Differences between Mixer and BTC->XMR-> ?

[dwarren]

Hi,

Is there a difference between using a BTC mixer vs just Swapping BTC to XMR and then to whatever currency you want.

Once it has been converted to XMR, it is private correct?

Just wanted to compare the pros and cons to both methods.

Thanks.

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[Apocollapse]

If you're in a right path e.g. use open source OS, run full node, use Tor, use DEX etc, both of them are private.

But the drawback of using DEX is low volume, having a good volume is necessary to increase privacy.

Let's say today only few trades are successfully executed in DEX, it means either of these addresses are belong to you.

While in mixer, they will combine the Bitcoin from many spenders into one pool and it break the connection from the address you spend and address you use to receive the mixed coins.

[Bitcoin_Arena]

It will mostly depend on what service or medium you are using to swap or mix your coins. If you use a centralized exchange to swap your BTC to XMR, then you have almost done no work as the exchange you have used can easily monitor and log your data and hand it over to anyone who goes to them with a court order.

A similar discussion here - Mixing through Dexes ?

[digaran]

By mixing you are adding an extra variable to the algorithm of tracking transactions by chain analysis services,  also when you are using decentralized exchanges, you can't perform some functions only available when using a mixer, e.g, you can't manipulate the fees, time delay, receiving to several different addresses with time delays between each transaction.

Mixers can give you those options easily, and you just have to copy paste a few addresses, but doing it yourself might get you in trouble, it would be wise to use a service dedicated with expertise to do this for you in a professional manner, in shortest period of time, and without any hassle.

[pawanjain]

If you are exchanging BTC to XMR then you would probably use an exchange.
If you use a centralised exchange then the exchange will have your data and so it will not be private anymore.
If you use a decentralised exchange then you will face volume issues.
Whereas when you use a bitcoin mixer then you will convert your coins to tiny transactions and then sending it back to your wallet by mixing a lot of addresses in between.

[dwarren]

Are swappers considered Centralized even though they dont ask for KYC?

I'm assuming yes, because they have the ability to hold your funds, if it is flagged as suspicious.

[hugeblack]

If you do not trust any central mixing services, it is better to use a true DEX such as Bisq with TOR and then delay the transaction. For example, after exchanging Bitcoin to XMR, wait for a random time and divide your XMR it Random number of small inputs and exchnge it back to BTC.

Managing a full node through TOR will enhance your privacy, but privacy means being careful, as one mistake may reveal your identity, especially if you want to hide from government agencies that have resources.

If you want a mixing service to enhance your privacy in general, use the mixer in my signature.

But the drawback of using DEX is low volume, having a good volume is necessary to increase privacy.

By using DEX, you have given them part of the information, and therefore you must be careful and make random delay before exchange it back to BTC.

[Woodie]

Hi,

Is there a difference between using a BTC mixer vs just Swapping BTC to XMR and then to whatever currency you want.

From a neutral point of view, this is a good question!

And as far as am concerned, what's common about these transactions is that both of these are all exchange transactions with the main difference being the coin that one is to receive. Though with mixers we put an explicit condition to the platform not to send out the same coins you gave them to avoid money being traced back to you if privacy is your concern, unlike normal exchanges might send you your own coins as they don't offer the extra privacy feature.

Once it has been converted to XMR, it is private correct?

Just wanted to compare the pros and cons to both methods.

Thanks.

When it comes to mixers vs XMR both will give you a world of privacy and these are recommended mediums to use for privacy-conscious minds.

[Antotena]

Hi,

Is there a difference between using a BTC mixer vs just Swapping BTC to XMR and then to whatever currency you want.

Once it has been converted to XMR, it is private correct?

Just wanted to compare the pros and cons to both methods.

Thanks.

Everything lies on whether you are using a centralized for swap or you are using a decentralized exchange to that. When you swap your coin on any exchange that is centralized, you must have done a KYC before they allow you to do that, no documentation no use of the exchange and when you are verified on any exchange after provision of documents, you don't have any privacy to protect any more.

