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Author Topic: Cockfighting?  (Read 3885 times)
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October 17, 2023, 10:51:08 PM
 #521

These cockfighting superstitions are  fallacy.  There are no proven statistics that prove that these superstitions really work.  Even my relative who used to raise fighting fowl has his own superstition but in the end stopped because most of his fowl lost.
I really don’t understand how these superstitions goes,
What is it about them? Like is it what you tell yourself or some phrase you get to repeat over and over before taking a bet or engaging your animals in such activity to make money off them and eventually turn them to food?

I see a lot of animal cruelty in that and don’t or wouldn’t want to encourage any form of cockfighting. Come on?
Everything could be simulated in this day? Why do we have to put these animals through these.

I’m not a veggie or anything but, I was thought not to play with good, let alone to gamble on them. Just eat the damned thing and get your gambling on a sportbookie or casino.

Well the fact that there is already plenty of animal cruelty does not seem like a good argument to further encourage more animal cruelty in my humble view. Traditions are often cruel, but, you see, the uses of humanity change with time: witches were burnt, people crucified and newborns given to the wolves, not to mention the Aztecs killing humans for the gods. There is no need to continue things that one thinks wrong.

I agree.
Society has been advancing towards a path where we have beer trying to reduce cruelty on people and animals as much as we could, in as many levels as possible and that has brought us to where we are.
The fact dog fights and cock figths are outlawed in many of the so called first world countries is a reminder on how we cannot allow death and cruelty to evolve further and expand, for the sake of betting or gambling.

One thing is to sacrifice an animal because one needs to eat their flesh, but a completely different one is to inflict pain in them for entertainment. It is a long standing debate, if we think about it, whether culture and traditions are more important than progress and acceptation of animals as sensitive beings.

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October 18, 2023, 02:20:14 AM
 #522


Well the fact that there is already plenty of animal cruelty does not seem like a good argument to further encourage more animal cruelty in my humble view. Traditions are often cruel, but, you see, the uses of humanity change with time: witches were burnt, people crucified and newborns given to the wolves, not to mention the Aztecs killing humans for the gods. There is no need to continue things that one thinks wrong.
Animal cruelty has been the reason why many governments places a ban on some animal games mostly those games that involve animals getting into physical combat that could result in an injury or possible death to the animals.

Departing from all forms of cruelty is what has made civilization a special movement and with it, a lot has changed in the phenomenal trends that used to be before now,  I still can remember when some parts of the east in my country consumed human meats due to war deprivation and starvations,  but as time goes on things have changed and all that is becoming past incident right now.
Changes happen and it will be depends from the government to execute laws that can help to stop things like this, but the fact that we know inside that government there are many corrupt minds and it won't be hard to conclude that since we are still seeing places who continue to allow this kind of cruelty, it's either the government is not being alarm or there are part of this government who knows well if how money flows with this kind of gambling.

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October 18, 2023, 02:30:45 AM
 #523

These cockfighting superstitions are  fallacy.  There are no proven statistics that prove that these superstitions really work.  Even my relative who used to raise fighting fowl has his own superstition but in the end stopped because most of his fowl lost.
I really don’t understand how these superstitions goes,
What is it about them? Like is it what you tell yourself or some phrase you get to repeat over and over before taking a bet or engaging your animals in such activity to make money off them and eventually turn them to food?

I see a lot of animal cruelty in that and don’t or wouldn’t want to encourage any form of cockfighting. Come on?
Everything could be simulated in this day? Why do we have to put these animals through these.

I’m not a veggie or anything but, I was thought not to play with good, let alone to gamble on them. Just eat the damned thing and get your gambling on a sportbookie or casino.

Well the fact that there is already plenty of animal cruelty does not seem like a good argument to further encourage more animal cruelty in my humble view. Traditions are often cruel, but, you see, the uses of humanity change with time: witches were burnt, people crucified and newborns given to the wolves, not to mention the Aztecs killing humans for the gods. There is no need to continue things that one thinks wrong.

I agree.
Society has been advancing towards a path where we have beer trying to reduce cruelty on people and animals as much as we could, in as many levels as possible and that has brought us to where we are.
The fact dog fights and cock figths are outlawed in many of the so called first world countries is a reminder on how we cannot allow death and cruelty to evolve further and expand, for the sake of betting or gambling.

