Second chance for mixers?

[Lucius]

Is it known what happened to the Chipmixer owner? As far as I remember, he was also arrested, but is there any update on his case?
He might also seek some form of pardon or a reduced sentence, possibly by referencing the Tornado Cash case as precedent.

Are we sure they caught the real owner or just someone who was in charge of part of the whole operation? I can't remember that this person was convicted at all, because after the domain was seized, everything went into oblivion relatively quickly. Of course, this decision must have been very disappointing for those who portrayed all the participants in the sig campaign and the manager as some kind of criminals. As far as I know, no one ended up in prison or anything like that.

[drwhobox]

Is it known what happened to the Chipmixer owner? As far as I remember, he was also arrested, but is there any update on his case?
He might also seek some form of pardon or a reduced sentence, possibly by referencing the Tornado Cash case as precedent.

Are we sure they caught the real owner or just someone who was in charge of part of the whole operation? I can't remember that this person was convicted at all, because after the domain was seized, everything went into oblivion relatively quickly. Of course, this decision must have been very disappointing for those who portrayed all the participants in the sig campaign and the manager as some kind of criminals. As far as I know, no one ended up in prison or anything like that.

I can not remember I read anything about their arrest.

[examplens]

Are we sure they caught the real owner or just someone who was in charge of part of the whole operation? I can't remember that this person was convicted at all, because after the domain was seized, everything went into oblivion relatively quickly. Of course, this decision must have been very disappointing for those who portrayed all the participants in the sig campaign and the manager as some kind of criminals. As far as I know, no one ended up in prison or anything like that.

Oh, my mistake. I remember that he was charged with money laundering (two years ago), that's probably why I thought he was arrested.
Yes, he is on the FBI's most-wanted list. https://www.fbi.gov/wanted/cyber/minh-quoc-nguyen

[JollyGood]

I also thought the Chipmixer owner/operator was arrested and awaiting sentence but after looking at the wanted poster via the link, it seems as though he was charged with crimes in absentia. If memory serves correct, servers in Germany were also raided hence the confusion.

Oh, my mistake. I remember that he was charged with money laundering (two years ago), that's probably why I thought he was arrested.
Yes, he is on the FBI's most-wanted list. https://www.fbi.gov/wanted/cyber/minh-quoc-nguyen

[dkbit98]

Is it known what happened to the Chipmixer owner? As far as I remember, he was also arrested, but is there any update on his case?
He might also seek some form of pardon or a reduced sentence, possibly by referencing the Tornado Cash case as precedent.

Last time I checked the news, CM owner was never found and arrested.
They posted some alleged photos of him, but this could be anyone connected with CM.
I am sure authorities would brag everywhere if they found the real owner back then, but it loos like they are cooling down with with hunt this days.

[nutildah]

Is it known what happened to the Chipmixer owner? As far as I remember, he was also arrested, but is there any update on his case?
He might also seek some form of pardon or a reduced sentence, possibly by referencing the Tornado Cash case as precedent.

Last time I checked the news, CM owner was never found and arrested.
They posted some alleged photos of him, but this could be anyone connected with CM.
I am sure authorities would brag everywhere if they found the real owner back then, but it loos like they are cooling down with with hunt this days.

The official story is it was a one-man operation, and I have no reason to doubt the story. A Vietnamese national who was living in Vietnam. I remember the court filing had a map of GPS locations from his phone. He also had a second account here on the forum, hotpassion. He actually logged into the account in January of this year... looks like it was to delete around 30 posts. So he's definitely still out there.

https://www.justice.gov/archives/opa/pr/justice-department-investigation-leads-takedown-darknet-cryptocurrency-mixer-processed-over-3

Nguyễn is charged with operating an unlicensed money transmitting business, money laundering and identity theft. If convicted, he faces a maximum penalty of 40 years in prison.

They may not be looking very hard for him anymore... They already confiscated CM's unspent Bitcoin. Frankly I think they should leave him alone since he's not a U.S. citizen, but he'll probably not want to fly to the US or EU any time soon.

[dkbit98]

The official story is it was a one-man operation, and I have no reason to doubt the story.

