Something is going on with cross border payments

[Somegory]

Brazil central banks just put an end to crypto cross border payment, what the hell is going on?




Some days ago I was trying to purchase some items using Bitpay services and I can't log into my Bitpay accoun, I already passed their KYC verification in the past even though I don't want to, but right now that's the only option I have left.

I noticed that they intentionally don't want to give me access and after I messaged them they told me that they are sorry that my country is now on the list of those they aren't ready to give their services to.

Something I have used many times to pay for several things like data, VPN, and others.

[_act_]

Brazil central banks just put an end to crypto cross border payment, what the hell is going on?

Let us make it clear, they put an end to those regulated services. I do not know the reason for this, but I think they may want users to make use of their fiat for international payments. This is the only reason I think it can happen.

It would have been better if there are services that operate by not relying on the payment processors. Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies do not need third parties before they can be used as payment a option.

[suzanne5223]

Brazil central banks just put an end to crypto cross border payment, what the hell is going on?

Let us make it clear, they put an end to those regulated services. I do not know the reason for this, but I think they may want users to make use of their fiat for international payments. This is the only reason I think it can happen.

It would have been better if there are services that operate by not relying on the payment processors. Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies do not need third parties before they can be used as payment a option.

The major reason the Brazilian central bank banned regulated cross‑border payment channels that use Bitcoin and altcoin is because of their concerns about oversight of taxation, money laundering, and monetary sovereignty.
The most targeted platform was the electronic foreign exchange and crypto payment platform. However, they didnt didn't ban crypto, though.

There is a huge increase in the usage of electronic foreign exchange and crypto payment platforms in Brazil, while the government seems not to be getting the required tax funds.

[Fiatless]

Let us make it clear, they put an end to those regulated services. I do not know the reason for this, but I think they may want users to make use of their fiat for international payments. This is the only reason I think it can happen.

According a source this is why they are banning crossborder transactions,.

The decision by the Central Bank of Brazil is likely driven by several factors. These may include concerns about volatility, anti-money laundering compliance, and the ability to monitor transactions effectively.

The major reason the Brazilian central bank banned regulated cross‑border payment channels that use Bitcoin and altcoin is because of their concerns about oversight of taxation, money laundering, and monetary sovereignty.
The most targeted platform was the electronic foreign exchange and crypto payment platform. However, they didnt didn't ban crypto, though.

There is a huge increase in the usage of electronic foreign exchange and crypto payment platforms in Brazil, while the government seems not to be getting the required tax funds.

Are there no other ways to monitor cross-border trade than an outright ban? I don't like when the government makes generalised polices without considering the effect on businesses. Some businesses rely on cryptocurrencies for cross-border payment due to its fastness, low transaction fees and flexibility. The law should have promoted strict KYC for cross-border transactions instead of a total ban. Many businesses might be hurt by this ban.

[Pablo-wood]

The major reason the Brazilian central bank banned regulated cross‑border payment channels that use Bitcoin and altcoin is because of their concerns about oversight of taxation, money laundering, and monetary sovereignty.
The most targeted platform was the electronic foreign exchange and crypto payment platform. However, they didnt didn't ban crypto, though.

There is a huge increase in the usage of electronic foreign exchange and crypto payment platforms in Brazil, while the government seems not to be getting the required tax funds.

Banning cross-border crypto payments will not solve Brazil's tax evasion, money laundering, or monetary sovereignty concerns. These problem has been in existence before crypto and still persist through traditional channels regardless of regulatory restrictions.

On money laundering specifically  bad actors have always found ways to move money across borders. Crypto is not the enabler, we all know their weak institutional oversight is the primary challenge. Until Brazil addresses corruption within its own regulatory and financial leadership, they will keep pointing fingers on crypto whereas the main issue lies within their corrupt practices.

