Re: Farewell

[FatFork]

I already answered your question, I provided the quote from directly from Chipmixer where they said they deleted the private keys:

Whether they deleted the private keys or not (we have no evidence they didn't), how does that prove what you claim?

If you say ChipMixer was a scam, show me the evidence of them stealing people's coins. You claim your accusations are backed up with proof, so let's see it.

And let me repeat, since you obviously dodging the question: You specifically stated "they stole everyone's coins". Was that a lie?

Why do you think o_e_l_e_o backstabbed theymos and told everyone to use centralized mixers instead of Wasabi?

What made you think I was interested in some software from some shitty company you're promoting? Well, let me make that clear: I'm not!

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[Kruw]

Whether they deleted the private keys or not (we have no evidence they didn't), how does that prove what you claim?

If you say ChipMixer was a scam, show me the evidence of them stealing people's coins. You claim your accusations are backed up with proof, so let's see it.

And let me repeat, since you obviously dodging the question: You specifically stated "they stole everyone's coins". Was that a lie?

We do have evidence that ChipMixer did not delete the private keys, I proved my claim with these victim testimonials:

Even my chips which I had in chipmixer service for which they claimed to "delete private" keys after 7 days or whatever, were seized/transfered. and these transactions took place good 3 months ago.

It seems that you are right, whoever had vouchers or chips was left without them. I checked some old wallets older than 1 year that only contained chips from CM, and they were all emptied. Yes, it's a bit stupid that I didn't spend them, but honestly I forgot about a few $ in those old wallets. It's really strange that it wasn't all deleted, but now we at least know where even 7GB of data came from.

Can confirm, they stole a chip of mine a friend of mine that he hadn't yet spent. :/ Really fucking bad practice of ChipMixer to keep private keys, not gonna lie.
It was still there today morning and even when the news broke here; I he had not considered that private keys may have been backed up on CM servers to be honest.

What made you think I was interested in some software from some shitty company you're promoting? Well, let me make that clear: I'm not!

You were the one who brought up theymos' perspective on this issue. As I pointed out, theymos' statements confirm that Wasabi improves your privacy compared to centralized mixers.  Why do you think o_e_l_e_o would backstab theymos and miseducate the users of his forum by telling them the opposite?

[nutildah]

Why do you think o_e_l_e_o would backstab theymos and miseducate the users of his forum by telling them the opposite?

You actually believe that framing things out of context helps your argument... It does not, because most of us see right through what you are doing.

 - o_e_l_e_o is allowed to hold his own viewpoints... if they differ from theymos' that is not a case of "backstabbing."

 - he is not "miseducating" the forum by expressing his viewpoints.

 - theymos hasn't mentioned Wasabi since 2019. Its quite possible his opinion has changed in the last 4 years. As I already mentioned, he also said this:

transaction analysis may still be possible, especially if you leave other traces; the coordinator could possibly do an active sybil attack against specific coins

It just so happens these are currently both giant, omnipresent concerns with Wasabi.

You're obviously here to protect a vested business interest, but you should attempt to have the insight to understand when you are doing more harm than good.

If you have no ability or desire to self-reflect on your actions and correct your behavior, then you will be cursed with a shitty reputation. This holds true in all aspects of life.

[Kruw]

You actually believe that framing things out of context helps your argument... It does not, because most of us see right through what you are doing.

What context have I left out?  Please provide it.

- o_e_l_e_o is allowed to hold his own viewpoints... if they differ from theymos' that is not a case of "backstabbing."

o_e_l_e_o's viewpoints confirmed that Wasabi's privacy is not compromised by coordinator policy:

TIMELINE

March 14 2022 - o_e_l_e_o admits coordinator policy doesn’t affect your inputs, admits to BlackHatCoiner that switching coordinators solves the censorship problem, and admits to BlackHatCoiner that his motivation is simply to fight against Wasabi anyways:

Even if this change from Wasabi won't affect any of your inputs, they are no longer an entity which I can trust to fight for my privacy.

Would it be possible for some to start running coordinators?

Absolutely. The coordinator code is open source, so anyone can download it and spin up their own instance. That would solve the immediate problem if everyone switched to a different coordinator, but it doesn't stop these other coordinators being pressured in to implementing the same restrictions and it doesn't change the fact that Wasabi did this in the first place instead of fighting against it.

March 15 2022 - o_e_l_e_o admits that the data feed is a 1 way street from a blockchain analysis company to the coordinator, and that no data is provided to blockchain analysis:

In fact, they need to cooperate with blockchain analysis to obtain information about "taint" UTXOs.

Well, they only need to cooperate in this sense to have the blockchain analysis entity feed them data about which UTXO's to block. But as I said, if they cooperate like this then it won't be long before that cooperation becomes a two way street, with them feeding data back to the blockchain analysis entity.

