MtGox account with $220 blocked for more than six weeks without explanation

[zwei2blum]

MtGox is blocking my account for more than 6 weeks by now without giving any explanation and without requesting any documents or other information.

I just want to share this unpleasant experience with MtGox to make others aware of such issues.

After making a Dwolla deposit of $220 into MtGox on October 25 and buying bitcoins with this money, I was asked to submit account verification documents in order to transfer bitcoins out of my account. I submitted the required documents and did not receive any response. I started to get confused when I could not login into my account a few days later as my password was rejected. When I filled the password recovery form on MtGox I did not receive a response.

I started to get worried and filed a ticket (see whole tickets below) in the support area. After I answered a few questions about my Dwolla deposit, the ticket was closed with the reply by MtGox:

Unfortunately, we can not assist you at this point. We will investigate this issue and return to you when it is resolved.

A few days later I opened a new ticket to ask for news. This ticket was marked as solved without any explanation.

To give MtGox some time to "investigate" and because I did not have time to spend hours writing tickets every day, it took me two weeks to write a new ticket. They did not request any more information and the ticket ended with the same words as the first one:

     Unfortunately, we can not assist you regarding this issue since we are investigating. We will notify you as soon as it is resolved.

This was on December 06. I sent them a new ticket today but I am loosing my confidence in MtGox as they did not come up with a solution for more than 6 weeks by now. Worst of all, they did not ask for any more information or documentation. I would be willing to submit any reasonable document they need to solve this issue. They did not give any explanation why my account is blocked either.

Did any of you make similar experiences with MtGox? How long did they block your account? Feel free to post a reply to this thread if you have similar problems with MtGox.

Merry Christmas,
Johannes

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Full quote of MtGox support tickets below.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Request #15585
Account inaccessible (username "zweiblum", email: zbmtgox@_____.de)

<RealName hidden>
Nov-25 02:56

Hi,

since I uploaded the documents you required for authentication about a
week ago, my account (username "zweiblum", email: zbmtgox@_____.de) is
inaccessible. In practice this means that my username/password
combination is rejected and that the "I forgot my password" form results
in a blak page and no password being sent.

Please reactivate the access to my account and give me access to the
money I deposited!

Thanks a lot,
<RealName hidden>

    smime.p7s smime.p7s

 
Comments
User photo
Mt.Gox Support
Support Desk

    Hello,

    Thank you for contacting us. May we ask if you recently made a Dwolla deposit? Can you please verify whether your Dwolla account is a US one or not?

    Thanks,

    MtGox.com Team

Nov-25 2011 09:45
<RealName hidden>

    Hi,

    I initiated my last Dwolla deposit on 10/25/2011, this Dwolla account is US based because I have been in the US until August 2011.

    Thanks,
    <RealName hidden>

Nov-25 2011 16:01
User photo
Mt.Gox Support
Support Desk

    Hello,

    Thank you for contacting us. In response to increased incidence of phishing and hacking attempts made against Mt.Gox and its users, stricter security precautions have been implemented to protect our users and their funds. Should suspicious activity be detected in relation to an Mt.Gox account, the ability to withdraw funds will be temporarily suspended until it can be confirmed that the owner of the account is in fact still in control. Please login onto the Mt.Gox page and visit https://www.mtgox.com/forms/verification to start the identification process.

    Thanks,

    MtGox.com Team

Nov-25 2011 16:04
<RealName hidden>

    Hi,

    as I mentioned in my first email, I ready submitted the verification
    forms (that was when the trouble started...). An I am still getting the
    error

    "Invalid username or password, please try again. "

    although I am using the same username/password as before.

    Please reactivate the access to my account and give me access to the
    money I deposited!

    Thanks,
<RealName hidden>
        smime.p7s smime.p7s

Nov-25 2011 20:19
Mt.Gox Support
Support Desk

    Hello,

    Unfortunately, we can not assist you at this point. We will investigate this issue and return to you when it is resolved.

