Negative trust from holydarkness – time to address the real problem

[haircombint]

HD tried his best to ignore you for as long as he could. For years you've followed him around from thread to thread nitpicking about this or that when he owes you no conversation whatsoever.

After this incident I decided it wasn't really worth trying to reason with you as you are too manipulative and hard-headed.

Take a look around for a moment: do you see anyone saying

"Maybe Ratings Place can help me"
"Where is Ratings Place?"
"What is Ratings Place's opinion on this subject?"
"Thank you Ratings Place for your assistance."

HD has taken it upon himself to actually try to resolve outstanding casino issues, and you are just there to stub his toe every step of the way.

Frankly, you're a nuisance. Its your right to be a nuisance but there is no right to be taken seriously.

Are you seriously complaining about him cutting a screenshot in half? You cherry pick my own quotes all the fucking time. Like in this thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5195815.420

[holydarkness]

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about and it's a waste of my time explaining. Unless you find something wrong in the trust that I gave to you or want proof of anything in there, I'm done with you.

Let's start with small baby step: What did I wrote on 27th June 2025? You made a statement that I wrote something that both my post history and bitlist archiver clearly show wasn't there. Is this not word-twisting from your side? No need for many words. Just a yes, admitting you twist words, or a no, and show us that I did wrote what you said I wrote.

[Rating Place]

@oly, this is the only thing that I'll reply too. If you find something wrong or need proof, I'll share it.

Outright liar. Took money from scam sportsbook Betpanda via signature campaign knowing that Betpanda was a scam sportsbook with many scam accusations at the time. Now there's even a flag on Betpanda. Is ruling that sportsbooks have the right to steal our winnings for value betting (good bets). Has even stated in one case that Rollbit was within their rights for for taking deposits and winnings for smart betting. Justifies sportsbooks stealing money by wrongly saying sportsbooks are just middlemen. The Provider is the one taking the money.

[haircombint]

I want to make it clear that my beef with holydarkness starts and ends with his period of shilling the scam casino known as betpanda. While it has soured my opinion of his integrity and due diligence abilities as betpanda has visibly had more scam accusations out of any casino, I wish him a speedy recovery in his medical issues. I was simply invited to contribute my 2 cents on this thread, as was T1HGO. The Nutella Man, however is the true bastard we should be making the thread about.

That motherfucker has accusations of shilling multiple scams, whether it be casinos or scam tokens/coins, accused of selling CP, accused of buying his own account, accused of having alt accounts. He calls legitimate projects such as Haircomb a scam, too.

[holydarkness]

@oly, this is the only thing that I'll reply too. If you find something wrong or need proof, I'll share it.

Outright liar. Took money from scam sportsbook Betpanda via signature campaign knowing that Betpanda was a scam sportsbook with many scam accusations at the time. Now there's even a flag on Betpanda. Is ruling that sportsbooks have the right to steal our winnings for value betting (good bets). Has even stated in one case that Rollbit was within their rights for for taking deposits and winnings for smart betting. Justifies sportsbooks stealing money by wrongly saying sportsbooks are just middlemen. The Provider is the one taking the money.

And in that silence and avoidance to give direct answer, lies our truth. You can't aswer with the yes or the no because you'll incriminate yourself. A concrete proof of of my negative trust, and verdict for this thread.

yahoo62278, my apology if I annoyed you a little with my wall of text. I believe this is where the thread ended: where all who read can interpret themselves what the real problem that need [and has been] addressed here.

I'll revise my feedback to a proper link: this thread, my second to last post on this thread, to show anyone who wonder why I tag Rating Place, and they can read the gigantic wall-of-text of a thread themselves.

[Rating Place]

holy , I should have warned people about you a long time ago. As I said before, I don't bother anyone unless they lie about me. You started this and I'm just telling the truth.

[nutildah]

BetPanda was in full blown scam mode, now there's a flag.

You're way over-exaggerating here, another reason why you're not taken seriously.

In your example you overlooked the fact that Holy actually did what he said he was going to do. A DuckDice rep bothered reaching out because Holy asked. You are not capable of performing such things, and why is that? Because nobody takes you seriously, because you lie and manipulate far too often.

