you are qualified to be on that list. If it's something that requires some kind of voting, I'm sure you will definitely get all the votes and support you need to get there. But it's all in the hands of the admin.

[nakamura12]

Well, I am sure that icopress will be a good merit source. There are some posters who aren't getting enough merits no matter how good they are compared to other posts that doesn't seem very good or some will say it is okay yet they more merits. I think more merit sources are needed as I see other posts that are good aren't get merited and there are lots of good posters or in short, merit sources need more hands to do the job. Like what fillippone is doing where some are still waiting to get merited except those who are only abusing the generosity of fillippone.

[EFS]

I support this application. You would be a good addition to merit sources as most sources burned out and stopped using merit system. I hope theymos will consider changes in sources soon as the system is almost dying.

For the merit system to continue as planned, active sources and members who distribute smerits they earn are needed.

[RickDeckard]

Every single interaction that I had with you was positive icopress, and I believe that will continue for as long as both of us are here. Considering what you (and your family) went throug, you were still able to provide good content to the forum[1][2] alongside GazetaBitcoin.

I couldn't think of a better merit source and I fully support it.
[1]https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5390008.msg59545797#msg59545797
[2]https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5437673.msg61693236#msg61693236

[Fivestar4everMVP]

Wow, with the kind of contribution and reputation Icopress has given and earned on this forum, I've always thought that he or she^{(I know its a He though)} was one of those merit sources. I am kind of surprised to find your merit source application here to be honest..

Well, no fretting, with your level contribution to both the development and growth of this forum in your own little way, I am more than convinced that you will be approved as a merit source soon, there is no need asking if I support the application or not, you will make a good source, Icopress will make a good merit source no doubt about that.

Wishing you the best of luck bud.

[Agbe]

~

It is well deserved and merited application. You have contributed enough to the development of the forum, you have sponsored programmes, contest, campaigns, quiz, and others. There will be no comma, or but in your application. Your Merit Source Application is overdue.
I pray that Boss Theymos grant your application without objection. Though we had disagreement in sometime but I still respect you and recommend you to be accepted.

[JeromeTash]

I definitely support your merit source application. We need more of these folks as members come and go. I believe there are a handful of merit sources that are no longer active after a couple of years. So, a member who is still very active like you would be a good addition.

Theymos usually take long to add new merits sources, but I hope he does it as soon as he can.

[Mr.suevie]

Well certainly for me and most members here, we all know you deserve to be granted the merit source job because its certainly a job and the field is currently lacking employees I know this because of some quote from the famous @skeptical chemist, when he said no one should thank him for giving them merit and he is just fulfilling his duty as a merit source and each merited post by him deserve it. Well its going to a waiting game from here as most members have certainly cleared that its been long theymos actually assigned a new merit source but I feel its time because the forum is lacking merit source that tend to attend  to these merit worthy posts.

Icopress is just the right man for the job

[Shamm]

I support your application as a merit source, Honestly being a merit source is another task for you but I see that you have determination, knowledge and generosity, so for me you are qualified for what you've been applying for.  But let's wait for theymos if he gonna accept your application as we all know that there are many applicants before but still didn't make them a merit source.

[Jessie2121]

Wow...
I only saw you @Icopress as a campaign manager but I never thought you'd be applying for a spot as a merit source, thought most members with higher ranks are merit source, still much to learn here though but from the way you handle your campaigns I think you'd do more better if given the opportunity to be a merit source... What I'm I saying, IMO the opportunity have been given is just a matter of time to approve it and making it official.

[fillippone]

I fully support this application.
Icopress would be an excellent Merit Source.

I'm posting this because it's impossible to become a merit source without an app.

Even though it is (very) rare, that's tehnically not correct as few members got merit source status 2 years ago when theymos did merit "readjustement" without applying to be a merit source.

Wasn't that 4 years ago?  I recall it being 2019 when Theymos told me I was now a merit source and to go forth and prosper. 

Last merit source rebalancing was 2 years ago: July 2021.

[Poker Player]

~snip

I didn't know you weren't a merit source. I guess since you earn merits at almost 4 times the activity, I've seen you give out quite a few merits.

Anyway, I believe that icopress' contribution is so remarkably positive to the forum as to be appointed merit source. The only thing I can think of to prevent it from happening is that maybe theymos does not want to appoint any new merit sources for now.

[LoyceV]

From my short experience as a campaign manager, I know checking posts is a very good opportunity to also spread Merit since you have to read the posts anyway. And since you're managing a lot of campaigns, that would make you a good candidate to contribute to the Merit system.

[cygan]

finally you did it!
for me you are one of the most dedicated forum users i appreciate here very much. i also had the chance to work with you - and it was an honor for me.
the discussions with you are always factual and professional.
i also hope and think that we will get another 'merit source' with you

[rachael9385]

I support you from my hart, you have been a good reputative user on this forum but I never knew your weren't a merit source untill yet, I seriously believe that @theymos will take you as a new merit source on the forum, @icopress you have done your best on the forum and I know that there are more you will do, and been a merit source is the most expensive reward on the forum, since a lot of us have agreed on this I don't think @theymos will give it a second thought about this but we hope to hear a positive response from him.

[uchegod-21]

From my short experience as a campaign manager, I know checking posts is a very good opportunity to also spread Merit since you have to read the posts anyway. And since you're managing a lot of campaigns, that would make you a good candidate to contribute to the Merit system.

This is very correct. Although I haven't managed any campaign but I believe that campaign managers are the people in good position to know the post quality of users, especially the ones in the campaigns under their management.

I really thought Icopress was a merit source. But then there is no doubt he wil be a good merit source if given the opportunity by theymos.

[hugeblack]

AFAIK, Merit sources are selected according to the best member for a particular board, you almost speak Russian and there are enough sources for that local board so adjusting the 10 quote posts to be in a specific board or 2-3 boards may support your application.

In any case, if there is any modification to the merit sources, I hope you will be selected.

I support Icopress ' Merit Source Application.

[bullrun2024bro]

I actually thought you're a merit source already. Anyway, I fully support this application.

You are one of the most active users of the forum and through your job as campaign manager you know what is needed for making good posts. If anyone can judge whether a post is merit-worthy, it's you!

Therefore, I really hope that @theymos will consider your application anytime soon and that you will become a merit source. I am sure it will happen sooner or later!

Keep it up, buddy! 

[icopress]

Thank you all for the kind words... I actually spoke to Theymos about this recently. The reason I posted this appendix is that when Theymos assigns new merit sources, he searches the meta section for relevant topics and assigns new m'sources based on the search results. ^{[I do hope that he will add new sources of merit soon]}.

[lovesmayfamilis]

It always seemed to me that to be a source of merit meant to accomplish a great feat, in the right sense of the word . Reading a huge amount of information and regularly looking for the most interesting posts is a huge dedication to the forum. I support your initiative, in addition to being a manager of subscription companies, to take on additional responsibility; it is really worthy of respect. To see what is happening in your country and, at the same time, to be so active
occupation for strong people.

[Gladitorcomeback]

I support your application and i hope we will see you as a Merit source very soon. You spent lot of times here and contributes well. You know which post deserve merit which is not easy task. First time i checked your BPIP profile and interesting to see that despite of so many weekly Merit reward you still not included in Merit source. happy to see so many positive response from Respected members who already support your application and i hope Theymos will consider your application also. best luck

[BenCodie]

I support this application.

As a campaign manager, icopress does a fantastic job in making sure advertisers get good value while participants are fairly paid. As a community member, I find it often that when I hit the "+Merit" button, icopress has done the same thing with high quality posts. I trust icopress to appropriately and responsibly use the power of being a Merit source to help reward users who are contributing impeccable quality content to the forum. Based on support and your profile icopress, I am sure it's a matter of when and not if. Good luck!

[GazetaBitcoin]

I totally support icopress' application for becoming a merit source. He is a very good forum contributor, known for organizing BitcoinTalk Community Awards contest since 2020. At same time, he is also one of the oldest campaign managers of the forum and he manages these campaigns with a strong hand. So far I did not hear about any complaints about him regarding his managerial skills, therefore he must be doing a great job.

And, since being a campaign manager means also to know and follow forum rules very well; and also to properly seek and appreciate quality posts -- these are a very strong point for him for being accepted as merit source. Other than that, as he already mentioned in OP, he already sent 2500 merits to other users. Furthermore, according to bpip, he is the 34th most merited user (and, at same time, he is on 26th place on the ladder of users with most earned merits) and 68th most trusted. Such stats should tell a lot about very very good contributions, taking also into consideration that he reached such stats out of more than 3.5M users of the forum!

Good luck, padawan! May your application be accepted!

[348Judah]

Definitely it's true,  that you are deserving to be a merit source, when we are to consider all that you have done and contributed to the forum, there's a lot to talk about which has led to the required quality potentials a merit source could have, you've brought in alot of opportunities to the forum starting from the initiative of the bitcointalk community award, signature campaign management, activeness on the forum with numerous contributions to the forum, i believe you could be a good candidate to deliver upto expectation to be a merit source if granted the opportunity to serve in this capacity, i wish you best of luck with your application.

[Coyster]

You had everyone thinking you are a merit source before now, including myself, anyway, it is better late than never. I fully support your application and i am pretty sure that most of the users in the forum will, you are a good user and your contributions are pretty obvious for all to see. Well, in the end it is up to Theymos to decide, but i think whenever he decides to add new merit sources, you'd be one of the stronger contenders to get the position, so goodluck.

[notblox1]

Icopress has my full support for new spot of merit source.
He was always helpful, trying to assist everyone whenever he could, and I think he would be great addition in team merit.
His contribution to forum was great so far and I remember him from BitcoinTalk Community Awards and Gambling board.
I had great experience with him as campaign manager and I would always recommend him to everyone.

[albon]

I strongly support Icopress as he is an active member, an expert contributor to the forum, and a well-known campaign manager. This Ukrainian guy is really distinguished and one of the most trusted 100 members in the forum and one of the most merited members. His stats on Bpip.org are really impressive, I wish him all the best and luck, and I hope that his interesting Merit source application will be accepted by theymos, because this old member really deserves it, and he fulfills all the conditions.

[Crypto Library]

Hey, I have been thinking for so long that you are one of the merit sources.  Anyway I am also supporting your application because your dedicatioNS and reputation are also saying that.
The number of forum members is increasing day by day and in the mean time the number of good activities is increasing, so there is no options without merit sources has promote them. So I think the number of merit sources should be increased in the forum. And Icopress  can be one of them . Hope that admin will listed you on the meritsource soon best wishes.

[icopress]

bump

[fillippone]

Actually merit sources are actively managed.
One merit source has just been demoted.
So, good luck with your application!

[aysg76]

Actually merit sources are actively managed.
One merit source has just been demoted.
So, good luck with your application!

If that's the case then @theymos might think about considering new applications as there are many pending and if he finds there's need for another one now with one source being demoted.So best of luck to @icopress with the same from my end also as we might see the list top up with few more sources.

[SamReomo]

Actually merit sources are actively managed.
One merit source has just been demoted.
So, good luck with your application!

If that's the case then @theymos might think about considering new applications as there are many pending and if he finds there's need for another one now with one source being demoted.So best of luck to @icopress with the same from my end also as we might see the list top up with few more sources.

I also think that soon there can be some new members as merit sources, and once again @icopress deserves to be one of them because he has been contributing a lot for the forum and when such members get accepted as merit sources then more merit deserving posts will be merited by such users. I hope that @icopress and some other reputable members of the forum would get accepted in the merit list.

[Learn Bitcoin]

Actually merit sources are actively managed.
One merit source has just been demoted.
So, good luck with your application!

If I am not wrong, I have read somewhere that a merit source also requested theymos to remove him from the merit source position, and I guess it was granted.

Edit: It was Royse777

I also blacklisted myself by requesting theymos from DT1 network, removed myself as one of the merit source. All because to keep myself out of all potential drama that can cause.

Anyways, I am unsure if my vouch/support is worth anything. But I believe Icopress is an established member with good knowledge about the forum and post quality. He is the perfect one when it comes to writing posts. His thread-designing sense is exceptional. You will barely find someone at his level with good design sense. I support Icopress application. I hope the admin will consider his application.

[hugeblack]

Actually merit sources are actively managed.
One merit source has just been demoted.
So, good luck with your application!

Can you provide us with more details? As far as I know, there is no merit source that has been removed in the last 2 years. It may be a request from the member, but merit sources changes are often in a collective form, unless the matter is related to the abuse of merits, such as selling them, for example.

If that's the case then @theymos might think about considering new applications as there are many pending and if he finds there's need for another one now with one source being demoted.So best of luck to @icopress with the same from my end also as we might see the list top up with few more sources.

I remember that the last change was by many merit source requests , as many was saying that there was a shortage of merits and they were increased to 1k sMerits for some accounts.

[fillippone]

Actually merit sources are actively managed.
One merit source has just been demoted.
So, good luck with your application!

Can you provide us with more details?

I haven’t many details about this other than what has been posted on the following message:

Merit bell

Not sure when it happened but today I saw.
1 merit source removed.
Total source merit drops from 33989 to 33940.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=merit;stats=sources

• But the update is, currently "there are 110 merit sources with a total merit generation of up to 33989 sMerit per 30 days"

[1miau]

Sorry for my late reply here, somehow I've missed it to note down that I wanted to reply here.
So, here's my friendly BUMP. 

Of course I'm also in support of icopress to become a Merit Source. It's even very interesting that icopress isn't a Merit source yet.
So far, icopress has proven to be an innovative Signature Campaign Manager by implementing advanced quality post requirements and that's beneficial for the forum as a whole by reducing low-quality posts and at the same time increasing quality posts.
As a very active forum member, icopress comes over many posts and giving him some Merit allocation will result in good posts getting more Merit for sure.
Therefore, I believe icopress is well suited to be a Merit Source. 

[rby]

Re: Icopress ' Merit Source Application ✔️

It seems that icopress just edited this thread and added this icon ✔️. Does this mean that theymos has granted his application? If yes, Congratulations

[icopress]

It seems that icopress just edited this thread and added this icon ✔️. Does this mean that theymos has granted his application? If yes, Congratulations

Sorry if I confused you ... I thought that a thread with some kind of eye-catching symbol would catch admin's eye, that's all.

[dkbit98]

Sorry if I confused you ... I thought that a thread with some kind of eye-catching symbol would catch admin's eye, that's all.

Is that why your avatar keeps mutating?  

I don't think that theymos is paying much attention to colors and symbols.
Try to fix and/or report some forum bug and you will get noticed.

[Agbe]

Sorry if I confused you ... I thought that a thread with some kind of eye-catching symbol would catch admin's eye, that's all.

Is that why your avatar keeps mutating?  

I don't think that theymos is paying much attention to colors and symbols.
Try to fix and/or report some forum bug and you will get noticed.

The Avatar is customized to suit stake. And the face of the Avatar has been multiply and that will become a synecdoche which is using one face to represent the whole. That symbol means "good" and "accepted" and also Symbolize "saluting, hailing". And  literally, others might see it in different ways. And as icopress explained it, the symbol attract eyes before the text. And theymos might see it as a form of hailing.

[1miau]

Sorry if I confused you ... I thought that a thread with some kind of eye-catching symbol would catch admin's eye, that's all.

Is that why your avatar keeps mutating?  
...

The Avatar is customized to suit stake.

So, are you suggesting, icopress is staking his avatar? 
(I could stake my cat as well  )

[Mr.suevie]

It seems that icopress just edited this thread and added this icon ✔️. Does this mean that theymos has granted his application? If yes, Congratulations

Sorry if I confused you ... I thought that a thread with some kind of eye-catching symbol would catch admin's eye, that's all.

Same here, I also support your merit source application and also have the same thought on colours and flashing symbols creating more awareness on someone being notice but I think theymos just doesn't noticed these things but am certain moderators do notice them and with all the support for you on your merit source application I know it's just a matter of time before T-Man grants your wish,@ skeptical chymist can attestify to this although he had his own way of drawing attention @speaking his mind to theymos and boy is he good at it .

[Etranger]

I'm not sure that my support will have any significant effect on the resolution of your request, but I fully approve of your desire to become a merit source, icopress. You have declared yourself as a very qualified campaign manager who carefully selects participants, writing quality posts. Also, you are one of the representatives of the Ukrainian community on the forum, and it would be great if we had our own merit source, it would revive the Ukrainian topic as well.

[Adbitco]

I know there are lots of application on a queue list but haven to see your application made me believe that you might achieved it quickly than the rest, although i can't give the reason why i said so but i just believed is possible.. Maybe due to your participation (Contributions) therefore, i fully support this merits source application.
Wish you good luck and stay safe.

[yhiaali3]

I also add my vote to the list of votes in support of the application submitted by @Icopress to become a source of merit. In the end, the decision is up to Theymos, but the presence of many supporting votes may have an effect.

In addition to being an active and trusted member of the BitcoinTalk community and being one of the most important signature campaign managers on the forum, this qualifies him to be an active merit resource. Certainly, his work as a campaign manager helps him identify good members and good posts that deserve merit.

I wish you success with your application.

[Mpamaegbu]

It's even very interesting that icopress isn't a Merit source yet.

Honestly, I thought the user was a merit source long time ago until now I realized he wasn't. He will make a good choice, no doubt. I support his desire and application with a carton of Heineken and a pot of hot spicy chicken peppery soup. Good luck, Icopress.

[digaran]

IMO, if 2 or 3 DT members / merit sources vouch for an established member to become a source, there is no harm in trusting the already trustworthy DT / merit source members and accept the application, however if it's the matter of not wanting to add more merits in circulation, the new source could get his smerit source allocation from those who vouched for him.😉

[_BlackStar]

My position is still the same – I mean, I will support anyone's wish to become a merit source if they truly deserve to be a merit source. I've come to support the OP as a merit source as I do any other application thread - of course this is because the latest addition of merit sources is necessary to get more outstanding merit and find more different users.

Many applications are still pending - so I think OP will need to be patient to get his turn. In the end I believe that icopress will be one of the merit sources if theymos really want to increase the list of members.

[Lida93]

I am not surprised by the unanimous reception of your application and how people enthusiastically admire your decision to apply for a merit source, you are a man with popular repute in the forum.

You have done that which you should do by applying for a merit source  and not that you desire to be a merit source in your own interest but for the service  and profit of the community for those good posts that deserves merit but are denied because of the insufficient number of merit source in the forum.

 With your addition to the merit source we already have in the forum there's going to be a degree of expansion and it's only necessary that those that wants  to serve be giving the opportunity by the forum admin.

 Icopress, your application has my support.

[Sexylizzy2813]

The user has it all, good rep, always active, contributing to the growth of this Forum and good at coordinating things he's handling. I think he deserves to be one of those merit sources we have here in this Forum, he's a no nonsense person.
He's really up to the task from how he manages his campaign, doesn't let any bad eggs to spoil his business, especially those with red tag. The way he manages his campaign would speak more about him, so I say yes to this Application.
Good luck Mr Icopress

[KingsDen]

My position is still the same – I mean, I will support anyone's wish to become a merit source if they truly deserve to be a merit source. I've come to support the OP as a merit source as I do any other application thread - of course this is because the latest addition of merit sources is necessary to get more outstanding merit and find more different users.