    Thanks,

    MtGox.com Team

Nov-28 2011 11:15

Request #15736
Account compromised? username: zweiblum

<RealName hidden>
Nov-29 09:06

Hi,

after submitting the verification documentation my account is inaccessible (cannot login, password rejected) and I do not receive the password recovery emails if I request them. Any chance my account has been hijacked? Why don't I receive the emails to set a new password?

original email on file for this account: zbmtgox@_____.de
username: zweiblum

This issue is related to the closed ticket #15585.

Thanks,
<RealName hidden>

Request #16053 follow-up to request #15585
Re: Account inaccessible (username "zweiblum", email: zbmtgox@_____.de)

<RealName hidden>
Dec-04 20:30

Dear Sir or Madam,

I still cannot access my account. I deposited US$ 220 on 10/25/2011 and I was asked to submit verification documents shortly afterwards. After doing so, my account became inaccessible (username/password no longer accepted). When I request a new password, I do not receive any password recovery emails. $200 is a large amount of money to me and I ask you to release this money and to reestablish the access to my account.

What I find most frustrating is that I did not receive any kind of explanation why I am refused access to my account.

Thanks,
<RealName hidden>
 
Mt.Gox Support
Support Desk

    Hello,

    Thank you for contacting us. Can you please provide me with your account username so I can look in to this for you?

    Thanks,

    MtGox.com Team

Dec-05 2011 11:48
<RealName hidden>

    Hi,

    the username is "zweiblum". The email address associated with this account is zbmtgox@_____.de.

    Thanks,
<RealName hidden>

Dec-05 2011 16:28

Mt.Gox Support
Support Desk

    Hello <RealName hidden>,

    Unfortunately, we can not assist you regarding this issue since we are investigating. We will notify you as soon as it is resolved.

    Thanks,

    MtGox.com Team

Dec-06 2011 12:17

[1714263584]

1714263584

[1714263584]

1714263584

[1714263584]

1714263584

[Stephen Gornick]

   Hello,

    Thank you for contacting us. May we ask if you recently made a Dwolla deposit? Can you please verify whether your Dwolla account is a US one or not?

    Thanks,

    MtGox.com Team

Nov-25 2011 09:45
<RealName hidden>

    Hi,

    I initiated my last Dwolla deposit on 10/25/2011, this Dwolla account is US based because I have been in the US until August 2011.

    Thanks,
    <RealName hidden>

Perhaps we can crowdsource a solution.

The question and your response raise a flag though.  Is there issues as far as where you are located?  Had you been in the U.S. at the time the Dwolla funds were deposited through the time they were transferred to Mt. Gox?
 - http://help.dwolla.com/customer/portal/articles/87276-can-i-use-dwolla-outside-the-u-s-

[zwei2blum]

Had you been in the U.S. at the time the Dwolla funds were deposited through the time they were transferred to Mt. Gox?

I have been in Germany at the time I initiated the transfer and still am. The transfer was done from a U.S. checking account and has cleared without any problems. As far as I understand the page you linked, it would be OK to use Dwolla, for example, during a vacational travel to Europe.

[RandyFolds]

Wow, what a crock...That is unbelievable. I would probably contact my financial institution and dwolla and throw the fraud word around a bit. Why support Mt.Gox after this BS? It just gives them the green light to do it in the future.

[Maged]

This is really quite a reasonable precaution on their end to lock out a German IP address from an account linked with a US-based Dwolla account.

I'll PM Adam to see if he can take a look into this case, and hopefully provide a better explanation. (Other MtGox folks are free to respond, of course!)

[ineededausername]

This is really quite a reasonable precaution on their end to lock out a German IP address from an account linked with a US-based Dwolla account.

They could say so, and stop being circumspect.

[plogank]

This is interesting.  I've never had this kind of results with MtGox. They have been very supportive.

A while back I made a deposit for $100 at my local bank to be credited to my MtGox account.  When it was credited, they made a mistake and credited $200.  I quickly emailed them and pointed out the error.  They emailed me back and told me to keep the extra $100.  I call that great service.