[_act_]

The major reason the Brazilian central bank banned regulated cross‑border payment channels that use Bitcoin and altcoin is because of their concerns about oversight of taxation, money laundering, and monetary sovereignty.
The most targeted platform was the electronic foreign exchange and crypto payment platform. However, they didnt didn't ban crypto, though.

There is a huge increase in the usage of electronic foreign exchange and crypto payment platforms in Brazil, while the government seems not to be getting the required tax funds.

Banning cross-border crypto payments will not solve Brazil's tax evasion, money laundering, or monetary sovereignty concerns. These problem has been in existence before crypto and still persist through traditional channels regardless of regulatory restrictions.

On money laundering specifically  bad actors have always found ways to move money across borders. Crypto is not the enabler, we all know their weak institutional oversight is the primary challenge. Until Brazil addresses corruption within its own regulatory and financial leadership, they will keep pointing fingers on crypto whereas the main issue lies within their corrupt practices.

Although I did not mention it up to that level, but that is what I guessed. If you make use of their fiat, they believe tax will be harder to evade, money laundering can be reduced and so on.

I am so sick of some governments around the world, including what Canada is planning to with with bitcoin ATMs. If it is their fiat that is used for money laundering, tax evasion (and which is happening) and other forms of crime,  they will not ban their own fiat, but look for ways to make sure such is not happening again or reduce, yet it is still happening and no ban if their fiat.

[bitcoindusts]

The major reason the Brazilian central bank banned regulated cross‑border payment channels that use Bitcoin and altcoin is because of their concerns about oversight of taxation, money laundering, and monetary sovereignty.
The most targeted platform was the electronic foreign exchange and crypto payment platform. However, they didnt didn't ban crypto, though.

These are always the reason of government who banned cryptocurrency transaction.  So it is not news.  Any government that banned cryptocurrency transaction is observed to have this kind of reason at hand.  It is funny to hear them say this things when their own currency is more often used to money laundering.  About the cross border payment, it is not the cyptocurrency that is the problem here, but the person who failed to file a report of the transaction.  I wonder why is it an oversight transaction when I heard that paying with fiat money in Brazil does not need to be reported?

[noorman0]

Banning cross-border crypto payments will not solve Brazil's tax evasion, money laundering, or monetary sovereignty concerns. These problem has been in existence before crypto and still persist through traditional channels regardless of regulatory restrictions.

Their efforts aren't to eliminate all the crimes you mention, they're simply preventing their growth. Their first option is clearly to eliminate payment services that aren't directly affiliated with the monetary system and don't contribute much to their revenue. It's unlikely they'd need to ban their local banks from operating in a similar manner.

[Cryptomultiplier]

From what I read online, the Brazil government are not entirely banning crypto currencies but trying to force the users to the more regulated payment services to facilitate cross border settlements.  
Bitpay is in a position now to comply with the regulations and that means they have to convert to using fiat only rails like the Brazilian Real or USD.

Am just wanting to know if you could withdraw your balance or your login has been frozen, because that would be a serious issue contend with already.

[Fortify]

Brazil central banks just put an end to crypto cross border payment, what the hell is going on?

Some days ago I was trying to purchase some items using Bitpay services and I can't log into my Bitpay accoun, I already passed their KYC verification in the past even though I don't want to, but right now that's the only option I have left.

I noticed that they intentionally don't want to give me access and after I messaged them they told me that they are sorry that my country is now on the list of those they aren't ready to give their services to.

Something I have used many times to pay for several things like data, VPN, and others.

Sounds like two separate issues that are related but you've merged into one. Firstly the platform has decided to pull out of supporting brazkian users, I've seen similar things happen quite often with platforms shutting down entirely or limiting certain countries due to changes in the law. You have to adapt and overcome, just find a similar exchange that is willing to continue doing business with you - but I guess it depends on the scale of activity you were needing. I wouldn't recommend using things like VPNs to get around such restrictions, especially as your identity documents clearly state your country. Do you have the option of moving and keeping funds in your own private bitcoin core wallet? It should be safer than way.

