MemoryDealers aka Roger Ver Arrested!

[mindrust]

Exactly. I've always wondered about that. But what if Satoshi Nakamoto was actually the CIA or NSA (which explains why no one has been able to find who he/she/they really was)? We'll never know for sure. The thing is crypto users need to be aware of governments' increasing surveillance tactics by protecting their privacy as much as possible.

Impossible to know what satoshi's real intention was. Maybe he was sincere or maybe he was a government tool. All I'm telling is, even if he was sincere, the gov would still find out his identity. Just because the general public don't know it, doesn't mean the big guys also don't.

If developers are creating something as controversial as a mixer or decentralized exchange, they must never reveal their identity to the public.
What's best? Satisfy investors by revealing your ID (making them believe your project is legit)? Or remain anonymous like Satoshi even if investors think your project is a scam? I think the last option is the way to go. Hopefully, crypto investors learn a valuable lesson with the US' aggressive stance towards the industry. Wishing all the best to Roger Ver.

That's the thing, you can't stay anonymous on the internet forever when you are using the internet infrastructure and domains which are controlled by the gov. They have unlimited power compared to a single individual.

You know even Intel admitted that they were putting a backdoor in their processors. That's what we are dealing with. Every windows/ios machine is a potential government spy in my eyes.

[Medusah]

But what if Satoshi Nakamoto was actually the CIA or NSA (which explains why no one has been able to find who he/she/they really was)?

So what if satoshi is the NSA?  Bitcoin is open-source and probably one of the most scrutinized software projects on the internet.  By the way, he is probably not the NSA, just one of the popular cryptographer suspects. 

That's the thing, you can't stay anonymous on the internet forever when you are using the internet infrastructure and domains which are controlled by the gov.

"Forever" is a very long time.  You can stay anonymous for a reasonable time.  Fire up Tails OS and use Monero as p2p e-cash.  Pretty good anonymity.  Just don't mess it up by linking your real world identity. 

[mindrust]

That's the thing, you can't stay anonymous on the internet forever when you are using the internet infrastructure and domains which are controlled by the gov.

"Forever" is a very long time.  You can stay anonymous for a reasonable time.  Fire up Tails OS and use Monero as p2p e-cash.  Pretty good anonymity.  Just don't mess it up by linking your real world identity. 

“Staying anonymous for a reasonable time” isn’t going to be enough if your are working on a project that can possibly disrupt the world.

What is reasonable? 3 months? 1 year? 10 years? How long will it take for the government to come up with a hint? Do you think we can delay the inevitable, say, for 5 years? Then what? Do jail time?

Forever anonymous is definitely what you want if you are working on a decentralized project which the government won’t like.

[Medusah]

“Staying anonymous for a reasonable time” isn’t going to be enough if your are working on a project that can possibly disrupt the world.

Check Monero's development team.  They are anonymous since 2014.  That means you can be anonymous as long as you are not reckless. 

How long will it take for the government to come up with a hint?

Depends on your OpSec.  If you use anonymous protocols like Tails, Tor and Monero, it solely depends on your potential human mistakes.  For instance, if you're a tennis player in real life, well... don't ever talk about tennis from your anonymous account.  If you have a real life nickname, don't ever use it online.  Come up with a completely new one.  Etc...

[Abiky]

Check Monero's development team.  They are anonymous since 2014.  That means you can be anonymous as long as you are not reckless. 

That's the point. You can be anonymous without leaving any trace on the web. Only if you follow the necessary security precautions. Unfortunately, most developers and people involved in crypto don't care about their privacy/anonymity. Most of them want to attract VCs, and institutional investors just to get enough funding to "pump" their coin all the way to the moon. And the only way to do that is by revealing who they are.

If developers were anonymous, investors are going to believe the project is a scam. That's the issue. Crypto figures like Charlie Shrem, and Roger Ver are ultimately paying the price of revealing themselves to the public. Who's to say Vitalik Buterin, Charles Hoskinson, and Gavin Wood are next? If everyone followed Satoshi's footsteps, crypto land would be a much better place.

[nutildah]

Check Monero's development team.  They are anonymous since 2014.

Except for their main, original dev who got the ball rolling. The project wouldn't have gotten off the ground without him, and he's possibly one of the most well-respected people in the crypto space (I put him several notches above Roger Ver any day of the week).

Who's to say Vitalik Buterin, Charles Hoskinson, and Gavin Wood are next? If everyone followed Satoshi's footsteps, crypto land would be a much better place.

Easy to say in retrospect...

[LoyceV]

Who's to say Vitalik Buterin, Charles Hoskinson, and Gavin Wood are next? If everyone followed Satoshi's footsteps, crypto land would be a much better place.

I don't see Satoshi buying billion dollar yachts. I think most people wouldn't like to be very rich in crypto if they can't spend it.

