The story of Betnomi.com (Exit Scam)

[GazetaBitcoin]

Maybe this is making a big jump; but would it be sort of possible to pin-point the time the devices were bought from the firmware version? I suppose that new devices come fully updated, and not so long ago we did discuss the 2020/2022 ledger operation times.

As far as I understand from an older post they made (included in my previous post), they bought these Ledgers in 2021

Let me clarify some details. To begin with, these custom wallets were not originally intended for ruffles or any other contests and events. These custom wallets were ordered in 2021 directly from the manufacturer to thank the employees for their hard work (quite a while has passed since then, and it is not surprising that the firmware is a little outdated). But we still had a few wallets left, until one of the forum users suggested some ideas where we can put them.

According to Ledger website (select Older firmware versions), we can see all firmware updates and their release dates. Hwever, the release date for 2.0.1 is not stated, by some reason. But we see that 2.0.0 was released on 21 October 2021 and 2.0.2 was released on 25 January 2022. So 2.0.1 was released between those dates. So the information matches what they said.

However, it's good to know that at least the devices don't contain some extra present; good work!

Thank you

@GazetaBitcoin Betnomi wallet hardware from you I can't enter Ledger Live have tried several times but failed, have entered the PIN but the fact is that it doesn't function properly.

Actually I wanted to ask this a long time ago but forgot because this hardware wallet is rarely turned on.

Maybe you know why it always stuck here?

Did you try to pull the USB cable completely inside the Ledger's muff? At my first attempt I inserted it half inside the muff so it did not even turn on, so I thought it was broken. Then I forced the cable muff a bit more inside the Ledger and it entered completely. Only after that I could turn it on and I had no problem with the Ledger Live.

Other than that, you can try uninstall Ledger Live and reinstall it and, when you start the tutorial again, select the option that you already have a Ledger which is set up, so not a brand new one.

And, of course, as Csmiami suggested, check the cable integrity I checked the wallet's integrity, not the cable =))) I hope you'll manage to bypass this problem. In any case, the software saying the Ledger is genuine is not so assuring. The important part is that we know now that the hardware integrity is in good shape. That is the most important aspect.


Later edit, as I just noticed your lattest post:

Confirming with another data cable can enter Ledger Live.
Yes, it seems that the power cord is not suitable for transferring data to the computer, but for charging it runs normally with the built-in cable.

Can it be said to be damaged if the built-in cable cannot transfer to the PC?

This is curious, but I observed, in time, that PC USBs act weird from a PC to another (maybe it depends if you have a USB 1.0 port or USB 2.0 or 3.0 or USB type C and so on). I don't know why this happens but it happens all the times. For example, when I try to connect my phone to my PC it does not see it or it sees it for 1 second then immediately it sees the phone was unplugged (although I did not unplug it). If I use same phone and same cable on another PC it works without any problem. It may be an issue with the USB port you are using. Since the cable can be used for powering the Ledger it's obvious that the cable is functional.

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[Csmiami]

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Since the cable can be used for powering the Ledger it's obvious that the cable is functional.

It can be functional but have the data pins or however they are actually called broken (or someone correct me if not). I'd simply toss if for another new one. Cables break, so not really a big issue

[holydarkness]

You've made tests which mean the products haven't been tampered. It's asking for big trust from ppl if they're using any thing given by Betnomi it's a risk they shouldn't take. Users shouldn't use them because if their balances became empty they won't forgive Betnomi.

Conclusion

Having these said, I guess that the owners of Betnomi Ledgers can relax now, as their products are not tampered with. Those which want though can perform the above steps for checking their wallets' hardware integrity on their own. However, I don't recommend this, unless you don't care if the device gets fully damaged or unless you are used to opening electronic device / fix them / etc.

It is very sad that icopress is having a huge loss because of Betnomi but, at least, they were not that evil to tamper the devices they raffled on the forum.

Pretty much sure the post you quoted just proven the exact opposite of your comment. Gazeta Tabloid spent a lot of time writing the post, and even longer time figuring every details and doing every steps needed to check the ledger's integrity, and they came clean.

Yes, people is advised to exercise caution when they use the ledger and they could do what Tabloid did [dismantling the device] if they want extra security, but it's proven that the ledgers are not tampered. Thus, if the balance became empty at one point, it's not necessarily Betnomi's fault. You do aware that there are a lot of malicious entities out there in crypto-space who perpetually tried to steal other people's fund, right?

By the way, supp...?

[GazetaBitcoin]

By the way, supp...?

Sup holydarkness

Pretty much sure the post you quoted just proven the exact opposite of your comment.

Lol! That also baffled me. He quoted the conclusion saying the Ledgers are clean while, at same time, he contradicts the conclusion. Furthermore, he contradicts himself inside his own sentence:

You've made tests which mean the products haven't been tampered. It's asking for big trust from ppl if they're using any thing given by Betnomi it's a risk they shouldn't take. Users shouldn't use them because if their balances became empty they won't forgive Betnomi.

So I'm not sure what he meant, unless he just tried to fill his signature campaign quota.