Many applications are still pending - so I think OP will need to be patient to get his turn. In the end I believe that icopress will be one of the merit sources if theymos really want to increase the list of members.

I like your introduction and summary. Very nicely written post. You support anyone's wish to become a merit source only if they deserve it. And you also acknowledged that the forum needs more merit sources. I also support icopress merit source application, not only because of his influence and contribution to the forum, but because he is a campaign manager and he knows what a quality post is. He must have been seeing some while counting posts weekly.

[Danydee]

Yah, icopress merit source very good very nice !    👍

[cygan]

friendly BTCump
so that this ms-application doesn't fall into oblivion, i bring it back to the top with this post and hope that my homie from the east @icopress will get the permission to serve as merit source in the whole forum someday

[paid2]

Bump amical 

I strongly support the application of icopress as a merit source. His ability to review posts, his deep knowledge of the forum and the community, would^(will!) make him a great source for sure. Good luck!

[digaran]

I don't know if anyone here really understands this, vouching for someone to become a source is useless, because admin does the review/audit the applicants personally, then decides whether to accept or not.

What would be constructive contribution is to find any reason why someone should not become a source.
The way you bump this means you benefit from OP becoming a source, then your vouches would lose their credibility.😉

[Learn Bitcoin]

I don't know if anyone here really understands this, vouching for someone to become a source is useless, because admin does the review/audit the applicants personally, then decides whether to accept or not.

If you don't know, I want to let you know that admins care about community feedback, which is why the admins themselves asked users to create an application thread with ten posts that deserve merits. Of course, admins also check the support of the community. This is why it's a community. Of course, admins are influenced by the community members.

What would be constructive contribution is to find any reason why someone should not become a source.

Most of the guys who created the Merit source application thread are established enough and proved themself by contributing to the forum for a couple of years. If you have any reason not to support their application, feel free to point it out, but don't encourage others to find negativity.

The way you bump this means you benefit from OP becoming a source, then your vouches would lose their credibility.😉

Don't take it negatively. Their vouches show that the community will profit if he becomes a merit source, not any particular person. Their vouches show the need for another merit source.

[SmartGold01]

Don't take it negatively. Their vouches show that the community will profit if he becomes a merit source, not any particular person. Their vouches show the need for another merit source.

I still can't tell why Theymos has became silent on picking out merits source to the forum especially to local board as well. I have been trying to understand why he is not paying attention anymore or could it be he has just decided to quit accepting and appointing more source to the forum or what, I think there are lots of spaces where I think merits source should play a vital role but this no signs and efforts to oversee the people's plight towards their interest on becoming a source. However I have never been in a deep discussion with op @Icopress neither has he accepted me in his campaign before if I am not mistakenly but, I want to say I openly support his application to become a merits source hope to see him extend his hands to everyone just as some other people are being generous with their power.
Good luck Icopress.

[Learn Bitcoin]

Don't take it negatively. Their vouches show that the community will profit if he becomes a merit source, not any particular person. Their vouches show the need for another merit source.

I still can't tell why Theymos has became silent on picking out merits source to the forum especially to local board as well. I have been trying to understand why he is not paying attention anymore or could it be he has just decided to quit accepting and appointing more source to the forum or what.

The forum admins and Global moderators have never been too open regarding these things. It is about appointing merit sources and other forum-related things like creating a new local sub-forum, banning appeal threads, etc. It's not like that they did not see the applications. They have seen the application, but they don't feel it's necessary right now. You will likely see their response once things get approved. As Icopress also mentioned in the OP, when theymos appoints a new merit source, he will look for an application thread in meta, which is why Icopress created this thread. 

[SmartGold01]

Don't take it negatively. Their vouches show that the community will profit if he becomes a merit source, not any particular person. Their vouches show the need for another merit source.

I still can't tell why Theymos has became silent on picking out merits source to the forum especially to local board as well. I have been trying to understand why he is not paying attention anymore or could it be he has just decided to quit accepting and appointing more source to the forum or what.

The forum admins and Global moderators have never been too open regarding these things. It is about appointing merit sources and other forum-related things like creating a new local sub-forum, banning appeal threads, etc. It's not like that they did not see the applications. They have seen the application, but they don't feel it's necessary right now. You will likely see their response once things get approved. As Icopress also mentioned in the OP, when theymos appoints a new merit source, he will look for an application thread in meta, which is why Icopress created this thread. 

Then making it open for everyone to know that the forum doesn't need any merits source application for now so that people won't keep applying for a source while the forum doesn't honor them. It's better the mod or admin make it clear to air and to everyone who has intention for such application to hold still than writing without approval. If you check at the meta section you would understand that there are series of application pipeline waiting to be approved but yet no response from either theymos regarding on their application progress.

[Shamm]

Don't take it negatively. Their vouches show that the community will profit if he becomes a merit source, not any particular person. Their vouches show the need for another merit source.

I still can't tell why Theymos has became silent on picking out merits source to the forum especially to local board as well. I have been trying to understand why he is not paying attention anymore or could it be he has just decided to quit accepting and appointing more source to the forum or what.

The forum admins and Global moderators have never been too open regarding these things. It is about appointing merit sources and other forum-related things like creating a new local sub-forum, banning appeal threads, etc. It's not like that they did not see the applications. They have seen the application, but they don't feel it's necessary right now. You will likely see their response once things get approved. As Icopress also mentioned in the OP, when theymos appoints a new merit source, he will look for an application thread in meta, which is why Icopress created this thread. 

Then making it open for everyone to know that the forum doesn't need any merits source application for now so that people won't keep applying for a source while the forum doesn't honor them. It's better the mod or admin make it clear to air and to everyone who has intention for such application to hold still than writing without approval. If you check at the meta section you would understand that there are series of application pipeline waiting to be approved but yet no response from either theymos regarding on their application progress.

There many applications who still pending and did not yet accepted nor declined but anyways I support Icopress for becoming a merit source as we all know that he done so many good things here in forum also he is one of the trusted mangers here in our community, hoping that admin will take a look at the applications and decide if who are the eligible user to become a new merit source.
Icopress just still keep moving forward and someday you will be notice and accept as Merit source,

Good luck mate.

[SmartGold01]

Don't take it negatively. Their vouches show that the community will profit if he becomes a merit source, not any particular person. Their vouches show the need for another merit source.

I still can't tell why Theymos has became silent on picking out merits source to the forum especially to local board as well. I have been trying to understand why he is not paying attention anymore or could it be he has just decided to quit accepting and appointing more source to the forum or what.

The forum admins and Global moderators have never been too open regarding these things. It is about appointing merit sources and other forum-related things like creating a new local sub-forum, banning appeal threads, etc. It's not like that they did not see the applications. They have seen the application, but they don't feel it's necessary right now. You will likely see their response once things get approved. As Icopress also mentioned in the OP, when theymos appoints a new merit source, he will look for an application thread in meta, which is why Icopress created this thread. 

Then making it open for everyone to know that the forum doesn't need any merits source application for now so that people won't keep applying for a source while the forum doesn't honor them. It's better the mod or admin make it clear to air and to everyone who has intention for such application to hold still than writing without approval. If you check at the meta section you would understand that there are series of application pipeline waiting to be approved but yet no response from either theymos regarding on their application progress.

There many applications who still pending and did not yet accepted nor declined but anyways I support Icopress for becoming a merit source as we all know that he done so many good things here in forum also he is one of the trusted mangers here in our community, hoping that admin will take a look at the applications and decide if who are the eligible user to become a new merit source.
Icopress just still keep moving forward and someday you will be notice and accept as Merit source,

Good luck mate.

Though have also seen those who are eligible enough become a merits source but what I noticed or do I say sense is that theymos doesn't give a merits source according to how helpful you have been to forum or generous someone could be because I have seen those that are merits source they don't possess enough quality than Icopress or to even those that are already presented their merits source application. But still I hope theymos just devote his time to go through those application to accept them especially those that applied on a local board application to be approved.

[Sandra_hakeem]

Isn't it time for the Old man to select from the lots he has??.. we seem to have an abundance of inflow per annum but, the distribution is poor.. seen a couple of good writers down the hillside, struggling Thier way out... Peeps be saying that any submitted post without merit gets merited, ONLY IF IT'S WORTH IT... Exactly!! - the truth is, everyone's got their standards... Ratimov might see 'em as a bravo buh, Chymist might be abit objectional... LoyceV would definitely not see any regular shit like that; wouldn't even say a word assuming he's been tagged on it.... (That's just an assumption anyways)
in conclusion, I think it's right about time for Theymos.. I believe he sees this too.

Sandra 🧑‍🦰

[Learn Bitcoin]

The forum admins and Global moderators have never been too open regarding these things. It is about appointing merit sources and other forum-related things like creating a new local sub-forum, banning appeal threads, etc. It's not like that they did not see the applications. They have seen the application, but they don't feel it's necessary right now. You will likely see their response once things get approved. As Icopress also mentioned in the OP, when theymos appoints a new merit source, he will look for an application thread in meta, which is why Icopress created this thread. 

Then making it open for everyone to know that the forum doesn't need any merits source application for now so that people won't keep applying for a source while the forum doesn't honor them. It's better the mod or admin make it clear to air and to everyone who has intention for such application to hold still than writing without approval. If you check at the meta section you would understand that there are series of application pipeline waiting to be approved but yet no response from either theymos regarding on their application progress.

The decision is not in our hands, right? All we can do is suggest them and influence them. Probably, they don't need a merit source right now, but of course, they have a plan to appoint merit source in the future, and theymos does not want to ask them to create a application thread. Instead, he will choose a merit source from existing applications. This is the reason why they do not ask them not to create application thread. Another reason is freedom. If you see someone created a merit source application thread and you want to create as well, if they don't allow, you may say they are maintaining some double standard. I hope that make sense.

[virasog]

friendly BTCump
so that this ms-application doesn't fall into oblivion, i bring it back to the top with this post and hope that my homie from the east @icopress will get the permission to serve as merit source in the whole forum someday

Almost three months have gone since the icopress applied his application for the merit sources. I have not read any single post not voting for him to the merit source. But still, the decision is pending from theymos end. I do not know how long he would have to wait before becoming a merit source.

In my point of view, there are few people who deserve to be merit sources, as they are doing some great work for the community and he is one of them.

[icopress]

Bump 

[examplens]

..

Oh man, I was convinced that you were already a merit source. You seem to understand the forum well, it would be logical to see you in this role.
If my support means anything, you have it. 

[DYING_S0UL]

The forum admins and Global moderators have never been too open regarding these things. It is about appointing merit sources and other forum-related things like creating a new local sub-forum, banning appeal threads, etc. It's not like that they did not see the applications. They have seen the application, but they don't feel it's necessary right now. You will likely see their response once things get approved. As Icopress also mentioned in the OP, when theymos appoints a new merit source, he will look for an application thread in meta, which is why Icopress created this thread. 

I think, theymos sees everything. He is the house master. Of course, he knows what's going on his house. It's just he responds vary rarely when it comes to the changes of the forum. I think, it's a way of him to choose the right candidate. Like observing a person for months or years, making sure everything is ok and then appointing a merit source. If he made this decision hastily  there wouldn't be any merit source application left. Anyway, when was the last merit source appointed? A year ago? Can't remember.

[digaran]

Anyway, when was the last merit source appointed? A year ago? Can't remember.

It might have been very recently, one source was removed, one was added.
Regarding OP, I can only say my experience, I haven't followed them to check other things, but one thing which really made a difference was meriting someone threatening me with negative feedback, and that was the green light for Nurotic fish or a name like that to go on with the tag.

I don't say OP is a scammer or untrustworthy, no, he is just a bit extreme bias IMO. and some people when saw his merit, they backed off from that case because OP is a known campaign manager. So I would say consider these facts first.

[Poker Player]

Blah, blah, blah. Bullshit paid signature spamming.

I am sure that theymos will take into deep consideration your arguments, I mean your bullshit spam, to decide if he appoints icopress as a merit source or not. 
Especially with how trustworthy you are. Besides, I have given you a reason so you can answer me with garbage and you can continue filling your spam quota week.

[Hhampuz]

icopress, I'm late to the party but since this is being bumped I'll throw in my 2 satoshi below:

Anyone who spends a lot of time at this forum reading post upon post and creating content to ensure they keep reading posts deserve to be a merit source. Even though you come across many good users (as evident by your campaigns), I'm certain you can see the difference between who deserves a merit here or there and who doesn't. Not saying you'll only need to or have to give merit to people who join your promotions, participate in your campaigns or otherwise but you may read many posts that are good but for one reason or another gets overlooked. You seem like a capable user on your own merit, too, and a valued member of this here community.

Needless to say, I am in support of this merit source application and I think you would be a fine addition to the current source gang.

[Poker Player]

Not saying you'll only need to or have to give merit to people who join your promotions, participate in your campaigns or otherwise but you may read many posts that are good but for one reason or another gets overlooked. 

I have only worked on campaigns managed by icopress for a long time and if you look at the merit history he has given me you will see that he has only given me merit at specific times for quality posts. I believe this is general. He is not biased at all on that. Regardless of whether you work on his campaigns or not, in general he tends to give merits to quality posts, although that estimation obviously has a subjective component.

[BabyBandit]

Bump  

Hey icopress, very good application. I hope you will reach the goal and get the role as a merit source. But why do you want to be a merit source? If you want to answer...I'm asking with all kindness.

- Regards BabyB. 👼

[EarnOnVictor]

The forum admins and Global moderators have never been too open regarding these things. It is about appointing merit sources and other forum-related things like creating a new local sub-forum, banning appeal threads, etc. It's not like that they did not see the applications. They have seen the application, but they don't feel it's necessary right now. You will likely see their response once things get approved. As Icopress also mentioned in the OP, when theymos appoints a new merit source, he will look for an application thread in meta, which is why Icopress created this thread. 

I think, theymos sees everything. He is the house master. Of course, he knows what's going on his house. It's just he responds vary rarely when it comes to the changes of the forum. I think, it's a way of him to choose the right candidate. Like observing a person for months or years, making sure everything is ok and then appointing a merit source. If he made this decision hastily  there wouldn't be any merit source application left. Anyway, when was the last merit source appointed? A year ago? Can't remember.

I do hear stories from the senior ones here, and with my conclusion, I know that theymos is working, he is adding and removing the amount apportioned to some merits sources. His actions might be easy to know as those who are not performing their duties in this regard might have their sMerits amount reduced, but for those who are doing well, he might add if need be.

For doing this, I know he has not left the forum for once and has been reading applications and queries of people, and in due time, he will act appropriately. About the last time sMerits was apportioned, I can't remember, but all I could also conclude is that it could be in 2024 for the sMerit approval to be made known.

He has his even pattern.

[Shenanigan]

I believe that a person can perform his duties well only when he is busy with only one thing.

I don't know is OP a merit-source or not. But I see that he wants to do all the things at once: to be both a merit-sourcer and an organizer of competitions

It's bad when a person has too much to do. It is necessary for a person to have only one thing that he does well

Organizing competitions and counting votes is too painstaking and time-consuming for merit-sourser

[paid2]

I believe that a person can perform his duties well only when he is busy with only one thing.

I don't know is OP a merit-source or not. But I see that he wants to do all the things at once: to be both a merit-sourcer and an organizer of competitions

It's bad when a person has too much to do. It is necessary for a person to have only one thing that he does well

Organizing competitions and counting votes is too painstaking and time-consuming for merit-sourser

Don't you think it's a bit pretentious to claim to know better than OP whether he'll be able to manage all this or not?
For the time being, we can all see that he's effective when it comes to multitasking. Between the campaigns, the competitions and his activity on the forum, we can see that everything's working well.

+ now that Ratimov is no longer a source, it makes even more sense to add a new source.

[Shenanigan]

I believe that meritsourser should not be involved in extraneous matters. This may affect the quality of distribution of merits.

Too much money is involved in this competition (BCA 2023).
Where are the guarantees that this meritsources icopress is not an interested party?

By the way, is icopress a meritsourcer or not?

[Rikafip]

By the way, is icopress a meritsourcer or not?

So you didn't even bother to check what's this thread all about? Well, that explains some of the posts that you wrote here.

Please stay away from the things that you know nothing about or at least have a decency to inform yourself before coming here and sharing an opinion.

[Don Pedro Dinero]

I don't know is OP a merit-source or not.

By the way, is icopress a meritsourcer or not?

If you don't get the gist of it, how can you expect us to give any credibility to anything you say at all.

It's amazing how many people on the forum comment and not only don't know about the comments on the first page, they don't even know what the title and the OP say.

I'm going to explain it to you so that even my 9 year old nephew can understand: this is a thread in which icopress apllies for a merit source. And can you imagine why he does it? Just think.

Because he is not a merit source.

Let's see if you understand.

So you didn't even bother to check what's this thread all about? Well, that explains some of the posts that you written here.

Please stay away from the things that you know nothing about or at least inform yourserself before coming here and sharing an opinion.

The bad news is that his is not an isolated case, far from it.

[Shenanigan]

Because he is not a merit source.

Okay. It's clear.

I’m sure that he’s a good guy, but still let he choose one thing - either meritsourcing or competition organizations. Simple folks look and envy when so much power falls into one hand. Some kind of centralization is obtained again

The bad news is that his is not an isolated case, far from it.

It would be better if you created a list of active meritsourcers so that everything is clear to everyone.

[Learn Bitcoin]

Like observing a person for months or years, making sure everything is ok and then appointing a merit source. If he made this decision hastily  there wouldn't be any merit source application left.

I guess theymos takes that much time because he doesn't't feel the necessity of appointing a merit sournt. But he does not want to disappoint anyone. He might appoint a new merit source in the future and he is sure about it. This is why he ask candidates to create their appeal thread.

Anyway, when was the last merit source appointed? A year ago? Can't remember.

I don't know. I am not sure even if I was there or not. I don't remember if I have seen any new merit sources.

[Bureau]

Hasn't he recently become a DT1 user with all those who are active on their local boards? I do not think he should be given a Merit source application as he tends to misuse it. Being said that the way he has been arguing with another BM is not good. If given the authority of merit source he will use it for his own benefit. I think the BM should be removed from becoming a DT1 as this would make them more loyal towards a project and disloyal towards the forum.

[Shenanigan]

I do not think he should be given a Merit source application as he tends to misuse it. Being said that the way he has been arguing with another BM is not good. If given the authority of merit source he will use it for his own benefit. I think the BM should be removed from becoming a DT1 as this would make them more loyal towards a project and disloyal towards the forum.

Exactly

icopress doesn't inspire confidence in me. In the last competition, he excluded from his competition the votes of those he personally did not like. But no one attached any importance to this then. But this was a fact of vote manipulation

The people whose votes icopress excluded simply voted in vain in his contest. After that, people felt like icopress pissed in their mouths

And now this impudent person icopress has the audacity to ask people to consider his application?

