Are Coinbase now immortal?

[zasad@]

https://fortune.com/crypto/2024/01/03/coinbase-usdc-terra-sec-gary-gensler-stablecoin-lawsuit/
"USDC is already a unique situation. Nominally, its issuer until recently was the Centre Consortium, which was really just a partnership between Circle and Coinbase. In August, the two firms finally sunsetted Centre, formalizing the stablecoin’s 50/50 split, though Circle would continue to handle matters of governance. Coinbase, however, is the main purveyor of USDC. If you go on its dedicated page now, you’ll be met with an offer: Buy USDC and earn a 5.1% reward by “simply holding USDC on Coinbase.”

At this point, you may ask yourself why the USDC rewards program is so different from UST and Anchor Protocol. I did, so I asked Todd Phillips, a financial regulation expert and assistant professor at Georgia State University. “Coinbase is playing a dangerous game,” he told me. “I do not know how they can justify that as not being an investment contract.”

There are several complicating factors. For one, Coinbase says that the rewards come from its own funds, which it writes off as marketing expenses, as opposed to doling out yields based on its own investments. At worst, one could describe this as a subterfuge to hide that the yield is still just a promise of Coinbase’s future success. According to Phillips, any “rational court” would see through the tactic."

__
Istria with Terra may repeat itself. 5.1% is not 20% per annum, but it is a very large profit that no bank in the US gives on deposits.

[Poker Player]

Istria with Terra may repeat itself. 5.1% is not 20% per annum, but it is a very large profit that no bank in the US gives on deposits.

This is not true. I just searched for "interest for deposits in US banks" and in less than a minute I found this:

https://www.depositaccounts.com/savings/

where you find a lot of options between 4.35% and 5.50% APY.

Considering that the FED gives 5.5% is not so far-fetched either, simply by doing arbitrage Coinbase would earn 0.4%.

[Husires]

stablecoins, including USDC, are based on trust in the one who issues them and that source has sufficient assets to cover the printing of these currencies. It may seem that the financial position of Coinbase makes it give guarantees for a stablecoin that is more reliable than other stablecoins, but it still requires trust, especially since US can force them at any time to stop issuing them.
So Coinbase is playing with fire with the regulators, especially if they give high profit margins.

[HeRetiK]

Istria with Terra may repeat itself. 5.1% is not 20% per annum, but it is a very large profit that no bank in the US gives on deposits.

This is not true. I just searched for "interest for deposits in US banks" and in less than a minute I found this:

https://www.depositaccounts.com/savings/

where you find a lot of options between 4.35% and 5.50% APY.

Considering that the FED gives 5.5% is not so far-fetched either, simply by doing arbitrage Coinbase would earn 0.4%.

This, exactly. I'm not sure whether Coinbase is able to get the full 5.5%, but even so they can get more than 5.2% by simply holding 6 month treasury bills; more if they go for shorter terms: https://www.marketwatch.com/investing/bond/tmubmusd06m

Regardless of whether the rewards come from their funds rather than investments, as they claim, it goes to show that 5.1% are not that big of a deal in the current market environment.

Additionally it's not like Coinbase is locking themselves in at the rate they are currently promising. While I haven't read the fineprint these rates will surely drop once the FED starts cutting interest rates again, if not sooner.

[zasad@]

Istria with Terra may repeat itself. 5.1% is not 20% per annum, but it is a very large profit that no bank in the US gives on deposits.

This is not true. I just searched for "interest for deposits in US banks" and in less than a minute I found this:

https://www.depositaccounts.com/savings/

where you find a lot of options between 4.35% and 5.50% APY.

Considering that the FED gives 5.5% is not so far-fetched either, simply by doing arbitrage Coinbase would earn 0.4%.

I admit that I haven't looked at these statistics.
But think for yourself that the exchange needs liquidity and they can raise interest rates to 10 per annum or at least offer 6-7%.
CZ pays billions in fines, and this is the money of the hamsters who lost it on Binance. Coinbase can do the same and make billions or more

[hugeblack]

Regardless of whether the rewards come from their funds rather than investments, as they claim, it goes to show that 5.1% are not that big of a deal in the current market environment.

