Wake up people, there are no bitcoins, Nakamoto fooled you

[BlackHatCoiner]

Haven't you got bored creating accounts in this place?

[Curious T]

I stopped reading at "I picked up a pen, wrote “2 BTC” on a piece of paper, and said that I had just created exactly the same record."

It's one thing to say Bitcoin is a fraud or worthless thing or echo one of the arguments of Peter Schiff, but saying it doesn't exist is a different level of delusion altogether.  . What I find funny are the people who are actually trying to explain things to you.

[sergiorus]

Haven't you got bored creating accounts in this place?

Ok I feel a little embarrassed. Now it's clear that they are a troll and I fed them quite a bit.

Is it a somewhat known person or you just recognised a familiar posting style? Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if it was someone who has a history of coming here just to troll people.

Really pathetic of me that I didn't get it from the very first post.

[Bluedrem]

I think OP is still far behind in technology education. Or he is a blind fan of fiat currency which is losing its purchasing power day by day.
There is a huge difference between a Bitcoin written on a white paper and a Bitcoin created by a blockchain. It is decades ahead of current technology.
I would like to ask OP, what asset can give you financial freedom? What asset is yours alone, with no second or third party interference?
What asset do you own that you know the total supply of?

[DaveF]

Everyone, don't forget to ~Mariokb in your trust list and leave some negative feedback.
Does not do much since he is going to crawl back into his moms basement soon and go away but might as well.

-Dave

[Vvang]

OP are you saying you believe this write up and you are trying to confuse people on here that this is true? That's a shitty post

He claimed to take a piece of paper and write 2 BTC To proof rubbish, if someone should me 2 million dollars in is bank account I can do the same, grab a paper and write the same down to proof that I own 2 million dollars.

This person is a very stupid person that might never learn anything in his life, the difference is I can withdraw 2 BTC for $500,000 in the near future and he will have to withdraw his 2 BTC from his piece of paper, let's see how that goes.

[JoyMarsha]

In a forum like ours, is it where you want to discredit Bitcoin, which every one of us holds in high regard? I don't know what gives you the boldness to post a delusional article that is not convincing about Bitcoin.

How can you give an opinion that Bitcoin doesn't exist, whereas countries, companies, and millions of people are buying into it daily. Does it mean they are buying and hodling on to nothing as future assets? Think wise before defining Bitcoin in a foolish way

[Rikafip]

Is it a somewhat known person or you just recognised a familiar posting style? Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if it was someone who has a history of coming here just to troll people.

He is a very known anti bitcoin troll, that has been operating on bitcointalk since at least 2017 and every once in a while he comes back with new account spreading the same bullshit. And will be coming back as long as people keep replying to his nonsense.

[Pumpsta]

Following your reasoning nothing exists: no software, no digital documents, no games, no operating systems, just pixels on a screen. Btc source can be audited, transactions can be verified, addresses can be signed from uniquely; everything's verifiable and easy to analyze dude Your argument's nonsense.

[Hatchy]

Unable to answer, my colleague pivoted, claiming he didn’t actually care because the market is massive and he was bound to make money anyway.

I pointed out that this is precisely the problem and the very core of the collective delusion in which he was participating. Millions of people are giving away assets just to hold a number, surrendering tangible future benefits for something anyone can create for free with a few strokes of a pen or taps on a keyboard.

I concluded, “Every collective delusion inevitably ends in a harsh awakening. When that happens, no one will be willing to give you assets anymore, and your money will be gone forever.”"

It's a long post, but you still haven't explained why you think Bitcoin is just a bunch of written numbers. Anyone can write 2 BTC on a piece of paper, but that doesn't make it real Bitcoin or an asset. I think that's the wrong way to look at it, especially when everything about Bitcoin is clearly explained in the white paper. You should spend some time researching how it actually works.You also tried to defend the fiat system but I don't understand the point you were trying to make. If the 2 BTC shown in your wallet isn't real then what about the money shown in your banking app? It's also just numbers on a screen. Does that mean it's not real either?

The difference is that when your money is in the bank the bank has full control over it. Banks use customers deposits to make loans and generate profits, while you often earn little or no interest in return. Bitcoin will always be the better option for me. No matter how you try to analyze it your argument still doesn't make sense to me. Years from now, I believe you'll realize your friend made the right decision. You may even end up regretting not taking the opportunity when you had the chance. People said the same things when Bitcoin was worth very little, and history has shown how that turned out.

