The effect the mixer ban has had on the forum.

[Poker Player]

As I just said in another thread, I think this topic deserved its own thread.

The main effect that the ban has had is that the mixers have gone to advertise in another forum (shitcoinstalks.com), and with it the campaign managers here as well as a lot of forumers that have been "teleported", being currently active in both forums. I put here the quote of mine from the other thread that I think sums it up well:

I wonder if advertising there has any result. If it has, any forum could do the same, and I really doubt it works that way.

Of course it works that way. If you create a forum today and get the traffic and advertisers there, the advertising will have the same effect as here, but it will be a slow process of change, it will not happen overnight.

I don't have data to know the effect that advertising is having there but if the campaigns are paying about 1/3 of what they were paying here it is because they have made a calculation based on the traffic there and other factors.

Now, once you open the pandora's box you don't know how this can end. If as a result of the increase in traffic and there start to advertise more campaigns and increase rates, then we will see a transfer of traffic from this forum to that, which so far has not happened because most of those who have been teleported are writing campaigns in the two forums and giving priority to this forum because in these campaigns they get paid more.

If in the end the campaigns there, mixers or whatever, in a hypothetical future, will pay as the mixers paid here before, with up to $250 per week and here the ones that are left pay no more than $100 then we will see a real migration of traffic.

This is something theymos should take into account for future restrictions on campaigns, and I think it deserves its own thread. He said he did not expect more restrictions in the near future, as it could be on casino campaigns for example, but he has to be aware that more restrictions in this sense would simply mean that traffic would migrate elsewhere, surely the shitcoinstalk forum, which has seen a business opportunity in this and makes it easier for people to go there "teleporting" which is to keep the rank they have here by simply creating an account with the same name.

If you go to that forum the first thing you see is a link at the top saying:

To teleport your account from Bitcointalk, click here

This is not to criticize theymos' decision to ban mixers, which I understand in order to prevent greater evils in the future, but it is important to be aware of the danger of traffic transfer if further restrictions are introduced in the future.

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[nutildah]

I wouldn't worry about it too much. Does any organic traffic actually land at that site? Not really. Does it have posts by Satoshi, Hal, Vitalik & other crypto-luminaries of our time? No. Does it have 12 years worth of content & backlinks? No.

Here's a quick comparison of the site's traffic metrics according to Similarweb:

Bitcointalk Global Rank: #39,778 Worldwide
Altcoinstalks Global Rank: #540,599 Worldwide

Bitcointalk Monthly Visits: 1.5 million
Altcoinstalks Monthly Visits: 45.4 thousand

Bitcointalk Traffic Sources: 42.54% Search
Altcoinstalks Traffic Sources: 10.45% Search


I assume the campaigns there are paying peanuts compared to here. Also, its got to be a complete spamfest, which is why its not attracting organic traffic. If people want to make a few extra bucks by posting there, good for them. I don't think it will detract from Bitcointalk's status.

[BitMaxz]

We shouldn't blame the admin for removing Mixers he just wants to make the forum clean and safe.

Why worry about them their forum is not yet the same as Bitcointalk which has more impressions than this forum.
There's no problem for any forum users to teleport there since we can be active here and there(I myself am actually more active here than there).
And I agree the campaign rates there are pretty low and not so active unlike here on the forum.

[Poker Player]

Does it have posts by Satoshi, Hal, Vitalik & other crypto-luminaries of our time?

No, but it has posts by examplens, tranthidung, dkbit98, hugeblack, bitmover, Stompix, Rikafip, Igebotz and BlackHatCoiner among others. And so far I have counted 4 managers of signatures campaigns of this forum also there.

Does it have 12 years worth of content & backlinks? No.

Here's a quick comparison of the site's traffic metrics according to Similarweb:

Bitcointalk Global Rank: #39,778 Worldwide
Altcoinstalks Global Rank: #540,599 Worldwide

Bitcointalk Monthly Visits: 1.5 million
Altcoinstalks Monthly Visits: 45.4 thousand

Bitcointalk Traffic Sources: 42.54% Search
Altcoinstalks Traffic Sources: 10.45% Search

You look at the still photo, and I'm talking about the possible evolution.

I assume the campaigns there are paying peanuts compared to here.

At $40 to $45 a week when campaigns here pay between $70 and $120 for Legendary doesn't sound like peanuts to me.