I am not a fan of buying a stablecoin to make a guaranteed profit from it, but during the bull market, all companies are able to fulfill their obligations, which they sometimes withdraw from, as I am certain that the interest will be much lower once the time for payment comes or the Fed decides to raise interest.
It's too much risk for just a 5% profit.
I'm still surprised how USDC is still working while BUSD has stopped

[dansus021]

I don't know 5.5% seems high enough for a nonbank company like Coinbase even tho they said that 5.5% comes from marketing funds that is still crazy enough to pay each user that amount of money what if 25% of usdc user put their money on coinbase those marketing will bleeding cash.

and this may spark a fire in to regulator but who knows right since Coinbase are a legal company that handles crypto and BlackRock also has trust to Coinbase

I'm still surprised how USDC is still working while BUSD has stopped

I also wonder about this part. Like what the heck happen BUSD fail but paxos still alive and currently they creating PYUSD with Paypal all this don't make sense to me but binance seems make a new proxy company and make FDUSD

[hugeblack]

I also wonder about this part. Like what the heck happen BUSD fail but paxos still alive and currently they creating PYUSD with Paypal all this don't make sense to me but binance seems make a new proxy company and make FDUSD

This shows that the problem with Binance, the last thing regulators want to see is more FTX-like bankruptcies, so they are trying to limit the role of any platform that is not based in the United States and is not subject to US regulatory.
I wonder how many stablecoins there are, it's getting crazy that there are dozens of them and this is the first time I've heard about FDUSD.

[zasad@]

I'm still surprised how USDC is still working while BUSD has stopped

I also wonder about this part. Like what the heck happen BUSD fail but paxos still alive and currently they creating PYUSD with Paypal all this don't make sense to me but binance seems make a new proxy company and make FDUSD

In this business, you need to have the right support and allies with great capabilities. Blackrock has a lot of interest in Coinbase, so they are investing in this project and will support it. Binance in the USA is not needed by their major players. But everything in business has a limit of arrogance.

[BenCodie]

Unlike Terra/Anchor/Luna, Coinbase's sole purpose is not to fulfill the 5.1% yield that they offer. Coinbase's main business practice is the exchange. This 5.1% might be paid from the profit that the exchange itself is making from fees. Are we forgetting their main business model here?

In addition to that, if it is considered a "marketing campaign" then this marketing campaign can simply be ended at any time.

I wouldn't compare it to Anchor. Anchor was proposing something that was infeasible and ultimately, was made on top of other risky investment products. There was not much other than new inflows that was keeping that project alive. I don't think we can currently say the same thing about Coinbase.

[zasad@]

Unlike Terra/Anchor/Luna, Coinbase's sole purpose is not to fulfill the 5.1% yield that they offer. Coinbase's main business practice is the exchange. This 5.1% might be paid from the profit that the exchange itself is making from fees. Are we forgetting their main business model here?

In addition to that, if it is considered a "marketing campaign" then this marketing campaign can simply be ended at any time.

I wouldn't compare it to Anchor. Anchor was proposing something that was infeasible and ultimately, was made on top of other risky investment products. There was not much other than new inflows that was keeping that project alive. I don't think we can currently say the same thing about Coinbase.

A Russian would tell you that "these are the same eggs, only from the side"(C).
Terra and Coinbase are not producing anything. Their profit is hamsters' money. And the hamsters are also glad that they were given the opportunity to lose their money.
Look at the fines the Binance case ended with. This is hamsters' money.
Coinbase is profitable at any interest rate, but for now they are afraid to attract capital at a higher interest rate than in banks.

[stompix]

I admit that I haven't looked at these statistics.

You should have!

But think for yourself that the exchange needs liquidity and they can raise interest rates to 10 per annum or at least offer 6-7%.
CZ pays billions in fines, and this is the money of the hamsters who lost it on Binance. Coinbase can do the same and make billions or more

First you have CZ - a foreign citizen running an unregistered and unlicensed exchange with a fake virtual office , not willing to disclose where it is headquartered, what laws it follows, banned and chased out of multiple counties, compulsory liar on top of that
Then you have Coinbase - company based in the US, operating there by the law, listed on the stock exchange, which is forced by the law and presents statements every quarter about their assets and profitability, that can have its books checked every day and the IRS or FTC can have them in minutes

So, which one would you allow to do run a business with your country money and which no?

A Russian would tell you that "these are the same eggs, only from the side"(C).

Looking at that country financial history, probably the last persons on earth to ask for advice!

[zasad@]

I admit that I haven't looked at these statistics.

You should have!

But think for yourself that the exchange needs liquidity and they can raise interest rates to 10 per annum or at least offer 6-7%.
CZ pays billions in fines, and this is the money of the hamsters who lost it on Binance. Coinbase can do the same and make billions or more

First you have CZ - a foreign citizen running an unregistered and unlicensed exchange with a fake virtual office , not willing to disclose where it is headquartered, what laws it follows, banned and chased out of multiple counties, compulsory liar on top of that
Then you have Coinbase - company based in the US, operating there by the law, listed on the stock exchange, which is forced by the law and presents statements every quarter about their assets and profitability, that can have its books checked every day and the IRS or FTC can have them in minutes

So, which one would you allow to do run a business with your country money and which no?

A Russian would tell you that "these are the same eggs, only from the side"(C).

Looking at that country financial history, probably the last persons on earth to ask for advice!