[uchegod-21]

Can we still say Bitcoin is borderless if people still have to rely on all of these intermediaries? Bitcoin doesn’t care about restrictions from governments or central banks; the network still operates smoothly regardless. Third-party service providers grant convenience, but there are risks involved, and situations like this can leave you stranded; unable to carry out transactions. Your bitcoins can be frozen and you may be directly affected by regulatory issues. These are the reasons why people should push towards using Bitcoin the original way.

[Delaforetnoire]

Brazil central banks just put an end to crypto cross border payment, what the hell is going on?

It is quite clear that they are focusing more on using their fiat currency.
They are stopping crypto payments because it is not possible to evade taxes on any transaction using fiat currency.

[Royal Cap]

Actually, as far as I understood after reading news, Brazil has not actually banned crypto entirely, but has tightened the use of crypto in cross border payments. That is, they want such transactions to remain within the traditional system. You can see a report on this here. Another news article also says the same thing. However the fact that you are not able to access BitPay seems not entirely due to this rule. Many times, such companies block some countries in advance to reduce their own problems. So it seems to be a bit of a mixed issue.

[AmoreJaz]

Actually, as far as I understood after reading news, Brazil has not actually banned crypto entirely, but has tightened the use of crypto in cross border payments. That is, they want such transactions to remain within the traditional system. You can see a report on this here. Another news article also says the same thing. However the fact that you are not able to access BitPay seems not entirely due to this rule. Many times, such companies block some countries in advance to reduce their own problems. So it seems to be a bit of a mixed issue.

If they are banning third party platforms for crypto payments, then, users can directly pay crypto to the person or to the site. No need to use the third party payment provider like bitpay. Or find alternative way to directly deal with them using crypto, since, crypto is not totally banned in their country.

This third party platform may not be conforming to their government regulations, hence, banning the site. But with crypto, you can always find alternative way how to pay the other side, even with cross-border limitations. Because that's the advantage of crypto. There will be other routes to take without this third party payment provide. It is not the only solution so to speak.

[shinratensei_]

Actually, as far as I understood after reading news, Brazil has not actually banned crypto entirely, but has tightened the use of crypto in cross border payments. That is, they want such transactions to remain within the traditional system. You can see a report on this here. Another news article also says the same thing. However the fact that you are not able to access BitPay seems not entirely due to this rule. Many times, such companies block some countries in advance to reduce their own problems. So it seems to be a bit of a mixed issue.

If they are banning third party platforms for crypto payments, then, users can directly pay crypto to the person or to the site. No need to use the third party payment provider like bitpay. Or find alternative way to directly deal with them using crypto, since, crypto is not totally banned in their country.

What happen to other payment provider other than bitpay which can give alternative to existing traditional settlement layer? I can imagine brazilian to not be able to pay for digital goods using crypto anymore since companies always use 3rd party intermediary and never about P2P. This regulation could be detrimental in the long run.

[Somegory]

Actually, as far as I understood after reading news, Brazil has not actually banned crypto entirely, but has tightened the use of crypto in cross border payments. That is, they want such transactions to remain within the traditional system. You can see a report on this here. Another news article also says the same thing. However the fact that you are not able to access BitPay seems not entirely due to this rule. Many times, such companies block some countries in advance to reduce their own problems. So it seems to be a bit of a mixed issue.

If they are banning third party platforms for crypto payments, then, users can directly pay crypto to the person or to the site. No need to use the third party payment provider like bitpay. Or find alternative way to directly deal with them using crypto, since, crypto is not totally banned in their country.

I'm not going to do that but if you can I will advise against it, paying someone directly means they can walk away without you getting your purchased item, you don't know how people behaves at times?

Even in local online stores I have been scammed like this few times using Fiat, and crypto is even more effective for such things than fiat, there is nothing to track unlike bank account which have name.

I strongly advise against trusting strangers like this, if you know any alternative that works you can drop the name, I can't find any that allows crypto payment without the help of Bitpay, thanks.

