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Author Topic: (Unofficial) [ANN] Litecoin [LTC] to X11 algorithm hardfork  (Read 67884 times)
ivanlabrie
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April 01, 2014, 09:39:17 AM
 #261

We feel the 65% in the poll is a pretty convincing number for us to continue on our project.

The original developers vote against but Litecoin is not owned by them.
Litecoin is owned by the community.

The developers try to spread FUD, we expected this.
Phase 2 of project "LTC 2 X11" will start in 3 weeks from now.
We will contact pool operators of major pools and exchanges to make the transition as smooth as possible.

If pools and or exchanges won't follow us, we understand we can't finish our project. We need their support for this to succeed.
I expect they will be contacted by Coblee too, so we really need to convince them.

Thanks for your support so far!

Why x11? It can easily be ported to asic, has a low memory footprint and that's the main deterrent, vram chip cost.
Variable n factor with shorter schedules would be way better.
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Beeker
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April 01, 2014, 09:41:34 AM
 #262

@Beeker, please address my question from earlier in the thread about whether you are using someone else's forum account for these discussion.

You clearly are not the same person evidenced by your posting history.

So the question remains, why are you using somebody else's account?

Thanks, we already addressed this:

Thanks for your reply.

We have thought about this.

Our group is small right now, 2 developers and 3 people (including myself) for PR and communication.

User Beeker is involved in this too and we use his account for the first weeks of communicating to the Bitcointalk community.
2 of us are well known hero members on Bitcointalk but won't yet disclose our identity until we think there's enough community support to get into the next phase of this project.

We understand the challenges ahead and we hope to get the main LTC team on our side, one they realize what LTC is facing.

To battle Bitcoin we need progressive thinking and a long-term vision for LTC.

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April 01, 2014, 10:00:06 AM
 #263

continue on our project.

Oh great. I'll have to go get some more popcorn.

I thought this display of comedy was already over. But here comes the second act.

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April 01, 2014, 10:05:38 AM
 #264

STOP ALL THIS NON-SENSE, please read this:

https://litecointalk.org/index.php?topic=18166.0

Best Regards.

coblee
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April 01, 2014, 10:08:06 AM
 #265

We feel the 65% in the poll is a pretty convincing number for us to continue on our project.

The original developers vote against but Litecoin is not owned by them.
Litecoin is owned by the community.

The developers try to spread FUD, we expected this.
Phase 2 of project "LTC 2 X11" will start in 3 weeks from now.
We will contact pool operators of major pools and exchanges to make the transition as smooth as possible.

If pools and or exchanges won't follow us, we understand we can't finish our project. We need their support for this to succeed.
I expect they will be contacted by Coblee too, so we really need to convince them.

Thanks for your support so far!

Hey X11 team, would you be willing to make a post to respond to our posts? https://litecointalk.org/index.php?topic=18166.0
Specifically:
- Who are you and why are you hiding behind the user Beeker?
- X11 is possibly less ASIC-resistant than even Scrypt. So why X11?
- Would you just switch algorithm again when ASIC is ever built for X11?
- Are you not concerned about splintering the Litecoin userbase with this controversial change?
- How do you plan to convince the exchanges to switch to your fork when you don't have the support of the Litecoin developers, the Litecoin Association, and have no influence within the community (I'm assuming this since we don't know who you are), and have no control of litecoin.org and other litecoin websites?
- Are you willing to not use the name Litecoin/LTC so as to not cause mass confusion?

Looking forward to your reply.

And when you do reveal yourself. Please please convince us why your development team will do a better job than the current Litecoin development team moving forward. What kind of development work have you done on Bitcoin, Litecoin, or any other alts. And lastly, if your motivations are to save Litecoin, than why have you not contributed to the Litecoin codebase previously and joined our team?

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April 01, 2014, 10:14:21 AM
 #266


That would be a great revolution.

It would be the first time that a community decide to make a change that the creator doesn't agree with.

Here's my bag so you don't ask : Bitcoin, tenX, iexec, byteball and pepecash
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April 01, 2014, 10:29:11 AM
 #267

Just mine Ultracoin with your gpus when scrypt asics take over litecoin

Ultracoin is that the coin thats supa fast

with a great community behind it

and ofc going on BTC-e in May 

Thats the one yes  Grin
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April 01, 2014, 02:27:26 PM
 #268

continue on our project.

Oh great. I'll have to go get some more popcorn.

I thought this display of comedy was already over. But here comes the second act.

Yep.  Might be time to cash in my Litecoins - this split in the community will only hurt the price.

And all for some perceived threat from ASICs that may never eventuate.  Sad.

On the other hand, the Darwinian in me says that if a single person (or team) can bring down a coin simply by persuading people to accept a forked version of it, then it's not robust enough to be used as a currency and therefore deserves oblivion.

