No longer pursuing Epochtalk

[Mitchell]

This whole DT discussion feels very off-topic for this topic. Maybe move it somewhere else

[cryptosize]

BBS* -> fora -> social media -> AI/Metaverse

* very few of you are old enough to remember without googling it...

For better or worse the rise of social media coincides with the rise of mobile devices in 2014 (this forum especially is very hard to use due to the lack of mobile theme -> constant zoom in/zoom out to read a post, let alone writing a lengthy post).

Mobile devices have displaced PCs for 99% of the population worldwide and this makes fora less attractive.

Unfortunately mobile devices are way too easy to use, that even a chimp's brain (equivalent to 5-year old Homo Sapiens intelligence) can use it, so you probably now understand why the internet keeps getting worse and worse quality-wise, despite the vast technological progress (faster CPUs/GPUs, faster fiber connections).

It is what it is. It was good while it lasted.

[ChiBitCTy]

I'd like to extend my personal thanks to PowerGlove for the recent implementations to the current forum software, as well as theymos who has continually contributed their own time towards improvement. As well as some third party projects which I think have contributed positively to the average users forum experience. I'm sure there's others behind the scenes that have also helped, as theymos hinted.

I'm absolutely sure it took theymos a lot of time, and frustration to pull the plug, which ultimately I believe started as a ambitious passion project, come heavily invested project.

Ultimately thank you to the community for continuing to contribute, and keep the ol' heart running around this place.

Echo this.  Power Glove is a bad ass, his contributions have been incredible and his openness to hear others out, even idiots like myself w/dumb ideas, it's pretty cool.  I know he's being paid but never hurts to send a few pieces of corn to buy him dinner or something and Theymos, the username speaks for itself. 

@Theymos.. I read this thread yesterday so going off memory here.  You mentioned how things wont ever be the way they use to be ( I miss those days) but I think they could def improve.  Just a thought but advertising the forum could really help. Likely brought up before but maybe now worth revisiting ?  I feel like this could be done at a reasonable cost. I have brought a lot of people here, they had no clue this place existed.  It's a bit hard to find if you're newer to btc.  When I started collecting physical btc's I didn't even come across btalk, I think I was googling and searching the web pretty decently..tho that was a decade ago nearly.  I just can't imagine my life without having found this place.  It's special.  If more people knew about it, they'd come. Could help combat road blocks, like YouTube censoring the fuck out bitcointalk..insane.. if you type "btalk" "btc forum" "btc talk" it'll be gone in like 5mns or less.

Twitter is a cesspool to converse crypto.  r/bitcoin..I don't need to tell you..it seems to have changed a good bit.  I'll come across a post where everyone is saying "yeah keeping your coins on coinbase is fine" ..you use to get persecuted for nonsense talk like that, and you absolutely will here and rightfully so.  So many people need btalk, they just don't know it yet. Anyways I've always thought it would be awesome if r/bitcoin "advertised" for btalk somewhere, "for more in depth conversations, where Satoshi conversed while active, hodl"  etc.  I can't remember if you run a bot there but a thought...I've seen constant physical btc's pop up there and a lot of the time no one with knowledge joins the chat.  Or you get.. "bitcoin is not physical lol dummies..it's just a souvenir coin"..a bot leading to collectibles would be cool /helpful !  Esp for posts like "I have a 2FA Titan coin, I can't redeem it, help!"..bot says take a look at bitcointalk collectibles sub (they find my scam write up, they just got a huge favor and maybe stick around. 

Just my 2 satoshis /thinking a bit out loud.   Preciate ya big time regardless. 

[JollyGood]

Is it possible to know who was getting paid and who worked voluntarily (as well as the payments made to them)? I was under the impression PowerGlove was not getting any payment at all and was volunteering his time. There is a lot of detail in this post by theymos but it is not point specific.

Having said that, I reiterate relief the project has ended. We were looking forward to a massive upgrade but in the end after years of waiting it was not delivered (for the reasons already explained) and now this episode can put in the past.

