[NEWS]NewYork Suing Valve for for promoting "illegal gambling" Inside their game

[uneng]

Yes, it's a form of gambling. However, to ban it just mean the state is removing the responsability from parents' shoulders, who should be more attentive to their children's routine on the internet. If children are having access to considerable amounts of money to purchase lootboxes, there is something wrong going on with the families' dynamics.

Gambling has always existed, just like every other kinds of activities which can also trigger addiction. But why everything nowadays is much more harmful than it was to previous generations? Why can't this current generation learn how to deal with things just like the previous ones did?

[Julien_Olynpic]

Loot boxes are essentially very similar to gambling, the only difference being that loot boxes typically don't contain real money, but rather in-game items of uncertain value, uncertain legal status, and often very low liquidity. Furthermore, loot boxes are often not purchased but rather received as a reward for, for example, completing a certain level in a game. In all other respects, loot boxes are not much different from gambling. For example, lotteries, especially scratch-off lotteries (instant lotteries), are very similar to loot boxes.

[ZeroVinsonN]

I don’t consider it as gambling since the rewards is an in-game item which just happened to have a value set by the players who is willing to pay for that item due to its rarity.

This is same when buying pokemon cards booster park which collectors doesn’t know what inside and can sell rare cards in the open market.

If lootboxes categorize already as gambling then all gatcha type game that has real fiat value will fall to that same category.

How familiar are you with cs2 lootboxes? Do you know that these in-game weapon skins can be traded for real money directly on steam platform. Then you can use those money to buy other games serial key as a gift, and trade it outside steam platform. I have seen sites where you can bet your skins on wheel against other user skins. The mechanics that you first need to buy cs2 weapon case, then a key to it, then run wheel to get random skin - isnt that gambling? Money = check, fact of random prize = check, spinning wheel = check.

People think that because it's happening inside a game it doesn't qualify as gambling but the truth is that alot of games contain one form of gambling or the other, it's regrettable that these things are exposed to children early but it's usually not a problem since some of them are very well hidden but others don't even try to hand it or at least make it look less like gambling, infact they are heavily promoted, it's only a matter of time before people want those same things outside the game and they can only get it from casinos.

[maydna]

~snip~

We have been seeing different cases where kids are involving themselves in gambling without the awareness of their parents which is something no one can stop because they have full access to the internet which is not regulated.
There are so many areas the government need to work on not accusing innocent casinos for allowing children to use their platforms to gamble when there is no exact manner this can be done to prevent their actions.

Lack of parents control makes children accessing many things that they want including porn and gambling. Parents thinks that they gives the devices and access to their children and that is enough but that is not enough because their children needs guidance from adult people to use the devices.

We also see juvenile delinquency happens in many places because they access something. While casinos are just a place to have fun and allow people to visit and gambling but the control must come from individual.

[X-ray]

It seems Valve is still being harsh with their lootboxes according from their latest statement. I know it's their business, but it's basically a gambling. Someone betting on the boxes to get a rare skin that can be sold for more money. When he fails he got a skin that has no value.

So it's just another form of gambling. There is a player, intermediary and monetary value player get when winning it. If Valve thinks it's not form of gambling, they can sell their skin directly instead of putting it in their lootboxes. 

It's time for them to exclude NY from being able to buy their lootboxes.

[freedomgo]

It seems Valve is still being harsh with their lootboxes according from their latest statement. I know it's their business, but it's basically a gambling. Someone betting on the boxes to get a rare skin that can be sold for more money. When he fails he got a skin that has no value.

So it's just another form of gambling. There is a player, intermediary and monetary value player get when winning it. If Valve thinks it's not form of gambling, they can sell their skin directly instead of putting it in their lootboxes. 

Of course it is gambling since they are a gambling site, but as the title says, they are being accused of promoting illegal gambling through loot boxes.

I do not know if there is a special registration or license required for that, but we know how strict the policies are in this state. They should comply with the requirements first before offering it. Or maybe they will just reach an agreement and pay a penalty, since it has already become a lawsuit.

It's time for them to exclude NY from being able to buy their lootboxes.