This hijacking attempt will be a good test for Litecoin.
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April 01, 2014, 02:30:52 PM
 #269

I'm still not figured out if you guys are trolling or just too dumb to see you are harming the coin.

And why not make it CPU mine only?? Litecoin, originally, wasn't ment for GPU's either.

The ONLY reason to do this is to retain GPU mineability. Yet the downsides don't weigh up for this point. Decentralization due to ASICs is nonsense, the vendors are openly selling their hardware so the hashes will go to the private person who bought them. A higher risk would be the centralised pooling of hashes, especially the auto-switch pools but this problem can't be fixed.
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April 01, 2014, 02:34:57 PM
 #270

We, a team of Litecoin supporters and developers

who is this we?

Retarded scammer, trying to destroy hard work of LTC developement team, and most likely LTC itself...?
HunterS
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April 01, 2014, 02:42:08 PM
 #271

just shut this topic down and move on.its just terrible what u are trying to do.and than to go say u going ahead with it if u get the community support weather litecoin devs like it or not.that just down right fuking rude and inconsiderate.if thats your attitude i wouldnt want u as a dev.

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April 01, 2014, 02:53:36 PM
 #272

LTC is not just about mining anymore... people have invested $ into LTC, so  how will u explain to average Joe, that his 10000$ worth of LTC is lost, cause he send them to the LTC wallet that doesnt exist. Go and create your own "ASIC resistant" coin, build infrastructure around it, do whaveter you want... and leave LTC to DEV team and community behind them.
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April 01, 2014, 04:36:01 PM
 #273

LTC is not just about mining anymore... people have invested $ into LTC, so  how will u explain to average Joe, that his 10000$ worth of LTC is lost, cause he send them to the LTC wallet that doesnt exist. Go and create your own "ASIC resistant" coin, build infrastructure around it, do whaveter you want... and leave LTC to DEV team and community behind them.

When the hardfork and the transition to the new algorithm is completed, it's still LTC but with another algorithm. Please don't spread FUD.

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Beeker
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April 01, 2014, 04:46:16 PM
 #274

We feel the 65% in the poll is a pretty convincing number for us to continue on our project.

The original developers vote against but Litecoin is not owned by them.
Litecoin is owned by the community.

The developers try to spread FUD, we expected this.
Phase 2 of project "LTC 2 X11" will start in 3 weeks from now.
We will contact pool operators of major pools and exchanges to make the transition as smooth as possible.

If pools and or exchanges won't follow us, we understand we can't finish our project. We need their support for this to succeed.
I expect they will be contacted by Coblee too, so we really need to convince them.

Thanks for your support so far!

Hey X11 team, would you be willing to make a post to respond to our posts? https://litecointalk.org/index.php?topic=18166.0
Specifically:
- Who are you and why are you hiding behind the user Beeker?
- X11 is possibly less ASIC-resistant than even Scrypt. So why X11?
- Would you just switch algorithm again when ASIC is ever built for X11?
- Are you not concerned about splintering the Litecoin userbase with this controversial change?
- How do you plan to convince the exchanges to switch to your fork when you don't have the support of the Litecoin developers, the Litecoin Association, and have no influence within the community (I'm assuming this since we don't know who you are), and have no control of litecoin.org and other litecoin websites?
- Are you willing to not use the name Litecoin/LTC so as to not cause mass confusion?

Looking forward to your reply.

And when you do reveal yourself. Please please convince us why your development team will do a better job than the current Litecoin development team moving forward. What kind of development work have you done on Bitcoin, Litecoin, or any other alts. And lastly, if your motivations are to save Litecoin, than why have you not contributed to the Litecoin codebase previously and joined our team?

- dear Charlie, we will not disclose that (yet)
- show me one existing X11 ASIC?
- yes, we would. And because of that, no company would take the risk to invest in building an ASIC for X11 unless another X11 coin (HIRO / DRK) becomes the second cryptocurrency
- our main concern is we will not be able to convince an overwhelming majority to support the hardfork and that's why we will have to put much effort in it
- exchanges and pools will be dealt with, without their support there will be no hardfork. A website is not vital for the survival of a coin, you may or may not host the hardforked client on the current website, there are other ways to distribute a client
- the hardforked coin still is LTC after the hardfork, so no reason for confusion. All the coins will stay where they are, except for a client update nothing will change for anyone, except the miners use another miner and scrypt ASICS become irrelevant for LTC

You're welcome.

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April 01, 2014, 04:53:05 PM
 #275

We feel the 65% in the poll is a pretty convincing number for us to continue on our project.
You never considered that people that want to ruin Litecoin completely (because of interest/investment in other coins) may vote Yes to fork Litecoin - just because they all know that such a fork will create chaos and make Litecoin become less popular?