[Shenanigan]

Do you have any proof for your claims? If you don't have any, then why are you really here?

Hello digaran

There is a proof. The votes of these people were blatantly excluded from the last competition (BCA 2021):

marilynmanson21, techearn17, palle11, AnonBitCoiner, Tigerheart3026, aylabadia05, zahed, shawonngp, Rigon, Bobrox, bussybuddy, JeWay, superman184, robattfield, mrjoy15, beveryu778, Mr.Scott, tarable, qqwx, , airfinex, Tumanggor,  BobK71, mdzahed134, bounceback, BTC_Mouse, lifeOK, MJSO22, sifat08, Mups099, ZAINmalik75, Shussainshah, mumang siat, Erumo, musafar37, Teletalk.org, Marykeller, packagemission, preikaler

[Don Pedro Dinero]

Hasn't he recently become a DT1 user with all those who are active on their local boards? I do not think he should be given a Merit source application as he tends to misuse it. Being said that the way he has been arguing with another BM is not good. If given the authority of merit source he will use it for his own benefit. I think the BM should be removed from becoming a DT1 as this would make them more loyal towards a project and disloyal towards the forum.

That's a wonderful shitty argument you just made. Congratz coz I don't think anyone is going to waste much time even trying to dismantle it.

icopress doesn't inspire confidence in me.

It's OK. You're the one who doesn't inspire confidence in me, since you start talking in this thread without knowing what the main topic is about. And I don't think I'm the only one who doesn't trust you.

[examplens]

I believe that a person can perform his duties well only when he is busy with only one thing.

I don't know is OP a merit-source or not. But I see that he wants to do all the things at once: to be both a merit-sourcer and an organizer of competitions

It's bad when a person has too much to do. It is necessary for a person to have only one thing that he does well

Organizing competitions and counting votes is too painstaking and time-consuming for merit-sourser

Open your eyes and you will see that there are people who have more than a single core in their heads.
Have you ever wondered how some people who play the guitar (and I'm sure you've heard that there are such people) may use both hands and completely independent movements of each hand/fingers, yet quite synchronized?

[GazetaBitcoin]

Now I understand why all his competitions are so unfair

Which are all these competitions? And how are they unfair?

[decodx]

I knew there was something wrong with icopress. Now I understand why all his competitions are so unfair

Now, I understand. You're some alt playing the newbie card. Just a few days back, you lied about not even knowing what "merits" are. And here you are, trolling icopress's merit source application for no good reason. What's your deal? Why the act?

[Shenanigan]

Now, I understand. You're some alt playing the newbie card.

LOL.  
Yes I've been reading the forum for a long time, but I am registered at january 2023  
What's the problem?  

you lied about not even knowing what "merits" are.

I remembered that I know what merits are  
What's the problem?  

And here you are, trolling icopress's merit source application for no good reason. What's your deal? Why the act?

I'm talking not only about icopress. I discuss and will be criticize anyone who will be involved in shenanigans


Because I hate shenanigans

[paid2]

I'm talking not only about icopress. I discuss and will be criticize anyone who will be involved in shenanigans

Still waiting for the proofs.

Why don't you answer ?

Which are all these competitions? And how are they unfair?

[GazetaBitcoin]

Okay, so let me see if I et this straight: so at first you directly accuse icopress of something:

Now I understand why all his competitions are so unfair

You bring no proof for your statements. Then you take the approach "I did not say anything, he did":

Royse777 said that icopress involved into some shenanigans.

So anyway, what are these shenanigans and what's their relation to the competitions organized by icopress; and, again, how are these competitions unfair? As far as I remember, Royse did not state anything about any competition organized by icopress.

OMG! What a shame!

What shame?

Look, Shenanigan, the more you type, the more you appear to be a troll. Now I don't know if you are aware, but trolling is not permitted on this forum:

3. No trolling.

[Shenanigan]

Hey trolls, don't take the topic aside and don't shy away from commenting on the main topic. I don't buy your offtopics, look for the fools  

Don't force me to go bad and expose what you two do behind the scene (the template, scripts - guess what I mean).

Royse777 said that icopress involved into some shenanigans. If this is true, then icopress don't deserve to be a meritsourcer

OMG! What a shame!

[GazetaBitcoin]

Hey trolls

Who is trolling here except you?

don't take the topic aside and don't shy away from commenting on the main topic. I don't buy your offtopics, look for the fools  

Then you admit that this statement of yours is also off-topic?

Now I understand why all his competitions are so unfair

If so, you are breaking another forum rule:

2. No off-topic posts.

Don't force me to go bad and expose what you two do behind the scene (the template, scripts - guess what I mean).

Royse777 said that icopress involved into some shenanigans. If this is true, then icopress don't deserve to be a meritsourcer

OMG! What a shame!

Why do you repeat yourself like a parrot? Instead, you should explain what competitions of icopress are unfair. And how.

[Shenanigan]

Instead, you should explain what competitions of icopress are unfair. And how.

Because this is an offtopic in this thread. Stop provoking offtopic, trolls

Still waiting for the proofs.
Why don't you answer ?

I am still waiting for the comments too
Why don't you answer to quoted post below?:

Royse777 said about icopress and GazetaBitcoin:

Don't force me to go bad and expose what you two do behind the scene (the template, scripts - guess what I mean).

[tread93]

Can we still apply to become a merit source? I have recently been given the suggestion to partake but it looks like the thread has gotten way off topic and maybe even some people are arguing but before I go spending all this time accumulating all of these merit worthy posts I want to be sure that I would still have a shot to be accepted if spots are still availible....

[Don Pedro Dinero]

Can we still apply to become a merit source?

You can. What happens is that theymos takes a long time to appoint new merit sources, it can take years. But if you are interested I would take the chance. But let's not talk about this here anymore as there is enough off-topic already, although the good thing for the OP is that every time someone replies here his application gets bumped.

And by the way, I have commented several times on the thread and I realised that I hadn't explicitly said yet that I support his application. I think his choice of threads is good, and in general on my local board we think highly of him, so I think if he is finally appointed merit source he will do well.

[JollyGood]

Yes he is an alt-account pretending to be a newbie. I doubt he will answer your questions or announce which other accounts he operates or why he is acting this way.

He has been posting in far too many threads that newbies would otherwise not post in. Also, the number of times he asks questions pretending to be innocent/new to the forum (yet clearly knows everything beforehand) is becoming quite boring, therefore that played a part when I tagged his account.

Back to the subject of icopress and his application for merit source, I hope he will receive good news soon. As mentioned in another merit source application thread, I am thinking of applying too.

I knew there was something wrong with icopress. Now I understand why all his competitions are so unfair

Now, I understand. You're some alt playing the newbie card. Just a few days back, you lied about not even knowing what "merits" are. And here you are, trolling icopress's merit source application for no good reason. What's your deal? Why the act?

[wallet4bitcoin]

Looking into the thread I notice that it has veered off the topic for which it was or has been created. Icopress, in my opinion, deserves to be a Merit Source but the forum admins know better.

I don't see why there is so much cloud around his competence and credibility. I know the number of campaigns he currently has under his sleeves may not account for his persona but considering his degree of coverage in the forum, I support his application.

Or has he been made a source already?

[JollyGood]

That is a sad side-effect of what happens when trolls and nefarious actors post a barrage of nonsensical text. When replies are made to address and question the trolls, it does inevitably take us away from the essence of the thread.

There is zero cloud around icopress and his application to become merit source because he has competence and credibility in abundance (and he has displayed that over a number of years). The issue is one that can only be accepted or declined by theymos, other than that it seems the vast majority of members support the application.

Looking into the thread I notice that it has veered off the topic for which it was or has been created. Icopress, in my opinion, deserves to be a Merit Source but the forum admins know better.

I don't see why there is so much cloud around his competence and credibility. I know the number of campaigns he currently has under his sleeves may not account for his persona but considering his degree of coverage in the forum, I support his application.

Or has he been made a source already?

[icopress]

bump

[Inwestour]

I have worked with icopress many times, and always remained only the best impressions. icopress is competent in many areas, so I have no doubt that it will be an excellent merit source. I see that he is active in several locales, which should also benefit the entire forum. Of those users who would now like to become a merit source, I do not know a more worthy candidate, who could apply for this place.

I believe that icopress can become an excellent merit source, and that its applications will be accepted in the near future.

[m2017]

If someone wants to speak up, don't be shy. 

Mine will speak.

For how long do you want to become a merit source? I mean, how quickly will you get tired of playing it?

There was that one character in the local section with a past as a merit source and who ended his activity on the forum on a negative note. It seems to me that all his activities with the role of a merit source were only to satisfy personal selfish goals on the forum. He played around with the activities of the merit source and eventually abandoned it. You won’t say in a year or a little later that you’ve had enough and ask to be relieved of these responsibilities, right?

Will your activity as a bounty campaign manager interfere with your role as a merit source and vice versa? Or is this a way to combine one with the other for the benefit of promotion?

In my opinion, when recruiting another merit source, one more requirement should be added - “this forum user must be free from any third-party activities, such as the role of a bounty campaign manager and the like, in order to avoid abuse of some job responsibilities for the sake of gaining benefits in others.” Let's be honest, the merit source will allow you to spam the forum with your nickname anywhere and everywhere, which will have a positive effect on the advertising of your services.

[examplens]

Well, considering that Ratimov, as a merit source from the Russian board, withdrew from the forum with all his privileges, It seems quite logical to me that icopress should take its place. As far as I know, he is active in the Russian local board, I'm even convinced that he would manage such an opportunity better than the previous ^Ratimov one.

note: However, I'm not a regular visitor to that part of the forum, I almost don't even know which of the more reputable members is from there.

[BlackHatCoiner]

Give that man the merit source, please. He is more than established and competent for that position.

[paid2]

Friendly bump, as I think the forum still need more reliable sources

[JollyGood]

I am glad the thread was bumped. icopress created the thread in July 2023 therefore it is approximately seven months ago and there is no estimated time before he is advised if the application has been accepted or rejected.

As there are far too many merit sources at the moment it seems there is an understandable lack of urgency on part of theymos to process this and other applications. I hope he receives a positive outcome soon.

Friendly bump, as I think the forum still need more reliable sources

[SamReomo]

I think Theymos should consider Icopress's merit source application because he's a very active member of the forum and he's doing a great job. Although, there are some other good merit source applications but I think this one needs some special attention because Icopress has been doing very good on the forum and if he becomes a merit source then he can help so many members by meriting their good posts.

[Etranger]

... because Icopress has been doing very good on the forum and if he becomes a merit source then he can help so many members by meriting their good posts.

I believe, he is already doing this, he follows a lot of users, especially those, who are members of the signature campaigns he manages. But of course with the opportunities if a merit course he would be able to do more, appreciate more quality users and motivate them to to their best here in the forum. I think he has a decent understanding of who deserves merits. And this is exactly the quality that the merit source needs.

[criptoevangelista]

Even though I'm a relatively new user here on the forum (I've only been here for a few months), I always see @icopress participation as a positive contribution to the entire bitcoin talk community, which is why I support him in this candidacy and I'm absolutely certain that he will do good work, contributing and encouraging all good users to contribute even more.

[BenCodie]

I support this application.

As a campaign manager, icopress does a fantastic job in making sure advertisers get good value while participants are fairly paid. As a community member, I find it often that when I hit the "+Merit" button, icopress has done the same thing with high quality posts. I trust icopress to appropriately and responsibly use the power of being a Merit source to help reward users who are contributing impeccable quality content to the forum. Based on support and your profile icopress, I am sure it's a matter of when and not if. Good luck!

I retract this support.

Since supporting icopress, I have only noticed more and more that he is here to favor his own interests with advertisers and that the community is not truly first priority for him. It is fine to make a business from bitcointalk. If you want to do that and prioritize the business over the community however, then you do not deserve to be a merit source...

If icopress is made a merit source, you can be very sure that merit distribution will be biased and influenced by icopress' business interests. There is no way that it will not be influenced by their business interests, and it would be naive to think that icopress will take an unbiased approach to merit distribution.

There are many better members out there to support or to encourage to make an application for being a merit source over icopress.

[Poker Player]

Since supporting icopress, I have only noticed more and more that he is here to favor his own interests with advertisers and that the community is not truly first priority for him.

Do you mean that you, with your (supposed) super high IQ, do put the interests of the community first by wearing a casino advertisement in your signature, while saying this?

As for the question if gambling is unethical - it undoubtedly is. Casinos, gambling, etc have always been unethical. Why do you think some countries outright ban gambling activities? Because it's exploitative.

...

If you really think the gambling board is as ethical as other boards this forum contains, you're out of touch with basic ethics and probably lost in the casino sauce.

You're not here to give many ethics lessons yourself. I'll summarize it for you in a sentence, which is not mine:

Lol, guy that is willing to promote something that he thinks is highly unethical and exploitative for a little bit of bitcoin will teach us about ethics.  

[m2017]

It is fine to make a business from bitcointalk. If you want to do that and prioritize the business over the community however, then you do not deserve to be a merit source...

I am of the same opinion that there should be a clear distinction between the business role (bounty manager) and the merit-source (volunteer activity) to avoid conflicts of interest. In my opinion, combining the role of a company manager and a merchant will inevitably lead to abuse of power opportunity. Should clearly separate flies from cutlets / bees from honey.

I am firmly convinced that in the conditions for the appointment of a merit-source there should be a clause "a candidate for the role of a merit-source must NOT have any business-related activities".

[BenCodie]

Since supporting icopress, I have only noticed more and more that he is here to favor his own interests with advertisers and that the community is not truly first priority for him.

Do you mean that you, with your (supposed) super high IQ, do put the interests of the community first by wearing a casino advertisement in your signature, while saying this?

As for the question if gambling is unethical - it undoubtedly is. Casinos, gambling, etc have always been unethical. Why do you think some countries outright ban gambling activities? Because it's exploitative.

...

If you really think the gambling board is as ethical as other boards this forum contains, you're out of touch with basic ethics and probably lost in the casino sauce.

You're not here to give many ethics lessons yourself. I'll summarize it for you in a sentence, which is not mine:

Lol, guy that is willing to promote something that he thinks is highly unethical and exploitative for a little bit of bitcoin will teach us about ethics. 

I'm not giving ethics lessons...I'm stating the change in my opinion..

As for the rest of your post, this has already been discussed elsewhere. If you want to rehash that conversation, you can go to the relevant thread. I personally have already responded to it, the community and I have moved on...otherwise it'd still be a conversation.

I must say that I do like that the best you can do in attempt to invalidate my opinion is a set of quotes from August of 2023. That says a lot in itself. You're a very cute member and I enjoy your ongoing entertainment.

It is fine to make a business from bitcointalk. If you want to do that and prioritize the business over the community however, then you do not deserve to be a merit source...

I am of the same opinion that there should be a clear distinction between the business role (bounty manager) and the merit-source (volunteer activity) to avoid conflicts of interest. In my opinion, combining the role of a company manager and a merchant will inevitably lead to abuse of power opportunity. Should clearly separate flies from cutlets / bees from honey.

I am firmly convinced that in the conditions for the appointment of a merit-source there should be a clause "a candidate for the role of a merit-source must NOT have any business-related activities".

I 100% agree with you and I am pleased to see a fellow member sharing their honest opinion. Refreshing, and very well said. Kudos!

[fillippone]

I vouch for this application, as I think I already stated.
Also, given recent events, I guess at least a couple of (quite Heavy) merit sources have been demoted.
There might be space for a new one, and I think @icopress ticks all the boxes. 

[The Sceptical Chymist]

Also, given recent events, I guess at least a couple of (quite Heavy) merit sources have been demoted.

Don't know how far out of the loop I've been, but what events are you referring to, and who are these 'heavy' merit sources that might have been demoted?  O_e_l_e_o was one if I'm not mistaken, but he left the forum of his own accord and that wouldn't qualify as a demotion (but it would leave an open slot as far as I'm concerned).

I am firmly convinced that in the conditions for the appointment of a merit-source there should be a clause "a candidate for the role of a merit-source must NOT have any business-related activities".

Em, again....did I miss something with icopress mixing his campaign management with something he shouldn't have?  Is there any substance to the argument that he'd misuse the source sMerits he'd be allotted were he to be made a merit source? 

As far as that proposed requirement above, a lot of members have some sort of "business-related activities" and if Theymos were to assume that there would automatically be a conflict of interest, that there would be merit abuse because of those business activities, the list of merit sources would likely consist of drooling morons below Full Member rank who couldn't tell what a good post looks like.  In other words, it's not a good suggestion.  No offense.

[fillippone]

Also, given recent events, I guess at least a couple of (quite Heavy) merit sources have been demoted.

Don't know how far out of the loop I've been, but what events are you referring to, and who are these 'heavy' merit sources that might have been demoted?  O_e_l_e_o was one if I'm not mistaken, but he left the forum of his own accord and that wouldn't qualify as a demotion (but it would leave an open slot as far as I'm concerned).

Yeah, I have been referring to o_e_l_e_o. Of course he wasn’t demoted, but practically the effect is the same.
As far as I know after Ratimov also gave up his status, only a small Merit Source has been appointed (or someone had his stash improved by 200 or so)
 
The situation is the following:

Merit sources

There are 109 merit sources with a total merit generation of up to 33140 sMerit per 30 days

[m2017]

Em, again....did I miss something with icopress mixing his campaign management with something he shouldn't have?  Is there any substance to the argument that he'd misuse the source sMerits he'd be allotted were he to be made a merit source? 

I have nothing against @icopress personally and his activities as a bounty manager. It is his personal right to choose what type of activity to engage in and what projects to promote on the forum. But if my voice could influence anything, then I would vote against his (as well as any other forum member involved in bounty campaign management) candidacy for the role of merit-source while he is an active bounty manager.

As far as that proposed requirement above, a lot of members have some sort of "business-related activities" and if Theymos were to assume that there would automatically be a conflict of interest, that there would be merit abuse because of those business activities, the list of merit sources would likely consist of drooling morons below Full Member rank who couldn't tell what a good post looks like.  In other words, it's not a good suggestion.  No offense.

Not all good proposals will have a positive impact on the community, and not all bad proposals will be harmful. I’m not saying to ban any business activity (other types of activities should be discussed in a separate topic) for merit-sources, but only the role of a bounty manager. I consider the activities of a bounty manager with merit-sources unacceptable.

I don't claim to be the only correct and true opinion/suggestion, but only an honest one. I expressed what I thought about this. Some will agree with me, some will not. This is normal. The purpose of a forum is to speak out and discuss, and then on the basis of this the best solution for the community will be formed.


There is a simple and effective way to check the trustworthiness of intentions any candidate for merit-sources. If the user is ready to give up the role of bounty manager completely (at least for the period of assignment assumes the role of merit-source), then he is worthy of this role. This will demonstrate the “purity” of intentions for the period of service in the role of merit-source, for this is in a sense a volunteer activity.

[philipma1957]

Em, again....did I miss something with icopress mixing his campaign management with something he shouldn't have?  Is there any substance to the argument that he'd misuse the source sMerits he'd be allotted were he to be made a merit source? 