I don't know the for sure, but I stopped believing in official stories, for just about anything, long time ago.
If this was one-man operation and they know his real identity they would arrest him by now.
US is not in war with Vietnam anymore, and they have very good cooperation between countries, even if they don't have signed extradition treaty.

[NotATether]

I also thought the Chipmixer owner/operator was arrested and awaiting sentence but after looking at the wanted poster via the link, it seems as though he was charged with crimes in absentia. If memory serves correct, servers in Germany were also raided hence the confusion.

We see now that some parts of the EU are still pretty hostile to privacy projects even after the mixer ban, for example eXch announced it was shutting down because law enforcement was trying to arrest them.

I hate to say this, given that I will benefit greatly from a mixer unban, but a positive reception of crypto mixers in the USA is not enough to cause a ban reversal. There are still many European governments who are fiercely prosecuting mixers and other sites, and nothing is stopping them from targeting Bitcointalk.org either. That means theymos should wait until a time when most of the world's attitude to mixers is warm, before changing his decision.

[hugeblack]

We see now that some parts of the EU are still pretty hostile to privacy projects even after the mixer ban, for example eXch announced it was shutting down because law enforcement was trying to arrest them.

I don't know how you concluded that the EU was the reason for eXch's shutdown , but the US is still pursuing mixers on money laundering charges. The only difference is that they have stopped attacking end users.

We are aware that there is an ongoing operation targeting our service by some law enforcement agencies with the goal of adding us to the OFAC sanctions list and possibly seizing our infrastructure (good luck to them, nevertheless). Since it's primarily coming from U.S.-based agencies, we will update our ToS to inform our users in the U.S.

Regarding eXch and the forum, two weeks ago, admin has asked staff members to stop advertising for that service, and the reason was the quote above.

[LoyceV]

There are still many European governments who are fiercely prosecuting mixers and other sites, and nothing is stopping them from targeting Bitcointalk.org either. That means theymos should wait until a time when most of the world's attitude to mixers is warm, before changing his decision.

I remember this post:

I intend to ignore all stupidity coming out of the EUSSR.

Regarding eXch and the forum, two weeks ago, admin has asked staff members to stop advertising for that service, and the reason was the quote above.

I did not know this. But it makes sense, given this post:

There's a giant institution with guns out there which wants to destroy every centralized, destroyable component they can find related to privacy. Every centralized privacy service is at risk of being nuked from orbit at any moment, and you want to be nowhere near the strike zone. ~

I'm certainly not saying that privacy is a lost cause, but this environment requires a much higher standard of robustness and decentralization. This isn't as free a world as it was when Bitcoin was first created.

[hugeblack]

I did not know this. But it makes sense, given this post:

On the contrary, this statement ---->  https://www.justice.gov/dag/media/1395781/dl?inline is good.

It means that they will not pursue privacy protocols like Tornado Cash, CoinJoin, and centralized mixing services, but they will pursue individuals who exploit these protocols to further criminal offenses such as terrorism, drug and human trafficking, organized crime, piracy, and the financing of cartels and gangs.

So they released the Tornado Cash developers, and it's safer to use CoinJoin wallets or advertise mixing services here. However, they will continue to pursue services that exploit/use those services for these dark activities (I believe this misconception is the reason they are pursuing eXch).

[Lucius]

~snip~
So they released the Tornado Cash developers, and it's safer to use CoinJoin wallets or advertise mixing services here. However, they will continue to pursue services that exploit/use those services for these dark activities (I believe this misconception is the reason they are pursuing eXch).

It seems to me that there is a lot more to that story than we know at the moment in terms of the real reason why there is apparently a crusade against the service that is obviously bothering not only the authorities, but competing services that are obviously funding various experts to attack eXch constantly. I think it especially bothers all of them that this service also gives very generous donations to various projects that work on privacy and decentralization.

It's incredible how far human stupidity and malice can go, but nothing surprises me anymore in today's world - and I wouldn't be surprised if they all declared us a criminal organization and started putting us in prisons. What disappointed me the most is that the EU has become far more hostile to cryptocurrencies than the US.

[Ambatman]

What disappointed me the most is that the EU has become far more hostile to cryptocurrencies than the US.

Their rigidity vs US flexibility was one of the reasons the got the short end of the stick
After the Great Depression.
They are reducing and limiting change and growth for supposed stability.