But if you use a decentralized mixer to swap your btc to xmr, you have increased your privacy for using the centralized exchanges and addition swapping to xmr is highly a privacy protected coin and this is the reason why some countries hate to see their people use xmr because it is difficult to crack but doing it in a kyc centralized exchange is as if you protecting nothing.

Using a mixer is good though if you have bought a bitcoin from centralized exchanges because when you withdraw bitcoin from exchanges, the explorer usually tick it with exchange name as the source of the fund, mixing it will clean that and it will become untraceable depend on the mixing service you use.

[Silver005]

A BTC mixer is a service that helps to anonymize transactions by mixing them with other transactions and sending them through a series of addresses. On the other hand, BTCXMR is a separate cryptocurrency that uses privacy-enhancing features to protect the identities of users and their transactions. While BTC mixers can help to improve privacy for BTC transactions, they cannot offer the same level of privacy as BTCXMR. Additionally, BTCXMR uses the Zerocoin protocol, which is designed to provide stronger anonymity than Bitcoin mixers.

[CryptoHeadlineNews]

Hi,

Is there a difference between using a BTC mixer vs just Swapping BTC to XMR and then to whatever currency you want.

Yes, there is a very big difference between the two statements you just gave as above, because what a Bitcoin Mixer does is to make your Bitcoin more private, and by that I mean hide the root of your Bitcoin, hereby making it untraceable on the Bitcoin Blockchain, and it's not always free, as it comes with a fee for whatever amount of Bitcoin you intend to mixed (i.e making it more anonymous). E.g of a Bitcoin mixer is Sinbad.io

Once it has been converted to XMR, it is private correct?

No.. Using a Bitcoin makes your transactions more private than mere converting to Monero (XMR)

[BlackHatCoiner]

Is there a difference between using a BTC mixer vs just Swapping BTC to XMR and then to whatever currency you want.

Yes. When introducing XMR in the equation, you're most likely going to receive better levels of anonymity. The reasons why you might want to use a mixer over XMR swap are: comfort and pricing.

Once it has been converted to XMR, it is private correct?

Correct. If you run a Bitcoin full node, a Monero full node and make the exchange through Bisq, then you're achieving the highest levels of privacy there are.

[seoincorporation]

I would say the main difference is the traceability, while the mixer only mix the transactions there is still a trace in the blockchain, but if you swap your coins to Monero, then they will become untraceable and that's one of the main features of Monero, the blockchain hides relevant data like the real address and the transaction amounts. But in both scenarios, you become traceable again in the moment when you decide to sell your coins because for that you need an exchange.

[buwaytress]

XMR allows you to use more privacy features. Mind you, some of the built-in features can be used with Bitcoin (TOR connection for one, single address use is another). But it won't particularly help just to swap at an exchange and let it sit in your wallet. Particularly if that exchange knows who you are, won't be too hard to make the connection to your original coins.

Do as hugeblack says. Use a DEX, learn to P2P. But employ additional measures to enhance your privacy. Monero alone, even mixers alone, or any tool for that matter, and used improperly, gives you a false sense of sufficiency.

[Faisal2202]

While in mixer, they will combine the Bitcoin from many spenders into one pool and it break the connection from the address you spend and address you use to receive the mixed coins.

You have mentioned good points, but the selection of Mixer is also a difficult task because there are tens of mixers in the market right now with different fee structure's and some are centralized and some are decentralized so it is best for the Op or anyone else to chose a decentralized mixer with lesser fee or any fee that suits them best but obviously everyone wants to go for a cheap mixer.

Talking about XMR (monero) i like this idea and this is way better and easy if used on DEXs means if the swap is done on DEXs. As mixing can be done there too but in mixer's case even after choosing one mixer that suits you best, you don't know either you are getting the level of privacy that the mixer has promised. Because most of the times many are lying.

[Apocollapse]

By using DEX, you have given them part of the information, and therefore you must be careful and make random delay before exchange it back to BTC.