I have nothing against @icopress personally and his activities as a bounty manager. It is his personal right to choose what type of activity to engage in and what projects to promote on the forum. But if my voice could influence anything, then I would vote against his (as well as any other forum member involved in bounty campaign management) candidacy for the role of merit-source while he is an active bounty manager.

As far as that proposed requirement above, a lot of members have some sort of "business-related activities" and if Theymos were to assume that there would automatically be a conflict of interest, that there would be merit abuse because of those business activities, the list of merit sources would likely consist of drooling morons below Full Member rank who couldn't tell what a good post looks like.  In other words, it's not a good suggestion.  No offense.

Not all good proposals will have a positive impact on the community, and not all bad proposals will be harmful. I’m not saying to ban any business activity (other types of activities should be discussed in a separate topic) for merit-sources, but only the role of a bounty manager. I consider the activities of a bounty manager with merit-sources unacceptable.

I don't claim to be the only correct and true opinion/suggestion, but only an honest one. I expressed what I thought about this. Some will agree with me, some will not. This is normal. The purpose of a forum is to speak out and discuss, and then on the basis of this the best solution for the community will be formed.


There is a simple and effective way to check the trustworthiness of intentions any candidate for merit-sources. If the user is ready to give up the role of bounty manager completely (at least for the period of assignment assumes the role of merit-source), then he is worthy of this role. This will demonstrate the “purity” of intentions for the period of service in the role of merit-source, for this is in a sense a volunteer activity.

A campaign manager and a merit source are an inherent conflict of interest.

[Hhampuz]

Last time I checked merit records are public - so what exactly is the issue here? If a merit source were to "abuse" their power it won't take long until the community calls them out for it. Besides that, what's the worst a campaign manager could do by being a merit source? Rank up business accounts for their clients? lol.

I'm also quite confident that any manager here on average read and see more posts than any other user.

[Rikafip]

If icopress is made a merit source, you can be very sure that merit distribution will be biased and influenced by icopress' business interests. There is no way that it will not be influenced by their business interests, and it would be naive to think that icopress will take an unbiased approach to merit distribution.

Have you already noticed that he is distributing merit based on his business interests, or are you just assuming that if he gets merit source status, he will begin to exhibit that kind of behavior? If it's the former, could you provide some evidence?

By the way, he wouldn't be the first bounty manager with merit source status anyway.

[CLS63]

Icopress has been a member who has been making valuable contributions to the forum for a long time. Along with his being a campaign manager he is making a big contribution to gambling board as well. For this reason I'm supporting Icopress' application.

[paid2]

A campaign manager and a merit source are an inherent conflict of interest.

Not more than any campaign participant if we follow this logic... Any source could merit bomb a manager in exchange of a good campaign position/payrate.

If someone is trustable and own all required qualities to be source,  manager or not is not important IMO. A positive thing with a manager is that we know he won't risk his reputation/business here for some merits donations

[decodx]

A campaign manager and a merit source are an inherent conflict of interest.

I disagree. In fact, the campaign manager works under considerable scrutiny, making them less likely to abuse merit source status. Besides, campaign managers can decide freely who they want to accept in the campaigns, with or without merit requirements.

[arabspaceship123]

If ppl didn't say names I wouldn't know they're talking bad about icopress because he's really a good guy who's helped users. He gave me a chance to join UniJoin's sig campaign. I haven't been in sig campaigns after Jan 1st mixers ban because UniJoin moved out but I didn't see 1 complain against icopress or Unijoin in their services topics.

They're posts are lamentable because they don't like icopress so they'll accuse him of lies just because he's asked for merit source.

He's a good guy so I don't believe ppl saying icopress shouldn't be merit source. I don't believe them when they're saying his own interests with advertisers his mean more to him. He's more helpful in bitcointalk forum than small group of users lying about him in this topic.

[avp2306]

A campaign manager and a merit source are an inherent conflict of interest.

If being a merit source plus being a manager will be a conflict of interest then how much more for being a DT 2/1 and manager? Maybe there will be a conflict of interest if the person is a doing crazy business here.

I think its fine as long as the person acquire that will do his job with no biases or bad intention.

[SamReomo]

I believe, he is already doing this, he follows a lot of users, especially those, who are members of the signature campaigns he manages. But of course with the opportunities if a merit course he would be able to do more, appreciate more quality users and motivate them to to their best here in the forum. I think he has a decent understanding of who deserves merits. And this is exactly the quality that the merit source needs.

Yes, he's a quite good and active guy who gives enough time to this forum and read some good posts of the members that are part of signature campaigns that he manages, not only those members but all the members who make good posts are noticed by him. I think he highly deserves to be a merit source and I believe that once he becomes a merit source, he'll fulfill his responsibilities in the best way possible. i fully support his application and I believe Theymos should also consider his application.

If icopress is made a merit source, you can be very sure that merit distribution will be biased and influenced by icopress' business interests. There is no way that it will not be influenced by their business interests, and it would be naive to think that icopress will take an unbiased approach to merit distribution.

What a way to change your statement from favor of an application to against that application. I don't know what lead you to think that Icopress is no longer fit for a merit source position because to me it seems more like a personal issue rather than a genuine one. As far as I know, Icopress mostly give merits to the good posts only and he's not someone who would favor the ones who are in his best interest.

As a campaign manager he has the right to favor advertisers and deal with them professionally but that doesn't mean that after becoming a merit source he may send merits to the advertisers only so he can please them for his own best interests. That's a totally false statement against a reputed member like Icopress. I highly disagree with you in that regard and I believe that majority of the members will also disagree with you.

[Poker Player]

I must say that I do like that the best you can do in attempt to invalidate my opinion is a set of quotes from August of 2023.

You were a hypocrite who is not to give moral lessons in August 2023, and you are still a hypocrite now, because nothing has happened since then to think that you have stopped being a hypocrite, on the contrary.

I am of the same opinion that there should be a clear distinction between the business role (bounty manager) and the merit-source (volunteer activity) to avoid conflicts of interest.

A campaign manager and a merit source are an inherent conflict of interest.

This is interesting and I agree in principle if we add the word potentially: A campaign manager and a merit source are potentially a conflict of interest. Maybe if I were theymos I would think about not giving merit source status to any campaign manager for this very reason. Now, if this is not the case, as Hhampuz says the merit records sent are public and if there was a misuse some people would immediately complain about it in the Reputation section.

In fact, to me the strongest proof that icopress will not misuse merits if given merit source status is that he earns merits at 5 times his activity and does not misuse them now.

[OgNasty]

Last time I checked merit records are public - so what exactly is the issue here? If a merit source were to "abuse" their power it won't take long until the community calls them out for it. Besides that, what's the worst a campaign manager could do by being a merit source? Rank up business accounts for their clients? lol.

I'm also quite confident that any manager here on average read and see more posts than any other user.

It isn't really exclusive to campaign managers but if you've been watching what's going on here over the last few years you'd see that some people took their merit source status and used it to get their subordinates or people who agree with their politics into the default trust network.  They then use their influence to have those who don't agree with their opinions excluded.  This has led to the default trust network becoming nearly useless for real world activity and actually trusting people on this forum with money as I believe it was meant for.  

[Billo_]

Last time I checked merit records are public - so what exactly is the issue here? If a merit source were to "abuse" their power it won't take long until the community calls them out for it. Besides that, what's the worst a campaign manager could do by being a merit source? Rank up business accounts for their clients? lol.

I'm also quite confident that any manager here on average read and see more posts than any other user.

It isn't really exclusive to campaign managers but if you've been watching what's going on here over the last few years you'd see that some people took their merit source status and used it to get their subordinates or people who agree with their politics into the default trust network.  They then use their influence to have those who don't agree with their opinions excluded.  This has led to the default trust network becoming nearly useless for real world activity and actually trusting people on this forum with money as I believe it was meant for.  

It's about time, Vod publishes his website presenting your fraud and it will get revealed to everyone.


From all Merit distribution of icopress we can only conclude he will be a good Merit source.

[BenCodie]

I must say that I do like that the best you can do in attempt to invalidate my opinion is a set of quotes from August of 2023.

You were a hypocrite who is not to give moral lessons in August 2023, and you are still a hypocrite now, because nothing has happened since then to think that you have stopped being a hypocrite, on the contrary.

One could choose to perceive that isolated situation as hypocrisy (as you do) though I've already explained in the thread about how I do not see it that way, as I believe being open and honest about the fact that casinos thrive on human greed and weakness should not mean that I have to change his opinions just to qualify for a signature campaign, and that others should not be excluded from this opportunity because of discussing this fact.

Since you accuse me of being a hypocrite since then on a constant basis, how about you provide some evidence of that? My best is that you'll either find nothing or post some unrelated garbage, since garbage posting is something is a constant with yourself.

If icopress is made a merit source, you can be very sure that merit distribution will be biased and influenced by icopress' business interests. There is no way that it will not be influenced by their business interests, and it would be naive to think that icopress will take an unbiased approach to merit distribution.

What a way to change your statement from favor of an application to against that application. I don't know what lead you to think that Icopress is no longer fit for a merit source position because to me it seems more like a personal issue rather than a genuine one. As far as I know, Icopress mostly give merits to the good posts only and he's not someone who would favor the ones who are in his best interest.

As a campaign manager he has the right to favor advertisers and deal with them professionally but that doesn't mean that after becoming a merit source he may send merits to the advertisers only so he can please them for his own best interests. That's a totally false statement against a reputed member like Icopress. I highly disagree with you in that regard and I believe that majority of the members will also disagree with you.

That's not what I'm saying. I am saying that a member that favors the interests of advertisers over the interests of the community does not deserve to be a merit source, period.

[FatFork]

Since you accuse me of being a hypocrite since then on a constant basis, how about you provide some evidence of that?

Blatant evidence of your hypocrisy is easily visible in your personal signature area. But, we already have several threads on the Reputation board dedicated to this topic. Perhaps you've simply forgotten about them?  Anyway, reviewing those discussions would be more appropriate than rehashing everything here.  So, I suggest you to stop further discussion on this matter as that would also be off-topic here. Otherwise, the moderators will have some cleaning to do.

[GazetaBitcoin]

Last time I checked merit records are public - so what exactly is the issue here? If a merit source were to "abuse" their power it won't take long until the community calls them out for it. Besides that, what's the worst a campaign manager could do by being a merit source? Rank up business accounts for their clients? lol.

Not more than any campaign participant if we follow this logic... Any source could merit bomb a manager in exchange of a good campaign position/payrate.

I could not agree more with Hhampuz and paid2. And, of course, with all the others which expressed same thoughts. But I think the parts I quoted above are explaining the situation in best possible way.

Other than that, even if a campaign manager (icopress in this case) would actually misuse his Merit Source "powers" (assuming that his application will be approved), then he can also be demoted by theymos. There were many cases in the past, when other Merit Sources lost their status, for various reasons. The process of being "promoted" to Merit source is not irreversible and all Merit sources are aware of this. As a consequence, all which act in good faith are doing their best to preserve their status and use their "powers" in the way they were meant to: to help the forum, to help users deserving to rank up to actually achieve this, to highlight quality posts, to appreciate the ones which are good forum contributors by sending them merits.

I am sure that if icopress' application will be approved he will do a very good job in this new position, same as he did a very good job in anything else he did on this forum for years.

[SamReomo]

That's not what I'm saying. I am saying that a member that favors the interests of advertisers over the interests of the community does not deserve to be a merit source, period.

I must tell you that my intention was not to say that he favors the advertisers by sending them merits or something like that. You misunderstood my words, I said that because a manager need to convince the advertisers to advertise on a forum which isn't a simple thing. The manager has to convince them that they will get good results if they advertise on a forum like this.

Favor in my words is more like helping those advertisers to grow on this forum, and I guess now you got my words. Nothing is wrong in that approach because advertisers are paying huge money in order to get results and a manager tries his/her best to give best results to those advertisers by accepting the active participants of the forum. Favor doesn't mean that he doesn't give importance to the interests of the community.

In fact, I believe Icopress is one of those managers who gives so much importance to the interests of the community. He's not only a good manager but also a very good human being and I believe someone like Icopress will surely be a very good merit source of this forum.

[JollyGood]

Icopress has been a member who has been making valuable contributions to the forum for a long time. Along with his being a campaign manager he is making a big contribution to gambling board as well. For this reason I'm supporting Icopress' application.

In fairness, icopress has been contributing across the forum. Without doubt he is a valuable member, that cannot be denied because his longevity and consistency has demonstrated. The member that has changed his opinion and no longer wants icopress to be merit source has a chequered history of dubious posts and behaviour therefore to give him any attention regarding this matter is probably not warranted.

Quite clearly, he has applied for campaigns managed by icopress and maybe was never selected therefore stopped applying, maybe that is his motivation. Anyway, I think regardless of the number of members that will support (or oppose) his application the final decision is/always was with theymos and if he looks at this thread he will see icopress has almost unanimous support.

In fact, to me the strongest proof that icopress will not misuse merits if given merit source status is that he earns merits at 5 times his activity and does not misuse them now.

This is an interesting statistic and what it means is if anything untoward happened with regards to icopress handing out merits, it would already have been mentioned/alleged in this thread.

[philipma1957]

A campaign manager and a merit source are an inherent conflict of interest.

Not more than any campaign participant if we follow this logic... Any source could merit bomb a manager in exchange of a good campaign position/payrate.

If someone is trustable and own all required qualities to be source,  manager or not is not important IMO. A positive thing with a manager is that we know he won't risk his reputation/business here for some merits donations

Not the same at all..

Any campaign manager could merit 2 or 3 or 4 or 5 people. Do it for a month. Then let them join as heroes getting them higher fees.

It is an inherent conflict of interest.

I do not know the status of the 109 merit sources. I am not sure any are campaign managers.  But it does not change the fact that no campaign manager should ever be a merit source.

As for a signature person giving tons of merits to a campaign manager. It is visible if they do.

The difference is clear.

A campaign manager will know he is giving to 5 accounts that he can add at will in the future. Along with 5 or 10 others that he does not care just to throw you off.

A signature guy can give 50 merits to a campaign manager and ask in a month but it would be obvious  to see they did it as they would be giving to an active person.

While a campaign manager giving to 15 people knowing he will add 5 down the road can hide what he is doing.

If I funded a campaign I would insist that the manager does not give merits to anyone that is not a legend as it would protect me from over paying.

So if Icopress says he will only give merits  to legends his source would be pure.

Same for any other campaign manger.

let me explain this better.


this is a high paying campaign

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5387753.0

'Rules:

➥ Posts in local sections will be taken into account.
➥ Post bursting is not allowed, moreover it is easy to check with ninjastic.space.
➥ Posts that do not carry a semantic load or posts whose content is less than 200 characters will not be paid.
➥ I reserve the right to change the rules and disqualify any post and any participant for any reason.
➥ Excluded boards, (Altcoins, WO & Serious, Sig Threads, Press, Politics, Games, Micro, Off-topic, Mega Threads.).'

So by letting him be a merit source you are giving him the ability jack up 3 or 4  full members to hero.

Then slip them in down the road.


I am not saying he will but I am saying this is an inherent conflict of interest.


I would love to know what campaign managers are merit soruces and look back a year or 2 at the merit history.

[Poker Player]

Since you accuse me of being a hypocrite since then on a constant basis, how about you provide some evidence of that?

Sure, I'm going to get down to providing evidence of what everyone can see, lol.

My best is that you'll either find nothing or post some unrelated garbage, since garbage posting is something is a constant with yourself.

Sure, sure. The fact that you earn merits at 0.64 times your activity despite the walls of text you write and the lessons you pretend to give everyone and you call me a garbage poster when I earn merits at 1.54 times my activity is a big lol as well. Don't you get tired of making a fool of yourself?

Oh, wait, it turns out that you don't earn enough merits in this forum because the forum members have a low IQ, is that it?

 

let me explain this better.


this is a high paying campaign

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5387753.0

...


So by letting him be a merit source you are giving him the ability jack up 3 or 4  full members to hero.

Then slip them in down the road.


I am not saying he will but I am saying this is an inherent conflict of interest.

That's all well and good philipma1957 but what you don't explain is why he hasn't done that already. icopress has earned almost 7000 merits, which is almost 3500 smerits. Look at his post history and tell me a single case that is as you say. It is no more a conflict of interest than the 7,000 merits he has earned. Shall we ban him from using smerits too?

[philipma1957]

Since you accuse me of being a hypocrite since then on a constant basis, how about you provide some evidence of that?

Sure, I'm going to get down to providing evidence of what everyone can see, lol.

My best is that you'll either find nothing or post some unrelated garbage, since garbage posting is something is a constant with yourself.

Sure, sure. The fact that you earn merits at 0.64 times your activity despite the walls of text you write and the lessons you pretend to give everyone and you call me a garbage poster when I earn merits at 1.54 times my activity is a big lol as well. Don't you get tired of making a fool of yourself?

Oh, wait, it turns out that you don't earn enough merits in this forum because the forum members have a low IQ, is that it?

 

let me explain this better.


this is a high paying campaign

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5387753.0

...


So by letting him be a merit source you are giving him the ability jack up 3 or 4  full members to hero.

Then slip them in down the road.


I am not saying he will but I am saying this is an inherent conflict of interest.

That's all well and good philipma1957 but what you don't explain is why he hasn't done that already. icopress has earned almost 7000 merits, which is almost 3500 smerits. Look at his post history and tell me a single case that is as you say. It is no more a conflict of interest than the 7,000 merits he has earned. Shall we ban him from using smerits too?

i won’t say anything nasty.

i will ask this instead : do you have a complete history of every merit he gave out?

and did he give merits to people that were not hero or legendary.?

so:

 a) show me every merit he gave away. since he gave merits.
b) show me every merit he gave to anyone under  hero.
c) if you do this I will then need  to see every one he approved to a better campaign.

if not you simply do not answer my conflict of interest concept.


this is not about Icopress.

this is about all campaigns by all managers.

it is very simple

can I easily see every merit a source campaign based manager gives out?

back to the beginning of every source person that is a manager of campaigns.

If I can I can see if they boosted a person in 2020 or 2021 in preparation for promotion to a well paying campaign.

especially since most campaigns pay shit  at this time due to theymos  banning mixers.

I have been completely transparent about paying back over four thousand dollars to a mixer campaign and will continue to mention this. So that no one will say I hold a grudge against icopress because of this

this is not about icopress. this is about a  conflict of interest issue that hurts bitcointalk.

[philipma1957]

If someone wants to speak up, don't be shy.  

I gave you 50 merits

I do not think any campaign manager should be a merit source.

I do not know of anyway for me  to be more clear on the subject.

Point A) I like you and think you are honest.
Point B) I do not think a campaign manager should be a source as it is a conflict of interest.


Sorry for double post, but it is separate from the one before.

[JollyGood]

Since you accuse me of being a hypocrite since then on a constant basis, how about you provide some evidence of that?

Sure, I'm going to get down to providing evidence of what everyone can see, lol.