Power Glove is a bad ass, his contributions have been incredible and his openness to hear others out, even idiots like myself w/dumb ideas, it's pretty cool.  I know he's being paid but never hurts to send a few pieces of corn to buy him dinner or something and Theymos, the username speaks for itself.

[TryNinja]

Is it possible to know who was getting paid and who worked voluntarily (as well as the payments made to them)? I was under the impression PowerGlove was not getting any payment at all and was volunteering his time.

He started as a volunteer, but nowadays he does get paid. From him himself:

I'd like to correct a misconception that I keep bumping into before it becomes too widespread:

While most of the patches I've posted to date were done on a free-time/voluntary basis, theymos and I did recently come to an arrangement, and I am now paid for the work I do on Bitcointalk.

[igebotz]

He started as a volunteer, but nowadays he does get paid. From him himself:

I'd like to correct a misconception that I keep bumping into before it becomes too widespread:

While most of the patches I've posted to date were done on a free-time/voluntary basis, theymos and I did recently come to an arrangement, and I am now paid for the work I do on Bitcointalk.

Took back my words after reading your quote - he earned whatever he's getting and this is only the start..

Why spend more Bitcoin on third-party developers when we already have our own wizard, PowerGlove, doing everything for free? If anyone needed to be paid to enhance the forum, it would be him. He made significant patches for free; imagine what he'd do if paid.

[ibminer]

I assumed PowerGlove not getting paid would have been cleared up on Page 2 of this thread.

[joker_josue]

For forum users, nothing has changed. The developers of Epochtalk were not working on anything actually used by forum users: they were working on a hope that we might someday move away from PHP/SMF. Most of the original goals for Epochtalk have in fact already been completed in the current software through work by myself, PowerGlove, and others in the 10+ years since the idea of new forum software was first contemplated. Since 2011, we've added trust, merit, 2FA, "evil fees", watchlists, drafts, a sane reports system, and many other improvements on stock SMF. Going forward, we will continue to make improvements to the current software. One of the most requested features is improving the forum's usability on mobile devices, and that is already being worked on.

If I can be of any help, you can count on me. I'm used to adapting layout and front end, so if there's anything I can do, let me know. Maybe I can even help.

[OgNasty]

Spending an outrageous sum of donated funds on an unknown company when everyone said it was a bad idea and would not work.  I don't see it as a violation of being the Admin here, but it's... a bit tacky, I guess.  I suppose an analogy would be like spending taxpayer money on DEI initiatives that nobody wanted, asked for, or thought would result in a positive outcome.  

 - Not asking the community (or Donators) how we wanted our funds spent was unprofessional.
 - Spending money on an unknown company always has some amount of risk.
 - Now we have to spend time on this drama.

The insane amount of BTC that was wasted is unimportant, and I'd feel exactly the same if the wasted amount was 100x more or 100x less.  If I'd been holding the BTC, no BTC would've been wasted at all, and in fact it would have grown from airdrops as I respect the responsibility that comes with fiduciary duty.

[JollyGood]

You stated your perspective on what either went wrong or what should not have happened during the whole Epochtalk episode and many of us done the same thing. Some of us have added opinions about what should happen next. Is it possible you could add your opinion on what should happen going forward in order to not repeat past errors?

Spending an outrageous sum of donated funds on an unknown company when everyone said it was a bad idea and would not work.  I don't see it as a violation of being the Admin here, but it's... a bit tacky, I guess.  I suppose an analogy would be like spending taxpayer money on DEI initiatives that nobody wanted, asked for, or thought would result in a positive outcome.  

 - Not asking the community (or Donators) how we wanted our funds spent was unprofessional.
 - Spending money on an unknown company always has some amount of risk.
 - Now we have to spend time on this drama.

The insane amount of BTC that was wasted is unimportant, and I'd feel exactly the same if the wasted amount was 100x more or 100x less.  If I'd been holding the BTC, no BTC would've been wasted at all, and in fact it would have grown from airdrops as I respect the responsibility that comes with fiduciary duty.