There's a way to do things that results in meaningful change, and then there's a way to do things to attract maximum attention to yourself, and that's how you do things. That's why I can't help but feel you are always advertising yourself in some way.

Taking money knowing that BetPanda was a scam book totally changed my opinion on holy's motives.

Betpanda is following their own terms and conditions so its not a "scam book"... Confiscating winnings on the basis of "value betting" is just a bad business practice. Again, you're not even trying to be reasonable, you're just doing theater on stage. Well, have fun with that.

[haircombint]

Betpanda is following their own terms and conditions so its not a "scam book"... Confiscating winnings on the basis of "value betting" is just a bad business practice. Again, you're not even trying to be reasonable, you're just doing theater on stage. Well, have fun with that.

Like a dog retreating to it's own vomit you return back to your BetPanda shilling. But for what? Your days of profiting from such duplicity are long gone.

[Rating Place]

Betpanda is following their own terms and conditions so its not a "scam book"... Confiscating winnings on the basis of "value betting" is just a bad business practice. Again, you're not even trying to be reasonable, you're just doing theater on stage. Well, have fun with that.

Like a dog retreating to it's own vomit you return back to your BetPanda shilling. But for what? Your days of profiting from such duplicity are long gone.

There may be 5 books in the world that I know of that confiscate money for value betting and holy may be in contact with all 5.

Holy , I haven’t actually checked this to verify. It’s a general statement. I probably have a list of 100 crypto and I’ll verify if you want. I’ll also get a list of fiat books since not 1 confiscates for value betting.

Pay and then limit is the industry standard.

BetPanda was in full blown scam mode, now there's a flag.

You're way over-exaggerating here, another reason why you're not taken seriously.

In your example you overlooked the fact that Holy actually did what he said he was going to do. A DuckDice rep bothered reaching out because Holy asked. You are not capable of performing such things, and why is that? Because nobody takes you seriously, because you lie and manipulate far too often.

There's a way to do things that results in meaningful change, and then there's a way to do things to attract maximum attention to yourself, and that's how you do things. That's why I can't help but feel you are always advertising yourself in some way.

Taking money knowing that BetPanda was a scam book totally changed my opinion on holy's motives.

Betpanda is following their own terms and conditions so its not a "scam book"... Confiscating winnings on the basis of "value betting" is just a bad business practice. Again, you're not even trying to be reasonable, you're just doing theater on stage. Well, have fun with that.

I got the last DuckDice solved in days when holy was gone even though everyone else disagreed with me. Holy wasn’t there to protect DuckDice. Check my thread. The guy thanked me. I PMed DuckDice.

You can’t be serious on the current case. Both Bob and holy lied. You’re great at scam busting. I have no idea how you don’t see this. These reps play holy.p

Nutildah  you have to catch these things before it happens. I downgraded Nitro to D over a year ago. How did you not see this coming with Betpanda? Go read my thread some time. Go check when I gave the Nitro warning. Over a year ago and they were paying then. They starting giving away huge bonuses and I smelled a rat.

I’ll get links of everything I said above later including lies by Bob and Holy.

[nutildah]

You can’t be serious on the current case. Both Bob and holy lied. You’re great at scam busting. I have no idea how you don’t see this. These reps play holy.p

Holy remains the only meaningful bridge on the forum between complainants and casinos. You could do this if you weren't so quick to write off casinos as scammers. That's not how you engage in the art of negotiation. Actual negotiation looks like what Holy is doing.

Nutildah  you have not catch these things before it happens. I downgraded Nitro to D over a year ago. How did you not see this coming with Betpanda?

See what coming? Their policies have been consistent the entire time.

I'm only commenting here to provide balance to your one-sided version of events.

[Rating Place]

You can’t be serious on the current case. Both Bob and holy lied. You’re great at scam busting. I have no idea how you don’t see this. These reps play holy.p

Holy remains the only meaningful bridge on the forum between complainants and casinos. You could do this if you weren't so quick to write off casinos as scammers. That's not how you engage in the art of negotiation. Actual negotiation looks like what Holy is doing.

Nutildah  you have not catch these things before it happens. I downgraded Nitro to D over a year ago. How did you not see this coming with Betpanda?

See what coming? Their policies have been consistent the entire time.

I'm only commenting here to provide balance to your one-sided version of events.