I am sure you will have fun with this. By the way, the number of times he applied to join campaigns run by icopress (and the time he used the words please can I join) is laughable when you look at the way he is conducting himself now with a clear anti-icopress agenda.

Something quite clearly is not right with him. Even before he copied and pasted all that nonsense in his thread for the security sub-board, he had an overinflated ego and thought far too much of himself considering he has not really contributed at all to the forum. The levels of hypocrisy shown by him are shocking. The constant barrage of nonsense he spouted including trying to justify why he spouted the nonsense in the first place with all the contradictory messages (related to Whirlwind and gambling) effectively showed the level of hypocrisy he is at.

My best is that you'll either find nothing or post some unrelated garbage, since garbage posting is something is a constant with yourself.

Sure, sure. The fact that you earn merits at 0.64 times your activity despite the walls of text you write and the lessons you pretend to give everyone and you call me a garbage poster when I earn merits at 1.54 times my activity is a big lol as well. Don't you get tired of making a fool of yourself?

Oh, wait, it turns out that you don't earn enough merits in this forum because the forum members have a low IQ, is that it?

 

.. and all of those post he made about his alleged superior intellect therefore the word narcissism seems apt  

[Rikafip]

Any campaign manager could merit 2 or 3 or 4 or 5 people. Do it for a month. Then let them join as heroes getting them higher fees.

What's exactly stopping a manager to pay Sr Member as Hero member (or getting him on a private deal)  if he thinks that member is good and will bring him extra visibility? So why going through that hassle of ranking members up in the first place.

Dunno, I think that you guys are just overthinking things.

[philipma1957]

Any campaign manager could merit 2 or 3 or 4 or 5 people. Do it for a month. Then let them join as heroes getting them higher fees.

What's exactly stopping a manager to pay Sr Member as Hero member (or getting him on a private deal)  if he thinks that member is good and will bring him extra visibility? So why going through that hassle of ranking members up in the first place.

Dunno, I think that you guys are just overthinking things.

Nope it lowers the campaign’s integrity.  

Pretend I want to pay for a campaign.

I want to trust manager x.

First I can’t see his long term merit history.

So I have no idea if he grooms people by hiking them up long ago .

So if you really want to allow any manager to be a merit source you need to have a list of every merit they ever gave.

If I pay a hero 100 a week and he is a hero due to many merits given by the campaign manager I need to be able to see that pretty much with no effort.

the look at merits goes back 120 days.


https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=merit;u=1137579


so basically not just for icopress but for all of us.

so in order for a campaign manager to have a proper check you need his or hers merit history to go back way way way more than 120 days.

thats why I keep saying this is not about icopress it is about all campaign managers.

[Rikafip]

I want to trust manager x.

Then check his trust feedback. 

First I can’t see his long term merit history.

Sure you can. Then again, I really doubt that an average business looking to advertise here cares about manager's merit history or even knows what merit is.  

So if you really want to allow any manager to be a merit source you need to have a list of every merit they ever gave.

There is already at least one active manager who is also a merit source.

[philipma1957]

I want to trust manager x.

Then check his trust feedback. 

First I can’t see his long term merit history.

Sure you can. Then again, I really doubt that an average business looking to advertise here cares about manager's merit history or even knows what merit is.  

So if you really want to allow any manager to be a merit source you need to have a list of every merit they ever gave.

There is already at least one active manager who is also a merit source.

and whom ever he is or she is they should not be a merit source.

[decodx]

I want to trust manager x.

Then check his trust feedback. 

First I can’t see his long term merit history.

Sure you can. Then again, I really doubt that an average business looking to advertise here cares about manager's merit history or even knows what merit is.  

So if you really want to allow any manager to be a merit source you need to have a list of every merit they ever gave.

There is already at least one active manager who is also a merit source.

and whom ever he is or she is they should not be a merit source.

But theymos obviously doesn't think so, so this argument is a mute point in someone's merit source application thread.

As far as I know icopress's merit sharing history has been exemplary so far and there is no particular reason why he shouldn't be a merit source, and I think it is unfair to judge someone based on some speculations about what could happen. Does that mean no one should be a merit source due to potential misuse?

[dkbit98]

Is theymos back to sleeping hibernation mod again?  
His last post was on February 6 and I am sure he is busy with other things in his life, but maybe it's time to check merit source applications again.
We know there is one less merit source now and I think icopress will be a good choice to fill the empty spot.

[philipma1957]

I want to trust manager x.

Then check his trust feedback. 

First I can’t see his long term merit history.

Sure you can. Then again, I really doubt that an average business looking to advertise here cares about manager's merit history or even knows what merit is.  

So if you really want to allow any manager to be a merit source you need to have a list of every merit they ever gave.

There is already at least one active manager who is also a merit source.

and whom ever he is or she is they should not be a merit source.

But theymos obviously doesn't think so, so this argument is a mute point in someone's merit source application thread.

As far as I know icopress's merit sharing history has been exemplary so far and there is no particular reason why he shouldn't be a merit source, and I think it is unfair to judge someone based on some speculations about what could happen. Does that mean no one should be a merit source due to potential misuse?

it means no campaign manager should be a source.

[philipma1957]

Last time I checked merit records are public - so what exactly is the issue here? If a merit source were to "abuse" their power it won't take long until the community calls them out for it. Besides that, what's the worst a campaign manager could do by being a merit source? Rank up business accounts for their clients? lol.

Not more than any campaign participant if we follow this logic... Any source could merit bomb a manager in exchange of a good campaign position/payrate.

I could not agree more with Hhampuz and paid2. And, of course, with all the others which expressed same thoughts. But I think the parts I quoted above are explaining the situation in best possible way.

Other than that, even if a campaign manager (icopress in this case) would actually misuse his Merit Source "powers" (assuming that his application will be approved), then he can also be demoted by theymos. There were many cases in the past, when other Merit Sources lost their status, for various reasons. The process of being "promoted" to Merit source is not irreversible and all Merit sources are aware of this. As a consequence, all which act in good faith are doing their best to preserve their status and use their "powers" in the way they were meant to: to help the forum, to help users deserving to rank up to actually achieve this, to highlight quality posts, to appreciate the ones which are good forum contributors by sending them merits.

I am sure that if icopress' application will be approved he will do a very good job in this new position, same as he did a very good job in anything else he did on this forum for years.

do you know the leading receiver of merits from icopress.

that leader got 256 merits.

number 2 merit reception was only 97
number 3 merit reception was only 82.

sorry for double post on an ipad and hard to merge them.



number
1
2
3


all supported icopress to be a merit source.

its another conflict of interest with zero transparency on their part.



decodex gave me the link showing all of icopress’s merits given.

and just by viewing the first three merit received people there is a lack of transparency and a conflict of interest.

my thanks to decodex for the link. 🔗

[icopress]

In reality, both support and criticism have no effect on who the admin assigns as a merit source. The admin personally told me to create an application for the reason that when he assigns new merit sources, he does not consider users individually, but looks for relevant threads in the meta using keywords.

that leader got 256 merits.

number 2 merit reception was only 97
number 3 merit reception was only 82. [...]

It seems that the difference between first and second place is 159 merits, and one can assume that my favorite author is GazetaBitcoin.

I should probably mention that you also have a favorite author, since the difference between the first and second place of those you sent merits to is 177.

Although in reality you probably should have looked at the other panel which says that I submitted 3267 merit 2180 times, to 471 profiles (not being the merit source). Btw, you sent 8790 merit 4496 times, to 1259 profiles (being a merit source).

To be honest, I have no idea how all these discussions regarding conflicts of interest relate to my appointment. But I am sincerely grateful to everyone who participates in the discussion, regardless of your opinion, since active discussion allows this thread to continuously remain at the top of the meta section.

[philipma1957]

In reality, both support and criticism have no effect on who the admin assigns as a merit source. The admin personally told me to create an application for the reason that when he assigns new merit sources, he does not consider users individually, but looks for relevant threads in the meta using keywords.

that leader got 256 merits.

number 2 merit reception was only 97
number 3 merit reception was only 82. [...]

It seems that the difference between first and second place is 159 merits, and one can assume that my favorite author is GazetaBitcoin.

I should probably mention that you also have a favorite author, since the difference between the first and second place of those you sent merits to is 177.

Although in reality you probably should have looked at the other panel which says that I submitted 3267 merit 2180 times, to 471 profiles (not being the merit source). Btw, you sent 8790 merit 4496 times, to 1259 profiles (being a merit source).

To be honest, I have no idea how all these discussions regarding conflicts of interest relate to my appointment. But I am sincerely grateful to everyone who participates in the discussion, regardless of your opinion, since active discussion allows this thread to continuously remain at the top of the meta section.

yep which is why I don't  try too manage a campaign. So my merits are not tied with my handing peoples cash.

[icopress]

yep which is why I don't  try too manage a campaign. So my merits are not tied with my handing peoples cash.

What exactly do you say “yes” to?

[arabspaceship123]

Unless you're abusing your role there isn't a conflict of interest if you're sig campaign manager & merit source. I'm happy your topic's at the top of meta because you're a good candidate for merit source.

To be honest, I have no idea how all these discussions regarding conflicts of interest relate to my appointment. But I am sincerely grateful to everyone who participates in the discussion, regardless of your opinion, since active discussion allows this thread to continuously remain at the top of the meta section.

[Poker Player]

it means no campaign manager should be a source.

I don't know why you pontificate in such a categorical way in a forum that is not yours, but theymos'. I have said before that I find it reasonable in principle to see a potential conflict of interest, but if theymos has already appointed a manager as a merit source it is clear that he studies the cases one by one and does not see things as categorically as you do.

[philipma1957]

yep which is why I don't  try too manage a campaign. So my merits are not tied with my handing peoples cash.

What exactly do you say “yes” to?

I bolded what I said yep to.

Unfortunately people do not understand what conflict of interest means.

I sorry I was unable to explain the issue to you.

Or anyone else that does not understand my explanation.

I wish I could be more eloquent , but I am not good enough to get my point of view across to all that disagreed with me.

[joker_josue]

I wish I could be more eloquent , but I am not good enough to get my point of view across to all that disagreed with me.

I'm not the most eloquent either, but maybe I can explain what I understood from your words.

You say that it could be a conflict of interest, because the manager could use his ability to give merits to a certain user to increase his ranking and thus be able to participate in the campaign or have a higher level of payment. Doing so can provide one user with advantages over another.

For example: imagine that I was still a Hero, and a manager wanted me to participate in a campaign that only accepts Legendary. I need 50 merits to level up. The manager being a source of merit, would give me these merits to raise my level, and so I could participate in the campaign.

Was this your idea @philipma1957?

[BlackHatCoiner]

Am I noticing a bit of a hatred on signature campaign managers lately? Some people keep talking about "conflict of interest" between icopress and its hired participants, whereas it's just not true. Usually, merits are counted as a unit to encourage managers hire you. Merits sent by other people, and it's just an indication; managers (or at least, good managers) look on more than that. If the manager likes your posts and overall presence and influence, they'll hire you regardless them being merit source or not.

[Etranger]

I wish I could be more eloquent , but I am not good enough to get my point of view across to all that disagreed with me.

I'm not the most eloquent either, but maybe I can explain what I understood from your words.

You say that it could be a conflict of interest, because the manager could use his ability to give merits to a certain user to increase his ranking and thus be able to participate in the campaign or have a higher level of payment. Doing so can provide one user with advantages over another.

For example: imagine that I was still a Hero, and a manager wanted me to participate in a campaign that only accepts Legendary. I need 50 merits to level up. The manager being a source of merit, would give me these merits to raise my level, and so I could participate in the campaign.

Was this your idea @philipma1957?

A manager can do this only if he is incredibly interested in a particular user. Personally, I doubted the reality of such a situation. There are quite a lot of participants on the forum who write good, qualified posts, and that is why there is serious competition when applying to signature campaigns. Why would a manager risk his reputation as a merit source by upgrading a specific user faster when he can simply choose another user with the required rank already?

[philipma1957]

I wish I could be more eloquent , but I am not good enough to get my point of view across to all that disagreed with me.

I'm not the most eloquent either, but maybe I can explain what I understood from your words.

You say that it could be a conflict of interest, because the manager could use his ability to give merits to a certain user to increase his ranking and thus be able to participate in the campaign or have a higher level of payment. Doing so can provide one user with advantages over another.

For example: imagine that I was still a Hero, and a manager wanted me to participate in a campaign that only accepts Legendary. I need 50 merits to level up. The manager being a source of merit, would give me these merits to raise my level, and so I could participate in the campaign.

Was this your idea @philipma1957?

Yes.

And it gives an extra level of power and control to a campaign manager.

A} he or she can pick and choose anyone he wants to be in the campaign = true.
B} he or she can get rid of anyone he wants to get rid of = true.
C} he can ask the person to be sure to post in certain sections for credit = true.

D} with source merits he can boost a person to earn more = not true for icopress as I think is is not a source.


I think no source should be a campaign manager. It has been claimed a source already is a campaign manager there was a post that said this.  If true It is a conflict of interest and that person should surrender  his source for the good of bitcointalk.

[joker_josue]

Yes.

And it gives an extra level of power and control to a campaign manager.

A} he or she can pick and choose anyone he wants to be in the campaign = true.
B} he or she can get rid of anyone he wants to get rid of = true.
C} he can ask the person to be sure to post in certain sections for credit = true.

D} with source merits he can boost a person to earn more = not true for icopress as I think is is not a source.


I think no source should be a campaign manager. It has been claimed a source already is a campaign manager there was a post that said this.  If true It is a conflict of interest and that person should surrender  his source for the good of bitcointalk.

I understand what you mean, but in the end, I think there is no conflict of interest.
The campaign manager makes the rules, he can even book the campaign by invitation only. And then you can invite whoever you want and pay whatever you want, regardless of the ranking.

Either way, I understand what you mean.

[alani123]

Am I noticing a bit of a hatred on signature campaign managers lately? Some people keep talking about "conflict of interest" between icopress and its hired participants, whereas it's just not true. Usually, merits are counted as a unit to encourage managers hire you. Merits sent by other people, and it's just an indication; managers (or at least, good managers) look on more than that. If the manager likes your posts and overall presence and influence, they'll hire you regardless them being merit source or not.

I normally wouldn't mind having a signature campaign manager be a merit source. After all people that have a job related to this forum spend a lot of time here and could spot valuable posts easily due to their experience. 

But right now I know that there's an oversupply of merit. Merit sources have thousands of sMerits and there's a distinct lack of influx of new users. You're a very weird exception to this rule becoming a legendary user pretty fast compared to others. But most new people that come into this forum are either interested in bounties or local boards. So it doesn't make much sense at this moment to have even more merit sources in my opinion, especially when there's years worth of backlog for local board merit sources.

For one, our local Greek board hasn't had even a moderator in months, let alone merit source applications from Greek speakers pending for years! Theymos' attention should be directed to older requests imo with a focus on other things like local boards.

[Timelord2067]

Not only that, but a certain group of DT1 users gift each other absurdly high numbers of merits between themselves (on the pretext that somehow the merits will trickle down the slippery slope) then do little to gift those merits to up an coming users.

I agree there needs to be a separation between anyone dispensing merits and those administering signature campaigns.

[EarnOnVictor]

Not only that, but a certain group of DT1 users gift each other absurdly high numbers of merits between themselves (on the pretext that somehow the merits will trickle down the slippery slope) then do little to gift those merits to up an coming users.

I agree there needs to be a separation between anyone dispensing merits and those administering signature campaigns.

I've said many times here that the merit system is not as people think of it, and I've sided with those who claimed some impartial sharing is going on. Seeing you now again saying a similar thing, I conclude that unbiased people can think beyond the bracket and those who are favoured by the impartiality will always look away.

Well, I am not against the campaign managers becoming a merit source, but it might be biased towards the people in their campaigns. They have enough work to do already, and for this, they can't move around like those who are not CMs.

[PytagoraZ]

I agree with philipma1957. I have been thinking about this thought for a long time, but maybe my opinion could make me not accepted in the campaign managed by icopress, but this thought bothers me enough that I want to convey it here.

Honestly, I don't doubt Icopress's objectivity because he is an old member who has contributed a lot to this forum, but with him as a merit source there is the possibility:

~ As a selling point and perhaps sending more merit to the client's account
~ Send merit more often to campaign participants because he see their campaign participants' posts every week

If I look at campaigns that have merit source participants, usually those client accounts get more merit and rank up faster compared to campaigns that are not participated in by merit sources.

This is just my brief assumption, maybe I will revise my opinion if it turns out that my opinion is wrong. Sorry for icopress, I don't have a special intention, I just said what was on my mind

[FatFork]

I agree with philipma1957. I have been thinking about this thought for a long time, but maybe my opinion could make me not accepted in the campaign managed by icopress, but this thought bothers me enough that I want to convey it here.

Honestly, I don't doubt Icopress's objectivity because he is an old member who has contributed a lot to this forum, but with him as a merit source there is the possibility:

~ As a selling point and perhaps sending more merit to the client's account
~ Send merit more often to campaign participants because he see their campaign participants' posts every week

Are you suggesting icopress has a history of favoring certain clients or participants? If so, can you point to specific examples? If not, what do you think prevented him from doing it already? What specific changes do you predict if he becomes a merit source?

If I look at campaigns that have merit source participants, usually those client accounts get more merit and rank up faster compared to campaigns that are not participated in by merit sources.

Why are you adding campaign participants to the mix now? Are you suggesting that merit sources should not even participate in campaigns, let alone manage them?

[JollyGood]

Merit sources have a responsibility to give merits in an unbiased manner but can we really state as a matter of fact that has been the case throughout? We all have seen merit sources give over the top merits (excessive merits) to posts others would find not worthy of any attention and likewise, we all have seen quality or deserving posts being ignored by merit sources whereas others have picked up on them.

None of this means anything because merit sources are not held to account in order to justify their merit distribution, they give merits just as you and I non-merit sources do and they/others could also view some of our merit distribution as dubious/deserving/non-deserving therefore the concept of conflict of interest does not really stand up.

Hypothetical scenarios about manufactured conflicts of interest that do not exist is a topic in itself which should have a thread created by those wanting to discuss it.

Time to let this thread be about either supporting icopress because of historical statistical data proving he is an asset to the community or to post here with historical statistical data proving he is not a good candidate.

[examplens]

And it gives an extra level of power and control to a campaign manager.

Each merit source gets additional power, I guess the administrators should evaluate who will not abuse it. For example, Ratimov was not a manager, but certain manipulations with his distribution of merits were recognized. The matter is quite individual, and it can't be generalized.
One more example, LoyceV managed the campaign a long time ago, and as far as I know he is still open to such offers. Do you doubt that he would abuse his merit source status by running a campaign?

A} he or she can pick and choose anyone he wants to be in the campaign = true.
B} he or she can get rid of anyone he wants to get rid of = true.
C} he can ask the person to be sure to post in certain sections for credit = true.

D} with source merits he can boost a person to earn more = not true for icopress as I think is is not a source.

To repeat, merit source status certainly gives a certain power here on the forum. But the example of the conflict you mention is probably not the best.
If the manager himself decides who to accept in the campaign, why would he force anyone by giving him an unrealistic number of merits? He can accept them even if he earns only one merit in 120 days.

