Winna took my referrals 12k in winnings for counting cards when he just sat

[Tylerdurden6091]

What happened::
My buddy literally pick out a table that he thought he could win on and did 2 5k bets. Gets call out from Alexis that the provider said he was counting cards. How when he just sat down?

Scammers Profile Link:
https://winna.com/

Reference Link:
see pictures for proof.

Amount Scammed: 12000
Payment Method: USDC
Proof of Payment:
Like his deposit wasnt that high but i included pics.

PM/Chat Logs: https://imgur.com/a/m3dOcPv

Additional Notes: Heres his stats

I have deposited a total of $48,100.96 since I started Winna.
I have withdrawn a total of $36,564.22
I have withdrawn a total of $24,548.45 before today,

This means that even with this withdrawal, I have a net loss of a total of $11,536.74

[noviesol]

Just to be clear it is practically impossible to count cards on Evolution Baccarat. Also, playing 2 hands is just high volatilty U got lucky.

This is indeed a sketchy case and I'm curious what Winna's representative has to say about this. Because this is the second ''card counting'' case I have seen on the Accusations thread.

Did u contact a VIP host? Also, u speaking for your refferral right?

[AHOYBRAUSE]

Well as noviesol already stated, it's as good as impossible to count cards online since they mostly operate with a small amount deck shoe, much less than a normal one in a casino.
The problem here is, most likely the problem doesn't lie with the casino, but with the game provider since they flagged the player and not the site.
They are also the ones withholding the funds.

But let me repeat, accusing the player of card counting is ridiculous! If it was so easy and profitable then everybody would do it. Since it isn't, nobody is doing it. I hope winna will come to the same conclusion here!

[Cointxz]

Just to be clear it is practically impossible to count cards on Evolution Baccarat. Also, playing 2 hands is just high volatilty U got lucky.

This is indeed a sketchy case and I'm curious what Winna's representative has to say about this. Because this is the second ''card counting'' case I have seen on the Accusations thread.

Did u contact a VIP host? Also, u speaking for your refferral right?

I agree that Evolution card games is almost impossible to card count because they shuffle the deck on the middle which means you can’t have an accurate account.

I’m confused about having 2 hands since this is Baccarat not Blackjack. Does the OP mean betting on Banker and Player at the same time?

Card counting on Baccarat can reduce the house edge to the bare minimum but I don’t how it can possibly done on evo.

[noviesol]

Just to be clear it is practically impossible to count cards on Evolution Baccarat. Also, playing 2 hands is just high volatilty U got lucky.

This is indeed a sketchy case and I'm curious what Winna's representative has to say about this. Because this is the second ''card counting'' case I have seen on the Accusations thread.

Did u contact a VIP host? Also, u speaking for your refferral right?

I agree that Evolution card games is almost impossible to card count because they shuffle the deck on the middle which means you can’t have an accurate account.

I’m confused about having 2 hands since this is Baccarat not Blackjack. Does the OP mean betting on Banker and Player at the same time?

Card counting on Baccarat can reduce the house edge to the bare minimum but I don’t how it can possibly done on evo.

He bet on Player and tied the first hand and bet Player again and won. Nothing out of the ordinairy.

If players could card count on Evolution they would go bankrupt already. What the casino is accusing OP off is nonsense.

[Tylerdurden6091]

yes im speaking for my referral he is to depress to actually speak up. I told him to make an account though and respond to your guys questions. No he betted on just player. That why were all confused about the provider saying he counted cards. Nothing make sense dude.

[psycoticlunatic]

This is me, the guy who lost the 12k.

Winna representation has been horrible. Live support has entirely ghosted me and no response has been given in the past 21 hours since their initial email:

Hi there,
​
thank you for reaching out!

We received an official notice from our supplier, confirming that your account has been engaged in card counting activity, which is strictly prohibited under both our Terms of Service and the supplier’s Terms and Conditions.

In accordance with our Terms of Service, the affected winnings have been voided and will not be paid out.
​
Thank you for your understanding.
​
Best wishes,
Winna Team

Alexis

Winna

I don't get it. I've done research on card counters, and a person who has lost as much as me does not hit any of the profiles of a card counter. I'm just a high stakes gambler as I'm sure they can see based on my dice gameplay.

[Zwei]

OP, you sould send a PM to bennettwinna with this thread link and ask him to respond.

This is indeed a sketchy case and I'm curious what Winna's representative has to say about this. Because this is the second ''card counting'' case I have seen on the Accusations thread.

i agree. from all the years i been checking the scam accusations board, this would be the second case i see, and both are from winna accusing a player of card counting, which is honestly beyond ridiculous knowing how stupid that is. and we all saw how they handled the other case, so i doubt this one is going to be any different.