[Kakmakr]

So should we now change his Bitcoin nickname from Bitcoin Jesus to Roger Tax Dodger? Seeing that he stopped supporting Bitcoin and also presumebly dodge taxes.

I can already see the meme changing from Roger Ver giving Bitcoin the finger to Ungle Sam giving Roger Ver the finger.  

[NotATether]

It's the war of government against the people, and all of the sudden developers are getting arrested, and everyone is breaking a law if they had any connection with Bitcoin.
With the way how they are going in future you will be able to use bitcoin only with custodial and government approved services  
You don't need to be expert to understand what is happening.

The puzzling thing is, why only crypto developers are facing this? Normal developers get by without any problems at all. I think they are being very selective here.

Check Monero's development team.  They are anonymous since 2014.

Except for their main, original dev who got the ball rolling. The project wouldn't have gotten off the ground without him, and he's possibly one of the most well-respected people in the crypto space (I put him several notches above Roger Ver any day of the week).

I would argue that the remaining developers are pseudonymous at best. Anonymity implies that nobody knows a thing about you. But they do have these online aliases they use for themselves, just like Satoshi.

[m2017]

I don't see Satoshi buying billion dollar yachts.

If we knew who Satoshi was, we could find out if he has billion-dollar yachts. And so, it is impossible to know what and who has it or not. In addition to the well-known BTC-address of the founder, there may be others.

I think most people wouldn't like to be very rich in crypto if they can't spend it.

Problems with spending (exchanging for fiat) cryptocurrencies in the future may become quite serious phenomena (without paying taxes like Roger Ver).

Or hopes for mass adoption of bitcoin as a means of payment may simply not come true and all the wealth will get stuck in the blockchain.

[Outhue]

For all those saying that this is a war on cryptocurrencies, it is not, this war is on privacy that exists in the crypto space, to combat tax evaders and also criminals hiding under the innovation.

I am still so glad that Bitcoin has nothing to do with privacy, no one will be here today if it is, because this will rule Bitcoin off for good, it will be a good reason to believe that Bitcoin is the perfect evil currency for criminals and terrorists.

I can't say that the government should do their thing, they must hunt for criminals and the unclean in this space, this doesn't feel like a threat to me, and surely it should be for people who aren't clean enough.

[Z390]

CZ was way better than all these shameless beings if I have to support anyone in this crypto space it will be CZ and CZ only, do not compare CZ to Roger Very.

Why would you support CZ, a criminal ? his exchange is known to sell paper-coins, manipulate prices and freezing random accounts for no reason.

I am surprised this whole Binance scam is still going. CEX are cryptocurrency cancer that needs to go away and be replaced by DEX.

Next arrest we need is the Tether printer owners, whole cryptocurrency market will go down for a while but at least we will have true valuation and not the inflated one.

It is easier for a criminal to blame CZ for freezing his or her account for no reason, CZ that have helped many lost and stolen funds to be reclaimed? Are you not here when Binance helped few exchange to track stolen assest and some were recovered?

Centralized exchanges can't be trusted and I am not saying they are but Binance have helped a lot and what do you mean by paper coins? Are you one of those people that hate altcoins too? In your other post I see how you talk about privacy and its importance, it is the same thing criminals wanted all along.

Now how can you figure out which human being will use privacy for the greater good or steal from other innocent beings and try to hide their tracks using privacy features? Pray that Biden don't win the next election, all Dex will be gone, there will be no single privacy left in this space.

[HideYourKeys]

The worst thing with this topic, is the comparison with Sam Bankman-Fried. It is clear that financing political parties pays-off... just compare the two judicial sentences

[pawel7777]

It's the war of government against the people, and all of the sudden developers are getting arrested, and everyone is breaking a law if they had any connection with Bitcoin.
With the way how they are going in future you will be able to use bitcoin only with custodial and government approved services  

This is slowly happening in European Union, which i somewhat touched in this thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5495068.0.
The point is, the governments don't even have to go after developers (although they might to set an example), all they need to do is to force centralised exchanges to block/freeze coins that comes from unidentified sources, and put on them the responsibility of investigating their customers.

That's why it's crucial to have at least one bitcoin-friendly country, in which you can safely exchange coins to fiat. Otherwise the whole concept of blockchain and decentralisation becomes obsolete. It could get replaced with a spreadsheet ran by authorised entities.

[dkbit98]

The puzzling thing is, why only crypto developers are facing this? Normal developers get by without any problems at all. I think they are being very selective here.

They are clearly trying to send a message to everyone with this arrests, and they scared many people by doing that.
It's not an accident or coincidence that in short time period they arrested Tornado cash developers, Samourai devs, and some of the big names in this space like CZ and Roger ver.
I don't even think they have serious legal case against most of this people, especially with Ver who renounced his US citizenship ten years ago.