I do it a lot faster. Last one was 3 days. I told you I don't want to step on holy's toes. He was gone so I jumped in. Check the thread. I was the only person that sided with the player. I shot Bob a PM. He didn't reply but then the player got paid.

I'll add slowly to my previous comments. Then I'll go back to see what I saw in Betpanda scam mode.

Hi,

I'm from the community team on DuckDice, and I wanted to update you that we are investigating your case and asking our provider for more information to assess the situation. We will update you via email and here when we have a clearer understanding of the situation. We do have to rely on the expertise of our sports providers, since there are many ways in which sports books can be exploited; however, we do recognise that false positives can occur in rare circumstances, and we do our best to treat every case with fairness. We appreciate your patience whilst we look into it.

Thanks,
Bobstone, Community Head, DuckDice.

Betby's AI Labs division is in charge of risk mitigation and profiling. They do not communicate with the books. It's all AI. Bob is lying about contacting the provider. After Betby sends the flag, it's up to internal investigation to decide.

Holy made a prior post

Based from what other casino explained, both personally and publicly [feel free to browse recent thread on this board, I am not dragging that casino into this equation by mentioning their name], for their own case of thus would safe to assume is not leaning to support DuckDice with your case, rather prove a situation as two casinos share common trait: when Betby investigate bets, they don't explain to the casino what and why and when, they only said "this player, flagged for xxx violation.

Though, IIRC, if casino inquire the case and the case is recent, thus the data is still on betby's system, they can pull more info. I'll nudge someone from DuckDice to either appear here or to try inquire more details to Betby.

It has nothing to do with recent data still on Betby's system. Bob may have told that to holy. Maybe holy isn't lying, he just buys in to whatever they tell him. I had suspicions about Bob in the previous case. He said some things that made no sense.

[nutildah]

I do it a lot faster. Last one was 3 days.

This is what it comes down to: If your reputation could stand on its own two feet you wouldn't need to follow Holy around from thread to thread yapping at him like a forgotten puppy. You seem to be more interested in sabotaging his efforts than actually helping anybody.

I told you I don't want to step on holy's toes.

Yeah I know, you said this already. Except the reason why you have a second negative trust is because of this very problem: you won't stop stepping on holy's toes. Just because you say you're not doing something, it doesn't mean you're not actually doing it. You're just not doing it from your perspective.

[haircombint]

There's no reasoning with the Nutella Man, Rating P. He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster.

[Rating Place]

I do it a lot faster. Last one was 3 days.

This is what it comes down to: If your reputation could stand on its own two feet you wouldn't need to follow Holy around from thread to thread yapping at him like a forgotten puppy. You seem to be more interested in sabotaging his efforts than actually helping anybody.

I told you I don't want to step on holy's toes.

Yeah I know, you said this already. Except the reason why you have a second negative trust is because of this very problem: you won't stop stepping on holy's toes. Just because you say you're not doing something, it doesn't mean you're not actually doing it. You're just not doing it from your perspective.

Just look at the image above. I just don't brag about it. If holy's on it I'm not going try to go over his head. You guys have a good thing going on in scam accusations.

I do it a lot faster. Last one was 3 days.

This is what it comes down to: If your reputation could stand on its own two feet you wouldn't need to follow Holy around from thread to thread yapping at him like a forgotten puppy. You seem to be more interested in sabotaging his efforts than actually helping anybody.

I told you I don't want to step on holy's toes.

Yeah I know, you said this already. Except the reason why you have a second negative trust is because of this very problem: you won't stop stepping on holy's toes. Just because you say you're not doing something, it doesn't mean you're not actually doing it. You're just not doing it from your perspective.

 I only jump in a few cases that should be easy to win. Mostly value betting type. Talk about exaggerating.  haircombin is right. I'm not arguing with you unless you are logical. It's surprising because you are logical scam busting.

Duckdice not paying holy's DuckDice case and it's a tiny amount.

[nutildah]

Just look at the image above. I just don't brag about it.

LOL. I suppose the irony of that statement goes over your head. Cmon man the volume of help requests Holy has dealt with over the years supersedes yours by 10 fold. There is no comparison.

If holy's on it I'm not going try to go over his head. You guys have a good thing going on in scam accusations.

