The most legit 21st century robbery

[SatoPrincess]

Why keep stolen funds in your pockets? It's like seizing cocaine or illegal guns and then keeping them for your use. What then is the difference between you, the so-called law enforcer, and the criminals?

But isn’t that what governments always do? They confiscate drug money, and use it for their own purposes. They don’t burn the cash just because they know it’s from cartels neither do they channel the funds back into the communities that are mostly affected by drug use. It’s not surprising that the US government applies the same principle when it comes to seized bitcoin.

[CryptoYar]

[...]

This situation shows danger of middle man mixers because these are similar to traps that let police grab money, which makes much of people turn to self run tools that cannot be controlled by anyone. In addition to taking equipment, government is now allowed to clean Bitcoin that it takes by selling it publicly, and calling any coins held by normal people as blocked in case they ever touched mixer. This forms scary system in which there is difference between clean and dirty Bitcoin, with law enforcement having huge powers to decide who is allowed to actually use their digital wealth.

[Luke3bird]

This situation shows danger of middle man mixers because these are similar to traps that let police grab money, which makes much of people turn to self run tools that cannot be controlled by anyone. In addition to taking equipment, government is now allowed to clean Bitcoin that it takes by selling it publicly, and calling any coins held by normal people as blocked in case they ever touched mixer. This forms scary system in which there is difference between clean and dirty Bitcoin, with law enforcement having huge powers to decide who is allowed to actually use their digital wealth.

People can use open source and non custodial wallets with change addresses, coin control, and Coinjoin for their transactions with good privacy. They don't have only option with middle man mixers and by controlling what they're doing, they avoid risk of losing bitcoins by any legal accident with mixers.

After CoinJoin transactions, they must manage using their outputs properly.
Bitcoin Q&A: Blacklists, Taint, and Wallet Fingerprinting.

[demonica]

It's not something surprising actually... I understand that it felt that way cause the money wont get returned to its owner. And of course, we know that would be a hard thing to do as well. But this aint just happening with crypto assets they seized. It happens on other things they also get from something illegal.

Same with other seized money from illegal activities like gambling, drugs, or even from criminals who got caught, the money they collected ends up on their possession. Probably in their own pockets... I don't know... Cause you can't even trust the government officials anymore. They can say that the funds goes to the national treasury of government budget, but can we really sure about that? Or if it is really being used properly? Sometimes the government is just like a bigger criminal but the only different is they can claim it's legal as they are the "government".

[AbuBhakar]

It's not something surprising actually... I understand that it felt that way cause the money wont get returned to its owner. And of course, we know that would be a hard thing to do as well. But this aint just happening with crypto assets they seized. It happens on other things they also get from something illegal.

Same with other seized money from illegal activities like gambling, drugs, or even from criminals who got caught, the money they collected ends up on their possession. Probably in their own pockets... I don't know... Cause you can't even trust the government officials anymore. They can say that the funds goes to the national treasury of government budget, but can we really sure about that? Or if it is really being used properly? Sometimes the government is just like a bigger criminal but the only different is they can claim it's legal as they are the "government".

They will not announce the wallet that they confiscated that amount of money, so they can reduce or increase what they have got since it was confiscated and came from illegal sources. It is easier for them to hide it, because no one will come after the money. They can say that this is the only amount they got, but the truth is that they saved more than that for themselves. And it is true what you said that happens even with small amounts and small people, so the loss is bigger the higher the position, especially since the money does not come from legal sources.

[goldkingcoiner]

This is not justice, not even close.



They seized stolen funds successfully, not just this one but many.
No bad actors gotten arrested and sentenced.
The real holders don't get the funds back.

Tell me how this is not a robbing method in a robinhood outfits by these governments.

Not your keys not your coins.

The real robbery is happening everyday to those who depend on the fiat monetary system.

This is just another proof of how corrupt they are willing to go when it comes to money. And when it comes to money, it seems justice takes second place. Maybe even third place.

[Zlantann]

It's a mixer, it will be hard to trace the rightful owner unless they can actually trace the funds to an entity, to another entity, and so on before it eventually reaches the rightful owner. That depends on how the owner lost his coins, btw. How many wallets will they start tracing just to give the rightful owner back their funds? It's quite a lot. Not saying they can't do it, but it's a mixer at the same time.

What I would have thought is putting it into aid and help programmes. There are lots of camps, homeless, less privileged, and displaced people who would actually need it.

The benchmark for getting back the seized funds should have been the victims abilty to prove that they lost money in a project. There are still means to trace the owners of funds in mixers if the governemnt is sincere. The issue is that their main target is to seize and own the asset. It took many years for those who lost money in Mt Gox to get back what they lost.

Giving these funds to charity is not justified when the victims are still around. When you hear the government say they are fighting money laundering and terrorist financing, just know that they are out to forcefully take people's funds. Money that was seized from a politician in my country was brought back after thirty years when the value has depreciated and they have profited from it massively.  