Campaign managers today generally have their hands free over management. So, for example, they can always make a custom deal with a user, regardless of their (rank) merit count. there is no need to build someone's rank, it is enough just to accept him in a higher-tier position in the campaign.

I don't think any intelligent manager would risk his reputation for merit abuse. As far as I know, most of their clients come from outside the forum and don't know much about things like merit, sources etc... Certainly, the label "abuser" reduces the chances of someone being hired.

[Etranger]

I agree with philipma1957. I have been thinking about this thought for a long time, but maybe my opinion could make me not accepted in the campaign managed by icopress, but this thought bothers me enough that I want to convey it here.

Honestly, I don't doubt Icopress's objectivity because he is an old member who has contributed a lot to this forum, but with him as a merit source there is the possibility:

~ As a selling point and perhaps sending more merit to the client's account
~ Send merit more often to campaign participants because he see their campaign participants' posts every week

If I look at campaigns that have merit source participants, usually those client accounts get more merit and rank up faster compared to campaigns that are not participated in by merit sources.

This is just my brief assumption, maybe I will revise my opinion if it turns out that my opinion is wrong. Sorry for icopress, I don't have a special intention, I just said what was on my mind

I believe those possibilities you described could happen even if a campaign manager is not a merit source. Campaign managers often get a lot of merits, simply because they are always in plain sight, and their posts are followed by a large number of users, so they will not go unnoticed. That means they already have lost of sMerits and could do what you suggested. I mean, if there is an intention to abuse merit system, there are plenty of opportunities for campaign managers to do so.

But we don't see such a behaviour from behalf of icopress. That is why I personally don't see any reason why he shouldn't be a merit source and what potential conflicts of interest could occur because of that.

[vapourminer]

~ Send merit more often to campaign participants because he see their campaign participants' posts every week

this aspect i hadnt really thought of. as the cm would (i would think) prioritize reading the campaign posts (thats their job after all) those campaign posts may get a disproportionate amount of merits simply because they were read 1st before the cm "spends down" their merits.

so basically anyone joining a campaign where a cm is also a ms looks to have a better chance of earning merits in that campaign than other campaigns.

does this gives the a cm whose a ms an advantage over other cms?



 

[BlackHatCoiner]

But right now I know that there's an oversupply of merit.

Better have an oversupply than an undersupply. I think we have less merit sources comparably to last year, so if someone's going to replace this lack, be it icopress.

So it doesn't make much sense at this moment to have even more merit sources in my opinion, especially when there's years worth of backlog for local board merit sources.

It doesn't make sense to grant the merit source position randomly, but as far as my experience goes, icopress wouldn't merit uninteresting / minimum value posts.

For one, our local Greek board hasn't had even a moderator in months, let alone merit source applications from Greek speakers pending for years!

I'm a merit source. And the Greek board is quite dead, I hope we all acknowledge that. I agree that it needs moderation, but this is another discussion.

Merit sources have a responsibility to give merits in an unbiased manner but can we really state as a matter of fact that has been the case throughout?

Merit sources are supposed to merit whatever they like. Be it a high quality post, a joke, or a newbie question. That's why we have more than a hundred merit sources; simply because there's no "universal unbiased standard".

[JollyGood]

Precisely. I do not have a problem with that because if there is no reason to scrutinise the manner in which merits are given by merit sources there is no reason to scrutinise the manner in which merits are given by non-merit source members too. I think if there is merit abuse between farmed accounts that should be addressed but other than that members are free to merit any post they like regardless of them being merit source or non-merit source.

Other than that I am not a huge fan of the merit system as it currently stands but that is a matter for a different time. Right now, I can see no reason why icopress is not a good candidate for merit source and hope theymos will keep him in mind the next time he selects a merit source.

Merit sources have a responsibility to give merits in an unbiased manner but can we really state as a matter of fact that has been the case throughout?

Merit sources are supposed to merit whatever they like. Be it a high quality post, a joke, or a newbie question. That's why we have more than a hundred merit sources; simply because there's no "universal unbiased standard".

[alani123]

But right now I know that there's an oversupply of merit.

Better have an oversupply than an undersupply. I think we have less merit sources comparably to last year, so if someone's going to replace this lack, be it icopress.

I respectfully disagree. If merit sources had too many posts to pick from and less merit they'd be more pressure on them to focus on actually good posts by good members so they can reward their efforts by making them rank up. Now there's so much merit going around from merit sources that most of it ends up being not utilized at all. And at best, there's huge merit circlejerks in the absence of new posters. Merit is so abundant that nearly no one cares about it anymore. Even in cases of abuse. In an ideal world there would be more admins to be looking through this every few weeks or so to remove or add merit sources accordingly based on how many new users are coming in. But on the contrary, for the last few years we've had an oversupply of merit. But now that we have too much of it, nearly no one cares. New users just find hacked accounts to rank their own accounts through local boards and it gets lost in the merit circlejerks of users that have already reached legendary rank.

[Rikafip]

D} with source merits he can boost a person to earn more = not true for icopress as I think is is not a source.

But manager can already do that by choosing whoever they want in the campaign so I don't see how that would change with more managers being merit sources.

It has been claimed a source already is a campaign manager there was a post that said this.

Yes there is.

If true It is a conflict of interest and that person should surrender  his source for the good of bitcointalk.

theymos obviously doesn't think so and in the end he is the only one whose opinion matter in this case really.

[BlackHatCoiner]

I respectfully disagree. If merit sources had too many posts to pick from and less merit they'd be more pressure on them to focus on actually good posts by good members so they can reward their efforts by making them rank up.

I'll speak for myself. If I had less sMerits, I'd simply do what I had been doing before I become a merit source; merit the same posts, but with less merits. I don't feel like I have more pressure on meriting "good posts" now that I'm merit source. Whenever I find an interesting post, I simply merit it. That's all, and I'd say I'm biased to an extent to newbie posts, because I want to encourage them continue their journey and rank up.

But on the contrary, for the last few years we've had an oversupply of merit. But now that we have too much of it, nearly no one cares.

The whole point of the merit system is mainly to discourage shitposts. Even with an oversupply of merits, it still fits that purpose. It's just that high-quality posters get merited more generously and/or regularly.

New users just find hacked accounts to rank their own accounts through local boards and it gets lost in the merit circlejerks of users that have already reached legendary rank.

I certainly wouldn't rather to help a user who sees the forum as a milking cow instead of an Internet board, rank up. Why am I the one to blame and not them for being incapable to produce somewhat medium quality content?

[alani123]

I respectfully disagree. If merit sources had too many posts to pick from and less merit they'd be more pressure on them to focus on actually good posts by good members so they can reward their efforts by making them rank up.

I'll speak for myself. If I had less sMerits, I'd simply do what I had been doing before I become a merit source; merit the same posts, but with less merits. I don't feel like I have more pressure on meriting "good posts" now that I'm merit source. Whenever I find an interesting post, I simply merit it. That's all, and I'd say I'm biased to an extent to newbie posts, because I want to encourage them continue their journey and rank up.

I'm quite certain many people have the same approach now, but things work differently on a macro and on a micro level.
The macro level is that if everyone has less sMerits and there were far fewer merit sources, the result of having less merit to go around would be that the responsibility on spotting and rewarding good posts increases.

I certainly wouldn't rather to help a user who sees the forum as a milking cow instead of an Internet board, rank up. Why am I the one to blame and not them for being incapable to produce somewhat medium quality content?

Precisely because there's a lack of new users with good posts I believe that we don't need new merit sources. At this point in my opinion new merit sources should only happen if less active ones are removed and their sMerits rescinded. When forum activity from new users goes down merit sources should ideally decrease, not increase.

[uchegod-21]

Honestly, I don't doubt Icopress's objectivity because he is an old member who has contributed a lot to this forum, but with him as a merit source there is the possibility:

Objectivity has nothing to do with forum age. A newbie can just arrive the forum, read the rules, understand them and be more objective than someone who is here for 4 years.

~ As a selling point and perhaps sending more merit to the client's account

Most of his clients are project owners who does not make posts day in day out. Even if he sends just a merit to enable his clients upload images, that's not a problem.

~ Send merit more often to campaign participants because he see their campaign participants' posts every week

If the posts he will send merits to are quality posts, there's no problem. Besides, those campaign participants are still members of BTT and deserve ranking up.

If I look at campaigns that have merit source participants, usually those client accounts get more merit and rank up faster compared to campaigns that are not participated in by merit sources.

This is also not a problem, in as much as their posts are quality. The people that benefits from The Sceptical Chemist post review rank up than others, they are just lucky and it shouldn't bitter anyone.

[BlackHatCoiner]

The macro level is that if everyone has less sMerits and there were far fewer merit sources, the result of having less merit to go around would be that the responsibility on spotting and rewarding good posts increases.

And in that case, I'd be more careful with how much I spend. Maybe I stopped sending 4 merits to newbies for just sharing an interesting thought, and so would other merit sources. The result would rather be that high quality posters would just rank up more slowly.

Precisely because there's a lack of new users with good posts I believe that we don't need new merit sources.

How do you know we lack new users with good posts? I believe we had quite a lot new users who made their entrance in 2022-23, and ranked up pretty fast, as they were worth it. Shitposters, on the other hand, still find it difficult to rank up, as they should.

[alani123]

Precisely because there's a lack of new users with good posts I believe that we don't need new merit sources.

How do you know we lack new users with good posts? I believe we had quite a lot new users who made their entrance in 2022-23, and ranked up pretty fast, as they were worth it. Shitposters, on the other hand, still find it difficult to rank up, as they should.

This is highly subjective.

To me, a forum where tens of thousands of people are active posting very regularly like in here, should also be having an influx of new users that are able to contribute that is akin to its active userbase. That would be at least a few hundreds of new users becoming legendary every year. If we check https://bpip.org/Report?r=mostmerit there's only one legendary user in the top 1000 with a registration date of 2021 and 14 users from 2020. So in a little more than 3 years only 15 users reached the maximum rank. Also note that the bottom of the top 1000 have only a tiny bit merit above the required 1k to become legendary so I wouldn't guess that there's many more besides that.

I know this is an unorthodox way to check this but I can't find any better way to do so.

[LoyceV]

One more example, LoyceV managed the campaign a long time ago, and as far as I know he is still open to such offers. Do you doubt that he would abuse his merit source status by running a campaign?

I'd argue the opposite: a campaign manager is supposed to read many of the posts made in his campaigns. That's a great opportunity to Merit the good ones (and remove the users with bad posts from the campaign). That's not Merit abuse, it's doing a good job.
It may mean the campaign manager sends more Merit to users in his campaigns, because he reads more of their posts. But that shouldn't matter much, as there are 100+ other Merit sources too.

To call it Merit abuse, there should be something in it for the campaign manager. Unless you're going to the extremes of Meriting his own alts to join his own campaigns, I don't see that happening. Most campaign managers have earned enough sMerit to be able to do that without being a source anyway.

[nutildah]

To me, a forum where tens of thousands of people are active posting very regularly like in here, should also be having an influx of new users that are able to contribute that is akin to its active userbase. That would be at least a few hundreds of new users becoming legendary every year. If we check https://bpip.org/Report?r=mostmerit there's only one legendary user in the top 1000 with a registration date of 2021 and 14 users from 2020. So in a little more than 3 years only 15 users reached the maximum rank. Also note that the bottom of the top 1000 have only a tiny bit merit above the required 1k to become legendary so I wouldn't guess that there's many more besides that.

To become a Legendary w/ a 2021 registration date by now would mean posting just about every day (or at least 14 times per 2 weeks) since then, along with accumulating an average of ~1 merit every day... No easy feat really. It requires a lot of commitment to going beyond shitposting, which is a step most accounts here aren't willing to take. They are here because its "easy money"... once you have to put effort into it its no longer "easy" anymore. So they will never get beyond Sr. Member or Hero and they don't care.

I think it took me at least 4 years to get to Legendary based on the speed of my posting, which was intermittent. I don't think merits would have been a factor but who knows.

[Poker Player]

To me, a forum where tens of thousands of people are active posting very regularly like in here, should also be having an influx of new users that are able to contribute that is akin to its active userbase. That would be at least a few hundreds of new users becoming legendary every year. If we check https://bpip.org/Report?r=mostmerit there's only one legendary user in the top 1000 with a registration date of 2021 and 14 users from 2020. So in a little more than 3 years only 15 users reached the maximum rank. Also note that the bottom of the top 1000 have only a tiny bit merit above the required 1k to become legendary so I wouldn't guess that there's many more besides that.

To become a Legendary w/ a 2021 registration date by now would mean posting just about every day (or at least 14 times per 2 weeks) since then, along with accumulating an average of ~1 merit every day... No easy feat really. It requires a lot of commitment to going beyond shitposting, which is a step most accounts here aren't willing to take. They are here because its "easy money"... once you have to put effort into it its no longer "easy" anymore. So they will never get beyond Sr. Member or Hero and they don't care.

I think it took me at least 4 years to get to Legendary based on the speed of my posting, which was intermittent. I don't think merits would have been a factor but who knows.

I am surprised by this data, which I did not know, as I registered in 2020 and I would say I was legendary last year (is there any way to check?). Although I write better than a shitposter I am not among the most exceptional posters but according to that data I would be among a minority of the best posters who registered the same year as me. That said, with some exceptions, I usually write 7 days a week.

[FatFork]

I am surprised by this data, which I did not know, as I registered in 2020 and I would say I was legendary last year (is there any way to check?).

According to the DdmrDdmr's Merit Dashboard, you were promoted to Legendary rank sometime in early December 2022:

Poker Player             -> Legendary from New Era Newbie during Merit System kick-off.

[Etranger]

Precisely because there's a lack of new users with good posts I believe that we don't need new merit sources. At this point in my opinion new merit sources should only happen if less active ones are removed and their sMerits rescinded. When forum activity from new users goes down merit sources should ideally decrease, not increase.

It implies that you consider merit sources necessary only for the development and encouragement of newbies. But they evaluate other ranks in exactly the same way. And it cannot be said that beginners need merits more than higher ranks. Moreover, the forum does not become a less active and interesting place because there are no motivated newbies writing quality posts. I personally find it more interesting to observe the development of those members who have already walked a certain path here, and who value this experience and skills acquired at the forum. For me it is more important rather than to look for newbies, trying to lure them with merit for some repetitive questions.

[alani123]

Precisely because there's a lack of new users with good posts I believe that we don't need new merit sources. At this point in my opinion new merit sources should only happen if less active ones are removed and their sMerits rescinded. When forum activity from new users goes down merit sources should ideally decrease, not increase.

It implies that you consider merit sources necessary only for the development and encouragement of newbies. But they evaluate other ranks in exactly the same way. And it cannot be said that beginners need merits more than higher ranks. Moreover, the forum does not become a less active and interesting place because there are no motivated newbies writing quality posts. I personally find it more interesting to observe the development of those members who have already walked a certain path here, and who value this experience and skills acquired at the forum. For me it is more important rather than to look for newbies, trying to lure them with merit for some repetitive questions.

Judging merit by its intended function isn't something bad, is it? Of course there's also other acceptable reasons to give merit. When there's an oversupply of something we become less caring about how we spend it. Much like with USD. A car used to be 500 USD. However as governments keep printing more, numbers become meaningless. A handful of people have thousands of merits, which isn't a bad thing really.

The odd thing here is that there's a very distinct lack of new posters with valuable information in this forum. And the question that arises here is if there's good enough reason to justify adding more merit sources if this situation persists.

[KingsDen]

Precisely because there's a lack of new users with good posts I believe that we don't need new merit sources. At this point in my opinion new merit sources should only happen if less active ones are removed and their sMerits rescinded. When forum activity from new users goes down merit sources should ideally decrease, not increase.

It implies that you consider merit sources necessary only for the development and encouragement of newbies. But they evaluate other ranks in exactly the same way. And it cannot be said that beginners need merits more than higher ranks. Moreover, the forum does not become a less active and interesting place because there are no motivated newbies writing quality posts. I personally find it more interesting to observe the development of those members who have already walked a certain path here, and who value this experience and skills acquired at the forum. For me it is more important rather than to look for newbies, trying to lure them with merit for some repetitive questions.

Although merits are needed for ranking up, but i think that theymos idea of merit is different from how it is working. Theymos idea of merit does not differentiate a newbie from a legendary member. The merit giver doesn't necessarily need to know the name of the user he is issuing merit to let alone the rank, but strictly on the quality of the post. If a legendary member makes 20 quality posts, those posts could all receive merits while a newbie who made 200 non quality post might not recieve even 1 merit. That is the merit system.

However, the merit sources are not machines, so they have conscience and that is why they see things differently and subjectively. Some at times give priority to newbies while others have high standards and keep recycling the merits among those they think make the quality posts.

[Bitcoinsummoner]

To become a Legendary w/ a 2021 registration date by now would mean posting just about every day (or at least 14 times per 2 weeks) since then, along with accumulating an average of ~1 merit every day... No easy feat really. It requires a lot of commitment to going beyond shitposting, which is a step most accounts here aren't willing to take. They are here because its "easy money"... once you have to put effort into it its no longer "easy" anymore. So they will never get beyond Sr. Member or Hero and they don't care.

I think it took me at least 4 years to get to Legendary based on the speed of my posting, which was intermittent. I don't think merits would have been a factor but who knows.

Your analysis provides a valuable perspective on the journey to reach Legendary status. It's important that reaching such a milestone requires consistent dedication and a willingness to contribute meaningfully. If one user honestly wants to reach the targeted figure then it will be possible for him but if users can't gather much knowledge about the forum with current news about the cryptocurrency then obviously the users will fail to reach that figure.

[Etranger]

Although merits are needed for ranking up, but i think that theymos idea of merit is different from how it is working. Theymos idea of merit does not differentiate a newbie from a legendary member. The merit giver doesn't necessarily need to know the name of the user he is issuing merit to let alone the rank, but strictly on the quality of the post. If a legendary member makes 20 quality posts, those posts could all receive merits while a newbie who made 200 non quality post might not recieve even 1 merit. That is the merit system.

However, the merit sources are not machines, so they have conscience and that is why they see things differently and subjectively. Some at times give priority to newbies while others have high standards and keep recycling the merits among those they think make the quality posts.

A situation where merits are given regardless of the recipient's rank is simply impossible. And I don't see how that could be considered the original idea of the merit system. We all see each other's rank and the amount of merit we have. And all this information influence the decision of sending merits. Even when a person decides to give merit to someone, he often takes into account who exactly wrote a quality post, and may give more merits to the post written by a newbie, for example, than for the same post written by a legendary, because he believes that making quality posts is harder for a newbie than for someone who is already familiar with forum. Or, on the contrary, a person sends significantly more merits to a hero or legendary, although he does not need them to increase the rank, simply because he thinks that the higher the rank, the more merits the post written by this user deserves. If the idea was to make a merit system independent of rank and the subjective opinion that arises because of the user's rank, then it would be logical to hide the rank. And so it is available to everyone, everybody see the rank of every other user and, of course, it affects the decision to send merits.