[Merit.s]

OP, I think your friend has brains than you and you think that you are more smarter than him. What will you say about the government and big companies buying bitcoin. Are you saying that you are smarter than all these people combined together.

I think, you're high on cheap weed to say there is no bitcoin. Maybe, the whole bitcoin network and how it's working is a big mystery to you but a lot of people understand how it works and what makes it an asset. Not just an asset but a store of value overtime.

[Chinesebaby]

I picked up a pen, wrote “2 BTC” on a piece of paper, and said that I had just created exactly the same record. I explained to him that this did not mean that two units of something had miraculously appeared in my possession. There was nothing to analyze to determine whether it was an asset or whether it was valuable.

I couldn't stop laughing reading at this very statement of you highlighted above, and it actually shows how delusional you are about Bitcoin and how it works. And for the fact that despite Bitcoin's 17years of existence, you still doubt about it, it's enough reason for me to not argue with you, because it's obvious you know or might have had about Bitcoin, but yet you chose to remain ignorant and keep arguing without making proper research about what Bitcoin actually stands for and works.
And secondly, can you transfer that 2 BTC you just wrote with pen into cash within few hours? Because that's what shows the biggest between what you just wrote on a piece of paper and what your student showed you on his phone with a current worth $120,000. So please, I will advise to stop acting foolish in the eyes of your colleagues and accept the fact that you know nothing about Bitcoin. Because if I was to be you, I will beg that colleague of yours to teach you about Bitcoin.

[ZAINmalik75]

Lol, I stopped reading right when I read "I took a paper and wrote 2 BTC and said I have created 2 BTC". How can someone be so foolish? OP probably has zero knowledge about the digital world, and it is actually him who is delusional and not those who are into Bitcoin. His friend should have asked him to quickly deposit those two bitcoins he created on paper in an exchange and try and convert it to fiat currency, when he couldn't do that, he should have demonstrated the same himself using only 0.001 bitcoins and he would literally shut up right there.

We are in 2026 already and there are still people who argue that digital money or assets can't exist only because they don't have a physical existence. Based on OP's point, the money that we see in our banking apps aren't actually ours or in our possession because we can transfer then digitally but we don't have them actually in our possession unless we withdraw them. This whole post is nothing but a rant from someone who is completely delusional and lack so much knowledge.

[Ahli38]

I tried to explain that he had fallen victim to a collective delusion and that he had simply given his money away because there are no “bitcoins.”

He opened a crypto app on his phone and showed me a record reading “2 BTC,” insisting that it proved he owned two bitcoins. I pointed out that this proved nothing.

I picked up a pen, wrote “2 BTC” on a piece of paper, and said that I had just created exactly the same record. I explained to him that this did not mean that two units of something had miraculously appeared in my possession. There was nothing to analyze to determine whether it was an asset or whether it was valuable.

You can’t claim ownership that easily just by writing something on a worthless piece of paper. And that cannot serve as proof that you own Bitcoin with the same transaction history. Every Bitcoin you own or even every fraction of a Bitcoin can be verified by anyone. And you can easily verify it yourself by visiting a blockchain explorer to trace every transaction that has taken place on the blockchain. On the other hand you can’t ignore Bitcoin’s value given its current market capitalization. Bitcoin is highly liquid because exchanges are constantly taking place, where there are always offers to buy or sell Bitcoin around the clock 24 hours a day. So I personally advising you to take this seriously and not overlook the valuation Bitcoin has built up over time. You also need to understand Bitcoin’s intrinsic value so that you don’t underestimate it. And you need to learn a lot about Bitcoin’s history which has led to its fantastic current price. You cannot compare it to fiat currencies which cannot serve as a store of value in the long term. You’ll only end up as a slave to governments that overly glorify fiatwhich is actually useless to hold onto over the long term. I believe that people who trust fiat currency are being fooled by the government.

Throughout history, all fiat currencies eventually face the same pressures. When debt grows faster than income and money needs to be created to fill the gap, the value of that money changes.

