Sig Ban Appeal for Bitinity

[Upgrade00]

If you expand it to 1 year, he is the 13th most active poster on the Gambling board but 54th in merits earned on that board. To me that suggests his posts (in general) aren't particularly informative or interesting to most readers.
<snip>
Because this account is particularly lacking in certain areas. They use the same words to describe the same or similar concepts, repeatedly -- for years now, living largely in threads where not many people appear to be reading much of anything.

These are some of the reasons again I am yet to get on board with the way some of the sig bans are getting handed out. It relies heavily on subjective criteria that is almost impossible to argue with. I should clarify first that I have not gone through the post history here, cause I am not replying to this in particular.
I expect bans to be giving for clear reasons; your posts are majorly spam so your signature rights have been revoked for xxxx period of time, if you need proof of that, here is a screenshot of 2-3 pages of your post history showing the regularity of said spam.

Highlighting 2 posts a month apart and suggesting to know what is interesting to others and what they read is not a reason for a ban, merit statistics isn't either, that is backwards inference. You should be saying;
"Your posts as you can see are mostly spam, further shown by your lack of merits from them" not,
"You do not get merits, so your posts must be spam"

What are these repetitive words? Are they by any chance core gambling words that will be used to explain most concepts in that area and were they applicable in the contexts they were used?

[bitmover]

24 - bitmover: 48 merits

I am impressed that I earned that much!! Gambling board is so much difficult for me to post, but i posted a lot there when i was in a casino sig campaign

my suggestion for anyone struggling to find any meaningful topics or discussions is to go to use some casinos and participate in their ANN threads. There are better discussions in ANN imo.

[yahoo62278]

It's extremely hard to earn merits on the gambling boards, especially gambling discussion as there really aren't a ton of interesting posts in that section. I have been reading posts here and there and try to send a merit now and then, but finding an interesting topic in that section is hard. I find myself reporting more topics than I find interesting.

I checked your profile, and I am solely gonna judge you for your comment in this topic, and not even for the post content (actually, haven't even read it!): Dice game seems not too popular | Bitinity's Comment

Like, who feeds this obvious spam topic!? Wait I know the answer and that's signature quota spammers and isn't the goal of sigban to reduce signature spam?

Tell you what even I felt the inkling to make my quick shitpost there but decided against it and rather reported the topic and it got locked, actually should have been thrashed due to how bullshit the topic was.

PS: I understand I might not be the best guy to parade 'morally superior behaviour' but above happening is factual!

I posted on the 1st page of this topic and you can see I let the OP of that topic know my feelings about the topic. They are just posting bs that mildy is about gambling so they meet their quota. They think if the word gambling is mentioned then it should be in gambling discussion. I feel like most of it is off topic trash.

Regarding Bitinity, I don't know that I would have banned him. I don't love the idea of the gambling section and merits being earned as the basis for banning or not banning a guy as that section is mostly full of shit posters. You might have to ban 50% of the forum. Merits don't fly around too much in the gambling discussion section. I think the quotas imposed by the campaign managers makes users make bad posts to reach their quotas. If there weren't quotas for number of posts that MUST be in that section, then a good % of users posting there wouldn't even visit that section. Being as most of the campaigns that are on this forum are from casinos, users are kinda fucked. Especially users that use this forum as a job.

I don't know the system used for deciding who gets banned and for what period of time, but I would consider not including merit from the gambling section in your data as really not many earn much in the gambling discussion section. The ones who get the merits mostly in that section are the ones launching a contest of some sort. If you earn 20 merits in the gambling discussion section over a period of 6 months, you did very well IMO.

I am not telling nutildah how to run the show. I doubt they enjoy banning anyone TBH. Just giving my opinion.

[nutildah]

It's extremely hard to earn merits on the gambling boards, especially gambling discussion as there really aren't a ton of interesting posts in that section. I have been reading posts here and there and try to send a merit now and then, but finding an interesting topic in that section is hard. I find myself reporting more topics than I find interesting.

Thats an accurate summary of things: those boards are full of uninteresting posts and topics, which is why they don't get a lot of merit. There's a good chance most people posting in those sections aren't reading many of the posts being written there either.

Regarding Bitinity, I don't know that I would have banned him. I don't love the idea of the gambling section and merits being earned as the basis for banning or not banning a guy as that section is mostly full of shit posters.