This is slowly happening in European Union, which i somewhat touched in this thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5495068.0.

But we should trust their stupid CBDC crap will have any privacy...

I will have to repeat this quote more often:

“The closer the collapse of the Empire, the crazier it's laws are.” ― Cicero

[Medusah]

That's why it's crucial to have at least one bitcoin-friendly country, in which you can safely exchange coins to fiat. Otherwise the whole concept of blockchain and decentralisation becomes obsolete.

No, it's the reliance on centralized entities for exchanges that becomes obsolete.  If you engage in peer-to-peer exchanges, utilizing platforms like Bisq or reputation-based systems that enable direct communication and transactions between people, there's little room for government intervention.  The problem comes when you transact with entities like Binance, Coinbase, etc. that are required to follow regulations. 

[franky1]

The puzzling thing is, why only crypto developers are facing this? Normal developers get by without any problems at all. I think they are being very selective here.
...
I would argue that the remaining developers are pseudonymous at best. Anonymity implies that nobody knows a thing about you. But they do have these online aliases they use for themselves, just like Satoshi.

not puzzling at all
many people get audited.. millions of people.. however we(the crypto community) only find newsworthy reports about crypto-fame people and when they get caught, where suddenly its a talking point.. for us

so while millions of people also go through the same audits.. only when someone that we know, who has been known to be an anti-taxer gets caught and it becomes news, do some people think its a direct target of crypto-bro's when in actual fact is there are a few thousand cases of tax evaders getting soo messed up by their aversions, that they get arrested.. but we only care to hear, note, talk and go viral the stories of crypto people and then think its a big target on us..

when in actual fact there are thousands of people evading tax, we just care about the few cases that evade tax and use bitcoin and have been loudly voicing their anti-tax stance which, foolishly put a target on them by being a loud voice about tax evasion..
dont blame crypto as cause, blame his(Ver) loud aversion to tax which got him noticed and then audited and then chased around the planet for years

its like many things.. the thing you protest the loudest becomes your own target of why you then get noticed by the thing your trying to avoid
EG privacy kings promoting anonymity are more then usually the ones that get flagged as suspicious the most and then followed the most due to their promoting of privacy tools

heres a secret.. the less you say the better

[Abiky]

I don't see Satoshi buying billion dollar yachts. I think most people wouldn't like to be very rich in crypto if they can't spend it.

Exactly. That's the point. You must be discreet by keeping a low profile to avoid bringing unwanted attention. Why do you think Satoshi never disclosed his identity in the first place? Because he knew of the consequences of doing so. Especially when he created an alternative to the existing monetary system. Governments would've been on his tail if he revealed his identity in the first place.

May this be a lesson to everyone involved in crypto. Never disclose who you are or what you possess. Sadly, figures like Roger Ver, Charlie Shrem, Tornado.Cash developers, and Samourai developers are ultimately paying the price. With increased government outreach/oversight, developers/founders need to remain anonymous to keep Bitcoin (and the whole crypto industry) safe. The future can't be predicted, so lets hope for the best.

[franky1]

Who's to say Vitalik Buterin, Charles Hoskinson, and Gavin Wood are next? If everyone followed Satoshi's footsteps, crypto land would be a much better place.

I don't see Satoshi buying billion dollar yachts. I think most people wouldn't like to be very rich in crypto if they can't spend it.

but you can spend it..... heres a lesson. lets use fiat as an example

soooo... if you had lots of fiat, you wouldnt like to be rich if you cant spend it.. simply because you want to be a tax evader, living in fear that spending it will get you caught..

how about realise you have alot of fiat and can afford tax and still profit, thus not play silly games and get caught and end up having your freedom taken away from you.. because all this evading crap is not you exercising your freedom, its actually causing you more trouble for yourself, limiting your freedom due to having to live in a life of fear and capture with every move you make

whether you hold alot of fiat or alot of bitcoin or alot of gold. if you cant understand proper ways to legally avoid tax, dont play the evade tax game as thats not going to give you freedom. its going to give you headaches and stress and interrupt your freedom due to the stress/fear of evading

[mindrust]

The guys that last in this business, are the guys who fly straight. Low-key, quiet. But the guys who want it all, chicas, champagne, flash... They don't last.

Wise words from Frank Lopez.

These names wanted fame, champagne, chicas and flash and lambos and shiet. Now they can’t fly straight anymore. They ain’t lasting. Remember how they took Tony Montana down. Tony wasn’t a wise guy. He was greedy and stupid.

Satoshi on the other hand. He was low-key quiet. He never went off-balance. That’s how you should be doing it.

Most crypto rich people wanted to show off, wanted to be famous and now they are paying the price for their stupidity.