One thing is to sacrifice an animal because one needs to eat their flesh, but a completely different one is to inflict pain in them for entertainment. It is a long standing debate, if we think about it, whether culture and traditions are more important than progress and acceptation of animals as sensitive beings.
I dont believe that we are really heading towards that path on which there would really be still places and corners of the world on which these kind of gambling or betting do really happens.
They dont really care about animal cruelty or whatever things that do really connects with it as long they would really be getting entertained then it wont really be that much of a concern whether this one hits about animal cruelty or not considering that its already that part of their culture or on a certain place then this wont really be that much of an issue. No matter what we do say about animal cruelty but these people wont really be showing care at all as long it would cater out their gambling leisure and entertainment.

So for us people who do really have that kind of insight and feelings about animal cruelty then there's no way that we could really be able to stop this thing.
It might not be that heard of globally but for sure they wouldnt really be ceasing to exist but rather it would really be just that staying as long theres a demand
and as long there would be people who do keep on betting on it.Here in our place then this is something that really very popular.

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October 18, 2023, 05:26:36 AM
 #524


Well the fact that there is already plenty of animal cruelty does not seem like a good argument to further encourage more animal cruelty in my humble view. Traditions are often cruel, but, you see, the uses of humanity change with time: witches were burnt, people crucified and newborns given to the wolves, not to mention the Aztecs killing humans for the gods. There is no need to continue things that one thinks wrong.

I agree paxmao: the uses of humanity change over time. Here in Spain a new law has just been approved, called "Animal welfare law". With absurd clauses like a mandatory course for everyone who wants to have a dog, mandatory insurance, or the use of animals totally forbidden in circus, it seems that the prohibition of bets linked to animal fighting is the most reasonable novelty.

And yet bullfighting is the exception and it's still allowed Roll Eyes

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October 18, 2023, 01:39:03 PM
 #525

Although cockfighting, or bullfighting, is practiced in many countries around the world, it is not included in any gambling or casino site. There may be specific reasons for this but as far as I know they are a competition banned by the Department of Animal Resources. All of these competitions involve acts of neglect or cruelty to animals that are practiced in many countries around the world but are officially prohibited. Cockfighting and bullfights are regionally legal and banned by the government, as various animals can bleed to death during these competitions.



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October 18, 2023, 01:47:38 PM
 #526

Although cockfighting, or bullfighting, is practiced in many countries around the world, it is not included in any gambling or casino site. There may be specific reasons for this but as far as I know they are a competition banned by the Department of Animal Resources. All of these competitions involve acts of neglect or cruelty to animals that are practiced in many countries around the world but are officially prohibited. Cockfighting and bullfights are regionally legal and banned by the government, as various animals can bleed to death during these competitions.

Just like the casinos are forced to do the KYC in order to comply with the regulations, could this be the reason too as the casino does not include cock fighting as a betting option in the gambling site? If they do, they could have to face the consequences as per the law. Also, I think it is important to know that regulations about games such as cockfighting and bullfighting can vary significantly from one country to another. Some countries may take serious action against gambling sites that promote and bet on animal fighting games.

It is better to first comply with the rules and regulations and not include such sports for betting only to attract more gamblers and generate revenue that may lead to the overall gambling site ban in many regions.

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October 18, 2023, 02:44:27 PM
 #527

Although cockfighting, or bullfighting, is practiced in many countries around the world, it is not included in any gambling or casino site. There may be specific reasons for this but as far as I know they are a competition banned by the Department of Animal Resources. All of these competitions involve acts of neglect or cruelty to animals that are practiced in many countries around the world but are officially prohibited. Cockfighting and bullfights are regionally legal and banned by the government, as various animals can bleed to death during these competitions.



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Cockfighting is still popular in much of the Asia-pacific region, especially in Indonesia and parts of South Asia, the sport remains legal in Puerto Rico and in such countries as the Philippines and Dominican Republic, where cockfighting clubs operate around the country. The sport was brought to the Philippines by Spanish colonizers and quickly took root in the country’s culture. Today it is estimated that there are more than 30 millions cockfights held  every year in Philippines, with about 2 million birds being used for fighting.
  Cockfighting (sabong) as it usually called In the Philippines, the 6 thousand year old spectator sport, has been transformed by the Philippines into a billion-dollar industry. Sabong is legal in the Philippines, meaning participation and betting can take place in public. The practice has drawn fire from anti-gambling and animal welfare groups internationally, but Filipinos overwhelmingly rejects calls to outlaw Sabong. According to some, such a ban would spark a revolution. With the recent increase in technology, there are now different platforms for viewing e-sabong. People can watch live match on this sites and even place bet if they wish.
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October 18, 2023, 04:29:13 PM
 #528