I'm failing to grasp why holding the Gambling and Gambling Discussion boards to the same standards as the rest of the forum is a problem. The idea that a special exemption should be given to accounts who primarily post on these boards doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. I believe every board gets the merits it deserves. (Every non-local board, that is -- local boards are a different story).

I don't wish to continue posting examples of what I consider to be spam from this user, but my conclusion is they frequently exhaust their supply of conversational material and resort to writing low-quality posts, a cycle repeating weekly over the course of years.

I already reduced the ban to 30 days (28 days remaining) out of recognition that at least some of their posts are of decent-to-good quality, and they seem to be appreciated by some community members.

I think the quotas imposed by the campaign managers makes users make bad posts to reach their quotas. If there weren't quotas for number of posts that MUST be in that section, then a good % of users posting there wouldn't even visit that section. Being as most of the campaigns that are on this forum are from casinos, users are kinda fucked. Especially users that use this forum as a job.

Yes. It is tricky. Let's talk about how we got to this situation in the first place.

Since a long time ago, it was well known that you could shitpost in Altcoin Discussion and Gambling Discussion and get away with it. Nobody really cared too much as the shitposters pretty much stuck to those sections. As you pointed out, many campaigns of today have a minimum # of gambling section posts per week, but for new accounts looking to make a career shitposting here, making low-value posts about gambling isn't enough to rank up, so they start making low value or contrived posts in other areas of the forum in the quest for merits. Slowly over time, other boards have become havens for shitposters as well, including Beginners & Help, Economics, and even the BTC Discussion board. A large chunk of this dynamic is fueled by people coming here to get paid for filling gambling post quotas.

Its true that merit sources frequent these other boards more than the Gambling Discussion board. However, the topics of Gambling Discussion inspire more low quality posts than any other board, which is probably why many merit sources avoid it if they don't have to post there.

The solution isn't to Thanos snap the forum, of course. Rather, new standards can be put in place to encourage people to either put more effort into their posts or post less if they don't actually have anything to say.

Not saying this applies to anyone in particular, but a good rule of thumb is this: before hitting "Post", ask yourself: would you read this post if you saw it on the forum? If the answer is "No", don't hit the button. Change it to make it worth reading, or don't post it at all.

[alani123]

To hold the gambling discussion board to the same standards would mean that users participating in it should also be giving merits instead of just expecting them. It goes both ways actually. I think we all hold some collective responsibility for overlooking the occasional good post or informative response there (it's easy to do that in the ocean of repetitive posts). But on the other hand, if someone makes the exception and posts something good there, the contrast should earn them just a bit of merit. My experience is that it's also hard to earn merits there. I'm not saying that I'm a very good poster myself, generally but also lately, but I can say that if a board makes it less likely for you to earn any merit at all, having to post in it can act as a dissuasion to post with quality, because it never gets rewarded. I'm sure members under the legendary rank especially think this way.

[Don Pedro Dinero]

If you expand it to 1 year, he is the 13th most active poster on the Gambling board but 54th in merits earned on that board. To me that suggests his posts (in general) aren't particularly informative or interesting to most readers.

We’ve told you before, that doesn’t mean anything; the people who earn the most points on those forums are usually casino representatives.

If you observe the yearly merit data of the gambling board, then you will find out most of the merits were sent to the casino representative's account. And users receive merit most of the time by making replies in some certain casinos ANN thread.

Here's a list of the top 60 merit earners on the Gambling board over the last 365 days so people can evaluate the data themselves:

1 - JackpotterCasino: 195 merits
2 - Zwei: 136 merits
3 - Rainbet: 134 merits
4 - sportsbet.io: 124 merits
5 - notblox1: 105 merits
6 - SirJohnVonSlotty: 93 merits
7 - buwaytress: 91 merits
8 - memehunter: 81 merits
9 - goodpunt: 78 merits
10 - Mahdirakib: 75 merits
11 - Pmalek: 72 merits
12 - SamReomo: 66 merits
13 - Harkorede: 63 merits
14 - @Whale: 59 merits
15 - Betpanda: 54 merits
16 - TheOriginals: 54 merits
17 - jeremypwr: 54 merits
18 - BetFury.io: 53 merits
19 - Betwrong: 53 merits
20 - Bitz_Casino: 51 merits
21 - SpongeS: 50 merits
22 - panjul07: 50 merits
23 - AB de Royse777: 49 merits
24 - bitmover: 48 merits
25 - Spinly: 45 merits
26 - yahoo62278: 45 merits
27 - 1win.global: 42 merits
28 - BABY SHOES: 42 merits
29 - AHOYBRAUSE: 37 merits
30 - slaman29: 37 merits
31 - Haunebu: 35 merits
32 - dewez: 34 merits
33 - salad daging: 34 merits
34 - 2UP.io: 32 merits
35 - hosemary: 31 merits
36 - EOSBet: 30 merits
37 - victorhing: 30 merits
38 - Bspin_io: 29 merits
39 - EarnOnVictor: 28 merits
40 - Monarch-: 28 merits
41 - iv4n: 28 merits
42 - xLays: 28 merits
43 - efialtis: 26 merits
44 - leea-1334: 26 merits
45 - Allstars.io Team: 25 merits
46 - Free Market Capitalist: 25 merits
47 - Little Mouse: 25 merits
48 - Slissy: 25 merits
49 - julerz12: 25 merits
50 - rohang: 25 merits
51 - LFC_Bitcoin: 24 merits
52 - famososMuertos: 24 merits
53 - 96OFFICIAL: 23 merits
54 - Bitinity: 23 merits
55 - Upgrade00: 23 merits
56 - duelbits: 23 merits
57 - Potato Chips: 22 merits
58 - xandry: 22 merits
59 - Pseudo-Random: 21 merits
60 - Trofo: 21 merits

I have crossed out names from that list on the safe side, as I could also have crossed out campaign managers and accounts which, although not directly linked to casinos, belong to members who are connected in some way through organising promotions or events with them. Take all those off the list and you’ll see that he doesn’t come off half as badly.  

Also, informative?

This is how informative real discussions are on another forum:

Sure, I suppose that on the other gambling forums you’re on, the discussions are intellectual debates of the highest calibre. I’ll give you some links to the biggest Spanish-language forum. The Real Madrid v Atlético de Madrid derby is taking place today:

Día de Derbi

The OP is an NSFW photo. Here are some of the comments, translated into English:

Whores’ Day

They’ll be sodomised by a black player from Real Madrid

Wank day

Now I’m going to translate a more ‘serious’ thread for you.

Se está jugando al fútbol en Madrid?

First comments:

What a proper battle. What a pair. ‘Embarrassing’ doesn’t even begin to cover it. ‘Intensity’ – that’s what the football-illiterate lot would say, ha ha ha.

And what about you, you fatso, hahahaJxddd

You know that the usual suspects’ tactic is that they only play when they want to

This year, the only teams playing football in LaLiga are Barça, Dépor and Sevilla.

Elche move the ball around very well

Those are the 'quality' comments you can find in other forums, If we compare it to our Spanish league thread here, I’d say ours wins hands down as far as 'quality' is concerned.

I am sure you are not going to find many merits sent in our Spanish league thread even though the comments there are of objective superior quality.

[Bitinity]

@nutildah: Thank you for the decision to reduce my sig ban to 30 days, I really appreciate it. I have no other things to say as I do not want to argue or to make any further excuses, I can understand your assessments. I will use it for my personal evaluation as it is a valuable lesson for me and hopefully for others as well.

@everyone else, I appreciate all the feedback, whether it was directed at me personally or as part of general discussion about the sig ban. I may not agree with every opinion but I appreciate everyone who took the time to chime in on the discussion.

[Rikafip]

If you expand it to 1 year, he is the 13th most active poster on the Gambling board but 54th in merits earned on that board. To me that suggests his posts (in general) aren't particularly informative or interesting to most readers.

Iirc, you said that you mostly look at the last 100-200 posts when evaluating whether someone should get sig banned, and that approximately coincides with the last 120 days. But even if you look at 1 year period an remove all those accounts that I mentioned before, he still wouldn't look that bad.

The solution isn't to Thanos snap the forum, of course. Rather, new standards can be put in place to encourage people to either put more effort into their posts or post less if they don't actually have anything to say.

What is imo more likely to happen (since its easier) is that people will start getting out of their way to farm merit, and I think that we already have enough of that as it is.