You can see a screen shot of the email from them at: http://i739.photobucket.com/albums/xx35/plogank/Deposit.jpg

Hope you get your problem resolved.

[zwei2blum]

I agree that the fact that I changed countries might raise some suspicion. However, we are living in the 21st century and people are traveling. This does not justify to block access to an account without explanation for such a long time.

[joshuawp]

That's awesome, honest and amazing that you reported this.

What's scary is their response: "Please keep the extra $100"

How many people haven't reported surplus deposits? Where is the "extra" money coming from? The OP's issue likely stems from poor systems and management giving away too much money. Incredible.

This is interesting.  I've never had this kind of results with MtGox. They have been very supportive.

A while back I made a deposit for $100 at my local bank to be credited to my MtGox account.  When it was credited, they made a mistake and credited $200.  I quickly emailed them and pointed out the error.  They emailed me back and told me to keep the extra $100.  I call that great service.

You can see a screen shot of the email from them at: http://i739.photobucket.com/albums/xx35/plogank/Deposit.jpg

Hope you get your problem resolved.

[Maged]

I agree that the fact that I changed countries might raise some suspicion. However, we are living in the 21st century and people are traveling. This does not justify to block access to an account without explanation for such a long time.

Oh, I agree. That's why I PM'd Adam from MtGox to have a look at this, since I feel that we could all use an explanation here.

[plogank]

That's awesome, honest and amazing that you reported this.

What's scary is their response: "Please keep the extra $100"

How many people haven't reported surplus deposits? Where is the "extra" money coming from? The OP's issue likely stems from poor systems and management giving away too much money. Incredible.

What's really scary to me is how quickly people put a negative spin on things.  This is not the only negative response I've had when I shared this information.

[SgtSpike]

That's awesome, honest and amazing that you reported this.

What's scary is their response: "Please keep the extra $100"

How many people haven't reported surplus deposits? Where is the "extra" money coming from? The OP's issue likely stems from poor systems and management giving away too much money. Incredible.

What's really scary to me is how quickly people put a negative spin on things.  This is not the only negative response I've had when I shared this information.

Haha, seriously.  Everyone's so glass-half-empty around here, it's amazing.

[PrintCoins]

That's awesome, honest and amazing that you reported this.

What's scary is their response: "Please keep the extra $100"

How many people haven't reported surplus deposits? Where is the "extra" money coming from? The OP's issue likely stems from poor systems and management giving away too much money. Incredible.

What's really scary to me is how quickly people put a negative spin on things.  This is not the only negative response I've had when I shared this information.

You see it as, hey great customer service. I see it as a system that is poorly automated, and fraught with human error. They make enough money that they don't sweat the small stuff, and that is cool and all, but I am always wondering if it will come to light that their errors mean that they do not actually have as much in the way of bitcoins or cash to meet the balances in their accounts.

Things I have seen
* The major hack which they "rolled back." How much they lost is unknown.
* Large pools of money they shift around between single addresses (suggesting to me a human activity rather than an automated bitcoin management system)
* The time they sent a large sum of bitcoins into oblivion (I forget how much)
* These errors where people are credited extra

Maybe they make enough profit per transactions that money slipping through the cracks is no big deal, but if they don't a run on the bank is a possibility.

[SgtSpike]

That's awesome, honest and amazing that you reported this.

What's scary is their response: "Please keep the extra $100"

How many people haven't reported surplus deposits? Where is the "extra" money coming from? The OP's issue likely stems from poor systems and management giving away too much money. Incredible.

What's really scary to me is how quickly people put a negative spin on things.  This is not the only negative response I've had when I shared this information.

You see it as, hey great customer service. I see it as a system that is poorly automated, and fraught with human error. They make enough money that they don't sweat the small stuff, and that is cool and all, but I am always wondering if it will come to light that their errors mean that they do not actually have as much in the way of bitcoins or cash to meet the balances in their accounts.