Binance operated in the USA through the company Binance USA and they complied with all laws on the one hand, but on the other hand Binance USA did not have so much control over their counterparties.

Next is the conspiracy theory. Binance had problems with SEC and they solved them. And after that, Binance specialists actively helped FTX develop in the USA. And there were a lot of scandals with the FTX exchange.
I agree with you, but the situation is always more complicated and we don’t know a lot of information.
Blackrock invests in Coinbase and this is a matter of influence and interests, but in general it doesn’t matter who will cut the hamsters.


____

A Russian would tell you that "these are the same eggs, only from the side"(C).

Looking at that country financial history, probably the last persons on earth to ask for advice!

This is not advice, but folk wisdom.
Show me your financial history.

[suzanne5223]

A lot of shady things happened with the mode of operation of all stablecoin in the platform's early days of operation, or the first 1-5 years.
USDT does its shady operation with the provision of users funds to support a crypto exchange which i don't remember the name of the exchange now.
TUSD also provides an interest to people like buy 1000 TUSD and get 1200 TUSD which later affect the stablecoin.
Therefore, I am not surprised by what you said about USDC because 98% of all stablecoins have a shady means of operation.

[stompix]

Binance operated in the USA through the company Binance USA and they complied with all laws on the one hand, but on the other hand Binance USA did not have so much control over their counterparties.

Which had its headquarters in a virtual office in Delaware and was incorporated with $100 in assets!
Yeah lol!

Next is the conspiracy theory.

Which only people who like to be brainwashed by something since they can't think on their own or don't like reality are interested in!

It doesn't change the fact that CZ lied about its licenses in Singapore then Japan then Malta!
It doesn't change the fact that Binance has no legal recognized headquarter anywhere in this world!
It doesn't change the facts that there is no real audit on this company, other than a firm which cut ties with Binance after doing one!

Show me your financial history.

Here it is!

[zasad@]

Binance operated in the USA through the company Binance USA and they complied with all laws on the one hand, but on the other hand Binance USA did not have so much control over their counterparties.

Which had its headquarters in a virtual office in Delaware and was incorporated with $100 in assets!
Yeah lol!

Next is the conspiracy theory.

Which only people who like to be brainwashed by something since they can't think on their own or don't like reality are interested in!

It doesn't change the fact that CZ lied about its licenses in Singapore then Japan then Malta!
It doesn't change the fact that Binance has no legal recognized headquarter anywhere in this world!
It doesn't change the facts that there is no real audit on this company, other than a firm which cut ties with Binance after doing one!

Show me your financial history.

Here it is!

I agree with you that CZ and its crypto exchange have violated a lot of laws. But why is everyone silent about why regulators in the US allowed such a disgrace?

And even now the Binance crypto exchange is the top in terms of trading volumes in the world and the Binance trading volume is 3 times higher than Coinbase Exchange.

Merit for the music of the 80s.

[stompix]

I agree with you that CZ and its crypto exchange have violated a lot of laws. But why is everyone silent about why regulators in the US allowed such a disgrace?

The moment US went after CZ everyone went assliking mode and said it's an attack on Bitcoin, remember?
What should the US agencies, police the entire world? LOL, you're demanding that?  

It's pretty simple, the US does what it wants and authorizes who it wants to do business inside their borders, you cross that line you either follow the rules or you cross it back, you can't sneak your way in lured by the trillions of us money, try to use it and at the same time respect nothing, do you think there is any country on this planet insane enough to allow such a thing?
Before you care what the US does, how about you look in your own garden first? How is Binance doing in Russia?
Oh wait, forget Binance, how is Bitcointalk doing in Russia?

See, it's a thing of cleaning your own mess before looking at what others do!

And even now the Binance crypto exchange is the top in terms of trading volumes in the world and the Binance trading volume is 3 times higher than Coinbase Exchange.

Trusting a volume reported by a company who doesn't report it's own location it's believing in Santa Claus!

[zasad@]

I agree with you that CZ and its crypto exchange have violated a lot of laws. But why is everyone silent about why regulators in the US allowed such a disgrace?

The moment US went after CZ everyone went assliking mode and said it's an attack on Bitcoin, remember?
What should the US agencies, police the entire world? LOL, you're demanding that?  

It's pretty simple, the US does what it wants and authorizes who it wants to do business inside their borders, you cross that line you either follow the rules or you cross it back, you can't sneak your way in lured by the trillions of us money, try to use it and at the same time respect nothing, do you think there is any country on this planet insane enough to allow such a thing?
Before you care what the US does, how about you look in your own garden first? How is Binance doing in Russia?
Oh wait, forget Binance, how is Bitcointalk doing in Russia?

See, it's a thing of cleaning your own mess before looking at what others do!

And even now the Binance crypto exchange is the top in terms of trading volumes in the world and the Binance trading volume is 3 times higher than Coinbase Exchange.