Not saying this applies to anyone in particular, but a good rule of thumb is this: before hitting "Post", ask yourself: would you read this post if you saw it on the forum? If the answer is "No", don't hit the button. Change it to make it worth reading, or don't post it at all.

In the last 17 weeks (approximately 120 days) he wrote 244 posts while his sig post quota for that period would add up to 510 posts (his weekly quota was 30 posts, $4 per post), which makes me think that he actually shows more constraint the many other whose sole purpose is to fill the post quota and therefore maximize the earning. Just because someone isn't filling max weekly quota doesn't ofc automatically mean that he is not shitposting but I think it still says a lot as it's not a common thing around here.

[Pmalek]

I have crossed out names from that list on the safe side, as I could also have crossed out campaign managers and accounts which, although not directly linked to casinos, belong to members who are connected in some way through organising promotions or events with them. Take all those off the list and you’ll see that he doesn’t come off half as badly.  

SirJohnVonSlotty, a name that you crossed out, is both a regular forum poster and member of our Croatian local board and an individual connected to an online casino (Rooli). Although, I am not sure what's going on with Rooli and his involvement with it. The announcement thread for the brand has been locked since April. Maybe he will see the tag and tell us if we should consider him a regular forum member, casino representative, or a hybrid.

[SirJohnVonSlotty]

SirJohnVonSlotty, a name that you crossed out, is both a regular forum poster and member of our Croatian local board and an individual connected to an online casino (Rooli). Although, I am not sure what's going on with Rooli and his involvement with it. The announcement thread for the brand has been locked since April. Maybe he will see the tag and tell us if we should consider him a regular forum member, casino representative, or a hybrid.

The crossed out part I took as a personal insult   The majority of my merits have been earned from my posts and threads as a regular forum member, not as a casino representative. Rooli isn't live for a while now. Pedro is belittling my contributions, tsk...

[Don Pedro Dinero]

SirJohnVonSlotty, a name that you crossed out, is both a regular forum poster and member of our Croatian local board and an individual connected to an online casino (Rooli). Although, I am not sure what's going on with Rooli and his involvement with it. The announcement thread for the brand has been locked since April. Maybe he will see the tag and tell us if we should consider him a regular forum member, casino representative, or a hybrid.

The crossed out part I took as a personal insult   The majority of my merits have been earned from my posts and threads as a regular forum member, not as a casino representative. Rooli isn't live for a while now. Pedro is belittling my contributions, tsk...

When I crossed out the names at a glance, I knew someone would object. Ok that name crossed out was wrong. How about we focus on the point I was trying to make? You can’t just take the merits distributed in that section and claim that if someone earns a quarter of the average merit, it means they aren’t contributing, because many of them are awarded to casino representatives or people linked to them.

[SirJohnVonSlotty]

When I crossed out the names at a glance, I knew someone would object. Ok that name crossed out was wrong. How about we focus on the point I was trying to make? You can’t just take the merits distributed in that section and claim that if someone earns a quarter of the average merit, it means they aren’t contributing, because many of them are awarded to casino representatives or people linked to them.

The mistake that he did is the same mistake that you did, both of you are measuring it wrong (no homo). But I'll leave the details to you guys and show myself out, I don't want to be part of this conversation.

[cryptofrka]

I'm failing to grasp why holding the Gambling and Gambling Discussion boards to the same standards as the rest of the forum is a problem.

Because it's in such state that nobody sane wants to step a foot in there.

A part of the reason is the fact that it's one of the easiest places to spam sig campaign quotas, sure.
But it's also badly organized, badly moderated and given up on from literally every merit source.

It can be held to the same standards when it starts receiving the same benefits. I will say again, a part of the blame is on the shitposters - but looking at a problem from only 1 angle never solved the actual problem - just created another one in its place.

[logfiles]

Bitinity's signature ban has actually been a bit of shock to me. He is  one of the users who gambles and shares his experience in those boards including promos and given the fact that he spends most of the time in those boards. Acquiring merits from there is definitely going to be so hard.