online cockfighting is legal in  several countries and so you can easily find it over the net. and still raking billions of dollars. and it seems that PH is leading on this one. then india, indonesia cuba, or france.
one can check this article - Countries With Legal Cock Fight Bets in the World just don't mind the gambling site they are recommending here. do your own search of the site.
the existence of this betting type seems to be more on the tradition of the area. how they evolved thru time and sustain this traditional gambling game.
As a local resident of PH, I think the masses in our country are more familiar with cock fighting rather than poker or at least in my area. There are at least 2 physical cockfighting arena in my city and it's neighboring city and there's no legal casino around. I live on a province in the Philippines and it is easier to find cockfighting arena than casino to be honest. Even my late grandfather raise cocks to fight in those arena! This is why I didn't get shocked when an online cockfighting casino rapidly grow in our country. I think cockfighting is a norm here.
It's basically business for platforms or service providers, they are always in the lookout for what's popular in a region so that they can offer that to the residents. Now the local betting shops or platforms know that people there love cockfighting and it is a very popular game among the masses that live in there, so they understand that if they offer bets for the cockfights, they can easily earn a lot of money from that because they obviously take some commission for the bets and lost bets are also kept by them.

You can barely find any platform offering the opportunity to place bets on an international level because the game is basically banned around the globe and it's only some countries where it's still allowed and it might not even be allowed but local authorities allow it and they don't get those arenas seized.
Of course there's business included but I don't know about the expansion of cockfighting business in our country aside from the online casino that just recently stopped by our government. Our local cockfighting arena existed before I knew it, this somehow means that the cockfighting arenas are a long time business and I guess regulated by our government since cockfighting arena are pretty much old and I haven't seen a new cockfighting arena in our local area since then. Maybe they just don't want to overpopulate these arenas, so thus there's a chance that future generation can lose interest in raising cocks to fight in those arenas.

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October 18, 2023, 08:44:13 PM
 #529

I see a lot of animal cruelty in that and don’t or wouldn’t want to encourage any form of cockfighting. Come on?
Everything could be simulated in this day? Why do we have to put these animals through these.

You're right mate, honestly when we look at what this animals may be passing through while serving this purpose and when we truly have this kind of feelings on abuse on right to living, we can also consider the animals that they are living things and deserve their own right for a free living, am just happy for now that the cock fighting game is not as trending as before again, this has been an old game of an entertainment and even this same game does not appear in most gambling platforms because people don't go for them as before, i hope this alone should make the cock happier than ever  Grin

It is difficult when we can talk about some particular activities, and these can make it known that now the world sees cockfights and horse racing as a form of animal abuse, I am a person who does not like to see when they are being abused. anigmal, I don't care about that, but I feel that the bodies in the world move because of money, and some people don't pay attention to them, it's as if they don't have any compassion, but I know that worldwide there is a good campaign against animal abuse and it is something logical, it seems to me that it is not bad, because animals cannot speak, they cannot defend themselves, if we ourselves do not value them, if we do not take care of them, how could we do? If they are the ones who could primarily be making a better version of things for our lives, in fact without animals the balance of life would not be good, then we must take care of them, we must not mistreat them.

I know that many people make their means or business through this, betting, cockfighting, horse racing, and this is something that even though it can give more money, it is not what it should be, it is considered something My how to make money in a bad way, I don't compare it with drugs, because I know that drugs are much more destructive, but I know that things can go differently, animals will have so many rights that people who try to abuse them Well, they won't have compassion when it comes to implementing it, it's pretty close, and on the surface it's not bad, for me Gallso's actions were not bad, the bad thing is that one of the animals dies, I've also seen it in the thread of horse racing, where those animals have also died due to abuse, then this is not the right thing to do, the right thing is that they can do many things to avoid the abuse, but since that activity has to be included, well, it is not the right thing to do. that others accept.