Isn't it also likely that most of the people voting Yes never had a chance to read the offical response from the Litecoin team? I think most people that first think "oh, I don't like asic for some reason, I must vote yes here because some random guy on the Internet say so", actually would change their opinion if they read the very good arguments for not changing to X11.

In addition to all that, there are probably many people that consider this to be a joke and don't even bother to vote. After all, X11 is more ASIC friendly and Botnet friendly than Scrypt, so none of this makes much sense.

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April 01, 2014, 04:56:09 PM
 #276

- dear Charlie, we will not disclose that (yet)
- show me one existing X11 ASIC?
- yes, we would. And because of that, no company would take the risk to invest in building an ASIC for X11 unless another X11 coin (HIRO / DRK) becomes the second cryptocurrency
- our main concern is we will not be able to convince an overwhelming majority to support the hardfork and that's why we will have to put much effort in it
- exchanges and pools will be dealt with, without their support there will be no hardfork. A website is not vital for the survival of a coin, you may or may not host the hardforked client on the current website, there are other ways to distribute a client
- the hardforked coin still is LTC after the hardfork, so no reason for confusion. All the coins will stay where they are, except for a client update nothing will change for anyone, except the miners use another miner and scrypt ASICS become irrelevant for LTC

so there will be no hardfork. no more worries Wink
if all exchanges and pools switch at the same moment the confusion will only be short: but its still very unlikely to happen

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April 01, 2014, 04:56:57 PM
 #277


Haha well said Beeker.
I like the attitude.

Fuck the ASIC investors. They are just here for the money.

Here's my bag so you don't ask : Bitcoin, tenX, iexec, byteball and pepecash
Beeker
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April 01, 2014, 04:57:01 PM
 #278

We feel the 65% in the poll is a pretty convincing number for us to continue on our project.
You never considered that people that want to ruin Litecoin completely (because of interest/investment in other coins) may vote Yes to fork Litecoin - just because they all know that such a fork will create chaos and make Litecoin become less popular?

Isn't it also likely that most of the people voting Yes never had a chance to read the offical response from the Litecoin team? I think most people that first think "oh, I don't like asic for some reason, I must vote yes here because some random guy on the Internet say so", actually would change their opinion if they read the very good arguments for not changing to X11.

In addition to all that, there are probably many people that consider this to be a joke and don't even bother to vote. After all, X11 is more ASIC friendly and Botnet friendly than Scrypt, so none of this makes much sense.

Thanks for your response.
A link to the official response of the current Litecoin developers is in the OP.

Meep meep
coblee
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April 01, 2014, 04:59:31 PM
 #279

Well, I'm sad to see that you are going ahead with this plan. And using the 65% vote of a tiny poll as the reason. I would have to assume this is a FUD attempt by a group that is trying to destroy Litecoin or by a misguided group that has no vision on what's good for Litecoin. Either way, the Litecoin development team will fight hard against it. Though it's a super waste of our time and resources.

On the other hand, the Darwinian in me says that if a single person (or team) can bring down a coin simply by persuading people to accept a forked version of it, then it's not robust enough to be used as a currency and therefore deserves oblivion.

This hijacking attempt will be a good test for Litecoin.

Agreed. If this FUD attempt can bring down Litecoin, then Litecoin is not strong enough. And if this rogue development team can overthrow us, then we don't deserve to be running Litecoin development. This is an open decentralized currency, so time will tell.

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April 01, 2014, 05:01:40 PM
 #280

- dear Charlie, we will not disclose that (yet)
- show me one existing X11 ASIC?
- yes, we would. And because of that, no company would take the risk to invest in building an ASIC for X11 unless another X11 coin (HIRO / DRK) becomes the second cryptocurrency
- our main concern is we will not be able to convince an overwhelming majority to support the hardfork and that's why we will have to put much effort in it
- exchanges and pools will be dealt with, without their support there will be no hardfork. A website is not vital for the survival of a coin, you may or may not host the hardforked client on the current website, there are other ways to distribute a client
- the hardforked coin still is LTC after the hardfork, so no reason for confusion. All the coins will stay where they are, except for a client update nothing will change for anyone, except the miners use another miner and scrypt ASICS become irrelevant for LTC

so there will be no hardfork. no more worries Wink
if all exchanges and pools switch at the same moment the confusion will only be short: but its still very unlikely to happen

We don't want to create confusion, that's why we are clear about what we want to do:

- create enough support by a majority involved with LTC (pools, exchanges, community)
- hardfork at current block + 3 months so there will be enough time for everyone to switch over their clients/daemons at the time the chosen block is reached

We want this to be a smooth experience for we are heavily invested in Litecoin ourselves and it would be plain stupid to shoot in our own foot.

Meep meep
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