[BitBrainers]

I'm not going to do that but if you can I will advise against it, paying someone directly means they can walk away without you getting your purchased item, you don't know how people behaves at times?
Even in local online stores I have been scammed like this few times using Fiat, and crypto is even more effective for such things than fiat, there is nothing to track unlike bank account which have name.
I strongly advise against trusting strangers like this, if you know any alternative that works you can drop the name, I can't find any that allows crypto payment without the help of Bitpay, thanks.

The trust issue with P2P is real and I get it. Most people have been burned at least once trusting a stranger online, crypto or fiat. But escrow-based platforms exist specifically for this problem. The funds get locked in multisig until both sides confirm the deal is done. Nobody can disappear with your money mid-transaction. It is worth spending an hour researching how those work before writing off P2P entirely.

What is happening in Brazil is not unique. We are watching the same pattern play out globally right now. Canada just proposed banning all crypto ATMs. The EU tightened stablecoin rules under MiCA. In every case the target is the intermediary layer, the payment processors, the ATM operators, the third party platforms. Not Bitcoin itself. The base layer keeps running regardless of what any central bank decides.

The uncomfortable truth is that every time we rely on a third party for convenience we are reintroducing the exact single point of failure Bitcoin was built to eliminate. BitPay was convenient until it was not. That is the lesson here more than anything else.

[Alpen]

Can we still say Bitcoin is borderless if people still have to rely on all of these intermediaries? Bitcoin doesn’t care about restrictions from governments or central banks; the network still operates smoothly regardless. Third-party service providers grant convenience, but there are risks involved, and situations like this can leave you stranded; unable to carry out transactions. Your bitcoins can be frozen and you may be directly affected by regulatory issues. These are the reasons why people should push towards using Bitcoin the original way.

Bitcoin is still very much borderless—whether you're in Brazil, Peru, or anywhere else on the planet. No one can prevent you from downloading a wallet and receiving BTC from someone on the other side of the world.

However, the issue you're describing is about paying for goods and services, which implies using a crypto gateway rather than a simple P2P transfer. From my experience with Cryptomus, I know that processing business payments is impossible without KYB (Know Your Business). In this scenario, you must comply with the laws of the jurisdictions involved.

At its core, Bitcoin remains a free payment network, but the moment it enters the territory of TradeFi, the laws of the real world take over.

[Hewlet]

Are there no other ways to monitor cross-border trade than an outright ban? I don't like when the government makes generalised polices without considering the effect on businesses. Some businesses rely on cryptocurrencies for cross-border payment due to its fastness, low transaction fees and flexibility. The law should have promoted strict KYC for cross-border transactions instead of a total ban. Many businesses might be hurt by this ban.

Most strict cases of ban is always as a result of the thought that it's becoming deficult for the government to regulate a system and the easiest solution they think of is to outrightly ban them. If the fear is that there is an increasing case of cross border scam cases, there should normally be the introduction of policies that tries to curb such occurrence but fact is that government will always kick against anything that is decentralised and as long as that's the case, bitcoin will get affected most times.

Even with this development, it's still possible for people to bypass these intermidiaries and still carry our Their inter border transaction. This will in the long run only affect such intermediaries and not key bitcoin users that will easily sort out an alternative though the convenience might reduce.

[Gozie51]

If they are banning third party platforms for crypto payments, then, users can directly pay crypto to the person or to the site. No need to use the third party payment provider like bitpay. Or find alternative way to directly deal with them using crypto, since, crypto is not totally banned in their country.

I don't think this is an outright ban on crypto use in Brazil but a regulatory measure to monitor capital and its source. Like checking for money laundering which may not be easier to follow with crypto transaction. It is also for tax compliance to avoid evading and defrauding the government.

So you are right to use third party alternative but their is still the possibility of such restrictions since they already started with one payment platform.

However, it is just a limitation that will discourage people to make third party payment for tax compliance but it doesn't stop P2P transaction.