Again you say things that I don't think you actually believe. Will be happy to be proven wrong.

[haircombint]

Again you say things that I don't think you actually believe. Will be happy to be proven wrong.

Men who are happy to be proven wrong don't block other men's bitcointalk accounts when given pushback.

[Rating Place]

When is the last time holy got winnings paid for a sports bettor? He's good with casinos but he's getting eaten up alive by the sportsbook reps. It's as if holy's working for them. Bring the case to scam accusations, holy will say the book doesn't have to pay winnings. The deposit gets returned and we all look like heroes .

It's interesting that a lot of his contacts come from the scam books. They've learned to play him.

holy "as if" . That's not an accusation. All your reps have you believing that books are the middleman. It's nothing against your honesty. It's just that you buy into these things easily.

nutildah - All of holy's reps are from D, F and NR books. They are the value betting crew. There's no need for me to know any of these guys. They are scam books. Scam accusations is filled with D, F and NR.

He doesn't know the others because they aren't in scam accusations.

You can’t be serious on the current case. Both Bob and holy lied. You’re great at scam busting. I have no idea how you don’t see this. These reps play holy.p

Holy remains the only meaningful bridge on the forum between complainants and casinos. You could do this if you weren't so quick to write off casinos as scammers. That's not how you engage in the art of negotiation. Actual negotiation looks like what Holy is doing.

holy is absolutely lost. Most of the time you need one or two questions answered and it's done.  

Go to my thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=717790.0, read the rules and figure out why books would want to talk and cases get settled in a day. The last page shows last two cases https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=717790.4440. As a team we would be even stronger.

Criteria used to rate a book.

1. Security - getting paid is by far most important.

2. Working with the forum. This is a player's thread and books are held responsible for their actions. Questions are asked of books concerning number of employees, time in business, experience, poster problems, etc. If a book is going to ignore a player's thread, they will be severely downgraded. Most books are very easy to work with.

The following cannot be quantified as to importance since being highly detrimental in one category may supersede other criteria used.

Most of the time it's the player scamming, so we can't fight for that. If we are 100% sure the player is right, then pressure will get the job done. One head of scam accusations is not the way to go. It's not holy or I that would be best. We need to be a team. We can't go back and forth for months. Show proof of the accusation and we're done. Put up a thread, make them aware and they will show if there are consequences for not showing.


holy, post 1 reason why negative trust should be up. Just so everyone will read it. Your best one.

If not it's time to add up the money being lost on the middleman scheme being run since 2023. If you keep ruling this way, it will continue. Brilliant move by your reps to get you in to believing it.

“If a sportsbook provider decide to cancel a bet, they pretty much can't do much about it, given they're just a ‘middle man’”

Rollbit case 2023 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5475823.0

fuck them, Rating. Fuck all of them.

3 years of books stealing money. I'll get quotes I made and holy made.

@nutildah - this seems to be why my posting count shot way up in 2023. I was arguing for the player and holy argued for the book.


Long argument between myself and holy. 9 pages showing the disagreements. Holy believes casinos and flags are proof. Forum pressure go the player paid. This is why holy posted negative trust, our disagreements. Proof of all arguments in thread.

ziportan quote

the thing is , holydarkness is prone to believe anything that the casinos say -although they are OBVIOUS lies- than the players claims which are supported by actual evidences.

flexie80 quote

@holydarkness

If you are so much defending the books for consicating for value betting, do you even realize that 99% of the bets that are being placed are pure value bets for the sportsbook itself?

ziiportan quote

ou keep saying that but you are the one that keeps confusing. You keep letting casinos or the casino reps here confuse you all the time. My case also was turned to arb betting by the rep, after he realized that value betting doesn't cause any winnings confiscation by any means.

darwstall

https://imgur.com/a/xwSFR5K

We still won this battle! Thanks to those who helped, thanks to every person who believed in me. We were able to do it.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5545943.0


Holy admits to his bias and gave me negative trust the day after I criticized BetPanda many times

I admit openly that there is a bias in my previous judgment and your question to me made me see in new perspective

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5541685.msg66609998#msg66609998

Ratings Place Quotes

Exact Quotes (in chronological order):