Gazeta Tabloid

spent a lot of time writing the post, and even longer time figuring every details and doing every steps needed to check the ledger's integrity, and they came clean.

Well, you figured that right, holydarkness... It took me around 5 hours to make all that research and write everything... As you saw, on Ledger website you only see those commands, but you have no idea where to type them. So search for that... find out you need Python... Then I launched Python but again I had no option to run those commands, then research again and find out you need something called "pip", then ask WTF is this pip, then look for how to install pip... then research some more and find out you also need some other components of Python installed and so on and so forth... Then the ultimate effort -- the one of opening the wallet case and try to place everything back inside... At some point I thought I won't be able to figure out how to perform this entire check but I felt somehow I was getting close so I didn't stop until I finished

[ajiz138]

It may be an issue with the USB port you are using. Since the cable can be used for powering the Ledger it's obvious that the cable is functional.

The USB port has no problem whatsoever, I have checked everything works on the PC, Yes it can only charge but cannot be connected to the PC with the built-in cable except for other cables that work properly.

I don't know where the problem lies, now it's normal with another data cable, trying to upgrade the firmwae to the latest version works fine and smoothly.

Now not so worried.

[efialtis]

https://www.btcgosu.com/blog/news/betnomi-exit-scam-users-left-in-limbo-as-crypto-gambling-operator-shuts-down/ 

[Mahdirakib]

It will be appreciated if all of you try to keep the subject of the thread accurate while making your post. GazetaBitcoin had changed it for the content of this post, but he has adjusted it on his next posts. Some other forum members aren't following it.
@ajiz138, will you take your time to merge your consecutive posts?

Pretty much sure the post you quoted just proven the exact opposite of your comment.

Lol! That also baffled me. He quoted the conclusion saying the Ledgers are clean while, at same time, he contradicts the conclusion.

Seems like the user has lack of commonsense. We had informed him several times that he is making unnecessary posts here. He ignored those warnings and continuously making unnecessary posts here. Even, it is hard to realize the key point of his post.

Well, you figured that right, holydarkness... It took me around 5 hours to make all that research and write everything

It also takes a long time to read and realise the steps of your post. I have only read the first part of it and ignored the second one where you described the process of opening the device. Thank you for verifying the transparency of Betnomi's given Ledger device.

Edit: @efialtis, I liked the title of the blog . Looks like you have included some information from this thread.

[LTU_btc]

After my earlier post, being also inspired by pixie85's post and by icopress' suggestion, I decided to check the hardware integrity of the Ledger I received from Betnomi.

Thanks for checking integrity of wallet. After reading your post, it looks like one of these operations that you shouldn't do at home if you don't know what you're doing. Well, this thing is definitely not for my skills. Maybe it would be possible to do it following your instructions, but I doubt that my wallet would work after that.
It's good to read that wallet is genuine. I was a bit sceptical about theory that Betnomi may have done something to it, it sounds like a bit too much sophisticated plan. But when it comes to scammers, you never can be sure.

[fillippone]

After my earlier post, being also inspired by pixie85's post and by icopress' suggestion, I decided to check the hardware integrity of the Ledger I received from Betnomi.

Very nice post, and somewhat reassuring.
The first, and only, thing I made with that signing device was actually performing an integrity check. I guess you are manually doing what the ledger live app is doing behind the curtain.
Don't trust, verify.

The only thing that puzzles me:

The entire list of TargetIDs is available on the website I mentioned above (obviously, none of these can be found directly on Ledger's website so you need deep Internet search for obtaining all this information):

Can you trust a list found on the internet? Why Ledger doesn't disclose this kind of information?

Otherwise,

Great work!

[Csmiami]

Why Ledger doesn't disclose this kind of information?

Huge leap maybe, but if what Gazeta did was really just manually check what Ledger Live does, I could think that they'd keep that private so that people would be "forced" to check the device/firmware integrity using the official app, and have more downloads and data spied

[fillippone]

Huge leap maybe, but if what Gazeta did was really just manually check what Ledger Live does, I could think that they'd keep that private so that people would be "forced" to check the device/firmware integrity using the official app, and have more downloads and data spied

Ledger Live App must be used anyway when updating the firmware, so there is a case for downloading the app and be spied on personal data. .

Anyway not a big surprise here, as the security model at Ledger has always been “Security trough obscurity”.

[GazetaBitcoin]

Very nice post, and somewhat reassuring.

Grazie tante!

I guess you are manually doing what the ledger live app is doing behind the curtain.
Don't trust, verify.

Yes, this is exactly what I did.

The only thing that puzzles me:

Can you trust a list found on the internet? Why Ledger doesn't disclose this kind of information?

Well, I will try to answer to this question below.

• The TargetID for Ledger Nano X -- 0x33000004 -- from that list was the same with the one mentioned on Ledger's website. Remember the command mentioned on their website:
  
  

  Secure Element attestation
  
  python -m ledgerblue.checkGenuineRemote --targetId 0x33000004

So having this TargetID mentioned on their website and as well inside that list confirmed that the information was correct. So no matter if the other values for TargetIDs from that list were correct or not, that did not influence the integrity check of this Ledger, as same information was provided by Ledger too.