Also, its got to be a complete spamfest,

A complete spamfest by examplens, tranthidung, dkbit98, hugeblack, bitmover, Stompix, Rikafip, Igebotz and BlackHatCoiner? Yeah sure. And every day new users are teleported.

We shouldn't blame the admin for removing Mixers he just wants to make the forum clean and safe.

I don't know why you're responding if you don't even read what I'm saying, and the other one talking about spamfest. I quote it to you to see if it is clear to you:

This is not to criticize theymos' decision to ban mixers,

[nutildah]

You look at the still photo, and I'm talking about the possible evolution.

Altcoinstalks is at a severe disadvantage in every relevant metric. No way its going to take a measurable traffic share from Bitcointalk. Did all the posters you mention "defect" from here to there? If they want to post over there as well, good for them, but I'd be very surprised if they stopped posting here.

Sig campaigns are the result of Bitcointalk's traffic, prestige & reputation; not the other way around.

Guess I just fail to understand what the problem here is.

[Solosanz]

The point is, you're trying to protect the current Bitcointalk's traffic right?

In capitalism, competition is inevitable, if sooner or later altcoinstalks can gain a good traffic, the campaign in this forum should increase their payrate to make it better. Isn't this is good? the new campaign is only compete against the other campaigns, but they will need to compete against other campaigns and altcoinstalks in order to get a good poster.

[SamReomo]

Did all the posters you mention "defect" from here to there? If they want to post over there as well, good for them, but I'd be very surprised if they stopped posting here.

Most of the members who have moved to that forum are still active on this forum in fact their activity on this forum is way more on this forum than on that forum.

All of the members have to allocate time on daily basis to post on both forums. A good number of users have moved to that forum, however nothing is wrong if the members can allocate more out of their daily time on another forum.

If someone is ready to put more effort on another forum and also has an account on this forum then that should not be a general issue I guess. The managers also shifted to that forum but they're still more active on this forum.

[lovesmayfamilis]

Why will users switch to another forum? There is still a company signature for mixers, but they pay much cheaper than here. This only means that both forums are used to make money. Remove all company signatures from both forums today; you will see those who are interested in Bitcoin or other crypto. And also, who will have more traffic.
But another interesting fact is how easily people are willing to exchange for small things, agreeing to do the same thing only for a much lower price. Can we blame them? This only indicates their financial need.
But there is also the factor of convenience and habit. Today I visited that forum for the second time since 2018, and I feel uncomfortable there.

[KingsDen]

OP isn't criticizing theymos decision to ban mixers. He only pointed out the effect of mixer ban in Bitcointalk. But I think that there is no problem anywhere. Theymos decision simply favoured Altcoinstalks forum, and did not take any traffic off from bitcointalk.
BTT just gave Altt some number of participants and did not lose any. It is just about those that has the ability to dualize.
If today theymos makes a rule that it is either you are here or there, but not both, everyone will immediately desert there. But that is not a rule that theymos will make.
Maybe theymos is somewhat happy that another forum got lucky by his decision. Having an alternative forum is fine, incase theymos falls out of love with the US government. So, there's nothing to bother. Where I think will be an issue is in the case of newbies. If the DT bullies here are not lenient on newbies, they might likely run to the other forum where growth is faster and without merits

[examplens]

Altcoinstalks Global Rank: #540,599 Worldwide

This is the stats for December.
In October before Mixer Drama's global rank for Altcoinstalks was #1,546,457. I would say there is significant growth. However, it is still early for any analyses and conclusions.

Altcoinstalks is at a severe disadvantage in every relevant metric. No way its going to take a measurable traffic share from Bitcointalk. Did all the posters you mention "defect" from here to there? If they want to post over there as well, good for them, but I'd be very surprised if they stopped posting here.

Sig campaigns are the result of Bitcointalk's traffic, prestige & reputation; not the other way around.

Guess I just fail to understand what the problem here is.

At some point Altt admin himself confirmed that these two forums cannot be compared. Simply, BTT is No. 1 not only as a forum but for the Bitcoin ecosystem itself. Altt is there as a supplement and is more dedicated to other cryptocurrencies. About Bitcoin itself and the services related to it, there is certainly a much better discussion here with many more relevant participants and information.

Certainly, this whole mixer ban will change some things.

OP isn't criticizing theymos decision to ban mixers.

Even if he criticizes, it is not forbidden.
As far as I know, this forum is still open for everyone to express their opinion. I criticized that decision and I still have the same opinion, but if it is the admin's decision for the long-term protection of the forum, I understand it. In the end, the only choice I have is to accept such a decision.