Here's a list of the top 60 merit earners on the Gambling board over the last 365 days so people can evaluate the data themselves:

1 - JackpotterCasino: 195 merits
2 - Zwei: 136 merits
3 - Rainbet: 134 merits
4 - sportsbet.io: 124 merits
5 - notblox1: 105 merits
6 - SirJohnVonSlotty: 93 merits
7 - buwaytress: 91 merits
8 - memehunter: 81 merits
9 - goodpunt: 78 merits
10 - Mahdirakib: 75 merits
11 - Pmalek: 72 merits
12 - SamReomo: 66 merits
13 - Harkorede: 63 merits
14 - @Whale: 59 merits
15 - Betpanda: 54 merits
16 - TheOriginals: 54 merits
17 - jeremypwr: 54 merits
18 - BetFury.io: 53 merits
19 - Betwrong: 53 merits
20 - Bitz_Casino: 51 merits
21 - SpongeS: 50 merits
22 - panjul07: 50 merits
23 - AB de Royse777: 49 merits
24 - bitmover: 48 merits
25 - Spinly: 45 merits
26 - yahoo62278: 45 merits
27 - 1win.global: 42 merits
28 - BABY SHOES: 42 merits
29 - AHOYBRAUSE: 37 merits
30 - slaman29: 37 merits
31 - Haunebu: 35 merits
32 - dewez: 34 merits
33 - salad daging: 34 merits
34 - 2UP.io: 32 merits
35 - hosemary: 31 merits
36 - EOSBet: 30 merits
37 - victorhing: 30 merits
38 - Bspin_io: 29 merits
39 - EarnOnVictor: 28 merits
40 - Monarch-: 28 merits
41 - iv4n: 28 merits
42 - xLays: 28 merits
43 - efialtis: 26 merits
44 - leea-1334: 26 merits
45 - Allstars.io Team: 25 merits
46 - Free Market Capitalist: 25 merits
47 - Little Mouse: 25 merits
48 - Slissy: 25 merits
49 - julerz12: 25 merits
50 - rohang: 25 merits
51 - LFC_Bitcoin: 24 merits
52 - famososMuertos: 24 merits
53 - 96OFFICIAL: 23 merits
54 - Bitinity: 23 merits
55 - Upgrade00: 23 merits
56 - duelbits: 23 merits
57 - Potato Chips: 22 merits
58 - xandry: 22 merits
59 - Pseudo-Random: 21 merits
60 - Trofo: 21 merits

I have crossed out names from that list on the safe side, as I could also have crossed out campaign managers and accounts which, although not directly linked to casinos, belong to members who are connected in some way through organising promotions or events with them. Take all those off the list and you’ll see that he doesn’t come off half as badly.  

You should have crossed out campaign managers and contest organisers as well to bring out a clear picture.

Well even after 4 months gap from the forum, I am still 8th highest lol.

You were one of the contest organisers some months back, no?  

[Don Pedro Dinero]

<...>


I have crossed out names from that list on the safe side, as I could also have crossed out campaign managers and accounts which, although not directly linked to casinos, belong to members who are connected in some way through organising promotions or events with them. Take all those off the list and you’ll see that he doesn’t come off half as badly.  

You should have crossed out campaign managers and contest organisers as well to bring out a clear picture.

As I said before, I crossed names in a conservative manner. Here is a maximalist list.

Here's a list of the top 60 merit earners on the Gambling board over the last 365 days so people can evaluate the data themselves:

1 - JackpotterCasino: 195 merits
2 - Zwei: 136 merits
3 - Rainbet: 134 merits
4 - sportsbet.io: 124 merits
5 - notblox1: 105 merits
6 - SirJohnVonSlotty: 93 merits
7 - buwaytress: 91 merits
8 - memehunter: 81 merits
9 - goodpunt: 78 merits
10 - Mahdirakib: 75 merits
11 - Pmalek: 72 merits
12 - SamReomo: 66 merits
13 - Harkorede: 63 merits
14 - @Whale: 59 merits
15 - Betpanda: 54 merits
16 - TheOriginals: 54 merits
17 - jeremypwr: 54 merits
18 - BetFury.io: 53 merits
19 - Betwrong: 53 merits
20 - Bitz_Casino: 51 merits
21 - SpongeS: 50 merits
22 - panjul07: 50 merits
23 - AB de Royse777: 49 merits
24 - bitmover: 48 merits
25 - Spinly: 45 merits
26 - yahoo62278: 45 merits
27 - 1win.global: 42 merits
28 - BABY SHOES: 42 merits
29 - AHOYBRAUSE: 37 merits
30 - slaman29: 37 merits
31 - Haunebu: 35 merits
32 - dewez: 34 merits
33 - salad daging: 34 merits
34 - 2UP.io: 32 merits
35 - hosemary: 31 merits
36 - EOSBet: 30 merits
37 - victorhing: 30 merits
38 - Bspin_io: 29 merits
39 - EarnOnVictor: 28 merits
40 - Monarch-: 28 merits
41 - iv4n: 28 merits
42 - xLays: 28 merits
43 - efialtis: 26 merits
44 - leea-1334: 26 merits
45 - Allstars.io Team: 25 merits
46 - Free Market Capitalist: 25 merits
47 - Little Mouse: 25 merits
48 - Slissy: 25 merits
49 - julerz12: 25 merits
50 - rohang: 25 merits
51 - LFC_Bitcoin: 24 merits
52 - famososMuertos: 24 merits
53 - 96OFFICIAL: 23 merits
54 - Bitinity: 23 merits
55 - Upgrade00: 23 merits
56 - duelbits: 23 merits
57 - Potato Chips: 22 merits
58 - xandry: 22 merits
59 - Pseudo-Random: 21 merits
60 - Trofo: 21 merits

Mind you, I might have made some mistakes. For example, maybe I should have included jeremypwr but I am not sure and I have included some that sound like casino reps but who I don't know, like 96OFFICIAL but we can get an idea.

[memehunter]

Well even after 4 months gap from the forum, I am still 8th highest lol.

You were one of the contest organisers some months back, no?  

That was a whisper text for humor that's why I kept the font size low for that statement (as I got notified by bot, and could not resist lol).
Since you quoted that, do you believe that merits earned for doing a job are not worth it? Specially when someone puts a lot of efforts (sometime going out of his way) believing that community will find it interesting/meaningful/helpful/profitable?
@Don Pedro Dinero I don't think person like you should categorize someone one way or other. I identify myself as a contributing member of the forum (just like you) instead of attached to some casino.
  




 

[SuperBitMan]

Just a suggestion that if it would be possible to give any user one warning before banning, at least in border line cases. I mean sure temp ban of 30 days can be viewed as a warning but it is just a bit heavy IMO.
 
Well even after 4 months gap from the forum, I am still 8th highest lol.    

I understand your point and it will be good.
Some members should be sent a PM, warning them on the areas they are not doing it right, I’m not saying everyone should be sent a warning PM, those that are not really that bad in posting should be sent the warning PM, while those that are big time spammers should just be given a signature ban without any form of warning.

[Don Pedro Dinero]

@Don Pedro Dinero I don't think person like you should categorize someone one way or other. I identify myself as a contributing member of the forum (just like you) instead of attached to some casino.

I am not categorising I am making the point that putting merit earned by people who just comment on the gambling sections with merit earned by casino reps, managers and people who run promos for them to then say that the former don't earn enough merits is an unfair comparison.

I have the right to not run promos or being a casino rep or a manager and not for that being categorised as a poor contributor.

[memehunter]

to then say that the former don't earn enough merits is an unfair comparison.

Who said that and where? No body compared one merit to other until you gave this hypothesis.
Somebody will get merits for
being mod,
managing campaigns,
organizing contests,
spam busting... etc.

Every one is contributing in his own sense of being a productive member.

I have the right to not run promos or being a casino rep or a manager and not for that being categorised as a poor contributor.

Agreed. I dont think there is even need to debate this.

The point I am making is there is nothing like tainted merits.
 
 

[Don Pedro Dinero]

to then say that the former don't earn enough merits is an unfair comparison.

Who said that and where?

nutildah did on page 1 of this very thread.

According to TryNinja's Signature Ban dashboard, the average merits per post for all sigbanned users is 0.04, which is the equivalent of 1 merit every 25 posts. Since the introduction of the merit system, you are earning less than that, at 0.037 merits/post. The average merits/post for the Gambling board, where the majority of your posts are, is 0.10.

If Bitinity posts almost exclusively on gambling boards and the average merits/post there is 0.10 including casino reps, managers and people running promos that means that he ranks in the top percentile of merit recipients in that section if we exclude them.