[paid2]

--snip--

--snip--

We already have an active topic on the matter: Should Merit-Sources send merit based on their feelings or quality of the post?

[kuriboh]

One more example, LoyceV managed the campaign a long time ago, and as far as I know he is still open to such offers. Do you doubt that he would abuse his merit source status by running a campaign?

I'd argue the opposite: a campaign manager is supposed to read many of the posts made in his campaigns. That's a great opportunity to Merit the good ones (and remove the users with bad posts from the campaign). That's not Merit abuse, it's doing a good job.
It may mean the campaign manager sends more Merit to users in his campaigns, because he reads more of their posts. But that shouldn't matter much, as there are 100+ other Merit sources too.

To call it Merit abuse, there should be something in it for the campaign manager. Unless you're going to the extremes of Meriting his own alts to join his own campaigns, I don't see that happening. Most campaign managers have earned enough sMerit to be able to do that without being a source anyway.

Yes, I agree with your counterargument. A campaigner should read all posts made in his campaign very carefully. Many campaigning roles are avoided because his campaign is about campaigning. It's not that they don't see the post, but since they work on the campaign, they should read every post very well. Those who post good quality are already qualified, but for them, this is a golden opportunity from which they can quickly move ahead with qualification.

To me, a forum where tens of thousands of people are active posting very regularly like in here, should also be having an influx of new users that are able to contribute that is akin to its active userbase. That would be at least a few hundreds of new users becoming legendary every year. If we check https://bpip.org/Report?r=mostmerit there's only one legendary user in the top 1000 with a registration date of 2021 and 14 users from 2020. So in a little more than 3 years only 15 users reached the maximum rank. Also note that the bottom of the top 1000 have only a tiny bit merit above the required 1k to become legendary so I wouldn't guess that there's many more besides that.

To become a Legendary w/ a 2021 registration date by now would mean posting just about every day (or at least 14 times per 2 weeks) since then, along with accumulating an average of ~1 merit every day... No easy feat really. It requires a lot of commitment to going beyond shitposting, which is a step most accounts here aren't willing to take. They are here because its "easy money"... once you have to put effort into it its no longer "easy" anymore. So they will never get beyond Sr. Member or Hero and they don't care.

I think it took me at least 4 years to get to Legendary based on the speed of my posting, which was intermittent. I don't think merits would have been a factor but who knows.

I am very happy to see your post today. When I came here, the rules were straightforward. I came here in 2013, but my days have been greatly destroyed. Now that my physical condition is a little better, I came back after facing many problems. Had my status not deteriorated, my status on this forum would have been on the side of legend.
There are many rules now, which is a lovely aspect of the forum. Accordingly, good things can still be done in the forum. To become a legend, he needs to have that mindset. No one became a legend in a day in the forum; you have to work for it, only in the right way. It is possible, but it is not possible.
You started your journey in this forum in 2014 and gave everyone a lot of reasonable effort. It is possible because of tireless work. It took you 4 years, but it all depends on his attendance and how active he is. With your help, we will reach a good position ahead.

[nutildah]

I apologize for the off-topic, but this guy's continual lying bothers me a lot:

I came here in 2013

No, you did not. You bought this account and then started copy/pasting ChatGPT for your posts. Someone claiming to be the original owner even bothered to protest because your posts are so remarkably bad:

I can confirm that account is stoled, It was my old account that I dont have access anymore, I dont know how long my account has been stoled. I can confirm it by old mails and proofs, I dont want my old account back, i dont care tbh, but i dont want anyone to impersonate me.

If you can check my 2013 writing to this writing now is clear its not the same person, bc I was the old owner.

You should absolutely be banned.

Clear use of chatbot services that should result in a ban right away.

User: kuriboh

Copy:

I think Bitcoin is a dynamic and evolving digital asset, subject to price fluctuations, regulatory developments, and technological advancements, as of my most recent knowledge update in January 2024.

...

These are my own writings now how do I know someone else is posting the same give a link to any other post that matches my post.
...

 


To bring things back on topic, I am officially endorsing icopress as a merit source and support his application.

[SamReomo]

a campaign manager is supposed to read many of the posts made in his campaigns. That's a great opportunity to Merit the good ones (and remove the users with bad posts from the campaign). That's not Merit abuse, it's doing a good job.

Yes, that's very true, a campaign manager gives enough time to reading posts made by the users who are enrolled in the campaigns that he's managing, and thus it becomes easy for him to notice good posts. And, it's true that such campaign manager can merit all good posts in the campaigns that he's managing and there's nothing wrong in meriting good posts even if you're meriting someone who's part of the campaign that you're managing.

I believe Icopress can do both jobs brilliantly without any issue. We all know how much contribution he's doing on this forum and as a merit source he'll be able to contribute even more by sending merits to the posts that need those merits. I believe Icopress can be one of the best merit sources of this forum and that's why I think Theymos should definitely assigned him as a merit source.

[JollyGood]

Has any reputable member actually made any comment to state or suggest icopress should not be a merit source because they alleged he is incompetent? I read a post from a long time member stating a possible conflict of interest but he did not provide a factual reason icopress should not be considered for merit source.

Other than that, I believe there are a couple of posts from attention seekers (one of whom clearly has ulterior motives to oppose icopress becoming merit source, probably on the basis of being overlooked/rejected when he applied to join campaigns managed by icopress) who have opposed therefore the vast majority of members that have posted in the thread are in favour of his application.

I believe Icopress can do both jobs brilliantly without any issue. We all know how much contribution he's doing on this forum and as a merit source he'll be able to contribute even more by sending merits to the posts that need those merits. I believe Icopress can be one of the best merit sources of this forum and that's why I think Theymos should definitely assigned him as a merit source.

[SamReomo]

I believe there are a couple of posts from attention seekers (one of whom clearly has ulterior motives to oppose icopress becoming merit source, probably on the basis of being overlooked/rejected when he applied to join campaigns managed by icopress) who have opposed therefore the vast majority of members that have posted in the thread are in favour of his application.

Yes, I agree with you, I don't really want to say anything about those attention seekers because they won't be successful in their attempts no matter how hard they try. Icopress is a well-deserving member, he has done a lot for the forum, and those who understand his importance will always support him and his application. He's hard-working himself and he support all those members who work hard.

I can say that Icopress is a pure-hearted and a professional person, someone like him will always be recommended by those members who understand his worth. The service Icopress is doing of this forum is appreciate worthy and I will always support his application and I'm very sure that soon Theymos and other high authority members will also consider Icopress's application and make him a merit source. Hope that day will come soon.

[The Sceptical Chymist]

I read a post from a long time member stating a possible conflict of interest but he did not provide a factual reason icopress should not me considered for merit source.

Yeah, and if it's the post I'm thinking of (which I responded to earlier), the argument was basically that merit sources shouldn't be managing sig campaigns.  Sure, there could potentially be problems with that dual role depending on who the person is but I haven't seen any evidence presented that icopress in particular would take advantage of his position as merit source in some way, and a hypothetical argument like that just doesn't hold any water as far as this application is concerned.

While we're all debating this crap, none of us know what's on Theymos's mind with respect to the merit system, how it's functioning nowadays, and whether new merit sources are needed.  I don't even know when the last merit source was added, but it was probably a long time ago--and if it was recent it was probably to replace one or more sources that dropped out.  It'd be so nice if Big Boss Man would descend from the mountaintop with his tablets and, if not drop some commandments on us, at least give the community a state-of-the-merit-system address.  Curious minds like mine would love to know what's happening.

[Rikafip]

I don't even know when the last merit source was added, but it was probably a long time ago

You are right, it was quite a long time ago indeed, as last time theymos readjusted merit was in June 2021.

and if it was recent it was probably to replace one or more sources that dropped out. 

Effects of few merit sources leaving the forum are getting to be noticeable. As seen in the Merit Dashboard, monthly merit numbers were usually between 24-27k ever since July 2021 and last month (February 2024), that number dropped down to ~20k, which is the lowest since that latest merit readjustment and if the number continues dropping, I think we might see theymos intervening again.

[philipma1957]

I read a post from a long time member stating a possible conflict of interest but he did not provide a factual reason icopress should not me considered for merit source.

Yeah, and if it's the post I'm thinking of (which I responded to earlier), the argument was basically that merit sources shouldn't be managing sig campaigns.  Sure, there could potentially be problems with that dual role depending on who the person is but I haven't seen any evidence presented that icopress in particular would take advantage of his position as merit source in some way, and a hypothetical argument like that just doesn't hold any water as far as this application is concerned.

While we're all debating this crap, none of us know what's on Theymos's mind with respect to the merit system, how it's functioning nowadays, and whether new merit sources are needed.  I don't even know when the last merit source was added, but it was probably a long time ago--and if it was recent it was probably to replace one or more sources that dropped out.  It'd be so nice if Big Boss Man would descend from the mountaintop with his tablets and, if not drop some commandments on us, at least give the community a state-of-the-merit-system address.  Curious minds like mine would love to know what's happening.

Listen I have mentioned I like icopress and I gave him 50 merits which he can give out as he pleases. once a month is passed I WILL GIVE HIM 50 More merits,but the fact remains no signature person should be a merit source. I know some have said there are signature managers that are merit sources has it occurred to anyone when was the last signature manager appointed as a merit source  or better yet that no signature manager ever became a merit soure. That the dual people were merit sources and asked to be a signature manager.

Ie I am a merit source I want to be a signature manager does anyone want to hire me. Is this the way merit sources became signature managers.

or are there signature managers that added merit source later.

I know that there are supposed to be a few people with dual status .

but I do not know if they are all

source add signature manager.

or signature manager add source.


if none are signature manager add source then theymos is showing us something.

I will give icopress 50 merits once I can.

[Poker Player]

Listen I have mentioned I like icopress and I gave him 50 merits which he can give out as he pleases. once a month is passed I WILL GIVE HIM 50 More merits,but the fact remains no signature person should be a merit source....

I will give icopress 50 merits once I can.

You don't see anything unusual here? Because I do. To establish as a general category without exceptions that no campaign manager should be merit source and then give icopress 50 merits as often as you can I see it contradictory and even a bad use of the merit system.

What is the reason why you are giving 50 merits every time you can? Because it should be for his quality posts.

I could also read here that you are using your merit source status to not close the doors to icopress hiring you in the future because of the position you express here.

Not only campaign managers can have a potential conflict of interest if they are appointed merit sources. Campaign participants, like you, do too.

[philipma1957]

Listen I have mentioned I like icopress and I gave him 50 merits which he can give out as he pleases. once a month is passed I WILL GIVE HIM 50 More merits,but the fact remains no signature person should be a merit source....

I will give icopress 50 merits once I can.

You don't see anything unusual here? Because I do. To establish as a general category without exceptions that no campaign manager should be merit source and then give icopress 50 merits as often as you can I see it contradictory and even a bad use of the merit system.

What is the reason why you are giving 50 merits every time you can? Because it should be for his quality posts.

I could also read here that you are using your merit source status to not close the doors to icopress hiring you in the future because of the position you express here.

Not only campaign managers can have a potential conflict of interest if they are appointed merit sources. Campaign participants, like you, do too.

I will never use icopress as a signature manager because I am consistent about conflict of interest and would consider it a conflict of interest due to me giving him 50 and soon another 50 merits.

Please quote this.

thank you

[JollyGood]

Yeah, and if it's the post I'm thinking of (which I responded to earlier), the argument was basically that merit sources shouldn't be managing sig campaigns.  Sure, there could potentially be problems with that dual role depending on who the person is but I haven't seen any evidence presented that icopress in particular would take advantage of his position as merit source in some way, and a hypothetical argument like that just doesn't hold any water as far as this application is concerned.

That is correct, no evidence was presented to show a correlation exists between being a campaign manager and merit source simultaneously equates to a conflict of interest. Furthermore, exactly what that conflict of interest would be has not been elaborated on.

While we're all debating this crap, none of us know what's on Theymos's mind with respect to the merit system, how it's functioning nowadays, and whether new merit sources are needed.  I don't even know when the last merit source was added, but it was probably a long time ago--and if it was recent it was probably to replace one or more sources that dropped out.  It'd be so nice if Big Boss Man would descend from the mountaintop with his tablets and, if not drop some commandments on us, at least give the community a state-of-the-merit-system address.  Curious minds like mine would love to know what's happening.

I guess we could ask the whereabouts of theymos but at the same time we could also ask why the main protagonists that did not support the application by icopress has stopped frequenting in this thread.

[Poker Player]

I will never use icopress as a signature manager because I am consistent about conflict of interest and would consider it a conflict of interest due to me giving him 50 and soon another 50 merits.

Please quote this.

thank you

Lol.

I think you overcomplicate your life in this regard. You don't need to give him 50 merits every time you can, nor prohibit yourself from participating in his campaigns. Although obviously as an autonomous person and merit source you can do whatever you want. But I see all this in a simpler way, and I will not repeat what I have already said about icopress postulation in previous posts in this thread.

[JollyGood]

This caught post my attention because I fail to understand the rationale behind your point. This is how I interpreted it:

If icopress remains a campaign manager but is not a merit source (as the situation currently stands), you stating you will never apply to join his campaigns purely on the basis you deem it to be a conflict of interest because he merely asked to be a merit source. Did I understand you correctly?

I will never use icopress as a signature manager because I am consistent about conflict of interest and would consider it a conflict of interest due to me giving him 50 and soon another 50 merits.

Please quote this.

thank you

[SamReomo]

I will never use icopress as a signature manager because I am consistent about conflict of interest and would consider it a conflict of interest due to me giving him 50 and soon another 50 merits.

There is nothing wrong if you send merits to Icopress because he's a well contributing member and he deserves to have those merits. And, I believe you can get into signature campaigns managed by him and that won't be conflict of interest.

If he's managing a campaign and others are getting into those campaigns then you can also be part of those campaigns. I'm very sure that you sent Icopress those merits because you believe that he deserves those merits and there's no conflict of interest when you send 50 more merits.

[LoyceV]

the fact remains no signature person should be a merit source.

That goes against Bitcointalk's mission to be as free as possible. The only difference between a Merit source and someone else is that a Merit source isn't allowed to sell Merit.

Ie I am a merit source I want to be a signature manager does anyone want to hire me. Is this the way merit sources became signature managers.

I haven't seen much abuse from Merit sources, and I've never seen something as obvious as "hire me because I'm a Merit source".

[examplens]

I will never use icopress as a signature manager because I am consistent about conflict of interest and would consider it a conflict of interest due to me giving him 50 and soon another 50 merits.

Please quote this.

thank you

Oh, so isn't this the wrong attitude for merit giving, especially for merit sources?
you will give him maximum merit whenever you can, you promise in advance regardless of whether he will write something worth so much merit. Is that compensation for your position on this topic?

[Don Pedro Dinero]

The only difference between a Merit source and someone else is that a Merit source isn't allowed to sell Merit.

Explain that better because it infers that those of us who are not merit sources are allowed to sell merit and I doubt very much that you mean that. In fact from what I remember theymos talked about how he only saw it as legitimate to red tag someone for selling merit (not for exchanging it, for example, or giving it in a careless way), with no distinction between whether the person selling it is a merit source or not.

[LoyceV]

The only difference between a Merit source and someone else is that a Merit source isn't allowed to sell Merit.

Explain that better

Meriting as a normal user:

You have received a total of 101 merit. This is what determines your forum rank. You typically cannot lose this merit. You have 1 sendable merit (sMerit) which you can send to other people. There is no point in hoarding sMerit; keeping it yourself does not benefit you, and we reserve the right to decay unused sMerit in the future.

Meriting as a Merit source:

You have received a total of 16249 merit. This is what determines your forum rank. You typically cannot lose this merit. You have xxxx sendable merit (sMerit) which you can send to other people. There is no point in hoarding sMerit; keeping it yourself does not benefit you, and we reserve the right to decay unused sMerit in the future.

You are a merit source. The next 123 merit you spend will come from your source rather than your sMerit balance. Merit spent from your source will come back in 30 days. Unused source merit is wasted. It is not allowed for merit sources to sell their merit.

because it infers that those of us who are not merit sources are allowed to sell merit and I doubt very much that you mean that.

It's the same as selling accounts: it's not forbidden, so it's allowed. There are no consequences from the forum, but it's heavily frowned upon. You won't get banned and your sent Merit won't be reverted, but you can get negative feedback from anyone who thinks you deserve it.

theymos talked about how he only saw it as legitimate to red tag someone for selling merit (not for exchanging it, for example, or giving it in a careless way), with no distinction between whether the person selling it is a merit source or not.

Theymos was talking to a Merit source when he said that:

If a DT member tags you for something stupid involving merit (ie. probably anything less than selling merit), then they're not going to be a DT member for much longer.

[dkbit98]

The only difference between a Merit source and someone else is that a Merit source isn't allowed to sell Merit.

As far as I know nobody is allowed to sell merits in forum, not just merit sources, maybe this is not written in forum rules but everyone knows this is a not endorsed.
It happened before several times, they got caught and they deserved negative feedback for sure.

[LoyceMobile]

The only difference between a Merit source and someone else is that a Merit source isn't allowed to sell Merit.

As far as I know nobody is allowed to sell merits in forum, not just merit sources, maybe this is not written in forum rules but everyone knows this is a not endorsed.
It happened before several times, they got caught and they deserved negative feedback for sure.

I think it's a bit like scamming: the forum doesn't take action against it, but the community does.

[philipma1957]

I will never use icopress as a signature manager because I am consistent about conflict of interest and would consider it a conflict of interest due to me giving him 50 and soon another 50 merits.

Please quote this.

thank you

Lol.

I think you overcomplicate your life in this regard. You don't need to give him 50 merits every time you can, nor prohibit yourself from participating in his campaigns. Although obviously as an autonomous person and merit source you can do whatever you want. But I see all this in a simpler way, and I will not repeat what I have already said about icopress postulation in previous posts in this thread.

Took your advice and only gave him 13 even though I could have done 50.

[NotATether]

A bit late from me but I hereby endorse icopress' merit source application. Good luck.

[SamReomo]

Took your advice and only gave him 13 even though I could have done 50.

You could gave him 50 merits that wouldn't be wrong either. But, the point is, your sending of merits shouldn't impact your and his relationship in anyway. Like if you send him 50 merits at a time, and to be honest he deserves those merits, then you may still not feel any hesitation when you may get to work with him in future.

We all are like a family on this forum, and if someone who appreciates a family member's posts or in simple words contribution then he/she can send merits to that member for his/her contribution. After sometime when the member who sent merits to a member gets accepted in a campaign that's managed by the same member then there's nothing wrong in that either.

[philipma1957]

Took your advice and only gave him 13 even though I could have done 50.

You could gave him 50 merits that wouldn't be wrong either. But, the point is, your sending of merits shouldn't impact your and his relationship in anyway. Like if you send him 50 merits at a time, and to be honest he deserves those merits, then you may still not feel any hesitation when you may get to work with him in future.