• Now about the other values from that list, for the other Ledger models: if we look on Ledger's website, on the page about hardware integrity check, we can see this sentence:
  
  

  The source code is available here.

  
  If we access the link provided, we can see that the GitHub repository was provided by someone named dr-chain. Now if we open the page containing the list of TargetIDs we can see at its right side a section named "Contributors". There are 27 contributors. If we click on Contributors, to see all 27 names, one of them is dr-chain, meaning the one mentioned directly on Ledger's website. Does it make sense? Seeing the name of this developer on Ledger's website and also on that page containing all Ledger TargetIDs is reassuring from my perspective.

In any case, I did not check the integrity of other Ledger models excepting the Nano X one so I can't say that all those TargetIDs from that list are 100% correct. But for our check we can know for sure that the TargetID is correct, as same value is mentioned directly on Ledger's website.

Thanks for checking integrity of wallet. After reading your post, it looks like one of these operations that you shouldn't do at home if you don't know what you're doing. Well, this thing is definitely not for my skills. Maybe it would be possible to do it following your instructions, but I doubt that my wallet would work after that.

Glad I could help

[fillippone]

I guess you are manually doing what the ledger live app is doing behind the curtain.
Don't trust, verify.

Yes, this is exactly what I did.

Excellent.
Your guide inspired me so much I decided I am going to do that as well.
Maybe your wallet wasn’t tampered, but mine was!
Even if I vaguely remember the Ledger App certified that as genuine.

[GazetaBitcoin]

Your guide inspired me so much I decided I am going to do that as well.
Maybe your wallet wasn’t tampered, but mine was!

This is a great decision, as, in case it will turn out that it wasn't tampered, this information will reassure the others which also thought about this.
I'll be looking forward for your results. Be careful though and try to remember the place of each piece when you'll dismantle it. And be very, very gentle during the operation.

Even if I vaguely remember the Ledger App certified that as genuine.

Even if you saw this... you know very well that what a software says is not always accurate. Honestly, I trust more that fact that I see the PCBs identical than that command which confirmed the Ledger is genuine. In my opinion comparing the PCBs is more important in this check.

[dkbit98]

Maybe your wallet wasn’t tampered, but mine was!
Even if I vaguely remember the Ledger App certified that as genuine.

What do you mean? Did you received ledger wallet from betnomi in some of  their giveaway or you got it from some other source?
I saw them changing PCB's all the time, and to be honest I don't trust their integrity check process very much, as well as their closed source devices.

[GazetaBitcoin]

I think he means that, although I checked my Ledger and it showed up that it was not tampered, that does not necessarily mean that his Ledger was also not tampered, so he will perform a hardware genuine check on his own.

As far as I know, fillippone's Ledger is from winning BCA 2022 at Golden Feather category.

[Pmalek]

Maybe your wallet wasn’t tampered, but mine was!
Even if I vaguely remember the Ledger App certified that as genuine.

I would be interested in reading more about this. How, when, why do you think that?
I know that Ledger's initial onboarding setup can be buggy. They are aware of it themselves, that's why there is a link to solutions as to why your computer might not detect the device even if it's connected and unlocked. That also affects the genuine check which won't work. Running the app as administrator, restarting the PC, trying a different USB port, etc., etc., are some ways to "fix" it.
Let's get back to topic of Betnomi's most probable exit scam. @ icopress, any new contact with the reliable folks from Betnomi?

[fillippone]

What do you mean?

I would be interested in reading more about this. How, when, why do you think that?

Closing this small OT here.
I simply wanted to do the same checking process on my Ledger that comes as a prize for the BCA award.
I guess it’s a sensible idea being ultra paranoid toward a customised device that Betnomi knew was directed to a generic “well known user” of the forum.

[Pmalek]

I simply wanted to do the same checking process on my Ledger that comes as a prize for the BCA award.
I guess it’s a sensible idea being ultra paranoid toward a customised device that Betnomi knew was directed to a generic “well known user” of the forum.

I don't disagree with that, and you should check if for your own safety, especially after what is happening with Betnomi now. When you say "customized" and "tempered with", I thought you already saw or noticed something being off. But it seems to be just a hunch or a possibility, and you haven't actually found or checked for anything malicious yet.

[Mahdirakib]

Well, the unprofessional team of Betnomi is showing their moves by staying silent. If you want to be in the distrust list of Betnomi representative, then leave a negative feedback on their representative account

I agree that this topic should have been locked like... since few pages ago and not trying to beat the dead horse here, also it's not my habit to check someone else's trust list, but... recent case that I read made me curious, and one thing lead to another...

It's been made known that betnomi was online on 6th of September for no apparent reason, but I think I just found out why and that's because betnomi tried to "clean" their trust feedback. At least cosmetically, or whatever you like to call them. Their current feedback as per this post being made is:



and it seems they tried to "remove" the negative score by distrusting all who leave negative feedback on them, thus the negative won't shown on their page from their perspective.