[Agathamay]

Why surprised? when the US first began bitcoin support through trump did they ever make plans of buying? of course not they only when ahead to hold the seized funds of people where scam related or mixer related frozen cryptos, so if they forfeit now it's not a new step you don't own anything in the US as long as you have them in a centralised system where they can seize it, so decentralisation and privacy beats them over this that's why they hate privacy coins or whatever that has to do with it.

Exactly one of the major reasons why the government is fighting privacy and decentralization so they can monitor and act whenever they want and these should also remind us to take our privacy and decentralization very serious because this time, we're not just running away from criminals and scammers but also running away from the government.
The government over the time has never openly displayed how they spend recovered funds just like the case with abacha loots in Nigeria.

[Cryptomultiplier]

It's a mixer, it will be hard to trace the rightful owner unless they can actually trace the funds to an entity, to another entity, and so on before it eventually reaches the rightful owner. That depends on how the owner lost his coins, btw. How many wallets will they start tracing just to give the rightful owner back their funds? It's quite a lot. Not saying they can't do it, but it's a mixer at the same time.

What I would have thought is putting it into aid and help programmes. There are lots of camps, homeless, less privileged, and displaced people who would actually need it.

The benchmark for getting back the seized funds should have been the victims abilty to prove that they lost money in a project. There are still means to trace the owners of funds in mixers if the governemnt is sincere. The issue is that their main target is to seize and own the asset. It took many years for those who lost money in Mt Gox to get back what they lost.

Giving these funds to charity is not justified when the victims are still around. When you hear the government say they are fighting money laundering and terrorist financing, just know that they are out to forcefully take people's funds. Money that was seized from a politician in my country was brought back after thirty years when the value has depreciated and they have profited from it massively.  

Larry Harmon in the person known as Helix bagged a 3year sentence for this case and all sites involved has been seized along with the funds worth a lot that was discovered in it.
This is one reason the U.S granted the launch of a Bitcoin reserve bank to amass enough under the guise of certain laws that has been set in place to regulate, monitor and control cryptocurrency users and the systems involved. I don't know what to say about this, but they would claim it is all to fight terrorism a d hamper growth of money laundering by ghost individuals who can cause chaos at any time.

[finaleshot2016]

I'm not surprised with the current admin, I think everything in that country is getting worse, a lot of issues happening recently so of course a crypto-related, they will not do anything good about it. Imagine how much money did the current admin make by hyping crypto, they even make their "own" token but turns out to be a rugpull, they broke the crypto culture and it's getting worse nowadays. They're just using it because we all know that those front acts have hidden agendas and it's not really going well, the global market is down, and this kind of news aren't surprising, it's a daylight robbery.

[Ivystar5]

Why surprised? when the US first began bitcoin support through trump did they ever make plans of buying? of course not they only when ahead to hold the seized funds of people where scam related or mixer related frozen cryptos, so if they forfeit now it's not a new step you don't own anything in the US as long as you have them in a centralised system where they can seize it, so decentralisation and privacy beats them over this that's why they hate privacy coins or whatever that has to do with it.

Exactly one of the major reasons why the government is fighting privacy and decentralization so they can monitor and act whenever they want and these should also remind us to take our privacy and decentralization very serious because this time, we're not just running away from criminals and scammers but also running away from the government.
The government over the time has never openly displayed how they spend recovered funds just like the case with abacha loots in Nigeria.

One thing we most know is that government are not for us they are for what they represent so at some point when they start showering Ng their true identity or what they stand for we should be surprised which is one I advocate privacy more and decentralisation and always shout it out every time that no government likes bitcoin in terms of what it stands for or whatever it represents instead they are all in for the money or the speculative part of bitcoin which is the rise and diping of bitcoin which they leverage for higher profits and sometimes manipulate to their desires.

[serjent05]

We ain't safe in the hands of the government. If the government can seize assets from criminals without disbursing them back to the victims, it shows that one day, our assets can be seized too without any proper accountability. When the victims heard that the government  had successfully retrieved their stolen assets, they must have jumped in excitement thinking that they will be refunded, only to be met with the shock that their assets have been absorbed into government funds. We keep getting reasons why the government shouldn't getting involved in Bitcoin matters

Are we not used to this? When a normal citizen seizes something that is not theirs, it's theft or robbery, but when the government seizes things that are not theirs, it is a service for the people.  

So the US government is true to their word of creating a Bitcoin reserve by not buying them but from the confiscated Bitcoin fund.  What a brilliant idea!  

Exactly one of the major reasons why the government is fighting privacy and decentralization so they can monitor and act whenever they want and these should also remind us to take our privacy and decentralization very serious because this time, we're not just running away from criminals and scammers but also running away from the government.
The government over the time has never openly displayed how they spend recovered funds just like the case with abacha loots in Nigeria.

The government wanted control so it is not news that they hate decentralization and transparency.  They wanted to keep the citizens in the dark because they knew that controlled information was one key factor in keeping citizens in check.

[SeriouslyGiveaway]

Are we not used to this? When a normal citizen seizes something that is not theirs, it's theft or robbery, but when the government seizes things that are not theirs, it is a service for the people.  

So the US government is true to their word of creating a Bitcoin reserve by not buying them but from the confiscated Bitcoin fund.  What a brilliant idea!  