- he is not "miseducating" the forum by expressing his viewpoints.

o_e_l_e_o is miseducating users by telling them that a trusted third party provides better privacy than trustless software:

August 23 2022 – o_e_l_e_o lies and says the custodian he partnered with that stole everyone’s deposits and turned over their data to the government has as good or better privacy than Wasabi

If projects such as Samourai, JoinMarket, ChipMixer, Bisq, LocalCryptos, Monero, and anything else which gives users as good or better privacy than Wasabi can continue unencumbered, then Wasabi can too. They simply choose not to.

- theymos hasn't mentioned Wasabi since 2019. Its quite possible his opinion has changed in the last 4 years. As I already mentioned, he also said this:

transaction analysis may still be possible, especially if you leave other traces; the coordinator could possibly do an active sybil attack against specific coins

It just so happens these are currently both giant, omnipresent concerns with Wasabi.

Wasabi massively upgraded in 2022 to a brand new coinjoin protocol, it's quite possible he's even more impressed than when he originally awarded Wasabi & JoinMarket the bounty.

You're obviously here to protect a vested business interest, but you should attempt to have the insight to understand when you are doing more harm than good.

I'm here to help people improve their privacy and stop getting scammed, there's no "vested business interest" because the software is completely open source.

If you have no ability or desire to self-reflect on your actions and correct your behavior, then you will be cursed with a shitty reputation. This holds true in all aspects of life.

I've passionately defended using Bitcoin non custodially and privately against o_e_l_e_o who betrayed the Bitcointalk community by looting their coins and data with ChipMixer.  If you think this behavior needs to be "corrected", it sounds like you are against self custody and privacy.

[nutildah]

You willfully missed the entire point. Nobody here is swayed by your arguments, regardless of how many times you repost the same text over and over again.

I'm not sure you're capable of experiencing humility, so there's no reason to continue this discussion.

[Kruw]

You willfully missed the entire point. Nobody here is swayed by your arguments, regardless of how many times you repost the same text over and over again.

I'm not sure you're capable of experiencing humility, so there's no reason to continue this discussion.

I guess I didn't leave out any context then.  I rigorously proved that o_e_l_e_o was knowingly lying about open source privacy projects and convincing users to give up custody of their funds and data to ChipMixer, who scammed their depositors.

[OgNasty]

You willfully missed the entire point. Nobody here is swayed by your arguments, regardless of how many times you repost the same text over and over again.

I'm not sure you're capable of experiencing humility, so there's no reason to continue this discussion.

I guess I didn't leave out any context then.  I rigorously proved that o_e_l_e_o was knowingly lying about open source privacy projects and convincing users to give up custody of their funds and data to ChipMixer, who scammed their depositors.

I haven’t followed this issue much, outside of warning everyone right BEFORE chipmixer was shut down that they shouldn’t use it because the site had illegally laundered money for a criminal theft and would obviously be shut down as a result. I was attacked for that warning that turned out to be true. You’d think I would have been praised in a normal environment…

I think a person that comes here, runs a signature campaign to get money from this community and then leaves once that money dries up is probably not the most respectable Bitcoiner, but good luck convincing those who were on the payroll (a huge chunk of the current DT network here).

[SamReomo]

I guess I didn't leave out any context then.  I rigorously proved that o_e_l_e_o was knowingly lying about open source privacy projects and convincing users to give up custody of their funds and data to ChipMixer, who scammed their depositors.

If I'm not wrong then most reputed members of the forum were actively applying the signature on their profiles back then because at that time it was one of the most reliable mixers one can think of. But when they turned into frauds and did wrong things then most users remove that signature from their profiles.

Those who were applying the signature including o_e_l_e_o, weren't aware that a project like Chipmixer can do money laundering and other shady activities and if they were aware of that fact then they would most probably not apply the signature on their profiles. That's why blaming o_e_l_e_o or anyone else who were applying the signature on their profiles isn't a justifiable thing.

No one willingly applies the signatures of the platforms that do fraud with users. I believe 1xBit also launched their signature program on this forum but none of the good members applied that signature on their profiles because they were sure that the casino does shady things with the players and all those who applied the signature on their profiles got red tags from the reputed members of the forum.

[Kruw]

If I'm not wrong then most reputed members of the forum were actively applying the signature on their profiles back then because at that time it was one of the most reliable mixers one can think of. But when they turned into frauds and did wrong things then most users remove that signature from their profiles.

Those who were applying the signature including o_e_l_e_o, weren't aware that a project like Chipmixer can do money laundering and other shady activities and if they were aware of that fact then they would most probably not apply the signature on their profiles. That's why blaming o_e_l_e_o or anyone else who were applying the signature on their profiles isn't a justifiable thing.

No one willingly applies the signatures of the platforms that do fraud with users. I believe 1xBit also launched their signature program on this forum but none of the good members applied that signature on their profiles because they were sure that the casino does shady things with the players and all those who applied the signature on their profiles got red tags from the reputed members of the forum.