We all are like a family on this forum, and if someone who appreciates a family member's posts or in simple words contribution then he/she can send merits to that member for his/her contribution. After sometime when the member who sent merits to a member gets accepted in a campaign that's managed by the same member then there's nothing wrong in that either.

Yeah I could continue to support him with merits. I likely will do that.

A lot of the disagreement by  me with this thread  is my Accounting and IRS training. Which define a merit source act as a signature manager as a conflict of interest.

Much like the bill payer in a business should not be the bill collector. Separation of duties is the concept.

So far I gave him 63 merits .

[JollyGood]

Took your advice and only gave him 13 even though I could have done 50.

Forgive me if I am missing something here but did Poker Player actually give any advice aimed at you? I have read his post and cannot work out why you seem to have concluded anything from his comments equating to you giving merits to icopress (or anyone else) in order to support him.

Furthermore, I cannot think of any reason why you would give merits to support icopress or anyone else. How does support even work unless you are a merit source that reviews posts and helps members rank up by giving merits and the merits are all used. In that case members might give merits to help the rank up process for worthy posts but other than that I cannot see find any valid reason.

Yeah I could continue to support him with merits. I likely will do that.

A lot of the disagreement by  me with this thread  is my Accounting and IRS training. Which define a merit source act as a signature manager as a conflict of interest.

Much like the bill payer in a business should not be the bill collector. Separation of duties is the concept.

So far I gave him 63 merits .

I am curious, how do you think your 63 merits supported him?

[philipma1957]

Took your advice and only gave him 13 even though I could have done 50.

Forgive me if I am missing something here but did Poker Player actually give any advice aimed at you? I have read his post and cannot work out why you seem to have concluded anything from his comments equating to you giving merits to icopress (or anyone else) in order to support him.

Furthermore, I cannot think of any reason why you would give merits to support icopress or anyone else. How does support even work unless you are a merit source that reviews posts and helps members rank up by giving merits and the merits are all used. In that case members might give merits to help the rank up process for worthy posts but other than that I cannot see find any valid reason.

Yeah I could continue to support him with merits. I likely will do that.

A lot of the disagreement by  me with this thread  is my Accounting and IRS training. Which define a merit source act as a signature manager as a conflict of interest.

Much like the bill payer in a business should not be the bill collector. Separation of duties is the concept.

So far I gave him 63 merits .

I am curious, how do you think your 63 merits supported him?

63 merits = 31 merits to give out. 

[JollyGood]

If I understand the situation correctly, icopress has made a merit source application like many other members but I do not recall any of them receiving merits for the sake of helping the applicants to merit other posts.

I do not recall icopress ever asking for help at all and definitely not via merits. If he did not ask for members to merit his posts in order for him be able to merit more posts, why should any member take it upon themselves to merit his posts for the sake of increasing the number merits he can send? I am confused.

Also, if this type of generosity was aimed at just one merit source applicant while the others were not given merits, it is clearly unfair and would raise questions.

63 merits = 31 merits to give out. 

[philipma1957]

If I understand the situation correctly, icopress has made a merit source application like many other members but I do not recall any of them receiving merits for the sake of helping the applicants to merit other posts.

I do not recall icopress ever asking for help at all and definitely not via merits. If he did not ask for members to merit his posts in order for him be able to merit more posts, why should any member take it upon themselves to merit his posts for the sake of increasing the number merits he can send? I am confused.

Also, if this type of generosity was aimed at just one merit source applicant while the others were not given merits, it is clearly unfair and would raise questions.

63 merits = 31 merits to give out. 

he is the only one that handles signature campaigns.

if you can point out an application from a person that did not get the merit source and is a signature manager I may award merits to that person. If I like his work. Which is my entire point about Icopress I like his work.

[JollyGood]

Right now I cannot think of any campaign manager that asked to become merit source but having said that icopress asked to become a merit source he did not ask for members (including you) to merit his posts in order for him to be able to send out more merits to other members.

Hypothetically, if you asked to be merit source, given a choice would you prefer a member to post his support for you to become merit source or would you prefer to receive merits from a member because he likes your work but has become a vocal opposition to your merit source application citing a possible conflict of interest?

It seems you do not want icopress to become a merit source yet you are happy to give him merits for posts that might or might not deserve them on the basis you like his work. For me, the two simply do not equate.

If I understand the situation correctly, icopress has made a merit source application like many other members but I do not recall any of them receiving merits for the sake of helping the applicants to merit other posts.

I do not recall icopress ever asking for help at all and definitely not via merits. If he did not ask for members to merit his posts in order for him be able to merit more posts, why should any member take it upon themselves to merit his posts for the sake of increasing the number merits he can send? I am confused.

Also, if this type of generosity was aimed at just one merit source applicant while the others were not given merits, it is clearly unfair and would raise questions.

63 merits = 31 merits to give out.  

he is the only one that handles signature campaigns.

if you can point out an application from a person that did not get the merit source and is a signature manager I may award merits to that person. If I like his work. Which is my entire point about Icopress I like his work.

[SamReomo]

A lot of the disagreement by  me with this thread  is my Accounting and IRS training. Which define a merit source act as a signature manager as a conflict of interest.

Yes, I believe that's because of your accounting and IRS training, however in actual there won't be conflict of interest. If you notice the merit history of Icopress then you can easily observe that he gets more than enough merits and in all of the signature campaigns that he manages, he never asks for number of merits a member earned in past 120 days.

He mostly accept the members based on their posting habits not based on the number of merits earned, and if we keep that in our mind then I'm sure there won't be any conflict of interest even if he becomes a merit source and give merits to the valuable posts of the members who are part of the signature campaigns that he's managing.

I have read his post and cannot work out why you seem to have concluded anything from his comments equating to you giving merits to icopress (or anyone else) in order to support him.

If I'm not wrong then it's a generous act by philipma1957 to support Icopress with merits so he may get some sMerits that he could send to the deserving posts. That's what came in my mind, I could be wrong but it's an act of generosity and support from philipma1957 I believe. If I'm not wrong then philipma1957 also believes that Icopress is doing great job for the forum and that could be another reason why he's sending those merits to Icopress.

[JollyGood]

We are in agreement here, that is what he seems to be doing however he also voiced his opposition to icopress becoming merit source and that is where the two do not equate. No doubt he has been very generous with his merits to icopress but icopress did not ask for them.

The question if asked in a general sense, would any merit source applicant be happy to receive merits from those opposing his application because they like work or would they prefer to read a post to indicate they are (or are not) supporting his application?

Without doubt philipma1957 is being generous with his merits but from what I can see there is a huge contradiction in actions, that was why I stated that for me the two simply do not equate.

I have read his post and cannot work out why you seem to have concluded anything from his comments equating to you giving merits to icopress (or anyone else) in order to support him.

If I'm not wrong then it's a generous act by philipma1957 to support Icopress with merits so he may get some sMerits that he could send to the deserving posts. That's what came in my mind, I could be wrong but it's an act of generosity and support from philipma1957 I believe. If I'm not wrong then philipma1957 also believes that Icopress is doing great job for the forum and that could be another reason why he's sending those merits to Icopress.

[SamReomo]

We are in agreement here, that is what he seems to be doing however he also voiced his opposition to icopress becoming merit source and that is where the two do not equate. No doubt he has been very generous with his merits to icopress but icopress did not ask for them.

The question if asked in a general sense, would any merit source applicant be happy to receive merits from those opposing his application because they like work or would they prefer to read a post to indicate they are (or are not) supporting his application?

Yeah, he opposed the application but his stance was "Conflict of Interest," which's not true as we all know, and in his previous posts he mentioned that he had background knowledge in accounting and IRS training and that made him to bring the "Conflict of interest," topic to the application.

Icopress, never asked for any merits but I believe he won't mind having those merits as he's a deserving member of the forum and if someone sends him merits, no matter if the merits come from an opposing member, then there's nothing wrong with it. I know it could be somehow hurtful to hear opposing words from reputed members but I'm quite sure that Icopress understands that in merit source application, both support and opposition could be present.

You're right that no body becomes happy when they get merits from someone who opposed their application, but still if someone is sending merits as a way to show his generosity then one should accept it as a sign of good will. I highly agree with all your words, however, I believe that philipma1957 could rethink about his opposition and might take it words back because if we analyze it deeply then we can understand that there won't be any conflict of interest or whatsoever even if a manager becomes a merit source.

[Sandra_hakeem]

Also, if this type of generosity was aimed at just one merit source applicant while the others were not given merits, it is clearly unfair and would raise questions.

I just read through the entire argument and it was kinda like amusing at first... So many things happening and it seems like nothing has happened at all ... Meanwhile, philipma1957 didn't necessarily have to give out merit to Icopress -- especially since he's not made to issue an allocation of any sort... Ehnnn... But he said that he felt like supporting him and that he likes his job... In that case, do you feel uncomfortable or like maybe there's any suspicions in his actions?... I haven't seen you pressing on an issue like this without any valid reason.

The question if asked in a general sense, would any merit source applicant be happy to receive merits from those opposing his application because they like work or would they prefer to read a post to indicate they are (or are not) supporting his application?

I didn't get this point... Was philipma previously against icopress' application? Ofcourse they'd prefer to write on this thread whether or not they're in support  
Again Theymos, could you please validate the few merit sources "to-be" that have applied? I believe you can see this....cus I read something about some merit circle yesterday... That's exactly the kinda world we live in.

Sandra 🧑‍🦰

[icopress]

Again Theymos, could you please validate the few merit sources "to-be" that have applied? I believe you can see this....cus I read something about some merit circle yesterday... That's exactly the kinda world we live in.

At the moment, theymos is not considering anyone for the role of m'sources (I believe this will be the case for at least the next 6 months).

[Timelord2067]

Just scrolling back through many pages of your post history (going back over the last few months) anyone can see the majority of your own posts are in the gaming section (usually typical one line glib comments) - do you feel you have enough coverage of the various sections of the forum to be in a position to hand out endless merits to a wide cross section of the forum?

Or just people in your signature campaigns?

[m2017]

Again Theymos, could you please validate the few merit sources "to-be" that have applied? I believe you can see this....cus I read something about some merit circle yesterday... That's exactly the kinda world we live in.

At the moment, theymos is not considering anyone for the role of m'sources (I believe this will be the case for at least the next 6 months).

Well, then I believe that this topic can be closed for discussion for at least 6 months. Otherwise, the debating an irrelevant topic will not stop.

Just scrolling back through many pages of your post history (going back over the last few months) anyone can see the majority of your own posts are in the gaming section (usually typical one line glib comments) - do you feel you have enough coverage of the various sections of the forum to be in a position to hand out endless merits to a wide cross section of the forum?

In the gambling section, very little merit is given out (I wonder why) and an active Merit Source in that section could correct the imbalance through their actions.

Or just people in your signature campaigns?

This is precisely why it is unacceptable to combine the role of a campaign manager and a Merit Source.

[philipma1957]

Also, if this type of generosity was aimed at just one merit source applicant while the others were not given merits, it is clearly unfair and would raise questions.

I just read through the entire argument and it was kinda like amusing at first... So many things happening and it seems like nothing has happened at all ... Meanwhile, philipma1957 didn't necessarily have to give out merit to Icopress -- especially since he's not made to issue an allocation of any sort... Ehnnn... But he said that he felt like supporting him and that he likes his job... In that case, do you feel uncomfortable or like maybe there's any suspicions in his actions?... I haven't seen you pressing on an issue like this without any valid reason.

The question if asked in a general sense, would any merit source applicant be happy to receive merits from those opposing his application because they like work or would they prefer to read a post to indicate they are (or are not) supporting his application?

I didn't get this point... Was philipma previously against icopress' application? Ofcourse they'd prefer to write on this thread whether or not they're in support  
Again Theymos, could you please validate the few merit sources "to-be" that have applied? I believe you can see this....cus I read something about some merit circle yesterday... That's exactly the kinda world we live in.

Sandra 🧑‍🦰

This is very simple

1) I like icopress I gave him merits because I like him.

2) I think no signature manager should have merit source

3) I am a trained accountant and separation of duties is a concept I believe in. This is why I think no signature manager should be a merit source.


As an aside I just gave icopress a few merits. to show I still like him.

[Poker Player]

1) I like icopress I gave him merits because I like him...

As an aside I just gave icopress a few merits. to show I still like him.

Do I have to tell you that this is wrong?

That's not what the merit system was created for.

To be honest with you philipma1957, you can say that because you have been on the forum since 2012, you are the human user who has written the most posts etc., otherwise anyone who said that would be severely criticized and I would personally have left a neutral tag on your profile about it.

I also like him but I've never given him any single merit just because I like him.

Besides I don't think it's simply because you like him, more a way to compensate for your stance against him being appointed a merit source.

[JollyGood]

This is very simple

1) I like icopress I gave him merits because I like him.

2) I think no signature manager should have merit source

3) I am a trained accountant and separation of duties is a concept I believe in. This is why I think no signature manager should be a merit source.


As an aside I just gave icopress a few merits. to show I still like him.

When it comes to giving merits to someone you like rather than giving merits because of the contents of a post, it is clearly not the correct use of the merit system.

Do I have to tell you that this is wrong?

That's not what the merit system was created for.

To be honest with you philipma1957, you can say that because you have been on the forum since 2012, you are the human user who has written the most posts etc., otherwise anyone who said that would be severely criticized and I would personally have left a neutral tag on your profile about it.

I also like him but I've never given him any single merit just because I like him.

Besides I don't think it's simply because you like him, more a way to compensate for your stance against him being appointed a merit source.

If I have understood his point of view correctly, it seems he is not using the merit system in the correct manner. Furthermore, because he believes he is using it in an appropriate way it will be difficult to try to convince him otherwise.

By the way, I have seen merit sources asking theymos for more merits in order to give them out to (what they deem to be) deserving posts and receiving merits from members including mostly other merit sources as a way to help out. If this is what philipma1957 is doing, I think there is no need for him to do that in this case.

[BlackHatCoiner]

To be honest with you philipma1957, you can say that because you have been on the forum since 2012, you are the human user who has written the most posts etc., otherwise anyone who said that would be severely criticized and I would personally have left a neutral tag on your profile about it.

It's good that we're being honest lately. Here's an honest question of mine: what are the mitigating factors of having a 12-year-old account? If you think this deserves a neutral feedback, then you should do it regardless the reputation of the user, otherwise you're being dishonest to the new users.

This recent discussion is the reason I'm in favor of not having strict rules when it comes to the merit system. People should be free to do whatever they want with their merits. If the admin notices suspicious activity from a merit source, they can just take their source role away.

[philipma1957]

1) I like icopress I gave him merits because I like him...

As an aside I just gave icopress a few merits. to show I still like him.

Do I have to tell you that this is wrong?

That's not what the merit system was created for.

To be honest with you philipma1957, you can say that because you have been on the forum since 2012, you are the human user who has written the most posts etc., otherwise anyone who said that would be severely criticized and I would personally have left a neutral tag on your profile about it.

I also like him but I've never given him any single merit just because I like him.

Besides I don't think it's simply because you like him, more a way to compensate for your stance against him being appointed a merit source.

So if i like a person must I give all the reasons that I like them to justify the merits I give him.

Is liking him not enough words for you.

Do you want a detailed explanation of why I like him why I trust him?

Here is one reason I like him and trust him. He pays the signature participants the correct amount of money due to them.


The internet will always have issues when writing to communicate.

My apologies if saying I like someone was not detailed enough for your standards.

So me giving him merits is my way of saying he does a good job distributing payments to people. He has been honest from all evidence I have seen. He has done this for years.

All qualites of a good campaign manager.

[Sandra_hakeem]

It's good that we're being honest lately. Here's an honest question of mine: what are the mitigating factors of having a 12-year-old account? If you think this deserves a neutral feedback, then you should do it regardless the reputation of the user, otherwise you're being dishonest to the new users.

But why?.. tchh! Accountability is part of the core problems we have in our community... Even in my newbie days, I tried as much as possible to point out so many cases that proved our merit system is biased; several elite members never seem to agree with it -- though it was obvious already.., they keep beating about some petty sentiments that doesn't even correlate with the proper way of recycling merits ... You could choose to merit only elite members like yourself if you were never a merit source but; It's a different thing if you've been appointed/allocated merit for sourceship -- you have a duty... The case is different today.
Amongst all the reputable members in our forum; if merit sources were inclined to meriting technical post&thread alone/ appointed due to their vast technical knowledge, do you think most members would rank up/ be called up as merit sources??... Lol..THE SYSTEM is made to be as free as possible; but it looks like some powerful people feel others shouldn't be like them.

Sandra 🧑‍🦰

[Poker Player]

So if i like a person must I give all the reasons that I like them to justify the merits I give him.

Is liking him not enough words for you.

Do you want a detailed explanation of why I like him why I trust him?

Here is one reason I like him and trust him. He pays the signature participants the correct amount of money due to them.


The internet will always have issues when writing to communicate.

My apologies if saying I like someone was not detailed enough for your standards.

So me giving him merits is my way of saying he does a good job distributing payments to people. He has been honest from all evidence I have seen. He has done this for years.

All qualites of a good campaign manager.

Come on! Merits do not have to be given to someone because you like him, nor because he is a campaign manager who pays his participants, which is what he is supposed to do.

As I said before, if it wasn't you, someone else doing the same thing would have a dozen people telling him what I'm telling you but since it's you you get a pass, which doesn't take away that you are misusing the merits giving them to people because you like them or because they are good campaign managers.

[philipma1957]

So if i like a person must I give all the reasons that I like them to justify the merits I give him.

Is liking him not enough words for you.

Do you want a detailed explanation of why I like him why I trust him?

Here is one reason I like him and trust him. He pays the signature participants the correct amount of money due to them.


The internet will always have issues when writing to communicate.

My apologies if saying I like someone was not detailed enough for your standards.

So me giving him merits is my way of saying he does a good job distributing payments to people. He has been honest from all evidence I have seen. He has done this for years.

All qualites of a good campaign manager.

Come on! Merits do not have to be given to someone because you like him, nor because he is a campaign manager who pays his participants, which is what he is supposed to do.

As I said before, if it wasn't you, someone else doing the same thing would have a dozen people telling him what I'm telling you but since it's you you get a pass, which doesn't take away that you are misusing the merits giving them to people because you like them or because they are good campaign managers.

Sad so sad the anger in your heart ❤️ must weigh you down.

[Poker Player]

Sad so sad the anger in your heart ❤️ must weigh you down.

There's no anger. I am trying to explain to you in a rational way that the merits should be given mainly for posts that have quality, not giving them to a person who you like simply because you like him, while you take it as a personal attack.

It seems incredible that with how long you've been on the forum I have to explain this to you and you don't understand it. I guess it's because of the time you've spent in the WO thread, since everything is different there and is tolerated.

[El duderino_]

Again Theymos, could you please validate the few merit sources "to-be" that have applied? I believe you can see this....cus I read something about some merit circle yesterday... That's exactly the kinda world we live in.

At the moment, theymos is not considering anyone for the role of m'sources (I believe this will be the case for at least the next 6 months).

Beamed you up Scotty

Spend them well.