April 11, 2026, 01:08:04 AM (Post #1)
Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5579974.msg66604361#msg66604361
Exact quote:"There is even a current BetPanda case in Scam Accusations that fits this broader pattern... The thread “Betpanda stole my 500 dollars” is currently listed on the Scam Accusations board..."
April 11, 2026, 05:28:59 AM (Post #5)
Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5579974.msg66604662#msg66604662
Exact quote:"I wanted BetPanda to open up the players account so that the player could post his bets. ... By pressuring BetPanda they opened up the players account to view bets."
April 11, 2026, 08:20:00 AM (Post #9)
Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5579974.msg66604940#msg66604940
Exact quote (no direct "Betpanda" in this specific sentence, but contextually tied — this one was borderline and not counted in the 7 if we are strict on spelling).
April 11, 2026, 09:12:40 AM (Post #14)
Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5579974.msg66605056#msg66605056
Exact quote: (no new mention here — just continuing the same discussion)
April 11, 2026, 10:17:28 PM (Post #19)
Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5579974.msg66607435#msg66607435
Exact quote:"Took money from scam sportsbook Betpanda via signature campaign knowing that Betpanda was a scam sportsbook with many scam accusations at the time."
April 11, 2026, 10:32:15 PM (Post #20)
Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5579974.msg66607772#msg66607772
Exact quote:"Holy switched his signature campaign to BetPanda and was protecting BetPanda."
April 11, 2026, 11:05:42 PM (Post #22)
Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5579974.msg66607827#msg66607827
Exact quote:

Holy gave me negative trust the next day.

holydarkness   2026-04-12   Reference   Take this user's statement with heavy consideration and fact check as the user has tendency to butchering words and spin statements into different narrative that meet his agenda. See my post in reference for an instance and read the whole thread [warning, massive wall of text] if you want to learn deeper

Holy admits to his bias and gave me negative trust the day after I criticized BetPanda many times

I admit openly that there is a bias in my previous judgment and your question to me made me see in new perspective

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5541685.msg66609998#msg66609998

Ratings Place Quotes

Exact Quotes (in chronological order):

April 11, 2026, 01:08:04 AM (Post #1)
Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5579974.msg66604361#msg66604361
Exact quote:"There is even a current BetPanda case in Scam Accusations that fits this broader pattern... The thread “Betpanda stole my 500 dollars” is currently listed on the Scam Accusations board..."
April 11, 2026, 05:28:59 AM (Post #5)
Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5579974.msg66604662#msg66604662
Exact quote:"I wanted BetPanda to open up the players account so that the player could post his bets. ... By pressuring BetPanda they opened up the players account to view bets."
April 11, 2026, 08:20:00 AM (Post #9)
Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5579974.msg66604940#msg66604940
Exact quote (no direct "Betpanda" in this specific sentence, but contextually tied — this one was borderline and not counted in the 7 if we are strict on spelling).
April 11, 2026, 09:12:40 AM (Post #14)
Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5579974.msg66605056#msg66605056
Exact quote: (no new mention here — just continuing the same discussion)
April 11, 2026, 10:17:28 PM (Post #19)
Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5579974.msg66607435#msg66607435
Exact quote:"Took money from scam sportsbook Betpanda via signature campaign knowing that Betpanda was a scam sportsbook with many scam accusations at the time."
April 11, 2026, 10:32:15 PM (Post #20)
Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5579974.msg66607772#msg66607772
Exact quote:"Holy switched his signature campaign to BetPanda and was protecting BetPanda."
April 11, 2026, 11:05:42 PM (Post #22)
Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5579974.msg66607827#msg66607827
Exact quote:

Holy gave me negative trust the next day.

holydarkness   2026-04-12   Reference   Take this user's statement with heavy consideration and fact check as the user has tendency to butchering words and spin statements into different narrative that meet his agenda. See my post in reference for an instance and read the whole thread [warning, massive wall of text] if you want to learn deeper

This is outrageous!

There’s more but I’ll wait to see if holy wants to take the trust down.

I can understand holy's friends not wanting to criticize him and that's fine. For the integrity of the trust system, the negative trust should be taken down.