That's likely the next action, but they will have to face the lawsuit at the same time.

[junder]

Lack of parents control makes children accessing many things that they want including porn and gambling. Parents thinks that they gives the devices and access to their children and that is enough but that is not enough because their children needs guidance from adult people to use the devices.

We also see juvenile delinquency happens in many places because they access something. While casinos are just a place to have fun and allow people to visit and gambling but the control must come from individual.

With the current situation in my opinion it is a lot of parents who have given freedom to their children so that this opens up opportunities for children to access anything including gambling or pornography as you say, it is very rare for now there are parents who are very strict about giving their children mobile phone access, even with those who are still toddlers sometimes given a mobile phone when he is fussy by giving him a mobile phone and showing a cartoon animation video the goal is to make the child silent by watching animated videos or playing a mobile phone.

[Zadicar]

Lack of parents control makes children accessing many things that they want including porn and gambling. Parents thinks that they gives the devices and access to their children and that is enough but that is not enough because their children needs guidance from adult people to use the devices.

We also see juvenile delinquency happens in many places because they access something. While casinos are just a place to have fun and allow people to visit and gambling but the control must come from individual.

With the current situation in my opinion it is a lot of parents who have given freedom to their children so that this opens up opportunities for children to access anything including gambling or pornography as you say, it is very rare for now there are parents who are very strict about giving their children mobile phone access, even with those who are still toddlers sometimes given a mobile phone when he is fussy by giving him a mobile phone and showing a cartoon animation video the goal is to make the child silent by watching animated videos or playing a mobile phone.

We cant really be able to deny that technology does really give out that big convenience in our lives but it is also having the cons when it is that being used excessively or not in the proper way on which it will really be leading into the exposure into things on which not supposed to be seen by youngsters. We do know that once you do have the gadget and connected to internet then there's always the chance that they would really be that exposed into different thing on which including gambling and pornography on which it could disrupt out and influence these young minds on which it would be molded into some serious problem later on. Now going back about these gambling related inside a game then its not new anymore and it could really happen.

[Questat]

With the current situation in my opinion it is a lot of parents who have given freedom to their children so that this opens up opportunities for children to access anything including gambling or pornography as you say, it is very rare for now there are parents who are very strict about giving their children mobile phone access, even with those who are still toddlers sometimes given a mobile phone when he is fussy by giving him a mobile phone and showing a cartoon animation video the goal is to make the child silent by watching animated videos or playing a mobile phone.

But to access gambling sites, they will not be able to play without creating an account, unless it is only demo play. So that is another layer of security to make sure minors cannot get in. That is where KYC is created for. If a casino is strict with that, then minors should not be able to play.

So it is not right to fully blame the parents for lack of monitoring. Casinos also have responsibilities, especially when it comes to verifying the age and identity of their users.
 

[SirLancelot]

I thought it was legit illegal gambling at first ( you know, casinos ) but only to find out that it was just these lootboxes. But I think yeah OP, they are a form of gambling but I don't think so that they are illegal. New York right there is only OA, and maybe there are other reasons for the hate for Valve? Because if we think about it, these lootboxes do also exist on so many games now. So what about them?

Although like you, I also heard concerns about them but yet, their operations are still active. Not only about lootboxes though but also to the game as whole, especially on the Philippines country now where Roblox is said to be linked for the recent mass shooting in schools, lol.

[acroman08]

I thought it was legit illegal gambling at first ( you know, casinos ) but only to find out that it was just these lootboxes. But I think yeah OP, they are a form of gambling but I don't think so that they are illegal. New York right there is only OA, and maybe there are other reasons for the hate for Valve? Because if we think about it, these lootboxes do also exist on so many games now. So what about them?

Although like you, I also heard concerns about them but yet, their operations are still active. Not only about lootboxes though but also to the game as whole, especially on the Philippines country now where Roblox is said to be linked for the recent mass shooting in schools, lol.

From what I understand, one of the core reasons for the lawsuit is that the items in the loot boxes can be sold in exchange for money, which New York deemed to be gambling. What I said is very simplified, so if you want more detail, I suggest reading the article on the update I posted, New York explained there in more detail the core reason as to why they are suing Valve.