It's clearly and simply unfair and not right legallly too. Governments only can say like that if after seizures, they will use these seized money as distributions to all of their eligible citizens like a massive wealthfare distribution nationally.

In fact, it's well known that after seizures by any reasons, governments hold those seized funds and their citizens have no benefit from such governmental thefts. That's hard to argue with governments but only shows purposes of governments on seizing funds, it's for their benefit, not for citizen benefit.

The government wanted control so it is not news that they hate decentralization and transparency.  They wanted to keep the citizens in the dark because they knew that controlled information was one key factor in keeping citizens in check.

They want to control citizens with their national centralized governmental system and they can somewhat achieve that with altcoin blockchains. They only can not achieve that purpose with any attempts on Bitcoin blockchain which is truly decentralized and censorship-resistant.

Bitcoin is the only blockchain that is secure enough, decentralized enough, and has enough long history as well as strength to survive in the future in next bear markets, global financial crisis or geopolitical crisis.

[m2017]

That's what governments always do. "Hey, that's wrong! Give it to me." And then it's theirs. "Hey, that's dirty money! I've got to seize it!" And then they're keeping it. If it's money they label dirty, it shouldn't be in the hands of anybody else but theirs.

And you're waiting for governments to start buying bitcoin. You're making me laugh. As I've said many times before, they don't need to buy it, because they'll take it by force and for free. At first, the hunt is for the "big fish", but later, the "small fish" will get their turn. So, talk more about your bitcoin holdings and show who you are with your KYCs on centralized exchanges.

They can do whatever they want with dirty Bitcoin. They can use it as a reserve asset. They can even auction it off back to the public. Doesn't it reek with double standard?

That's right.

If somebody who's not a criminal or involved in any illegal transaction is keeping what's labeled as dirty coins, the coins will be confiscated. But the owner could have them back if he's buying it from the very government that seized them for being dirty. Isn't that a joke?

No, it's not funny. Those are the rules of the game. Get used to it. The "strongest" one dictates the rules and ensures they are followed.

Tell me how this is not a robbing method in a robinhood outfits by these governments.

This is just robbery, but there is nothing "noble" about it like Robin Hood - the "sheriff" will take all the money taken from Robin Hood.

How about this: one guy (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Zhong) withdrew bitcoins (over 50,000) from "silk road" (the so-called villains) using the "magic" of 2nd click, after which the government confiscated his bitcoins?

By law, these bitcoins should have been returned to their owners, right?

[nemesis_incarnate]

I'm not surprised with the current admin, I think everything in that country is getting worse, a lot of issues happening recently so of course a crypto-related, they will not do anything good about it. Imagine how much money did the current admin make by hyping crypto, they even make their "own" token but turns out to be a rugpull, they broke the crypto culture and it's getting worse nowadays. They're just using it because we all know that those front acts have hidden agendas and it's not really going well, the global market is down, and this kind of news aren't surprising, it's a daylight robbery.

Crypto is just a new field to them to toy around.

The field with good profits with almost no risks for them, i tell you, but for the people - there are lots of them

[arhipova]

The thread reminds me why I need to have good connections with right people and lot of power.

[betswift]

The thread reminds me why I need to have good connections with right people and lot of power.

You won't get such connections without being influential yourself first.

[Reatim]

Why keep stolen funds in your pockets? It's like seizing cocaine or illegal guns and then keeping them for your use. What then is the difference between you, the so-called law enforcer, and the criminals?

But isn’t that what governments always do? They confiscate drug money, and use it for their own purposes. They don’t burn the cash just because they know it’s from cartels neither do they channel the funds back into the communities that are mostly affected by drug use. It’s not surprising that the US government applies the same principle when it comes to seized bitcoin.

the problem arises if officials seize bitcoin just for personal uses. there might be questions of whether they’re actually seizing bitcoin under the law or are they being too strict for the sake of getting a hold of more bitcoin

[Ronsbit]

You should not be surprised, as this is always their tactic to accumulate their national reserve and treasury. Have you ever seen or heard where they bought crypto assets with their money? They believe in seizure of assets in the disguise of fraud and scams and hacks with the law backing them to do their dirty deed so that nobody would point accusatory fingers against them, and that's all, and there is nothing anybody can do about it.

[Ryu_Ar1]

Why keep stolen funds in your pockets? It's like seizing cocaine or illegal guns and then keeping them for your use. What then is the difference between you, the so-called law enforcer, and the criminals?

Let's not forget that even though the law always sees justice but in this case what kind of justice do they determine and when it comes to governments including the US which has a myriad of reasons to control (not only the country but also the world) then even what we consider unfair will look quite fair because it is determined like that where the powerful always have the highest law and it cannot be changed by anyone.

So in this case we can only look and smile at what is happening because what is declared as justice in the end is only a condition where we are only led to say that it is fair even though everything has been arranged in such a way as to benefit the rulers.
I will not say that those who justify all means including stealing in bitcoin are right but sometimes treatments such as those carried out by the government to confiscate and store as a form of state assets from criminals are also not too justified.