Trusting a volume reported by a company who doesn't report it's own location it's believing in Santa Claus!

It’s very strange for me to hear your negativity. I have a very adequate attitude towards the United States, and while this country is the first in terms of economy, I am interested in their practice with cryptocurrencies.
Binance didn’t just come to the US out of nowhere. They took advantage of loopholes in the legislation, paid a lot of money to lobbyists, and even after more than 3 years, Binance got away with only fines. In Russian this is called "demonstrative flogging", but other crypto exchanges in the United States also committed the same violations. Binance received the most punishment, and other major exchanges also left the United States.

Bitcointalk is blocked in Russia, but who cares? The Russian community is very large and there is no law in Russia that would punish me for communicating on the Bitcointalk forum.

If I dreamed that I and my family would be offered US citizenship, I would refuse. There are more freedoms in Russia.

I don't believe these statistics because with the help of trading bots with 0 commission you can draw any numbers.
https://coinmarketcap.com/rankings/exchanges/
https://www.coingecko.com/en/exchanges
I only trust statistics from decentralized exchanges because these data can be verified.

[stompix]

It’s very strange for me to hear your negativity. I have a very adequate attitude towards the United States, and while this country is the first in terms of economy, I am interested in their practice with cryptocurrencies.

No, you changed your attitude when you realized how wrong you were, first you accused them of extraordinary interest rates, then that they don't put the equal sign between a rogue exchange that follows no rule and an exchange that reports everything every 3 months and stopped when realized that you're asking exactly for what you don't actually want, the US to make all the rules all over the world!

Binance didn’t just come to the US out of nowhere.

That's exactly where they came from since they actually have no headquarters.
A company with a 100$ in assets, incorporated in Delaware and having some virtual offices in California, with no actual presence not even customer support in the US demands to be allowed to create a coin pegged to the dollar with no way of verfifg the assets behind it and do business in the US as every other company!

The Russian community is very large and there is no law in Russia that would punish me for communicating on the Bitcointalk forum.
~
 There are more freedoms in Russia.

I dare you to say something negative about the invasion of Ukraine or the deaths of thousands of russian soldieries for Putin's ego!
But be careful, before you're going to jump from the 10th floor of a two floor building you might get kicked out of your signature campaign, where the rules are not allowing you to talk on the subject! 
MUCH freedom! SUCH liberty! Wow nonsense!

I only trust statistics from decentralized exchanges because these data can be verified.

Biggest mistake as that can be faked into trillions by just a single guy with pockets 1/millionth of the volume.

[zasad@]

It’s very strange for me to hear your negativity. I have a very adequate attitude towards the United States, and while this country is the first in terms of economy, I am interested in their practice with cryptocurrencies.

No, you changed your attitude when you realized how wrong you were, first you accused them of extraordinary interest rates, then that they don't put the equal sign between a rogue exchange that follows no rule and an exchange that reports everything every 3 months and stopped when realized that you're asking exactly for what you don't actually want, the US to make all the rules all over the world!

Binance didn’t just come to the US out of nowhere.

That's exactly where they came from since they actually have no headquarters.
A company with a 100$ in assets, incorporated in Delaware and having some virtual offices in California, with no actual presence not even customer support in the US demands to be allowed to create a coin pegged to the dollar with no way of verfifg the assets behind it and do business in the US as every other company!

The Russian community is very large and there is no law in Russia that would punish me for communicating on the Bitcointalk forum.
~
 There are more freedoms in Russia.

I dare you to say something negative about the invasion of Ukraine or the deaths of thousands of russian soldieries for Putin's ego!
But be careful, before you're going to jump from the 10th floor of a two floor building you might get kicked out of your signature campaign, where the rules are not allowing you to talk on the subject!  
MUCH freedom! SUCH liberty! Wow nonsense!

I only trust statistics from decentralized exchanges because these data can be verified.

Biggest mistake as that can be faked into trillions by just a single guy with pockets 1/millionth of the volume.

Ok, Binance are scammers, but nevertheless they were able to take a lot of money from hamsters in the USA and according to statistics (which may be fake) they are leaders in the cryptocurrency trading market. Winans stole 5 billion and paid a fine of 4 billion, so they made money. Or do you think that CZ took out a loan?

Look at the swap cost on the decentralized exchange in Ethereum. You can trade millions, but you will have a lot of slippage.
https://etherscan.io/gastracker

The US is bombing Yemen, Israel is killing thousands of Palestinian children, but
Rhetorical question: "Why is Russia a main terrorist country?"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5441385

____
Latest data for 2023
"Binance’s market share decreased from 54.2% to 48.7%, marking a 5% decline, yet it still maintains a dominant position"
https://tokeninsight.com/en/research/reports/crypto-exchanges-2023-annual-report