[Vod]

but it's... a bit tacky, I guess.

Oh snap.  The pretend catfight continues. 

[ibminer]

You stated your perspective on what either went wrong or what should not have happened during the whole Epochtalk episode and many of us done the same thing. Some of us have added opinions about what should happen next. Is it possible you could add your opinion on what should happen going forward in order to not repeat past errors?
~

No, that is mainly a vengeance post which just copies and mocks posts theymos made about Og in 2019... while illogically comparing himself putting treasury funds at risk to get himself some shitcoins, to an investment theymos made into a multi-developer company to build [at the time] next-generation forum software for the forum.

He can try to spin it into a false narrative of growing the treasury funds nonsense these days, but clearly any self-inflated prima donna such as Og would have been bragging and gloating [at the time] to theymos and the community about all the shitcoins he gained for the treasury using airdrops, if that was actually his goal, but no, he was silent about it until he got caught (thanks to LoyceV).

In Og's twisted mind, he could have stolen or lost most of the treasury funds, and would have just turned around years later and told everyone how much more USD he made the forum with the remaining BTC, smh.

Even as a "donator", I wouldn't put much value in his opinion here.

[cryptofrka]

But still, I hope we all agree some sort of plan has to be made regarding those funds?
Most of the older accounts play the blame game without any constructive ideas.

It's OT in this thread so I hope some kind of 'what to do with this shitload of money' thread will be opened in the near future. Not really looking forward to all the childish drama that will occur there though.

For all I care, airdrop it all to Newbie multiaccounts - but the next course of action should be transparent enough.

[JollyGood]

About my post to OgNasty, yes it was directed at him even though his post not directed at me. I think my view would have been the same towards any member that wrote the post. It is easy for members to claim various actions should not have taken place with regards to Epochtalk (I did so myself) but not many put forward a credible alternative. Other than that I have no more and no less interest in his answer to the pertinent question.

As his post was more of a complaint regarding wasting resources on Epochtalk rather than him giving his own vision of the future, I just wanted to see if his proposals for the future would have contained the same conviction he had in the posts where he was complaining.

It will take reading some threads however I must make time to understand what the historic issues between certain members here are. For one reason or another I have never been fully aware of all the drama between certain members but I do remember there being multiple issues.

No, that is mainly a vengeance post which just copies and mocks posts theymos made about Og in 2019... while illogically comparing himself putting treasury funds at risk to get himself some shitcoins, to an investment theymos made into a multi-developer company to build [at the time] next-generation forum software for the forum.

He can try to spin it into a false narrative of growing the treasury funds nonsense these days, but clearly any self-inflated prima donna such as Og would have been bragging and gloating [at the time] to theymos and the community about all the shitcoins he gained for the treasury using airdrops, if that was actually his goal, but no, he was silent about it until he got caught (thanks to LoyceV).

In Og's twisted mind, he could have stolen or lost most of the treasury funds, and would have just turned around years later and told everyone how much more USD he made the forum with the remaining BTC, smh.

Even as a "donator", I wouldn't put much value in his opinion here.

[dkbit98]

But still, I hope we all agree some sort of plan has to be made regarding those funds?

What funds?
As far as I know developers already received payment for epochtalk paid in bitcoin long time ago, and that was spent.
Price of bitcoin was much lower at that time, and we can't receive any ''airdrop'' for that.

[cryptofrka]

What funds?
As far as I know developers already received payment for epochtalk paid in bitcoin long time ago, and that was spent.
Price of bitcoin was much lower at that time, and we can't receive any ''airdrop'' for that.

Remaining funds, over 1200 BTC. I think there should be a transparent plan on how to use that, currently this is the post I was referred to when I asked about it.
We are speaking about 100 million $ here, it's crazy that we're treating it like this.

I really think we should move this discussion to another thread, or at least stop discussing it here though. We're way off topic.