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October 18, 2023, 08:55:01 PM
 #530

Although cockfighting, or bullfighting, is practiced in many countries around the world, it is not included in any gambling or casino site. There may be specific reasons for this but as far as I know they are a competition banned by the Department of Animal Resources. All of these competitions involve acts of neglect or cruelty to animals that are practiced in many countries around the world but are officially prohibited. Cockfighting and bullfights are regionally legal and banned by the government, as various animals can bleed to death during these competitions.



image Collected from Google
This is nothing different from this bulfight vs cow fights that most northern men in my country use to fight on salad day celebration in the North east of the country,  but this game is unpopular due to it unhealthy practice and risks that it pauses against the animal,  although at some point,  one must have to come into acceptance on the fact that,  this games animals games will not be accepted as a global game due to regulations restrictions and the rest of the other attacks on the law against such games practices.

But then you did well to have brought up those ggameimages because it reminds me a lot about some other games that I widely played in some places but are limited in other places such as the I'll Fight or even the cock fight we Are Discussing here in this thread.

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October 19, 2023, 05:00:43 AM
 #531

I consider cock fighting a game that is more traditional than digital. It has not yet evolved into technological space as people have not yet given their thoughts on it. Then again, I consider it worthy a game for software development but what then will be the simulation behind the cock when they fight and their tactics. Asking this from the standpoint of one who understands that developments requires logic.

Maybe this is one of the reason why it has not yet entered the digital space as a game

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October 19, 2023, 05:11:41 AM
 #532

Although cockfighting, or bullfighting, is practiced in many countries around the world, it is not included in any gambling or casino site. There may be specific reasons for this but as far as I know they are a competition banned by the Department of Animal Resources. All of these competitions involve acts of neglect or cruelty to animals that are practiced in many countries around the world but are officially prohibited. Cockfighting and bullfights are regionally legal and banned by the government, as various animals can bleed to death during these competitions.



image Collected from Google
Maybe that is correct that the casino owner are not betting to start this kind of game as they believe it will receive less participants because of government banning or may attack because of cruelty.
or also I believe that bringing this online might be a start of rigging or abuse because the animals involved can easily hurt before the game so it has a high chances of losing in short manipulation will happen.
Myself are not willing to bet as well even if there is availability .

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October 19, 2023, 07:43:15 PM
 #533


Changes happen and it will be depends from the government to execute laws that can help to stop things like this, but the fact that we know inside that government there are many corrupt minds and it won't be hard to conclude that since we are still seeing places who continue to allow this kind of cruelty, it's either the government is not being alarm or there are part of this government who knows well if how money flows with this kind of gambling.
The fact is that many of the time,  government in some countries have many things that remain unregulated and at that we have to understand that those countries which have no regulations concerning such things as gambling have open up the door for such activities that are outside some of the gambling rules in other countries that already have regulations in place, and one other thing is that,  gambling I animals have been there for a while now,  but people have only interest for those games that less risk and not too bloody for the unlookers.

But cock fight or dog fights are not popular because both animal have some element of wide behaviour that sometime could result into injuring their partners to the point of death without any regulation to prohibit that during the games.

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October 19, 2023, 09:29:49 PM
 #534


Changes happen and it will be depends from the government to execute laws that can help to stop things like this, but the fact that we know inside that government there are many corrupt minds and it won't be hard to conclude that since we are still seeing places who continue to allow this kind of cruelty, it's either the government is not being alarm or there are part of this government who knows well if how money flows with this kind of gambling.
The fact is that many of the time,  government in some countries have many things that remain unregulated and at that we have to understand that those countries which have no regulations concerning such things as gambling have open up the door for such activities that are outside some of the gambling rules in other countries that already have regulations in place, and one other thing is that,  gambling I animals have been there for a while now,  but people have only interest for those games that less risk and not too bloody for the unlookers.

But cock fight or dog fights are not popular because both animal have some element of wide behaviour that sometime could result into injuring their partners to the point of death without any regulation to prohibit that during the games.
For cockfight then i do believe that this one could really be regulated or would really be allowed, but for dog fight then this do usually happens underground yet there's no way that it could really be that allowed or would really be legalized considering on the animal that involved. This isnt something that do talks about livestocks or something that could be easily to breed with. This is why if we do tend to compare about dogs and roosters/chicken then it would really be that a different thing. Not really that totally shocking that tons of people would really be that going against with cockfighting which considering that animal cruelty is something that would really be a main issue with this type of gambling.