[Shishir99]

I see how desperate you are, Rating Place, to get some attention from holydarkness. I don't think this is going to work anymore since you did not answer his question, but quoted the negative feedback that you have posted on his profile. Who sees that feedback, actually? It's you only. Does that actually affect holydarkness presents on the forum? Absolutely No. So, why would he bother wasting his time answering you again while you have refused to answer his question? Do you have a single established forum member who backs you here in this thread? If so, I would like to see them. Why don't you understand the fact that you are not a player who can play against holydarkness?

[Rating Place]

I see how desperate you are, Rating Place, to get some attention from holydarkness. I don't think this is going to work anymore since you did not answer his question, but quoted the negative feedback that you have posted on his profile. Who sees that feedback, actually? It's you only. Does that actually affect holydarkness presents on the forum? Absolutely No. So, why would he bother wasting his time answering you again while you have refused to answer his question? Do you have a single established forum member who backs you here in this thread? If so, I would like to see them. Why don't you understand the fact that you are not a player who can play against holydarkness?

 what's the question? It's backwards thinking. Holy made an accusation, now prove it.

It's same thinking that's been used for the last 2.5 years. A book makes an accusation and now they have to prove it. Cases take days. Instead holy negotiates months taking the books side and everyone has lost their winnings for 2.5 years.

holy tries to make players prove their innocence. You and the books have to prove guilt. He posted a wall of lies because everything in there contains arguments where holy believed the reps and their lies.

edit- do you think holy is helping or hurting? I don't get players paid, holy doesn't get players paid, forum pressure gets players paid. holy is the reason winnings are being stolen. Don't negotiate, force the book to show proof.

It's done by PM. Most of the time no one even knows.

That's quite convenient when making claims like yours. Regardless, its irrelevant. Nobody is impressed by what you're doing here.

When I post in scam accusations they are all almost the value betting cases. Holy and I argue in that thread because he rarely gets winnings paid.

No, you argue with him and he ignores you, because he realizes there is no reasoning with you. You finally pestered your way into a negative trust, and I think its well deserved.

Maybe if he read them all, players wouldn’t get stiffed. Holy was gone for a week or two and players were getting paid. Yahoo made a strong statement that I so isn’t an excuse on the value betting. I told players that I helped at this time to post publicly as I knew somehow it would come up. When is the last time that holy got someone paid his winnings for value betting? He needs to change his stance on value betting or books are going to take advantage of us.

I think overall your intentions are good, but you're very aggressive and biased in most cases. You start arguments that are unnecessary in the scam accusations section causing more confusion that help to the accusers. Maybe it's on purpose, maybe it's just passion for your beliefs idk.

I agree that the sportsbooks need to operate more transparently and that some legit players end up getting fucked because of the scammer players, but I don't agree with the way you try to go about being a hero without really knowing the whole story. It seems you are always against the sportsbook. You have to realize that not all scam accusations are legit. Help out but you have to be unbiased and follow the evidence.
The feedback should probably be neutral IMO but you're on thin ice with more than holydarkness it looks like. You might consider chilling with your aggressive opinions and try to advocate less aggressively.

I understand your point. My point is that if you let holy talk unchallenged players lose their winnings and sometime deposits. It's the same story for 2.5 years. All a book has to do is say arb, value or books the middleman with absolutely no proof. Flags are profiles, not proof. All holy has to do is ask the book to prove guilt. The case is over. I'm not needed, holy's not needed, forum pressure is needed. One time holy ruled that XYes was right to confiscate winnings and deposits. Forum pressure then got the player paid.

note - yahoo said neutral.

[nutildah]

Holy admits to his bias and gave me negative trust the day after I criticized BetPanda many times

II admit openly that there is a bias in my previous judgment and your question to me made me see in new perspective

This just shows that HD is capable of humility. He is open to entertaining new viewpoints. This is a beneficial quality no matter how you want to frame it.

holy is the reason winnings are being stolen. Don't negotiate, force the book to show proof.

Cmon man, 2 days ago you said you didn't want to "step on holy's toes" and now you are saying this desperate nonsense. If you could do what he's doing, then you would be doing it yourself -- end of story.

I can understand holy's friends not wanting to criticize him and that's fine. For the integrity of the trust system, the negative trust should be taken down.

The negative trust is 100% justified and reinforced by your behavior in this thread.

You poked the bear, poked & poked, and then one day the bear poked back. Then you have the nerve to be indignant about it.