Things I have seen
* The major hack which they "rolled back." How much they lost is unknown.
* Large pools of money they shift around between single addresses (suggesting to me a human activity rather than an automated bitcoin management system)
* The time they sent a large sum of bitcoins into oblivion (I forget how much)
* These errors where people are credited extra

Maybe they make enough profit per transactions that money slipping through the cracks is no big deal, but if they don't a run on the bank is a possibility.

Maybe, maybe not.  Why not give them the benefit of the doubt?  I don't see any reason to badmouth them or spread fear about them when there isn't any proof to back up what you are saying...  It seems overly paranoid and over the top, in my opinion.

[PrintCoins]

That's awesome, honest and amazing that you reported this.

What's scary is their response: "Please keep the extra $100"

How many people haven't reported surplus deposits? Where is the "extra" money coming from? The OP's issue likely stems from poor systems and management giving away too much money. Incredible.

What's really scary to me is how quickly people put a negative spin on things.  This is not the only negative response I've had when I shared this information.

You see it as, hey great customer service. I see it as a system that is poorly automated, and fraught with human error. They make enough money that they don't sweat the small stuff, and that is cool and all, but I am always wondering if it will come to light that their errors mean that they do not actually have as much in the way of bitcoins or cash to meet the balances in their accounts.

Things I have seen
* The major hack which they "rolled back." How much they lost is unknown.
* Large pools of money they shift around between single addresses (suggesting to me a human activity rather than an automated bitcoin management system)
* The time they sent a large sum of bitcoins into oblivion (I forget how much)
* These errors where people are credited extra

Maybe they make enough profit per transactions that money slipping through the cracks is no big deal, but if they don't a run on the bank is a possibility.

Maybe, maybe not.  Why not give them the benefit of the doubt?  I don't see any reason to badmouth them or spread fear about them when there isn't any proof to back up what you are saying...  It seems overly paranoid and over the top, in my opinion.

I suppose you are right. It is just one consideration people should have when dealing with an exchange.

I simply am listing the issues that have come up on the board, and note that if the errors outstrip their profits than their balance sheet will not line up, hence the possibility of a run.

@plogank was wondering how this could be spun negatively. If I saw my bank making mistakes that made it lose money, I would pull my money out, especially if it wasn't backed by something like FDIC protection.

I don't know if I would call this bad mouthing. I am just voicing a concern that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere else. Really I think that mtgox does quite well for itself with all of the volume, and most likely it's profits make for a balanced budget. But I also wouldn't be surprised if I was wrong in this assumption.

In other words: I reserve the right at some unknown (maybe non-existant) date to say "I told you so."

I have the benefit of never being able to be proved wrong

[plogank]

Haha, seriously.  Everyone's so glass-half-empty around here, it's amazing.

With the glass half empty it's a wonder they'd mess with Bitcoins they're so risky.

I'll bet they'd complain because and upside down cake was upside down.  LOL

[SgtSpike]

That's awesome, honest and amazing that you reported this.

What's scary is their response: "Please keep the extra $100"

How many people haven't reported surplus deposits? Where is the "extra" money coming from? The OP's issue likely stems from poor systems and management giving away too much money. Incredible.

What's really scary to me is how quickly people put a negative spin on things.  This is not the only negative response I've had when I shared this information.

You see it as, hey great customer service. I see it as a system that is poorly automated, and fraught with human error. They make enough money that they don't sweat the small stuff, and that is cool and all, but I am always wondering if it will come to light that their errors mean that they do not actually have as much in the way of bitcoins or cash to meet the balances in their accounts.

Things I have seen
* The major hack which they "rolled back." How much they lost is unknown.
* Large pools of money they shift around between single addresses (suggesting to me a human activity rather than an automated bitcoin management system)
* The time they sent a large sum of bitcoins into oblivion (I forget how much)
* These errors where people are credited extra

Maybe they make enough profit per transactions that money slipping through the cracks is no big deal, but if they don't a run on the bank is a possibility.