[Sandra_hakeem]

Why will users switch to another forum?

lol...interesting!! why do you think they won't? Lovesmay - everything might seem okay but, there isn't an oath of commitment or whatsoever, that bonds anyone in here ... It's solely about everyone's personal interest, which might be different from the purpose of which the forum was created... The fact that you never knew about signatures before getting registered might be true, but for some, signatures acted like the "catalyst"..

But another interesting fact is how easily people are willing to exchange for small things, agreeing to do the same thing only for a much lower price.

lovesmay, how much worth of trash coins do you think would equate exactly what you're being paid in your current campaign??!.. how much of those trash coins were being paid to anyone on bounty projects?.. how many shittyheads did you see, trailing along the bounty threads and begging to join?.... Seems you don't even know how desperate these degenerates are.
Personally, I've never thought of an alternative that mixers would have, talkmore of getting registered on a site,. whatsoever.
Edit:

The point is, you're trying to protect the current Bitcointalk's traffic right?

if that should matter to anyone, it should be THEYMOS himself...
..and what's this capitalism/breaking of monopoly stuff that you speak of? Are you aware that this site was created by the FOUNDER(Satoshi) himself?

Sandra 🧑‍🦰

[lovesmayfamilis]

Why will users switch to another forum?

lol...interesting!! why do you think they won't? Lovesmay - everything might seem okay but, there isn't an oath of commitment or whatsoever, that bonds anyone in here ... It's solely about everyone's personal interest, which might be different from the purpose of which the forum was created... The fact that you never knew about signatures before getting registered might be true, but for some, signatures acted like the "catalyst"..

But another interesting fact is how easily people are willing to exchange for small things, agreeing to do the same thing only for a much lower price.

lovesmay, how much worth of trash coins do you think would equate exactly what you're being paid in your current campaign??!.. how much of those trash coins were being paid to anyone on bounty projects?.. how many shittyheads did you see, trailing along the bounty threads and begging to join?.... Seems you don't even know how desperate these degenerates are.
Personally, I've never thought of an alternative that mixers would have, talkmore of getting registered on a site,. whatsoever.

Sandra 🧑‍🦰

I made a note that I do not condemn such people. They have a reason: the need for finance. But I'm also talking about those other people who will exchange the convenience of a good car for any jalopy that somehow moves.

[borovichok]

I made a note that I do not condemn such people. They have a reason: the need for finance. But I'm also talking about those other people who will exchange the convenience of a good car for any jalopy that somehow moves.

Nobody ever abandoned their good car; they still have it, but the ban on mixers only presented them with an alternative (jalopy) that also drives, so it's acceptable to say they now have two cars instead of one. And if good car is ever stolen, they will have something to fall back on at home.

The ban on mixers on BTT opened up opportunities for everyone to earn money elsewhere while still having a presence here. ATL forum is the new found gold.

[Ambatman]

There's no decision that wouldn't come with a side effect. The ban might look harsh now but Theymos been cautious had to protect the forum future the best way he can.

About the Altcointalk, The forum despite its efforts feels too young and lacks substantial information regarding various topics.
If i want to gain something i come to Bitcointalk and it has this comfortable feeling here unlike Altcointalk.
Everybody there are still active here. There's no way they would forfeit BTT for ATT.
Personally took it as an opportunity since its relatively new and would be easier to build a presence there not to mention no extra bucks for Minimal effort would be turned down.

$40 a peanut? Yes but accumulated in BTC continuously? Now that's a DCA.

If OP really tries the forum, you would understand the difference between it and Btt.
With time maybe people would start having a homely feeling with it but currently its a place to gain extra bucks.


One can get scared on the traffic if(not when) all signatures gets banned in Bitcointalk
That i believe would have a blow in our traffic.
Despite all this people would still be around
People came when Bitcoin was barely a dollar
Not to mention when its in 6-7 figures.
As long as Bitcoin exist. Bitcointalk would always be Dominant. Always.

[JollyGood]

I am not too familiar with that forum but I think it makes sense over time some members will go there and use both forums. In the end, virtually every person associated with the forum has that link because of financial incentives.

If members here could make money at a different forum at $30-$40 per week while still making $70-$80 here, they will do it because they will receive an extra income. Now that there is a mixers ban here, it will probably expedite the sign-up elsewhere and if does not impact immediately it will definitely do so over time.