“Cash is trash,” Dalio said

[Smartprofit]

The author of this thread is right (only in reverse)! Bitcoin is one of the few real assets. All other financial assets don't exist. 🙋

Do you own real estate? Of course not! The title to real estate is yours. It's just an entry in a registry that you don't control. If a government official decides to remove your name from the registry tomorrow, you'll no longer own that property.

Do you own money? Of course not! Unless it's cash, it's just a bank's promise to pay you. When the bank goes bankrupt, your money will disappear into thin air...

The same applies to stocks, bonds, derivatives, and so on. It's just an illusion. An abstraction...

As for Bitcoin, it's a real asset. It's a decentralized system that won't disappear overnight. A large number of miners, a large amount of computing equipment, a large amount of electricity, a large amount of resources. What could be more real? What could be more reliable?  At the same time, your coins are completely under your control (with caveats if you're paranoid and the entropy is high enough). Yes, there are risks, but there is also freedom. There are difficulties, but that's reality!

[citywise2]

Here is the article that nicely explains it: https://medium.com/@mario.kb99/bitcoins-do-not-exist-debunking-a-collective-delusion-f0afe8fb6568

"Bitcoins Do Not Exist: Debunking a Collective Delusion

Recently, a colleague proudly told me that he had bought “two whole bitcoins” for $120,000 and that he now owned a valuable asset.

I tried to explain that he had fallen victim to a collective delusion and that he had simply given his money away because there are no “bitcoins.”

He opened a crypto app on his phone and showed me a record reading “2 BTC,” insisting that it proved he owned two bitcoins. I pointed out that this proved nothing.

I picked up a pen, wrote “2 BTC” on a piece of paper, and said that I had just created exactly the same record. I explained to him that this did not mean that two units of something had miraculously appeared in my possession. There was nothing to analyze to determine whether it was an asset or whether it was valuable.

Why can't you guys understand that not everything has to be a physical item to be valuable? We live in the 21st century where things are becoming virtual. Your example is also a bad example. You wrote 2 BTC on a piece of paper but what can you do with that writing and piece of paper? Nothing but your friend can actually send his Bitcoin to an exchange and get the equivalent dollars in his bank account, which he can later withdraw via ATM and you'll see a real cash in his hand if physical thing is what you really want to see.

  People who refuse to see change or innovation and accept it never move  or grow beyond their shadows. If he cannot see the value in the 2 BTC, let him be - no need wasting time trying to make him accept reality and what is possible in the 21 century if he is of stone age. Let him take his 2 BTC on paper to the bank while his friend does same, he will see the difference.

[promise444c5]

Sorry mate, you lost me at the beginning with that long write up .. But I noticed that somehow you’ve managed to red-pill some users into your hallucinatory realm

You know what, I just wrote 3000BTC on a piece of paper too.. Now I can claim I own 3K BTC, all thanks thanks to you

in the words of the great Satoshi Nakomoto himself, ‘If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry.’

Old but still  Gold satoshi

[Hamza2424]

Haha, I almost got lost in the deep sea of your words, bro. But in your argument, you are confusing a physical or standalone digital object with a non-existing state, because it exists as units in a global state. It is not like you can write 2 BTC on a paper and it will have any demand or value. It is not recognized by any node, bro, so it is just paper, while the ownership and transfers of Bitcoins are enforced by the consensus rules.

Bro, you must know the dollar is also a number. It has demand because of taxes, law, liquidity, and network effects, and you can count many more reasons, but it has demand for specific reasons. The same way, Bitcoin has demand due to its scarcity, easy and smooth settlement without the need for any middleman, without giving any personal information. You control your funds, own them, and if you own US dollars in your bank and see numbers daily on your phone, I can say the same as you can't exchange your so-called favorite dollar with gold or any tangible asset, bro.

You proved nothing, bro.

[Mariokb]

Just because you can touch a dollar bill, does that make it a real form of value? And what is value anyway and where is it derived from?
Many people on this debate will deny labour originates from labour and will rather argue that it's not subjective but rather objective. But how would that make sense. Without labour, what kind of value would exist on this earth?