In cultural side of things which there are really that places on this world would really be having this kind of type of  gambling which turns out to be enjoyable on trying out to bet
in between rooster on whose gonna win on having that fight until to death. Sounds harsh but this is something that some people do really love to watch or to see.
Therefore, if you do find this betting to be that totally brutal or harsh then you could always opt not to see but doesnt mean that it would be completely
stop and this would depending on countries jurisdiction whether it would be allowed or not.

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October 20, 2023, 03:23:52 AM
 #535

I consider cock fighting a game that is more traditional than digital. It has not yet evolved into technological space as people have not yet given their thoughts on it. Then again, I consider it worthy a game for software development but what then will be the simulation behind the cock when they fight and their tactics. Asking this from the standpoint of one who understands that developments requires logic.

Maybe this is one of the reason why it has not yet entered the digital space as a game
Cockfighting is a popular regional sport found in some tribal and rural settings in some parts of Asia. This game is not included in the gambling section as it is not internationalized. Moreover, the venue of this game is not selected or there is no stadium, so this game has not received any international recognition.

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October 20, 2023, 04:03:27 AM
 #536

These cockfighting superstitions are  fallacy.  There are no proven statistics that prove that these superstitions really work.  Even my relative who used to raise fighting fowl has his own superstition but in the end stopped because most of his fowl lost.
I really don’t understand how these superstitions goes,
What is it about them? Like is it what you tell yourself or some phrase you get to repeat over and over before taking a bet or engaging your animals in such activity to make money off them and eventually turn them to food?

I see a lot of animal cruelty in that and don’t or wouldn’t want to encourage any form of cockfighting. Come on?
Everything could be simulated in this day? Why do we have to put these animals through these.

I’m not a veggie or anything but, I was thought not to play with good, let alone to gamble on them. Just eat the damned thing and get your gambling on a sportbookie or casino.

I understand that there some things that we dont really understand why it exist and why people of a certain group or region are practicing this and that when it doesn't looked normal to us.
Cockfighting is more of a culture and traditions, these people finds pleasure from raising a roster until the time they will take it to the cockpit to eventually make a profit or turn them into a food.
So, basically these roosters were raised primarily to win cock fights. That's the reason why these people doesn't consider it as part of the animal cruelty. And no, I bet they don't want to see any simulations, they always want to see a real cock fight.


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October 20, 2023, 12:29:03 PM
 #537

I consider cock fighting a game that is more traditional than digital. It has not yet evolved into technological space as people have not yet given their thoughts on it. Then again, I consider it worthy a game for software development but what then will be the simulation behind the cock when they fight and their tactics. Asking this from the standpoint of one who understands that developments requires logic.

Maybe this is one of the reason why it has not yet entered the digital space as a game
Cockfighting is a popular regional sport found in some tribal and rural settings in some parts of Asia. This game is not included in the gambling section as it is not internationalized. Moreover, the venue of this game is not selected or there is no stadium, so this game has not received any international recognition.

In the Philippines, it remained popular, especially in the rural areas where vast farms for breeding are located although many of its owners came from the cities. The sport is probably dying on the international stage since it is a form of animal abuse. Here in my country, cockfighting has its own exclusive cockpit arenas. Cockpit arenas can accommodate hundreds to thousands of audiences. The big event is called a derby where millions of dollars are in the prize pool not including the bigger money involved in betting.

So I really thought that the Spaniards brought cockfighting here. I was wrong because it was actually the first time the Spaniards watched modern cockfighting in the Philippines and they documented it. The sport is already popular even in ancient times from China to India, Persia, and Eastern Europe.

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HelliumZ
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October 20, 2023, 12:59:14 PM
 #538

I consider cock fighting a game that is more traditional than digital. It has not yet evolved into technological space as people have not yet given their thoughts on it. Then again, I consider it worthy a game for software development but what then will be the simulation behind the cock when they fight and their tactics. Asking this from the standpoint of one who understands that developments requires logic.

Maybe this is one of the reason why it has not yet entered the digital space as a game
Cockfighting is a popular regional sport found in some tribal and rural settings in some parts of Asia. This game is not included in the gambling section as it is not internationalized. Moreover, the venue of this game is not selected or there is no stadium, so this game has not received any international recognition.