Imagine there's a way to build a trustless casino on Bitcoin that doesn't let the operator cheat or steal from players.  Now imagine there's a trusted casino outside of Bitcoin that lets the operator cheat or steal from players. If someone goes to the thread of the trustless casino and tells others to use the trusted casino, anyone who listens will only end up in a worse position, and never in a better one.

You can't get cheated or stolen from with Wasabi's coinjoins, but you can get cheated or stolen from with ChipMixer.  o_e_l_e_o told people to abandon the trustless software and lose their funds to the trusted custodian.

[Doan9269]

Imagine there's a way to build a trustless casino on Bitcoin that doesn't let the operator cheat or steal from players.

If this gets in place, then maybe we may be deviating from the amin purpose on creating this platform, this is strictly on bitcoin discussion, any other affairs or activities you're having with any member should be at your own risk, that is why scam is not moderated here, we have to make our own research.

Now imagine there's a trusted casino outside of Bitcoin that lets the operator cheat or steal from players.

It happens in life that some things we trusted doesn't even appear the way we are seeing them in reality until we get into them before knowing, life is all about risk, but we must be sure of what we are into both in and out.

[Hueristic]

Imagine there's a way to build a trustless casino on Bitcoin that doesn't let the operator cheat or steal from players.

If this gets in place, then maybe we may be deviating from the amin purpose on creating this platform, this is strictly on bitcoin discussion, any other affairs or activities you're having with any member should be at your own risk, that is why scam is not moderated here, we have to make our own research.

Now imagine there's a trusted casino outside of Bitcoin that lets the operator cheat or steal from players.

It happens in life that some things we trusted doesn't even appear the way we are seeing them in reality until we get into them before knowing, life is all about risk, but we must be sure of what we are into both in and out.

A decentralized open sauce casino that's codebase's hash is signed and checked on the client side should not be that hard to code.

[Timelord2067]

Interesting concept.

A multi signature wallet by anyone wanting to financially support such a venture would ensure no one walks off with the bag.


Perhaps if you front up BTC the app issues you with a token which enables you to withdraw just your share and no one else's? 🤔

[Kruw]

If this gets in place, then maybe we may be deviating from the amin purpose on creating this platform, this is strictly on bitcoin discussion, any other affairs or activities you're having with any member should be at your own risk, that is why scam is not moderated here, we have to make our own research.

Exactly: o_e_l_e_o preemptively sabotaged the research of others by purposely lying about innocent projects.

[Kruw]

It occurred to me that o_e_l_e_o's behavior reminds me of Jussie Smollett, who faked a hate crime against himself: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jussie_Smollett_hate_crime_hoax

Just like Jussie Smollett was framing white people to promote himself, o_e_l_e_o framed open source privacy projects to promote his "mixing sites".

[Hueristic]

It occurred to me that o_e_l_e_o's behavior reminds me of Jussie Smollett, who faked a hate crime against himself: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jussie_Smollett_hate_crime_hoax

Just like Jussie Smollett was framing white people to promote himself, o_e_l_e_o framed open source privacy projects to promote his "mixing sites".

You never get sick of people telling you what a piece of shit you are do you?

[nutildah]

It occurred to me that o_e_l_e_o's behavior reminds me of Jussie Smollett, who faked a hate crime against himself: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jussie_Smollett_hate_crime_hoax

Just like Jussie Smollett was framing white people to promote himself, o_e_l_e_o framed open source privacy projects to promote his "mixing sites".

[NotATether]

Don't you find it retarded that he just refuses to let go of a thread made by someone who's not even here anymore?

[examplens]

Don't you find it retarded that he just refuses to let go of a thread made by someone who's not even here anymore?

I think everyone should ignore this thread.
Everything inside and about this thread is wrong and its life should not be extended. I believe that the OP would eventually give up if he realizes that there is no support or interest in this kind of discussion.

[Kruw]

You never get sick of people telling you what a piece of shit you are do you?

Why does telling the truth about Bitcoin make me a "piece of shit" to you?

Don't you find it retarded that he just refuses to let go of a thread made by someone who's not even here anymore?

Don't you have any sympathy for o_e_l_e_o's victims who listened to him and lost their money to Chipmixer?

Everything inside and about this thread is wrong

What is wrong in this thread? Use a direct quote.

[decodx]

Why does telling the truth about Bitcoin make me a "price piece of shit" to you?

I fixed that mistake in your quote.

Wanna see a picture instead? Here you go:


Need a definition?

A useless person who spews crap and bullshit out of their mouth constantly.

(1) a worse than worthless object or person; an object or person that holds no value or redeeming qualities whatsoever

(2) a stupid, low-life, self-righteous human being who makes life a living hell for themselves and others

Any peroson who is not worth the same amount as a piece of shit.

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=piece+of+shit

Tons of other definitions out there, but these ones hit the spot for you, in my opinion.