Maybe, maybe not.  Why not give them the benefit of the doubt?  I don't see any reason to badmouth them or spread fear about them when there isn't any proof to back up what you are saying...  It seems overly paranoid and over the top, in my opinion.

I suppose you are right. It is just one consideration people should have when dealing with an exchange.

I simply am listing the issues that have come up on the board, and note that if the errors outstrip their profits than their balance sheet will not line up, hence the possibility of a run.

@plogank was wondering how this could be spun negatively. If I saw my bank making mistakes that made it lose money, I would pull my money out, especially if it wasn't backed by something like FDIC protection.

I don't know if I would call this bad mouthing. I am just voicing a concern that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere else. Really I think that mtgox does quite well for itself with all of the volume, and most likely it's profits make for a balanced budget. But I also wouldn't be surprised if I was wrong in this assumption.

In other words: I reserve the right at some unknown (maybe non-existant) date to say "I told you so."

I have the benefit of never being able to be proved wrong

Yeah, I hear what you're saying.  I guess I just feel like *most* people would operate a company in a reasonable, sustainable way.  I feel like MtGox has been around long enough that they have proven they aren't a group of scammers.  And if that is the case, they receive no benefit from running their company into the ground by using more money than they are gaining.  They receive much more benefit from continuing their operations as-is ($2000-$5000/day) than they would from stealing everyone's funds without reporting it and turning into some sort of fractional-reserve that will eventually go bust.

[RandyFolds]

They receive much more benefit from continuing their operations as-is ($2000-$5000/day) than they would from stealing everyone's funds without reporting it and turning into some sort of fractional-reserve that will eventually go bust.

I'd like to see the bookkeeping on that one. Fractional reserve banking is all sorts of profitable, and the problems it causes are those that we are already seeing; unexplained delays, account funding problems, etc.

They already have huge incentive to manipulate the market. There is absolutely no transparency. If they add their 'advanced trading' in, they will indeed be busting out the fractional reserve.

[PrintCoins]

Yeah, I hear what you're saying.  I guess I just feel like *most* people would operate a company in a reasonable, sustainable way.  I feel like MtGox has been around long enough that they have proven they aren't a group of scammers.  And if that is the case, they receive no benefit from running their company into the ground by using more money than they are gaining.  They receive much more benefit from continuing their operations as-is ($2000-$5000/day) than they would from stealing everyone's funds without reporting it and turning into some sort of fractional-reserve that will eventually go bust.

Let's say you have about 1,000,000 bitcoins in your exchange, but 10,000 are lost due to operational mistakes. Your accounts still say they have 1,000,000 bitcoins. Who do you update for a loss? Do you update their losses? Do you subtract it from your profits? Do you just say, well it isn't like everyone is going to pull out 1,000,000 BTC in one day anyway. Lets just leave it float. No point in rocking the boat for a problem that isn't likely to ever get noticed.

What about if you lost 10% of the bitcoins in one day from a hack. Do you eat it, or just say... well no point in rocking the boat. Who will notice. It isn't like anyone is going to pull out 900K in btc in one day.

This isn't exactly scamming. This is not exactly stealing. The bitcoins in the DB still exist, they just don't happen to be backed by real bitcoins anymore, and we can make up the losses eventually.

And if you want to go to the dark side... (not saying they are)
---
Why not just take out a loan for 200K in btc, and upgrade all of the servers and support staff so the whole operation runs at top notch speed. They can just make back the money and then some from all the happy customers. With all this skilled talent, think of our savings in preventing mistakes. ...
---

The thing is, they could also be completely transparent and show that they are on the up and up. A full disclosure of all of their bitcoin addresses, along with a list of all balances in their accounts would help. The accounts could just display a code with the balance, and users could verify that the code in their account matches the db record and the same balance. It wouldn't be perfect, but it would at least make it an effort to cheat.

[altuin]

They do not lose anything from the 200 $. They just earn more on transaction fees. After all, to them it's just a number that can be changed. If they let you buy 200$ of BTC, they do not lose anything. They actually gain 2x more.