The value ascribed to money and even gold could be collectively abandoned in 1 single day. The value ascribed to gold held in vaults is 0 compared to the objective value a gold plated cable or circuit can provide. Yet we need only a tiny fraction of gold production for circuits and tangible things. So in the end anyone saying value is objective is disconnected from our world's reality. Monetary value is a manufactured value both for BTC as well as at FIAT money. But for both being compared on the same scale each has its benefits and disadvantages so for certain people indeed FIAT might be more valuable because utility in everyday payments could actually mean more value.

You've skipped the very first step of my argument. My article is not about whether value is subjective or objective. It is not about whether fiat, gold, or bitcoin is ultimately more valuable.
Before we can debate value, there must first be something that exists to evaluate. You begin by talking about the value of money, gold, and bitcoin as though bitcoins exist and are comparable to existing things such as units of debt(fiat money) or pieces of metal (gold ). That is precisely what my article disputes. There are no "bitcoins" in the first place, there are no units of something, only recorded numbers associated with addresses. If that argument is wrong, then explain where the "bitcoins" are. Simply discussing value assumes the very point under dispute.

If you see bitcoin is just a recorded number then you have no idea how bitcoin networks operates and how blockchain network thing works, etc. Fiat is physical so it has value is what your argument, but it has no value which is just a printed paper unless the central bank of every country says that it has value so the whole system works on the trust and what if one day everyone wakes up with a news like all the governments decided to abolish paper money so it will not have any value anymore?

But that thing will not happen with bitcoin, gold or anything else.

This reply illustrates exactly how deep the collective delusion is. You haven't addressed my argument at all. Instead, you've simply assumed the existence of "bitcoins" from the outset and then proceeded to explain how the Bitcoin network operates. My article never denied the existence of the Bitcoin network, its blockchain, its protocol, its software, or its rules. Those all exist.

What it disputes is the existence of "bitcoins."

Saying "if you see bitcoin as just a recorded number" simply assumes the very point under dispute. That is circular reasoning, not an argument. You then switch to discussing fiat money and what would happen if governments abolished it. Again, that has nothing to do with my argument. My point is not that paper has value because it is physical. In fact, I explicitly discuss intangible things such as debts, patents, copyrights, photographs, documents, and software. Nothing in your reply establishes the existence of "bitcoins." It simply assumes they exist and builds the rest of the argument on that assumption. Repeating the assumption is not an argument. Stop assuming the conclusion, and address the argument that was actually made.

I stopped reading at "I picked up a pen, wrote “2 BTC” on a piece of paper, and said that I had just created exactly the same record."

It's one thing to say Bitcoin is a fraud or worthless thing or echo one of the arguments of Peter Schiff, but saying it doesn't exist is a different level of delusion altogether.  . What I find funny are the people who are actually trying to explain things to you.

What's striking is that you treat the existence of "bitcoins" as so self-evident that you never even consider the possibility that it is the very assumption under examination. Rather than engaging that premise, you declare anyone questioning it to be detached from reality.

The irony is hard to miss: you're accusing me of delusion while participating in one so deep that you cannot even bring yourself to examine the assumption on which your entire argument rests.

[athanred]

I picked up a pen, wrote “2 BTC” on a piece of paper, and said that I had just created exactly the same record.

Not exactly the same. Your piece of paper won't contain a lot of leading zeroes, when you calculate SHA-256 of that.

In the same way, you could buy a monopoly game, take some pieces of paper out of it, and then argue, that it is the same, as having physical dollars. If printing money would be so easy, then 99% of cash in circulation would be fake, and it would instantly lose any value.

There are no two digital items, such as documents, photographs, or software programs

There is a software, which can tell you, how exactly coins are created, and validated. If you think, that it is as easy, as writing "2 BTC" on a piece of paper, then go on, produce some coins, and sell them for real dollars, or anything else you consider to be valuable.

Consequently, there is nothing to analyze to determine whether it is valuable or whether it is an asset, just as there was nothing when I wrote ‘2 BTC’ on a piece of paper.

You can analyze the math behind it. If it would be worthless, then anyone could move anyone else's coins anywhere.

If you write "2 BTC" on a piece of paper, then you don't use any elliptic curve, hash function, or anything similar, to prove ownership in any way. But here, there are real math problems, which can keep the whole system running. If you think it is worthless, then you can easily take a lot of profits, by proving, that the system is unsafe, assigning a lot of coins to yourself, and instantly selling all of that.