With alternatives out there, members will use other forums and with that increase in traffic and popularity will increase even if takes time.

[PytagoraZ]

~cut~

I think bitcointalk will not die even if there are no more campaigns here. Bitcoin users are already ideological and this is where Bitcoin was born. Even though I haven't followed the campaign for a long time, the discussions on this forum are quite interesting, I'm still here and not yet interested in altcointalk. I don't know the future...

Apart from that, this forum is also not intended to make a profit from advertising so it doesn't matter if there is a slight decrease in traffic because maybe this forum is dedicated only to supporting bitcoin, not for profit like altcointalk

[SmartGold01]

Can we blame them? This only indicates their financial need.
But there is also the factor of convenience and habit. Today I visited that forum for the second time since 2018, and I feel uncomfortable there.

What i mostly noticed is that there are people who so much care about their privacy, I am also a member over there but then it was so dull on my eyes to comprehend and even to move around because it's not as same as this place and I find it very hard to post over because of its poorly design nature.

Then talks about how mixers have moved down over there, well there are some mixer that has invested hugely by holding contest after few months to start establishing themselves it was then the announcement of limiting mixers they had no option than to move down there since that place lack reputable posters and users, there is no day they would start paying huge amount as same as here but I think with gradually process they would increase their offer but, that doesn't mean that people won't still stick around here to gain information and gets themselves updated on a regular basis.

I also see no sense to limit people from here over there because there are people who solely believe on privacy so even though they are getting paid for be around there it's good to make themselves familiarize over the forum I also believe that with the look out of things certainly payment are going to increase after they noticed they've gain enough traffic or even succeeded gaining the attention of most of the reputable users from here.

I am also in support to Theymos decision to ban mixers over here, all this was for a reason of safety of this site instead of here will be ceased by any government agencies it's better to limit mixers and I believe there will be no further limitation of project but if there's any theymos will surely make an announcement towards that so there is no need to crucify those who teleported their account over there the main thing is about choice and nothing much again nothing changes.

[Adbitco]

If the DT bullies here are not lenient on newbies, they might likely run to the other forum where growth is faster and without merits

Do you think growing over is that cheaper as you may think?
From my little stay over there i don't think is that easy to easily rank up over there and still op is correct on what he is saying just as you said. The restriction of mixers here has given that forum exponential growth from how it was knowing that some of the people here are teleporting their account over there, but still there is nothing wrong with that but they should be careful in terms of teleporting accounts to avoid account compromised even entirely losing their account due to high rate of teleportation, they could easily use their login details over here to make account there by so doing they have revealed their main account password to other site which easily to be hacked and that could be done by admin.

[SquirrelJulietGarden]

some of the people here are teleporting their account over there, but still there is nothing wrong with that but they should be careful in terms of teleporting accounts to avoid account compromised even entirely losing their account due to high rate of teleportation, they could easily use their login details over here to make account there by so doing they have revealed their main account password to other site which easily to be hacked and that could be done by admin.

Passwords must not be reused.

Teleport account or create a new account on different websites, passwords must be different.

If you reuse your password, you are responsible for your weak security.
[GUIDE] How to Create a Strong/Secure Password

Your account, email can be in data breaches too.
https://haveibeenpwned.com/

[EarnOnVictor]

As I just said in another thread, I think this topic deserved its own thread.

The main effect that the ban has had is that the mixers have gone to advertise in another forum (shitcoinstalks.com), and with it the campaign managers here as well as a lot of forumers that have been "teleported", being currently active in both forums.

This is not to criticize theymos' decision to ban mixers, which I understand in order to prevent greater evils in the future, but it is important to be aware of the danger of traffic transfer if further restrictions are introduced in the future.

Do not let this bother you so much, anyone can go anywhere they want to, that is human beings for you, and we are also in a free world. If you hear them, you will think it is Bitcointalk for life, but with little alterations in the forum for the sake of the forum, you see them jumping around. Who doesn't know it is all for the money?

They are doing the double standard without even any patience for the forum at all. Well, I do not see that stopping or reducing the traffic here as you can see, and as it is, those who even went to post in other forums only increased their presence there but have not relinquished their presence here, which makes Bitcointalk better as 75% of posters here may not even bother to go there.

As for theymos, I don't think he reasons things your way. He is probably more concerned about the sanity and integrity of the forum, rather than the traffic you are talking about. "A good name is better than silver and gold."