[r_victory]

I don't think they can be considered gambling, as they aren't directly linked to a platform dedicated to that activity. However, their features do leave room for such an interpretation; many games have had to stop offering them and reinvent themselves. Here in Brazil, there were even protests from children who play Roblox because age and identity verification started being required for certain features.

[Hispo]

I don't think they can be considered gambling, as they aren't directly linked to a platform dedicated to that activity. However, their features do leave room for such an interpretation; many games have had to stop offering them and reinvent themselves. Here in Brazil, there were even protests from children who play Roblox because age and identity verification started being required for certain features.

Right, but the problem is how similar it is to gambling and how many people can actually get addicted to lootboxes and skins within Counter-Strike. The mechanics require one to invest a starting capital, a few bucks, in order to open a box and claim skins which could be potentially worth thousands of dollars.
I can see why the State of New York are prosecuting Valve, honestly.

Also, there are a lot of people who have their life savings and important part of their net-worth "invested" in these centralized skins, which is dangerous to their personal well-being, as Valve (as a centralized entity) could do what they did in the past and change the supply of skins, wipping out the speculative value of them in the blink of an eye.

[r_victory]

~snip

Yes, I’ve seen cases of parents in despair because their children maxed out their credit cards, spending over $2,000 in a single month on in-game purchases. I realize the scale of the problem that it represents. I just think gambling is a different story and shouldn't be compared to that.

[Hispo]

~snip

Yes, I’ve seen cases of parents in despair because their children maxed out their credit cards, spending over $2,000 in a single month on in-game purchases. I realize the scale of the problem that it represents. I just think gambling is a different story and shouldn't be compared to that.

Well, we can have our own opinion on whether that is gambling or not, in the end the justice of New York will determine that in a fair investigation and even a trial (not sure about it could happen or not).
Beyond on the chances of the law siding against or in favor of Valve, I wonder what would Valve supposed to do if they are found guilty of running a gambling service within their ecosystem.

I doubt they will give up the mountains of money to pocket thanks to their lootboxes, and skins...
I could perfectly see Valve blocking their own game for player from the State of New York, so the rest of the planet can continue to buy lootboxes as usual.

It would be wacky to see all NY players to get excluded in such a manner, don't you think?

[maydna]

~snip~

With the current situation in my opinion it is a lot of parents who have given freedom to their children so that this opens up opportunities for children to access anything including gambling or pornography as you say, it is very rare for now there are parents who are very strict about giving their children mobile phone access, even with those who are still toddlers sometimes given a mobile phone when he is fussy by giving him a mobile phone and showing a cartoon animation video the goal is to make the child silent by watching animated videos or playing a mobile phone.

Parents can giving freedom to their kids but with limitations and monitoring them so they will not access something that can harm them. Parents can activating parenting control in the phone so their can manage the activity well. I see parents giving their children mobile phone especially when they eat so they can feeding his child calmly. That is not good for their psychology because child will thinks that if they eat or fret, they can watching video from the phone. Parents must realize this immediately and they can't let their child accessing phone in their hands without control from parents.

[junder]

We cant really be able to deny that technology does really give out that big convenience in our lives but it is also having the cons when it is that being used excessively or not in the proper way on which it will really be leading into the exposure into things on which not supposed to be seen by youngsters. We do know that once you do have the gadget and connected to internet then there's always the chance that they would really be that exposed into different thing on which including gambling and pornography on which it could disrupt out and influence these young minds on which it would be molded into some serious problem later on. Now going back about these gambling related inside a game then its not new anymore and it could really happen.

That's IT, technology has many benefits but on the other hand, there is also a negative side if it is used excessively and yes there are cases of bad news about children who are addicted to cellphones (technology) to make them reluctant to leave the house or socialize because they are more comfortable staying at home by spending time with the world of technology such as social media.

I'm sure most of today's children who already have full access to using mobile phones know a little bit about online gambling because by using social media they can most likely see gambling ads, not to mention added to the social interaction around which I think there are at least those who like to gamble online.