So they released the Tornado Cash developers, and it's safer to use CoinJoin wallets or advertise mixing services here. However, they will continue to pursue services that exploit/use those services for these dark activities (I believe this misconception is the reason they are pursuing eXch).

This is a Plus if there's no strings attached.

[hugeblack]

What disappointed me the most is that the EU has become far more hostile to cryptocurrencies than the US.

This is a Plus if there's no strings attached.

There will be a lot of hypotheses and they may be closed for a different reason

[Free Market Capitalist]

What disappointed me the most is that the EU has become far more hostile to cryptocurrencies than the US.

That's not what happened. What happened was the opposite.

Europe continues to have a hostile policy towards cryptocurrencies and everything it cannot control. That is why limits on cash payments have been implemented in most countries, some with ridiculous amounts, the implementation of CBDCs is still on track and has even been accelerated, and they are also linked to a project of digital identity.

The change has been on the other side of the Atlantic. Had there not been a political change there, they would have continued with the implementation of CBDCs, which Trump has banned, and with policies hostile to cryptocurrencies.

So the correct statement is that the USA has become more friendly towards cryptocurrencies.

[LoyceV]

What disappointed me the most is that the EU has become far more hostile to cryptocurrencies than the US.

Their rigidity vs US flexibility was one of the reasons the got the short end of the stick
After the Great Depression.
They are reducing and limiting change and growth for supposed stability.

A few weeks ago, I heard a great one on the Dutch radio: "De VS innoveert, China kopieert en de EU reguleert" ("The US innovates, China copies and the EU regulates"). In Dutch it all rhimes, in English it sounds terrible. We have politicians who want innovation, but innovation doesn't come from politicians. So all they're doing is adding more new laws to the existing laws.

So the correct statement is that the USA has become more friendly towards cryptocurrencies.

It's not as if there are no changes within EU. The most recent one requires people to confirm wallet ownership for every deposit or withdrawal to or from centralized exchanges above €1000.

Privacy is not a crime, but they sure try hard to make it look like that.

[Free Market Capitalist]

It's not as if there are no changes within EU.

Those are not changes, that is an implementation of what was already planned. What change has there been in EU policy since I wrote this?

Goodbye, privacy, goodbye, it was nice while it lasted.

The only change I see is what has happened in the USA, but that in the EU they are implementing what was already known, late and badly as befits such a bureaucratic structure I would not call it change, at least if we compare it with what has happened in the USA.

[fillippone]

<...>
 The most recent one requires people to confirm wallet ownership for every deposit or withdrawal to or from centralized exchanges above €1000.

Privacy is not a crime, but they sure try hard to make it look like that.

EU (over)regulation often comes from poor understanding of the matter.
The one you provided is only one of those, even if I suspect is done to "protect" the exchanges, rather than demonstrating anything for the users.

The main worrying point for me is the exh debacle. I think it bodes not so well for the mixers here on the forum.

[JayJuanGee]

[edited out]

So the correct statement is that the USA has become more seemingly friendly towards cryptocurrencies.

You are not wrong, but personally, I would feel MOAR better if there were to be a qualifier placed within your above statement.

[Free Market Capitalist]

EU (over)regulation often comes from poor understanding of the matter.

Do you mean they don't understand anything? Because they over regulate everything. And I'm not just talking about bitcoin or cryptocurrencies.

You are not wrong, but personally, I would feel MOAR better if there were to be a qualifier placed within your above statement.

Well, apparently in the EU until recently there were bitcoin ATMs where you could make transactions without KYC under €1,000, and although KYC for all transactions has a limit to be implemented in September practically all ATMs have already implemented it. USDT has been banned in Europe, you cannot use it legally (it is currently the third cryptocurrency, on its way to be the second in market cap). This coupled with things like what LoyceV commented before. And due to the EU's taste for over regulate I have a feeling that this is only going to be the beginning. Just think one thing, this €1,000 limit, even if they don't lower it, due to inflation in a few years is going to be a laugh.

Did you know that in some places in Europe the maximum you can pay in cash is just €500 (Greece) or €1,000 (Spain and France)? This is not just about cryptocurrencies is about control.

So seemingly, things are much worse in the EU than in the USA in this respect.