In the Philippines, it remained popular, especially in the rural areas where vast farms for breeding are located although many of its owners came from the cities. The sport is probably dying on the international stage since it is a form of animal abuse. Here in my country, cockfighting has its own exclusive cockpit arenas. Cockpit arenas can accommodate hundreds to thousands of audiences. The big event is called a derby where millions of dollars are in the prize pool not including the bigger money involved in betting.

So I really thought that the Spaniards brought cockfighting here. I was wrong because it was actually the first time the Spaniards watched modern cockfighting in the Philippines and they documented it. The sport is already popular even in ancient times from China to India, Persia, and Eastern Europe.
Even in my country Bangladesh, sometime in the past, cock fighting was organized as a village competition in the rural environment in different areas during the rice harvesting season. At one time the kings of this country used to organize cockfights for their family entertainment. However, this rare popular game is played in very few areas today. I have never seen such a game in my life but we get some idea of cock fighting competition from history. However, cockfighting is still very popular in other countries of the world.

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October 20, 2023, 07:13:28 PM
 #539

Even in my country Bangladesh, sometime in the past, cock fighting was organized as a village competition in the rural environment in different areas during the rice harvesting season. At one time the kings of this country used to organize cockfights for their family entertainment. However, this rare popular game is played in very few areas today. I have never seen such a game in my life but we get some idea of cock fighting competition from history.
Actually, that's a good thing if you're not seeing it anymore done in your country and that means that there are fewer cockfights to none happening there. Maybe in some private locations, it's still happening but to most it is unknown.

However, cockfighting is still very popular in other countries of the world.
It is and that has become a tradition and while some activists do not agree on this way of gambling. The gamblers that are into this won't let someone stop them even if it's the government. Yes, you've heard that right because even if the government places a ban to this particular cockfight, you'll still see a lot of them as I've mentioned are probably doing this somewhere else in a private area where no one is allowed to enter without permission from the organizers.

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Mahanton
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October 20, 2023, 08:37:20 PM
 #540

I consider cock fighting a game that is more traditional than digital. It has not yet evolved into technological space as people have not yet given their thoughts on it. Then again, I consider it worthy a game for software development but what then will be the simulation behind the cock when they fight and their tactics. Asking this from the standpoint of one who understands that developments requires logic.

Maybe this is one of the reason why it has not yet entered the digital space as a game
Cockfighting is a popular regional sport found in some tribal and rural settings in some parts of Asia. This game is not included in the gambling section as it is not internationalized. Moreover, the venue of this game is not selected or there is no stadium, so this game has not received any international recognition.

In the Philippines, it remained popular, especially in the rural areas where vast farms for breeding are located although many of its owners came from the cities. The sport is probably dying on the international stage since it is a form of animal abuse. Here in my country, cockfighting has its own exclusive cockpit arenas. Cockpit arenas can accommodate hundreds to thousands of audiences. The big event is called a derby where millions of dollars are in the prize pool not including the bigger money involved in betting.

So I really thought that the Spaniards brought cockfighting here. I was wrong because it was actually the first time the Spaniards watched modern cockfighting in the Philippines and they documented it. The sport is already popular even in ancient times from China to India, Persia, and Eastern Europe.
Even in my country Bangladesh, sometime in the past, cock fighting was organized as a village competition in the rural environment in different areas during the rice harvesting season. At one time the kings of this country used to organize cockfights for their family entertainment. However, this rare popular game is played in very few areas today. I have never seen such a game in my life but we get some idea of cock fighting competition from history. However, cockfighting is still very popular in other countries of the world.
There are really indeed some places which does have that cockfighting history on which it is good that you have been able to make out some words about history on which only a few people would really be that minding
much about knowing about those history of their places or their country.If it turns out that there's a history of cockfighting then you are really that aware that it is been allowed. Yes, there are several countries which do really make this thing to be something in part of their culture and still that been applying or being that adapted even through the years that had passed. It do really just turns out that in todays standards and impressions towards things where animal cruelty is such a main issue then this type of thing cant really be accepted nor would be recognized on every corners of the world.

This is why we do only see that this type of gambling could really be seen on places on which they are really that widely known or does really have that kind of historical application
or something that in connects with their culture. It is really just that better that we should really just simply ignore it out and let them be on believing on things that they've been get used to.
There are really that those people who do make out those kind of reactions as if it seems that people engaging into it are totally bad. lol

R


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