Yep since the @OP talk about using BTC or XMR in "private", using DEX will not have a problem. It different if he ask how to laundering through DEX which is he shouldn't use DEX as there's terms in their site.

You have mentioned good points, but the selection of Mixer is also a difficult task because there are tens of mixers in the market right now with different fee structure's and some are centralized and some are decentralized so it is best for the Op or anyone else to chose a decentralized mixer with lesser fee or any fee that suits them best but obviously everyone wants to go for a cheap mixer.

For the fee structure and minimum amount to mix, someone have created a dedicated thread 2023 List Bitcoin Mixers Bitcoin Tumblers Websites. I think any mixers that still promoted in this forum is safe enough, the user can choose which one he prefer.

I don't think there's a decentralized mixer, I guess you meant CoinJoin.

[PrivacyG]

It is a tough job to maintain Privacy with the Public Ledger Cryptocurrencies.  You will almost definitely make mistakes along the way and even forget things you have done in the past.  The more Addresses you split your Coins into.  The more Decentralized Exchanges you use.  The more Mixers you use.  You will one day have change on Decentralized Exchanges you forgot about.  Or Coins from Mixers you have not redeemed yet.  Or Addresses of yours you may not remember any more.

In theory you should be able to only turn your Bitcoin into Monero and have great Privacy.  But little mistakes will reveal many fingerprints.  So even if you Mix your coins.  Then use Join Market.  Then Bisq.  Then move to Monero and back to Bitcoin.  This is a complete waste of time and money if you make a little mistake.

Focus on how to avoid mistakes instead.

For example.  Say the Mixer you are using could be a honey pot.  Because who knows?  Maybe it is.  Use Tor and make sure your Coins do not have a history under YOUR ownership.  What I mean is do not Mix Coins coming from Bitcoin Talk signatures directly for example.  If the Mixer is a honey pot it is simply a waste of time and money to use a Mixer as a first option.

But if you had Monero and bought Bitcoin through Bisq and only THEN Mixed your Coins through Tor.  Preferably with no Java Script enabled.  That is another story.  If the Mixer is a honey pot they will not know much about you any more.  Of course the Mixing is now basically useless as you have Mixed through a pot.  But who cares.  You should have enough Privacy from Bisq now anyway.

Less mistakes and more care equals high Privacy.  Even if you use just ONE method.  All methods should be good.  But just like condoms, it matters a lot how you are using it if you want to keep that chance of the method not working low.

[Publictalk792]

When you use a Bitcoin mixer it  mixes your Bitcoin with other users coins making it difficult to trace the origin of the funds. This always help in privacy and anonymity.
Swapping BTC to XMR and then to another currency can offer a higher level of privacy but it may ask additional steps and higher fee.
Always try with a small amount and check if it is good and give an example how much it will deduct fee and you will understand the full process and will get experience. And next time you will be able to swap a big amount.

[pooya87]

Two different methods with two different sets of pros and cons.
Mixer pros:
- Easier to use
- Costs a lot less
- No need for additional setups (like running full node, installing new software, etc.)
- Fast

Mixer cons:
- Centralized so it may keep logs, have flaws, leak information, etc.
- It can be a honeypot!

Swap pros:
- Provides much better privacy and security
- Can be impossible to track

Swap cons:
- Harder to use correctly
- Can cost a lot more (higher fees, bigger spread in the market when buying and selling coins)
- Requires additional setup (like running the full node for bitcoin and monero, installing new software like Bisq, etc.)
- Slower

[NotATether]

Are swappers considered Centralized even though they dont ask for KYC?

I'm assuming yes, because they have the ability to hold your funds, if it is flagged as suspicious.

Most DEXes are technically not centralized in the way that they don't hold your funds centrally - but rather making you deal directly with the other trader - but DEXes need software to run, and most of that is hosted on someone's servers which are centralized. Although there are a small number like Bisq and Uniswap are completely decentralized and run from some blockchain.