[Tylerdurden6091]

i dm him a link to this like u said and ask for a response

[Tylerdurden6091]

well bennet dm me back asking what is my winna name? did he not even bother to read all this to know im not the one effected?

[Tylerdurden6091]

i wasn't asking i was telling all the update on the situation. i gladly gave up the information when he ask

[bennettwinna]

Hello,

We have reviewed your case and would like to clarify the following:

Your account was not involved in card counting activity. The restriction applied for this reason was due to an internal communication error by one of our Support Agents.

However, the account was involved in opposite betting. We were informed of this by the game provider, and as this activity violates our Terms of Service, the account has been locked and any winnings resulting from fraudulent activity have been confiscated.

The account will remain locked and has now been permanently closed.
This decision is final.

[noviesol]

Hello,

We have reviewed your case and would like to clarify the following:

Your account was not involved in card counting activity. The restriction applied for this reason was due to an internal communication error by one of our Support Agents.

However, the account was involved in opposite betting. We were informed of this by the game provider, and as this activity violates our Terms of Service, the account has been locked and any winnings resulting from fraudulent activity have been confiscated.

The account will remain locked and has now been permanently closed.
This decision is final.

What is opposite betting? Please explain how opposite betting would benefit a player? Baccarat has a standard commision of 5% when Banker wins or no commision but you get paid half when Banker wins with a 6. When OP bets on both Player and Banker he is destined to lose money since there is no case where he would profit.  I also think the game provider won't inform you about a player betting on both player/banker baccarat since he only loses money by commision or by banker winning with 6.

I think u are refering to of your ToS:

10.3 Examples of abuse include betting on all roulette outcomes simultaneously, using low-risk strategies, or claiming multiple bonuses fraudulently.

So everyone playing with a low-risk strategy has the risk to get their winnings confiscated and account locked?

The only reason I can think about would do this is a player trying to generate wagered volume to unlock bonusses or level up account. However, that should not be marked as abuse because even with low-risk strategies u are losing playing negative EV strategy. There is no 0% edge strategy on the casino.

[psycoticlunatic]

Hello,

We have reviewed your case and would like to clarify the following:

Your account was not involved in card counting activity. The restriction applied for this reason was due to an internal communication error by one of our Support Agents.

However, the account was involved in opposite betting. We were informed of this by the game provider, and as this activity violates our Terms of Service, the account has been locked and any winnings resulting from fraudulent activity have been confiscated.

The account will remain locked and has now been permanently closed.
This decision is final.

I would firstly like to reprimand the professionalism in the way Winna has handled this case. This is beyond a doubt unreasonable to communicate like this, where I have never received an email in the first place.

Secondly, what even is opposite betting?

Thirdly, this is very much scam behavior done by your casino. I have done nothing wrong, lost a lot of cash on dice to your casino, and you reward your loyal customers by ridiculous accusations and negating winnings and closing accounts with 12,000 in a pending withdrawal. This is clearly scam behavior and I'll be sure to file a complaint today with the gambling commissioner to address my complaints. I mean, why wouldn't a casino be greedy if they can get away with it?

[AHOYBRAUSE]

Hello,

We have reviewed your case and would like to clarify the following:

Your account was not involved in card counting activity. The restriction applied for this reason was due to an internal communication error by one of our Support Agents.

However, the account was involved in opposite betting. We were informed of this by the game provider, and as this activity violates our Terms of Service, the account has been locked and any winnings resulting from fraudulent activity have been confiscated.

The account will remain locked and has now been permanently closed.
This decision is final.

To be perfectly fair here, isn't a player that would perform "opposite betting" the dream of every casino? All games have house edge and if someone would do this he could only lose using this "strategy". There would be nothing to gain from it since over time the house edge would eat up the bankroll. What am I not getting here? There must be a better explanation surely.

Also, how do you go from "card counting" to "opposite betting". Those 2 things are VERY different and a simple miscommunication doesn't really sound reasonable.
Don't get me wrong, not picking any side here, but a little bit transparency would definitely help people understand your reasoning in this case.

[rohang]

Hello,

We have reviewed your case and would like to clarify the following:

Your account was not involved in card counting activity. The restriction applied for this reason was due to an internal communication error by one of our Support Agents.

However, the account was involved in opposite betting. We were informed of this by the game provider, and as this activity violates our Terms of Service, the account has been locked and any winnings resulting from fraudulent activity have been confiscated.

The account will remain locked and has now been permanently closed.
This decision is final.

what a clown show your site is,


You hold 12k of someone's winnings without even telling then what the real reason is,
And now its 'opposite betting'
stg these sites think we players are dumb gullible and they can do whatever they want. Opposite betting on baccarat is not banned by any major crypto site, inface like others said its a win win scenario for the book. you need to find another reason to take this guys money lol