[OgNasty]

About my post to OgNasty, yes it was directed at him even though his post not directed at me. I think my view would have been the same towards any member that wrote the post. It is easy for members to claim various actions should not have taken place with regards to Epochtalk (I did so myself) but not many put forward a credible alternative. Other than that I have no more and no less interest in his answer to the pertinent question.

As his post was more of a complaint regarding wasting resources on Epochtalk rather than him giving his own vision of the future, I just wanted to see if his proposals for the future would have contained the same conviction he had in the posts where he was complaining.

It will take reading some threads however I must make time to understand what the historic issues between certain members here are. For one reason or another I have never been fully aware of all the drama between certain members but I do remember there being multiple issues.

No, that is mainly a vengeance post which just copies and mocks posts theymos made about Og in 2019... while illogically comparing himself putting treasury funds at risk to get himself some shitcoins, to an investment theymos made into a multi-developer company to build [at the time] next-generation forum software for the forum.

He can try to spin it into a false narrative of growing the treasury funds nonsense these days, but clearly any self-inflated prima donna such as Og would have been bragging and gloating [at the time] to theymos and the community about all the shitcoins he gained for the treasury using airdrops, if that was actually his goal, but no, he was silent about it until he got caught (thanks to LoyceV).

In Og's twisted mind, he could have stolen or lost most of the treasury funds, and would have just turned around years later and told everyone how much more USD he made the forum with the remaining BTC, smh.

Even as a "donator", I wouldn't put much value in his opinion here.

It is actually hilarious that I got vilified for not only living up to my side of the treasury agreement in the face of not being paid the agreed funds by theymos for years, but I went above and beyond to give theymos forked coins from my address that I didn’t have to as well as gaining the forum more coins which I would have happily handed over with the millions of dollars in BTC and forks, but theymos was only interested in the high value coins and showed no interest in receiving any form of accounting. This after I donated my own 10 BTC to the forum. Meanwhile theymos loses thousands of BTC from Donators like myself and people still want to push this false narrative that what I did was bad and what he did was good. You can’t make this stuff up…

Only one person has ever touched the forum’s funds and given back more than he was tasked with holding. Me.

[Vod]

Only one person has ever touched the forum’s funds and given back more than he was tasked with holding. Me.

Just a little fact check for the newbies who still trust this liar...  the PAID treasurer OgNasty has stolen more from the forum than any other member (I don't consider Theymos a member, but administrator)

 

[dkbit98]

Remaining funds, over 1200 BTC. I think there should be a transparent plan on how to use that, currently this is the post I was referred to when I asked about it.
We are speaking about 100 million $ here, it's crazy that we're treating it like this.

This is unrelated with coins that was dedicated and used for working on Epochtalk software (that never completed).
I am not making any excuses, but if Theymos was thinking like you he would spend most donation coins a long time ago.
Those donations were never intended to be shared with forum members, and maintaining website all this years still cost money.
That being said, it would be cool if community receives small share of that.

[cryptofrka]

This is unrelated with coins that was dedicated and used for working on Epochtalk software (that never completed).
I am not making any excuses, but if Theymos was thinking like you he would spend most donation coins a long time ago.
Those donations were never intended to be shared with forum members, and maintaining website all this years still cost money.
That being said, it would be cool if community receives small share of that.

Yeah, I'm aware that the coins are unrelated. That's why I'm saying this conversation needs to be moved to another thread.

Also, what I said is 'for all I care, airdrop it to Newbie multiaccounts' to make a point, not to say it needs to be done, or that I would do it that way. Nobody sane would.

_______________________________________

I don't go into Meta, I don't really give a shit, I will soon disappear from this thread back to Gambling boards. If 100 million disappears, I'll be the last to give people shit about it.
Considering that it's a huge, huge amount of money, all I'm saying is that it would be good to have a plan people could trust and get behind, and that plans/decisions should involve more than 1 person.

It's irresponsible to handle 100 million dollars in a non-transparent way but then again - it's what we do best around here.